Vent/WWYD: Managing ADRs,etc with family members who want to "be unstructured"

[kboo]

Warning - this is a little long...

A little back story - Headed to WDW in March with my parents, DH, my 2 kids (4 yo, 3 mo old), and my sister and her DW and their baby (7 mo old). My mom has mild/early dementia that is just starting to affect her cognitively, so this will probably be our last whole family reunion where we actually travel, as opposed to gathering at one person's home. Chose WDW because it will be familiar for my mom and because she loves to see her granddaughters happy. I'm paying for the room and organizing everyone because, well, I'm on here aren't I?

Anyway. My parents were on board from the get go and excited about it (last summer). My sister's family finally decided, after a lot of persuasion along the "this will probably be our last family trip together" lines, to join us for part of the week, Sunday - Thursday. For Xmas I got my parents 5-day PHs, with the idea that they can extend the passes if they end up going to the parks every day, but they may want to take some break days as well. Sister said they were not going to go to the parks but just "hang out" at the condo the whole time. So I got them 3-day passes as well.

I made ADRs back when it was just us and my parents, and my sister had said she wasn't coming. Didn't totally book everything up, since I know my mom is going to be resistant to going out for every meal or being put on a terribly rigorous schedule, but I tried to schedule things she and my dad would enjoy.

I was texting my sister today about planning a dinner on the last night before they leave, as my parents and my family will be staying until Sunday. Also was trying to gauge which ADRs she'd want to be added to. She was basically resistant to discussing any of it, other than saying they were thinking of renting a car (!!!) because they wanted to get groceries and maybe go to Harry Potter World on a date undetermined, saying,

"Don't know when we'll decide it's still almost 2 months away! Part of being on vacation for us is for it to be unstructured. We may not decide until we're there."

I tried explaining to her that despite the advance planning I've done, we are relatively unstructured as well, but there are some things at WDW that, if you are "unstructured" about, you'll end up wasting a lot of time.
As it stands now there are actually only 3 meals that I'd potentially need to try to add people to the ADR (and HIGHLY unlikely I'll be successful) - Sunday dinner (BOG), Tuesday Wishes dessert party, and Wednesday brunch at Tusker House. Chances are, if they really wanted to go to one of them and I couldn't add them to the reservation, my parents would just bow out and let them go, but I don't want to put my parents in that position. But I'm really thinking of leaving those ADRs as is and letting them figure it out when we are there. And I could make FP reservations for them, but not sure if I should bother, as my sister my take that as a sign I'm trying to control their vacation.

What would you do? (And if you are all the way here, thanks for reading!)

 

[Pesky]

First off, you are a good, good woman. Patience of a saint. Second, you will not be able to force your sister to have a WDW vacation like you experience. As you put it, she's against structure. You have seen the value of structure and prefer it (like most of us -- it's why we're here). So okay, totally get her vacation style and that's cool as long as she goes into WDW (if at all) with minimal expectations as to getting on key rides without a long wait or getting into popular TS restaurants without an ADR, she'll have a great time. I'd simple email her the reservations you do have and alert her that if she wants you to try to add her (and that may be unsuccessful), she needs to tell you now. Otherwise, plan a dinner on Wednesday that maybe is at a resort and easier to get into or even off WDW property. Then take a deep breath and pull an Elsa (let it go). GL!

 

[powellrj]

What I would do is take a deep breath and let everyone do what they want to do. Your sister has already said she isn't interested in going to WDW, so don't push it. If they decide to go, then there are lots of counter service places they can eat at. Its their vacation too and if they want to stay at the condo or rent a car and go to Universal, let them. My oldest DS hates WDW, so we make our plans and if he wants to attend he does and otherwise his wife goes with us and he does what he wants.

As for your mom, I would tread lightly with her. We also took my mom when she was in her early stages of dementia and it was a nightmare. When we had plans to go to the parks, she didn't want to go. She wanted to eat what she wanted, when she wanted. If she wanted chicken fingers and soup at 7am, she would throw a fit until she got what she wanted. We had never seen her like this because she had never behaved like this at home. In fact, it took a few more years until we saw this type of behavior at home.

Go ahead and plan the trip you want, but I wouldn't make any ADRs that you aren't prepared for nobody but your family to attend. Your mom may decide she doesn't want to go out or eat what is being served and your sister has already said she may not want to do what you are doing.

 

[HopperFan]

Agree with PPs. I would just move forward with what planning you feel needs to be done for your family and parents. It really sounds like your sister still doesn't want to go but is because of the "last trip" guilt thing. Don't try to force them in to anything. Once your planning feels done then send her copies of your plans. This is a special trip for your Mom with the kids that YOU have planned. I think your Mom will love BOG and the Wishes party and love seeing the kids with the characters at Tusker. If your sister decides to be in the parks those days, then have them make alternate plans and you just meet back and forth.

