"Virginia moving to eliminate all accelerated math courses before 11th grade as part of equity-focused plan"

[mjkacmom]

People are complaining about this new program being unfair to advanced students. If you need 2 whole years in high-school to cover what college does in 1 year, then you aren't really an advanced student.

I don’t know what to tell you, that’s just how it works, it doesn’t mean they aren’t advanced students. In most high schools courses are a whole year vs. one semester in college. College students spend less time in class and more time on independent learning (especially this year).

 

[NotUrsula]

People are complaining about this new program being unfair to advanced students. If you need 2 whole years in high-school to cover what college does in 1 year, then you aren't really an advanced student.

To be fair, in most school systems, high school students usually are taking more classes than college students are. Standard in my kid's school is 8 classes. In college that would be a load of 24 credit hours in a semester, something almost no college would allow a student to attempt.

 

[Skippy918]

To be fair, in most school systems, high school students usually are taking more classes than college students are. Standard in my kid's school is 8 classes. In college that would be a load of 24 credit hours in a semester, something almost no college would allow a student to attempt.

In my engineering school 20-24 credits was normal. I knew some students taking more than that cause they were either trying to double major or get their masters in the same number of semesters.

 

[bcla]

I don’t know what to tell you, that’s just how it works, it doesn’t mean they aren’t advanced students. In most high schools courses are a whole year vs. one semester in college. College students spend less time in class and more time on independent learning (especially this year).

In my experience the whole year class I took in calculus was equivalent to the two semester calculus sequence I remember in college. There was something really odd in my Math 1B class though. It wasn't really part of the normal course, but something the professor seemed to like teaching.

 

[bcla]

In my engineering school 20-24 credits was normal. I knew some students taking more than that cause they were either trying to double major or get their masters in the same number of semesters.

When I was in school, 15 was typical. Anything over 18 (I think) required a special approval. In my masters program, "full time" was considered as a minimum 8 units. It was really difficult to do more than 8 or 10 because the engineering schedule was centered around classes for working engineers with 7-9 AM classes so they could go to work full time. I had a part time job working maybe 1 or 2 days a week, but could manage since some of my classes were at 5-7/7-9 PM - also work working engineers (including the instructors).

 

[mjkacmom]

In my experience the whole year class I took in calculus was equivalent to the two semester calculus sequence I remember in college. There was something really odd in my Math 1B class though. It wasn't really part of the normal course, but something the professor seemed to like teaching.

At the colleges my children recently attended/attend, 18 was the max, 19, if allowed, needed special permission and extra $. Two were business school, one health sciences. Replied to wrong poster.

 

[mjkacmom]

At the colleges my children recently attended/attend, 18 was the max, 19, if allowed, needed special permission and extra $. Two were business school, one health sciences.

 

[bcla]

At the colleges my children recently attended/attend, 18 was the max, 19, if allowed, needed special permission and extra $. Two were business school, one health sciences. Replied to wrong poster.

I really wouldn't know since I never went over 16 units, but there were rules since there was generally a flat fee/tuition per semester.

When I was in grad school, tuition was charged by the unit with a nominal registration ee per quarter. But at the time, I saw the pricing for undergraduates, which was $250 per quarter unit. It was actually quite reasonable at the time. I looked up undergraduate tuition at that school, and it's now close to $50,000.

My biggest problem was that I had plenty of AP credits. I passed 5 AP tests for 26.5 units. My registration materials said I was a sophomore after one semester, but that was based solely on the number of units I had. There was a minimum course load per semester unless I was about to graduate. Sometimes I just added one survey class (1.5 or 2 units) just to meet the minimum.

 

[kiddo76]

Point is, it really doesn't matter when you take Calculus. It seems more like a parental brag to say "well my kid started Calculus as a junior". When my husband hires new engineers, he doesn't give two hoots whether the applicant took Calc as a Junior in High School or a Freshman in college.

 

[Southernmiss]

Point is, it really doesn't matter when you take Calculus. It seems more like a parental brag to say "well my kid started Calculus as a junior". When my husband hires new engineers, he doesn't give two hoots whether the applicant took Calc as a Junior in High School or a Freshman in college.

Exactly! The high school accolades and achievements don't matter beyond getting into college.

 

[kiddo76]

Exactly! The high school accolades and achievements don't matter beyond getting into college.

And even that is all relative to what your high school offers for courses. Colleges are looking for students who challenge themselves based on what is available to them.

 

[bcla]

Point is, it really doesn't matter when you take Calculus. It seems more like a parental brag to say "well my kid started Calculus as a junior". When my husband hires new engineers, he doesn't give two hoots whether the applicant took Calc as a Junior in High School or a Freshman in college.

