What can or should Disney do about the crowds?

[darnheather]

What about a park in South America where a lot of tourists now come from other than from within the US? I didn't see that idea floated in the article linked. I for one wouldn't do parks in the middle of the US (micro or otherwise) but do want to visit the parks that are in other countries.

 

[disneysteve]

People are still going to flock in gigantic numbers and spend ridiculous money regardless of the crowd size. That's how crowds are formed in the first place isn't it?

As Yogi Berra said, "Nobody goes there anymore; it's too crowded."

 

[disneysteve]

I just don't think the dissatisfaction with the size of the crowds has really reached the point for Disney to do much if anything.

Seriously, I agree with you. I don't think it has reached that point yet, but I do think it's moving in that direction. Galaxy's Edge, a few new rides at Epcot, several new hotels, and in another couple of years, the place will be way more packed than it is today. And then what happens? Somewhere, some time, there is a breaking point.

 

[mcd2745]

Seriously, I agree with you. I don't think it has reached that point yet, but I do think it's moving in that direction. Galaxy's Edge, a few new rides at Epcot, several new hotels, and in another couple of years, the place will be way more packed than it is today. And then what happens? Somewhere, some time, there is a breaking point.

Agreed as well. They are not there yet, but will probably be there soon. What's interesting is that they seem determined to reach that point. It's as if they feel if they don't test that limit, they are likely leaving too much money on the table. As mentioned previously in this discussion, the next recession is probably the only thing that reduces crowds - and it probably happens before the guest breaking point is reached. I believe that's the bet they are making. So they're milking the current economy for every penny they could with the price increases and when the next recession happens, it solves the crowding problem. Additionally, with all the increases, when they are forced to discount during the next recession, it's from "rack" rates so high, they will still be charging higher than non-discounted prices only a few short years ago - but psychologically, people will feel like they are getting a good deal with the discounts.

 

[disneysteve]

when the next recession happens, it solves the crowding problem. Additionally, with all the increases, when they are forced to discount during the next recession, it's from "rack" rates so high, it will still be higher than non-discounted prices only a few short years ago - but psychologically, people will feel like they are getting a good deal with the discounts.

Not only that, but the drop in crowds will be measured from current levels which are at record highs. A 20 or 30% drop in attendance now would just put it back to what was normal attendance a few years ago. The parks surely won't be empty because there are plenty of people who aren't that impacted by the recessions. Personally, the last one didn't stop us from visiting and the next one won't either. We'll just enjoy the somewhat lighter crowds.

 

[GAN]

As Yogi Berra said, "Nobody goes there anymore; it's too crowded."

One of my favorites -used it the other night! It’s safe to say they are near or at that breaking point for some guests regarding the number of people to satisfaction ....and I’m sure Disney knows that. The parks are jammed and they keep building DVC resorts, which you would think guarantees park guests for 40-years or so.

 

[Jennasis]

If Disney only cared about the one and done visitor or the once in a lifetime family they wouldn't be building or investing in two new DVC resorts.

 

[KellyHonos]

I guess the only way you could really see a decrease in crowds is the opening of another park elsewhere in the americas to help disperse the masses throughout the 2 in the US and then a third one maybe in central or south. Obviously I know that that is more than likely never going to happen, but just hypothetically speaking, that's the only thing I can think of aside from expanding hours.

Whenever I have gone in the summer (2016 and 2018), it's never like the high crowds have kept me from doing the things I wanted. I never felt deprived of anything. I guess my complaint when it comes to crowds is the issue of personal space and overall level of comfort. Gone are the days where you can have oodles of personal space and can casually stroll and take your time. When I was in MK back in July of this year, it was literally body to body. I still got to do everything I wanted thanks for FP and the ability to book additional FP after the 3 you get off the bat, but you are met with body to body interactions the whole day long.

 

[hertamaniac]

I guess the only way you could really see a decrease in crowds is the opening of another park elsewhere in the americas to help disperse the masses throughout the 2 in the US

This is a compelling argument and think would be very effective at crowd levels.

 

[KellyHonos]

This is a compelling argument and think would be very effective at crowd levels.

It would be nice, but alas, I doubt it would ever happen

 

[ChrisFL]

I don't know if people are going to DLR instead of WDW because of crowd levels currently though (I'm guessing DLR is less crowded but I'm not sure)

My thoughts:

- Keep adding good quality attractions to the other 3 parks to draw people away from MK because that's the one park that's always too crowded. I think we might see a shift in crowd dynamics in the next 2-3 years because of the other things they're finally opening in DHS and Epcot
- Build more high quality and high capacity attractions. Disney needs to stop replacing high capacity attractions with low capacity ones.
- Find ways to clear certain pathway bottlenecks like between Peter Pan and IASW which is the most frustrating.

 

[OhDannyBoy]

It would be nice, but alas, I doubt it would ever happen

Didn't they try to do that in the 90's in Virginia with an America Land or something like that?