Don't try to force anything. They need to take responsibility for themselves and booking what they need. You worrying about them is going to put a damper on your trip. You focus on Mom and enjoy while you can. Just went through this and these memories will be priceless.

 

[kj2mom]

When we went last summer we had invited some of our friends who live in Florida to join us but we weren't sure if they would come. I made our meal reservations including them (we only had 3) in case they did come. It didn't cost anything to include them that far in advance (obviously we didn't book any pay in advance restaurants) and it was easy enough to remove them when we realized they wouldn't be joining us. As for the FP, we traveled with another family who was on site and made their FP 30 days before I did being off site. I did everything I could to make sure our FP times overlapped or were the same. A number of times it ended up that we didn't even go on the ride together even after all of my efforts. I would leave that completely in your sister's hands for her family and just take care of your immediate family and your parents. Once the trip arrives I always go in with zen zen zen in mind, whatever happens happens and I just try to go with the flow.

 

[ktlm]

I would try to add them to the ADRs where there is availability. WDW does not charge a no show fee if only part of your party shows up. As long as someone shows up, you are good. So, if you can add them and they don't go, then it is no big deal. Do you pay in advance for the Wishes dessert party? We have never done that one. I wouldn't add them to that unless they committed, if it was even a possibility this late to do so. If there are ADRs you can't add them to, I would keeping checking for openings. If no openings come up, then if they want to go once you get there, I would just tell them that you are sorry, but that there was no availability and they can not come to that meal. If they try to knock your parents out to take their place at the ADR, then I would remind them that the baby counts as a person- so 3 can't take the place of 2....of course, that opens the possibility of them trying to turn your parents into babysitters.

We have travel issues with BIL/SIL if we go on a trip with them... which we have done here and there when it is something MIL/FIL really want. We learned after the 1st trip to just let them do their own thing- which usually involves them sitting at their hotel or at their hotel pool most of the day instead of taking advantage of all the activities in the area. We typically make a few meal plans with everyone involved, and then other than that, we make our plans to do our own thing and tell them they are welcome to join us if they would like. Typically MIL and FIL will come do things with us for a while until they get tired, but BIL/SIL most times we just see at meals.

As far as FP+, if they want to make none for themselves, I would just go ahead and make some for them that correspond with yours for things you think they might like. I would just tell them that they don't have to use them or go with you, but that you made them just in case and that they can ignore them and not use them, try to change them to things they would rather have or do whatever else they want with them.

 

[3DisneyFanz]

Have you tried explaining to them unstructured and Disney don't go together anymore? If they prefer a free flow vacation to schedules then they'll probably enjoy their trip to see Harry Potter a bit more. All the explaining in the world about what a modern Disney vacation is doesn't mean anything until someone experiences it for themselves.

 

[TwoMisfits]

Gonna echo the chorus - let your sister do what she likes and don't force anything. The MOST I would do is encourage her to have one meal as a family AND I would do this as an off-site plan, so there is ZERO cost if you cancel (if your mom is not up for it, it would be pointless for everyone to go). Heck, if someone books a condo, I might do this as a family meal plan AT the condo (either takeout or cooking).

We took my dad when he was pretty sick and we had people who hated parks (and never went, staying in the condo all day and at the pools) and others who wanted to be there all the time. We planned ONE event to have with him as a whole family - Wolfgang Puck's upstairs dining to get their Weiner Schnitzel (my dad's childhood favorite meal) and all their great food...and this was years before any cancellation fees. Best $300 I ever spent (since my brother and I split the dinner cost and even 11 years ago, it wasn't cheap when you have big party and when you're just starting out in the labor force) Now, I'd book this type of meal offsite, since I wouldn't want to risk my dad having been sick that day and not up for it.

 

[scrapquitler]

Warning - this is a little long...

A little back story - Headed to WDW in March with my parents, DH, my 2 kids (4 yo, 3 mo old), and my sister and her DW and their baby (7 mo old). My mom has mild/early dementia that is just starting to affect her cognitively, so this will probably be our last whole family reunion where we actually travel, as opposed to gathering at one person's home. Chose WDW because it will be familiar for my mom and because she loves to see her granddaughters happy. I'm paying for the room and organizing everyone because, well, I'm on here aren't I?