Not in my state with the state universities. At least when I calculated GPA, it was 9th grade to 11th grade (plus summer) for the University of California and California State University. Then only 11th grade classes were eligible for extra weighting for honors or AP classes (it's 10th and 11th now). I took calculus in the 12th grade, but quite a few students in my school found a way to take it in the 11th grade in order to have it count for the extra GPA weighting. I knew quite a few classmates who wanted to pack as much weighted (i.e. AP and honors) courses into the 10th and 11th grade in order to pad their college GPAs.

My high school had 6 classes per day. In the 11th grade I only took two honors and one AP. In my senior year it was four AP classes because I was frankly better prepared for the material. However, I heard of some classmates who tried to pack that into two honors and three AP in order to pad the GPA.

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

Point is, it really doesn't matter when you take Calculus. It seems more like a parental brag to say "well my kid started Calculus as a junior". When my husband hires new engineers, he doesn't give two hoots whether the applicant took Calc as a Junior in High School or a Freshman in college.

It’s not just a parental brag. Competitive universities expect their applicants to take the most challenging course loads offered at their high schools. If you want to go to a top 25 school (or a school with a top ranked engineering program), you’d better have lots of AP classses on your transcripts - the more math heavy the better for engineering programs.

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

Actually it makes perfect sense. It's called differentiation. Any educator that can't differentiate his/her lessons to meet the skill levels of the students, shouldn’t be in a classroom.

Just curious, are you a teacher?

 

[Pink Partridge]

If you need 2 whole years in high-school to cover what college does in 1 year, then you aren't really an advanced student.

This is an odd statement. Students go by the curriculum standards. For whatever reason, some schools teach this class over "2 whole years". A student can't demand a teacher "hurry it up".

 

[bcla]

It’s not just a parental brag. Competitive universities expect their applicants to take the most challenging course loads offered at their high schools. If you want to go to a top 25 school (or a school with a top ranked engineering program), you’d better have lots of AP classses on your transcripts - the more math heavy the better for engineering programs.

That can certainly be as a senior in high school. However, many of the GPAs are calculated with honors and AP classes with an extra point. Since the applications are due before senior year grades are available, that boosts the weighted GPA if taken earlier.

 

[amylevan]

It doesn’t matter whether you take the classes in HS or college...

Unless you’d rather get college credit without having to pay for those credits,

Or you’re majoring in a tough STEM major and want to be able to lighten your load by getting things out of the way in HS,

Or you’re simply ready for more challenge in math and you don’t want to be held back in the name of equity.

It’s not always about bragging rights.

 

[Pink Partridge]

Point is, it really doesn't matter when you take Calculus. It seems more like a parental brag to say "well my kid started Calculus as a junior".

Again. Odd. Who would brag about that? When my children were ready to take calculus, they took it. What's there to brag about?

When my husband hires new engineers, he doesn't give two hoots whether the applicant took Calc as a Junior in High School or a Freshman in college.

Lol. Why would he care? Nobody cares. And, believe me, the engineer that your husband hires isn't even thinking about their calculus class. Nobody is taking calculus in high school with the thoughts of "Oh gee! I can't wait to impress the person hiring me once I get my engineering degree"

They take calculus because they are ready to take calculus. Because they have advanced to that level and it's the next logical choice. Because they don't want to be held back. Because they are good at math.

 

[Pink Partridge]

Any educator that can't differentiate his/her lessons to meet the skill levels of the students, shouldn’t be in a classroom.

This is not true.

I have a friend that teachers math to students that struggle with basic math. She is amazingly gifted and is the superstar teacher at her school. She turns lives around. She gets the kids that are failing to understand basic concepts.

She openly admits that she could never teach advanced math students, or even above average math students. Many have surpassed her knowledge, and I love that she is so open about that. She cannot meet the skill level of all students. And that's ok. She can meet the needs of those in her class. And she is an awesome teacher!

 

[Sargeant Tibbs]

How is differentiated learning going to happen in a classroom with 35-40 students? That is a normal classroom size in my school district here on Virginia. A single teacher cannot realistically implement differentiated learning in a classroom of that size. Since the majority of the students will be at or below average, where will the gifted kids wind up? I'm going to guess they will be completely overlooked in the teacher's effort to prepare the majority of their classmates to pass the standardized test. A teacher's performance is based on those test scores.

My daughter is two, and can already tell time on an analog clock as well as a digital, and requests to play "adding games." This move by the VDOE does not bode well for my child. Because of this my husband and I have decided that either private school or homeschooling is best for her.