TSM standby-less test Oct. 6-9

[magicbob]

I can understand people being frustrated when Disney does something that they see as adversely affecting their experience.

But there are a lot of posts on this board from people who are convinced that they know what is better for Disney as a whole than Disney management does. For example, they are sure that more guests preferred paper FP over FP+, and that any studies Disney does to evaluate that are skewed to produce the results Disney wants. I find it hard to believe that any company that is as successful as Disney would really do that.

So you feel a poll taken that has no negative comment section about a product gives you fair results. This topic was discussed at lengths not long ago. When you do polls or studies like this you have to get positive results. Wish I could remember what post had the actual questionaire on it but alas I don't perhaps someone else can help me out.

My first thought was... Have you READ some of the polls they're using to gather this "data" concerning the general public's attitudes about FP+?

And to steer the thread back to the topic... wouldn't you just love to see the results if they had polled the people who were turned away during this test?

 

[vacationer1954]

For example, they are sure that more guests preferred paper FP over FP+, and that any studies Disney does to evaluate that are skewed to produce the results Disney wants. I find it hard to believe that any company that is as successful as Disney would really do that.

I don't see a difference between what Disney wants and what accurate results would help them understand.

There in lies the problem with so many people, before Disney seemed to balance both. Now they seem to care only about maximizing profits even if customer service and many other aspects suffer.

Again, it has been like this for over twenty years. Is everyone who is complaining people who visited Disney in the early 1990s?

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

Again, it has been like this for over twenty years. Is everyone who is complaining people who visited Disney in the early 1990s?

I didn't visit in the 1990s at all. Our first visit was 2002 and second was 2003. After that, we weren't back until 2007 and have been going yearly since then. I'm not happy with the direction that Disney is going and annoyed with the spend it takes to get anything other new rooms built at Disney. I can tell a difference in our first 9 trips and our trip this past summer and it was a difference for the better. So it isn't just those that have been going since the 1990s that aren't happy.

 

[wisblue]

My first thought was... Have you READ some of the polls they're using to gather this "data" concerning the general public's attitudes about FP+?

And to steer the thread back to the topic... wouldn't you just love to see the results if they had polled the people who were turned away during this test?

The only surveys I've ever received from Disney have asked if there was anything that didn't live up to my expectations.

 

[grimley1968]

I don't see a difference between what Disney wants and what accurate results would help them understand. Again, it has been like this for over twenty years. Is everyone who is complaining people who visited Disney in the early 1990s?

In 1971, 1994 and all the way through 2013 Disney somehow managed to run WDW without ever shutting down a standby line for a functioning ride with no warning. So it's not "been like this for over 20 years."

What difference does it make what decades people visited? For the record I've been going since 1972, and didn't have any major problems with Disney until literally this year.

 

[DizDaD7]

So here's, a question. (sorry if this has been asked already)Is this still happeming, and if so for how long will it happen. We're heading down in 3 weeks, and TSMM is one of our fav,rides. I don't currently have a fp+ for it and would hate to not be able to ride it.

T.I.A.

 

[mesaboy2]

So here's, a question. (sorry if this has been asked already)Is this still happeming, and if so for how long will it happen. We're heading down in 3 weeks, and TSMM is one of our fav,rides. I don't currently have a fp+ for it and would hate to not be able to ride it.

T.I.A.

As the title of the thread strongly implies, it's over for now. No word on if or when it will return.

 

[grimley1968]

So here's, a question. (sorry if this has been asked already)Is this still happeming, and if so for how long will it happen. We're heading down in 3 weeks, and TSMM is one of our fav,rides. I don't currently have a fp+ for it and would hate to not be able to ride it. T.I.A.

This test is over, but it was unannounced, so no one knows if or when they'll pull this again on unsuspecting guests.

 

[Angel Ariel]

The only surveys I've ever received from Disney have asked if there was anything that didn't live up to my expectations.

There were polls that were screenshot and shared here, where there was no negative feedback option. They were posted a while back..maybe march? Before the 4th fp option was available

 

[vacationer1954]

So it isn't just those that have been going since the 1990s that aren't happy.

You misunderstood what I posted. I was think that maybe folks who have been visiting for more than twenty years remember Disney working like this all that time. Maybe not. Maybe some folks were just ready to be upset. Maybe it'll happen to our family someday.