Anyway. My parents were on board from the get go and excited about it (last summer). My sister's family finally decided, after a lot of persuasion along the "this will probably be our last family trip together" lines, to join us for part of the week, Sunday - Thursday. For Xmas I got my parents 5-day PHs, with the idea that they can extend the passes if they end up going to the parks every day, but they may want to take some break days as well. Sister said they were not going to go to the parks but just "hang out" at the condo the whole time. So I got them 3-day passes as well.

I made ADRs back when it was just us and my parents, and my sister had said she wasn't coming. Didn't totally book everything up, since I know my mom is going to be resistant to going out for every meal or being put on a terribly rigorous schedule, but I tried to schedule things she and my dad would enjoy.

I was texting my sister today about planning a dinner on the last night before they leave, as my parents and my family will be staying until Sunday. Also was trying to gauge which ADRs she'd want to be added to. She was basically resistant to discussing any of it, other than saying they were thinking of renting a car (!!!) because they wanted to get groceries and maybe go to Harry Potter World on a date undetermined, saying,

"Don't know when we'll decide it's still almost 2 months away! Part of being on vacation for us is for it to be unstructured. We may not decide until we're there."

I tried explaining to her that despite the advance planning I've done, we are relatively unstructured as well, but there are some things at WDW that, if you are "unstructured" about, you'll end up wasting a lot of time.
As it stands now there are actually only 3 meals that I'd potentially need to try to add people to the ADR (and HIGHLY unlikely I'll be successful) - Sunday dinner (BOG), Tuesday Wishes dessert party, and Wednesday brunch at Tusker House. Chances are, if they really wanted to go to one of them and I couldn't add them to the reservation, my parents would just bow out and let them go, but I don't want to put my parents in that position. But I'm really thinking of leaving those ADRs as is and letting them figure it out when we are there. And I could make FP reservations for them, but not sure if I should bother, as my sister my take that as a sign I'm trying to control their vacation.

What would you do? (And if you are all the way here, thanks for reading!)

If they don't want to do ADRs with you, then they can make their own plans. You make your plans and do what you want, let them do what they want. And if they decide during the trip that they want to do something together with you, figure out something that doesn't require advanced planning. Different strokes for different folks.

If anything, maybe rearranged ONE ADR to include them, and if they choose not to go, then go without them. If your sister is adamant about not planning that last night until the last minute, plan something in the condo or offsite if it's too hard to get ADRs.

But one thing stands out for me....they told you they don't want to go to the parks, so why did you bother buying them 3 day passes? That seems like you are trying to strong arm them into doing what they don't want to do.

 

[wed100105]

First of all, I'm sorry to hear about your mom, and I can tell from your post and the gifts you have given them, that this trip is special for you.

I'm sorry, but it doesn't sound like your sister shares your sentiment. I think she has said pretty loud and clear that she doesn't want you to plan anything for her (and really that she didn't even want to go). My advice would be to respect her wishes, and let it go. Plan what your immediate family wants to do, and be flexible to your sister joining along when she wants to. She probably won't eat with you; let that me okay. Please resist the urge to say "I told you that the availability would be gone. That's why I wanted to book the dining two months in advance." Even though all of us planners TOTALLY UNDERSTAND!

Hugs, OP.

 

[NKHarris329]

I would enjoy my vacation, stop trying to push for everyone to be at the same place at the same time always, and try to remember that this is supposed to be fun.

Remember, this is their vacation as well. Their time to relax and enjoy and take some time off. Not everyone wants a structured vacation, and it sounds like they fall into that category. That is OK... even at Disney. Focus on having a good time, making memories, and finding magic where you can.

 

[kboo]

...
But one thing stands out for me....they told you they don't want to go to the parks, so why did you bother buying them 3 day passes? That seems like you are trying to strong arm them into doing what they don't want to do.

I see why you'd think that. She cited the cost of the tickets as being prohibitive for them, and I was actually waffling on whether to get tickets for them or just a Disney gift card that they could spend on incidentals, or use toward tickets. In retrospect a gift card that equaled 1 day admission but could have left things more open. But my sister also is a notorious cheapskate and if I hadn't gotten the passes, she probably would have made us feel guilty about going to the parks without her because she "can't afford it," or making snide comments about how we choose to spend our money. Don't get me wrong, I love my sister, but I also know her well and I don't want to feel guilty for our lifestyle choices.

Edited to add: when we all went together in 2013 and stayed offsite, that was all my mom's planning because she was so excited to do Disney with her first granddaughter. DD1 wasn't even 2 yet. We left early in the AM to make rope drop, and my parents and sister (and her partner) slept in, joined us later in the the day and stayed in the parks when we went back for naps or for DDs bedtime. So i know they didn't go to the parks just to humor us.

