Uh, oh!! Rev. Pat Robertson's talking again!!!

[Geoff_M]

Dobson spoke out of school in revealing the private phone calls they get from Rove during the Meirs fiasco.

And if I'm not mistaken Dobson endorsed the nomination after the discussion. That endorsement had a net effect of zero in the conservative camp, which undercuts the notion of Robertson/Dobson being key influencers of the conservative ranks. Dobson reversed himself after it was apparent that the rank and file weren't buying what he was trying to sell.

 

[toto2]

What PR says and what is reality are often two very different things.

That said, I can call the White House at any time and my call will be answered. You can, too. So can anyone else. That's hardly a big claim to fame. If PR is claiming that he can speak to President Bush at any time -- well, that's where PR's fertile fantasy doesn't quite match reality.

PR has some power -- to raise money from too many gullible, suggestable individuals. But his assertion that he has some special pull with this administration is laughable.

Please , read post 74 to see what I am talking about. If you and I called the white house , it is not the same person who will take my call than if PR calls , you can be sure if that. It is just too bad I dont have the piece from Vanity Fair with me , so I could quote from it , but it clearly states that PR and his friend have powers and an ear atr the White house that is beyond having a message asking to press one or two !

As someone said before , they are not at the fringe of power , but with it !

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Can anyone get a private meeting with the President, as Robertson did?

For the right donation, I suppose they could. Unfortunately, I don't have that kind of money, but then I've never desired a private meeting with this or any president.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Please , read post 74 to see what I am talking about. If you and I called the white house , it is not the same person who will take my call than if PR calls , you can be sure if that. It is just too bad I dont have the piece from Vanity Fair with me , so I could quote from it , but it clearly states that PR and his friend have powers and an ear atr the White house that is beyond having a message asking to press one or two !

As someone said before , they are not at the fringe of power , but with it !

I read the post... I simply don't believe everything that is written.

 

[sodaseller]

And if I'm not mistaken Dobson endorsed the nomination after the discussion. That endorsement had a net effect of zero in the conservative camp, which undercuts the notion of Robertson/Dobson being key influencers of the conservative ranks. Dobson reversed himself after it was apparent that the rank and file weren't buying what he was trying to sell.

Your recall is correct, but I read that sequence of events differently. Let me concede upfront that Meirs' nomination was opposed by many groups for many different reasons. But I also feel the so called "Christian" Right (I think them undeserving of the moniker, presuming anyone is), was the critical mass in that effort. My point in referencing the private call to Dobson (and Robertson's private meeting with Bush), was to counter the portray of them as marginal actors in GOP politics.

Dobson indeed supported her, but he was the only one, and he cut quick as other "transcripts" et al came out. But my point was never that Dobson, Robertson et al carry much influence with the "rank and file", except for the individual in the center of the back rank, the King - Pres. Bush (litlle chess metaphor perhaps carried too far).

Just speculation, but I think that group probably turns off at least 35 million of the 59 million voters that voted for Bush in 2004. But they are assiduously courted privately regarding nominations etc because they will sit out an election if not pandered to, i.e. Rove's famous missing 4 million. And they are tremendously well organized at the precinct level, which magnifies the weight their pure numbers give.

 

[ducklite]

Pat Robertson is to Christianity what Sadam was to Islam. He makes absurd statements and unfortunately there are a few radicals who will take heed and follow his biding, thus causing disaster.

I had more respect for Jim and Tammy Faye

Anne

 

[JennyMominRI]

How many Democrats speak up when Louis Farrahkan rambles his hate-filled speech?

Talking about how one levy was blown up by the government to flood a predominantly african american neighborhood.

Believe me...He's a laughing stock to most of us on the left..
As to PR. I certainly don't see him as representing ANY of the Christians I know IRL

 

[RoyalCanadian]

I read the post... I simply don't believe everything that is written.

Pat Robertson is a very, very rich man with massive political and financial clout. Don't fool yourself into believing he can't make George Bush answer the phone.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Pat Robertson is a very, very rich man with massive political and financial clout. Don't fool yourself into believing he can't make George Bush answer the phone.

Sorry, I'm just not gullible enough to believe President Bush's secretary will come running into the Oval Office, breathlessly announcing that PR is holding on Line 2. That President Bush may talk with PR, may actually consult with PR -- that's within the realm of possibility. That PR can pick up any phone, dial a number and be connected to President Bush... well, I expect to see some much better fantasies when I arrive in WDW tomorrow morning!

 

[sodaseller]

Sorry, I'm just not gullible enough to believe President Bush's secretary will come running into the Oval Office, breathlessly announcing that PR is holding on Line 2. That President Bush may talk with PR, may actually consult with PR -- that's within the realm of possibility. That PR can pick up any phone, dial a number and be connected to President Bush... well, I expect to see some much better fantasies when I arrive in WDW tomorrow morning!