So it's not "been like this for over 20 years."

I'm sorry but similar things have happened. I'm sorry you don't remember them.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

Maybe some folks were just ready to be upset.

Really?? I can say 100% that my family was not "ready to be upset". My 8 year old loves to go to Disney and cried when I told him that he may only get to ride his favorite, Splash Mountain, one time because we have to travel during peak times of summer with crowd levels at 8 and 9 and most years we get 1 day at MK. He remembers going when he was 7 and riding Splash AND BTMR 3 times each with the old system. So was he "ready to be upset" or was he just disappointed that things changed? I love Disney parks. I hate some of the changes they have made and the direction it is going. Nothing more....nothing less. To try and blame and invalidate my families feelings is a bit crazy. "It can't be that Disney is doing something we don't like. It HAS to be that my family was just ready to be annoyed and upset with Disney."

 

[vacationer1954]

Really??

Given that I see things the way I see them which is differently from you, it is among the viable explanations.

"It can't be that Disney is doing something we don't like. It HAS to be that my family was just ready to be annoyed and upset with Disney."

I didn't say that Disney wasn't doing something that people didn't like. I said that they've been doing things that people don't like regularly for twenty years.

 

[Planogirl]

I didn't say that Disney wasn't doing something that people didn't like. I said that they've been doing things that people don't like regularly for twenty years.

I've been around here for a while and I've never seen anything like what I've seen here recently. True that this isn't likely representative of Disney visitors as a whole but it and a few other websites are all we have to go by.

 

[johde]

It's not a fact. It's Disney's opinion, one that is scewed by wanting the most money from it's patrons. There in lies the problem with so many people, before Disney seemed to balance both. Now they seem to care only about maximizing profits even if customer service and many other aspects suffer.

Again, it has been like this for over twenty years. Is everyone who is complaining people who visited Disney in the early 1990s?

I've been visiting WDW since nearly the beginning. My first trip was in 1976. You way it's been like this for 20 years. To that I'd say yes and no. In my opinion, there was a key change 10 years ago that changed the equation at WDW and led us where we are today. Disney started actively starting pushing for volume of customers at the expense of margins. 2001-2001 saw the aftermath of 9/11. Then in 2004, hurricanes Charley and Frances ripped across Orlando. Disney's attendance was hurting. January 1 2005, Disney introduced MYW tickets.

Dec. 31, 2004, a 1 day ticket cost $54.75 and a 5 day park hopper cost $249 (4.5x the 1 day price) The 4 day park hopper cost $219 (4x the 1 day price). 6 and 7 day tickets were only available as park hopper plus tickets that included the water parks.

On January 1, 2005, a 1 day base ticket Jumped to $59.75. But you could now get a 10 park hopper (that expired in 14 days) for $232(3.6* a 1 day price). That's less money than the 5 day ticket the year before. Disney was "penalizing" you for taking a short trip and strongly encouraging you to take a long single trip.

That next fall saw a variety of specials to encourage people to book during hurricane season. "Free Dining", 7 days for the price of 3 on hotels, tickets, and Dining, were just a couple of them.

If you look before and after than time, you can see a change in the numbers and quality of attractions added to the parks.

1992 Splash Mountain
1994 Tower of Terror
1995 Extra Terrorestrial Alien Encounter
1996 Barn Stormer
1998 Buzz Light Year, Fantasmic, Animal Kingdom Park
1999 Test Track, Winnie the Pooh, Rock n Roller Coaster, Journey into Your Imagination, Kali River Rapids
2002 Journey into Imagination W/ Figment
2003 Mission Space, Mickey's Philharmagic, Wishes
2004 Stiches Great Escape, Turtle Talk with Crush,

MYW Introduced Attractions during first couple of years already being constructed.
2005 Soarin', Lights Motors Action
2006 Expedition Everest, Seas with Nemo and Friends, Kim Possible World Showcase Adventure

2007 Monster Inc laugh floor. Grand Fiesta Tour w/ Three Caballeros, Jedi Training Academy, Finding Nemo the Musical
2008 Toy Story Midway Mania
2009 Sum of all Thrills,
2010 Captain EO returns
2011 Mickey at town Square, Disney Jr live
2012 Little Mermaid, Enchanted Tales with Bell, Storybook Circus, Agent P world Showcase
2013 Princess Fairytale Hall
2014 Seven Dwarfs Mine Train

Looking at the attractions before and after that date, you can see a big difference. People who who frequent the the table service restaurant talk about the simpler menus and closer tables since free dining has been around.