 

[myhoney]

It's hard to travel with non-planners, isn't it? They just don't get it! But seriously, your sister will enjoy her trip her way, while you will enjoy yours in your way. Take a breath, and let it go. Make the memories that you want with your mom, because that is ultimately who this trip is about. Maybe your sister wants to make memories with her at home, and this trip isn't the be-all-end-all for her. It's hard, I'm sure, because as a planner you probably have this whole picture in your mind of how it will go, and your sister isn't playing along to your ideas. So adjust your picture. Zoom in on your mom and dad and your kids. If your sister is around for a few of the "shots" - great. If not, that's ok, because the people you are focused on will be there. Anything her family makes it for is a bonus. Is she talking about taking your mom with her to US and messing up your plans? If not, then she is just opting her family out.

We went a few years ago on our first trip, and I asked my ILs if they were interested in coming. Were they ever! FIL, MIL, SIL. Except they are not planners. MIL would openly "tease" me about the meticulous planning I did for my own family. You know, like picking a park in advance. They were go with the flow types. We went for a week; they went for 4 days. In that 4 days, we had 2 dinners together and they did 1 ride with the grandkids. We didn't even walk around together. I joke that we didn't go to Disney "with" them. We were just both at Disney at the same time. But they enjoyed their trip and resting at the hotel, while DH and I had a fabulous week touring with our kids. Now we are planning to go this fall. I am not even mentioning it to the ILs, mostly because I don't want that stress again like you have now. Trying to plan those 2 dinners together was insane. FIL insisted on Cali Grill, because someone told him it was a nice view for fireworks. Except we were eating at 5pm. And the ILs are not adventurous eaters, nor are they big eaters. DH and I looked at the menu, and suggested they might want to look at it and maybe pick a different place. They refused to look at the menu and were adamant about going to the Cali Grill. We get there for dinner, and FIL said "There's nothing I like to eat on this menu!" and SIL had an app for dinner because there wasn't anything else she liked. We eat anything, so we had a great time!

Plan for your family's needs and wants, and let your sister do the same. I know you want it to be great for everyone, but not everyone has the same vacation styles, and it can still be great for everyone. Good luck.

 

[writermommy6]

My experience with family has done nothing but solidify that I prefer to vacation with just DH and the kids. With the InLaws we end up all going our separate ways like myhoney's family. We happen to be at the same place and the same time and they don't even care if we stay in the same hotel/condo as them. They stay wherever they want and won't even let us know until we get there. And my family isn't any better. They like to stay together for the most part, but then my father wants to ***** about waiting in lines or the weather or that he'd rather go back to the room/condo and he expects the rest of us to go back at the same time. This wouldn't be a big deal if he could drive but he is legally blind so my mom (who is all about being together as a family) has to leave the fun to take him back. That always makes me sad for her. And of course it wouldn't be a "vacation" without my parents getting into a massive fight at least every other day.

I'm with the others on do your own thing and let sis do hers. I hate it for your mom though. I hope she does well while you guys are there.

 

[kboo]

Thanks, all, for your support and your comments! In thinking about this all, I realize that there are a lot of emotional issues at play here. I feel like my sister has kind of been in denial about my mom's condition for a while (though she is starting to get it), and she probably resents me a little for making her face it with planning this trip. I am probably putting more pressure on myself to want everyone to have a happy time all together because I am seeing it as probably the last trip. My dad runs a lot of interference for my mom and manages her day to day - and part of this is to give him a fun break as well. I need to just let it go, as you all said, and enjoy the time however we end up spending it. And my sister's actions are somewhat conflicted too: She said all along that she wanted just to hang out at the condo, that my mom would just stay in the condo all day anyway, and yet they are considering taking a day to opt out entirely to go to HP World (after saying they couldn't afford tickets to WDW). At this point I think I will be happy so long as they don't buy a ton of groceries that they expect my mom to cook and us to move/clean (we are doing a split stay because of the # of points we needed to rent, so there's a chance we'd have to move rooms a few days into the trip). And I'm probably focusing on the planning because that's something I *can* control, unlike my mom's condition.

myhoney, your Cali Grill story is priceless! I'm pretty sure something like that will happen on this trip - not if, but when. We'll have a great time anyway - DD1 is so excited to go so even if everyone else is a stick in the mud, we will have fun.

 

[kboo]

Also - it's nice to know I'm not alone in vacationing with family... !!

 

[Chelley00]

We've traveled with my mom and my brothers family quite a bit and we have a plan that works well. They usually have quick service dining while we have the regular plan. We meet in the morning, hang out until dinner and then go our separate ways. This way we get plenty of time together but each family gets their own "family time" to go where they want.