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I don't know if people are going to DLR instead of WDW because of crowd levels currently though (I'm guessing DLR is less crowded but I'm not sure)

My thoughts:

- Keep adding good quality attractions to the other 3 parks to draw people away from MK because that's the one park that's always too crowded. I think we might see a shift in crowd dynamics in the next 2-3 years because of the other things they're finally opening in DHS and Epcot
- Build more high quality and high capacity attractions. Disney needs to stop replacing high capacity attractions with low capacity ones.
- Find ways to clear certain pathway bottlenecks like between Peter Pan and IASW which is the most frustrating.

The one time we went to DLR we found it way more crowded than WDW - some of that is because pathways are narrower so it feels more crowded but we also found ride wait times to generally be longer (and this was a mid-week trip in October)

And they are getting Star Wars Galaxy’s Edge first and t is going into Disneyland proper so that is going to make crowds there crazy I suspect

 

[disneysteve]

Didn't they try to do that in the 90's in Virginia with an America Land or something like that?

Yes. They had a proposed park, Disney's America, in Haymarket, VA. Unfortunately, the locals shot it down over concerns about the crowds and traffic.

I don't know this for sure, but I've heard that over the years, suburban sprawl has occurred in that area anyway with malls and stores and such. If that's true, they probably would have been better off with a Disney park.

 

[SorcererHeidi]

Yes. They had a proposed park, Disney's America, in Haymarket, VA. Unfortunately, the locals shot it down over concerns about the crowds and traffic.

I don't know this for sure, but I've heard that over the years, suburban sprawl has occurred in that area anyway with malls and stores and such. If that's true, they probably would have been better off with a Disney park.

I know I was VERY excited when this was a possibility. Very disappointed it never came to be.

 

[Pop Goes the Weasel]

More high volume shows and attractions. Lights Motors Action, for example, used to absorb thousands of guests for long periods of time in HS.

Another pragmatic solution that would be unpopular with central Florida locals is better managing local annual pass holder traffic. Vacation visitors who pay a premium for on-property hotels, food, and park hopper passes will stand in line to revisit a show they saw a year or two on vacation. And they will visit attractions like Impressions de France every year because it's still new and exciting. Local annual pass holders get tired of shows that are not frequently updated, and instead they tend to focus on new big ticket attractions during peak times. I would guess that some form of limiting or price increase will happen to shape pass holder traffic.

My anecdotal experience is that nothing kills the magic for a visiting family like being stuck in a long line with packs of moody local teenagers complaining loudly about their relationship problems and how it sucks that they are going on this ride again because they have nothing else to because parties at Kathy's house are even more lame than WDW.

 

[disneyland_is_magic]

I thought it was a shame your Main Street theatre was scraped. The Hyperion theatre is DCA pulls in just shy of 2000 guests and all the seats are pretty good IMO.
I think a theatre is great because it can last a lifetime without the safety liability and increasing maintenance a ride takes.
Yours could have easily been larger, allowed guests a chance out of the heat, (my little buddy snoozed while we watched Frozen) sold dining packages for revenue, etc.
Aladdin lasted 12 plus years and besides refreshing the script for pop culture jokes, it was still a big fan favorite. Now, granted I don’t think Frozen will make it as long...
It would have been an excellent investment, IMO. I thought it was really disappointing they dropped it.

 

[DLgal]

Yes. They had a proposed park, Disney's America, in Haymarket, VA. Unfortunately, the locals shot it down over concerns about the crowds and traffic.

I don't know this for sure, but I've heard that over the years, suburban sprawl has occurred in that area anyway with malls and stores and such. If that's true, they probably would have been better off with a Disney park.

Yep. I used to live near there. It's a huge Wal Mart anchored shopping center at a major intersection of highways. They made a terrible mistake shooting Disney down. Disney would have spent more money on the infrastructure there and they would not have nearly the traffic issues they have there now.

 

[YesterDark]

I think we're already seeing the answer and that's with the building of the Star Wars hotel. I believe that they have also discussed that if it's successful this will be the way they build future hotels. I read that in one article somewhere over a year ago.

The way you thin the crowds but ALSO don't lose customers and even increase revenue is extended that park experience into the resorts. Currently resorts are places you sleep, eat or go swimming for the most part with a few exceptions. And they are typically themed in non-Disney specific ways. If you can make the "resort day" almost or just as fun as a park you'll pull people out of them on more days during their stay. So instead of having 5 parks days in a 5-7 day vacation, you might be able to get that family to go one or two less days.

The Star Wars hotel will give us big hints once we start seeing it. Imagine a resort that is shaped like Arendelle and living inside an ongoing Frozen character story with meals and minor attractions and shows. Instead of $400-500 a night like other Deluxes it's $800-$1000.

Suddenly Disney will have a split stay calculator on their site so you can split between these resorts and others and justify the extra dollars for a room. If you're a family of four, that extra $300-400 going to park tickets is going to a hotel stay. Maybe instead of $400 extra it's $600 extra for the experience.

 

[ChrisFL]

Disney's America was, um...from the plans and notes about it, probably too much into realism and less fantasy. Yes, there's always been a place for that in the Disney parks but I think this might have been less "magical".

Plus, we can talk about having another resort, but WDW is 4 theme parks, 2 water parks, and lots of other things, so even if you build another park somewhere, it isn't going to make a huge impact.