I think you are reading his comment too literally. I don't think he meant that the President drops what he is doing to get on the line. If that is what he meant, I agree. But I bet he gets his calls returned promptly, and by either Rove, Card or the President. That is the proverbial indicia of influence

 

[Chuck S]

That President Bush may talk with PR, may actually consult with PR -- that's within the realm of possibility.

And pretty darn frightening.

 

[Tumbleweed]

I am having a very difficult time with religious organizations - ANY religious
organization - being involved in politics. If they are going to be so involved,
they should be paying taxes. I know it's naive, but politics have no place
in church. I resent churches getting tax breaks ( which means more taxes
from me), and taking over the government...even in other states!

 

[Tigger_Magic]

I think you are reading his comment too literally. I don't think he meant that the President drops what he is doing to get on the line. If that is what he meant, I agree. But I bet he gets his calls returned promptly, and by either Rove, Card or the President. That is the proverbial indicia of influence

Without hard evidence, such as the White House phone logs, this is, at best, speculation. I am simply not inclined to give PR the benefit of the doubt since he has a long track record of inflating himself.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

I am having a very difficult time with religious organizations - ANY religious
organization - being involved in politics. If they are going to be so involved,
they should be paying taxes. I know it's naive, but politics have no place
in church. I resent churches getting tax breaks ( which means more taxes
from me), and taking over the government...even in other states!

Maybe I missed the news, but in what state has any church taken over the government?

 

[Geoff_M]

But my point was never that Dobson, Robertson et al carry much influence with the "rank and file", except for the individual in the center of the back rank, the King - Pres. Bush (litlle chess metaphor perhaps carried too far).

In the case of Meirs, the Bush Administration talked to Dobson because he thought he would be useful to them... not because they cared what Dobson thought or sought his input. I also doubt the White House will be consulting Robertson on foreign affairs anytime soon.

But they are assiduously courted privately regarding nominations etc because they will sit out an election if not pandered to, i.e. Rove's famous missing 4 million. And they are tremendously well organized at the precinct level, which magnifies the weight their pure numbers give.

Rove's apparent genius aside, I think way too much has been made of the so-called "evangelical vote". The fascination that some political pundits and many in the dead-tree media had over this notion that the "Christian Right" were a make or break issue remind me of sports fans that obssess over how one call by an official determined the outcome of a game.

 

[arminnie]

Find us an example and we'll talk. But make sure the cleric has the same clout, power, and lust for media attention. Otherwise it's just simply not a valid comparison.

Louis Farrakan

 

[Tigger_Magic]

In the case of Meirs, the Bush Administration talked to Dobson because he thought he would be useful to them... not because they cared what Dobson thought or sought his input. I also doubt the White House will be consulting Robertson on foreign affairs anytime soon.

I truly doubt that Robertson is consulted on much of anything, with the possible exception of how certain decisions might "play" with the religious right. Even then, Robertson can only speak for a minority that actually follows him anymore. The idea that he has some Svengali sway over this administration is absurd.

Rove's apparent genius aside, I think way too much has been made of the so-called "evangelical vote". The fascination that some political pundits and many in the dead-tree media had over this notion that the "Christian Right" were a make or break issue remind me of sports fans that obssess over how one call by an official determined the outcome of a game.

The "evangelical vote" is a significant voting group, but it is in reality a minority group. It's certainly one that Republicans appeal to and may even, at times, cater to, but it's not a make or break group by any means. It's fairly certain that there are all types of individuals whose political views run the entire political spectrum included in this group. This is not a political bloc that Robertson or any evangelical leader can use as some sort of brokering chip with political leaders.

Yet the myth continues... like the one that we're planning to take over American and institute a theocracy. Oops... did I let the secret plan slip?

 

[mommyoeo]

And pretty darn frightening.

I'd doubt that. As someone who has watched the show and knows PR from my days in VA, he doesn't have very many kind things to say about GWB. He doesn't like Bush's policies, especially on Middle East peace and Israel. I doubt GWB gives him much of his time. They seem to be in different camps on many issues. I don't think either of them would find much in common and neither probably caters to the other.

By the way, for the most part, PR is great.

____

And the church is still separate form the state. That doesn't mean that Christians can't have a say and join their efforts together like every other American group with opinions of how to make the country better.

 

[bubie2.5]

Pat Robertson doesn't speak for me, but neither does he call his followers to Jihad! Unless you think Jihad is funny.

He called for the assasination of an south american president, that´s "Jihad-ey" enough to me.

Nevermind, I just read Independent's comment.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

By the way, for the most part, PR is great.

Well, if you consider calling down hurricanes on cities, suggesting foreign leaders be "taken out", and suggesting God's wrath will fall on a city for daring to teach science (of all things) in school good things, then I suppose I can understand why one might consider Robertson to be "great." I know this is not the total of his message, but his efforts to stir the pot with his followers often overshadows anything of merit he says or does.