Of course the trouble is the strategy that saved them after 9/11 and the hurricanes is coming around to bite them now that the economy is starting to improve slowly. They have theme parks at record attendance that haven't had major expansions in several years (outside of NFL at the MK now). And because most of the expansion has been in hotels and DVC they still have massive numbers of rooms to fill every night.

I think what we are seeing now from New Fantasy Land to FP+ is an attempt at a "quick fix" to allow ever increasing attendance into the park.

 

[vacationer1954]

I believe it goes back twenty years. The decommissioning of Mr. Toad's Wild Ride and Horizons. The ending of Surprise Mornings and introduction of the Character Caravan. Not expanding the monorail. The building of budget resort hotels. Rides that use plywood cutouts instead of well built sets. Maybe these things weren't brought up here on disboards, but I remember there being things to complain about very consistently.

 

[momof2n2]

I've been visiting WDW since nearly the beginning. My first trip was in 1976. You way it's been like this for 20 years. To that I'd say yes and no. In my opinion, there was a key change 10 years ago that changed the equation at WDW and led us where we are today. Disney started actively starting pushing for volume of customers at the expense of margins. 2001-2001 saw the aftermath of 9/11. Then in 2004, hurricanes Charley and Frances ripped across Orlando. Disney's attendance was hurting. January 1 2005, Disney introduced MYW tickets.

Dec. 31, 2004, a 1 day ticket cost $54.75 and a 5 day park hopper cost $249 (4.5x the 1 day price) The 4 day park hopper cost $219 (4x the 1 day price). 6 and 7 day tickets were only available as park hopper plus tickets that included the water parks.

On January 1, 2005, a 1 day base ticket Jumped to $59.75. But you could now get a 10 park hopper (that expired in 14 days) for $232(3.6* a 1 day price). That's less money than the 5 day ticket the year before. Disney was "penalizing" you for taking a short trip and strongly encouraging you to take a long single trip.

That next fall saw a variety of specials to encourage people to book during hurricane season. "Free Dining", 7 days for the price of 3 on hotels, tickets, and Dining, were just a couple of them.

If you look before and after than time, you can see a change in the numbers and quality of attractions added to the parks.

1992 Splash Mountain
1994 Tower of Terror
1995 Extra Terrorestrial Alien Encounter
1996 Barn Stormer
1998 Buzz Light Year, Fantasmic, Animal Kingdom Park
1999 Test Track, Winnie the Pooh, Rock n Roller Coaster, Journey into Your Imagination, Kali River Rapids
2002 Journey into Imagination W/ Figment
2003 Mission Space, Mickey's Philharmagic, Wishes
2004 Stiches Great Escape, Turtle Talk with Crush,

MYW Introduced Attractions during first couple of years already being constructed.
2005 Soarin', Lights Motors Action
2006 Expedition Everest, Seas with Nemo and Friends, Kim Possible World Showcase Adventure

2007 Monster Inc laugh floor. Grand Fiesta Tour w/ Three Caballeros, Jedi Training Academy, Finding Nemo the Musical
2008 Toy Story Midway Mania
2009 Sum of all Thrills,
2010 Captain EO returns
2011 Mickey at town Square, Disney Jr live
2012 Little Mermaid, Enchanted Tales with Bell, Storybook Circus, Agent P world Showcase
2013 Princess Fairytale Hall
2014 Seven Dwarfs Mine Train

Looking at the attractions before and after that date, you can see a big difference. People who who frequent the the table service restaurant talk about the simpler menus and closer tables since free dining has been around.

Of course the trouble is the strategy that saved them after 9/11 and the hurricanes is coming around to bite them now that the economy is starting to improve slowly. They have theme parks at record attendance that haven't had major expansions in several years (outside of NFL at the MK now). And because most of the expansion has been in hotels and DVC they still have massive numbers of rooms to fill every night.

I think what we are seeing now from New Fantasy Land to FP+ is an attempt at a "quick fix" to allow ever increasing attendance into the park.

WHAT a GREAT post! Thank you.
Heh --- no wonder we enjoyed WDW so much from 1994-2009!

 

[Angel Ariel]

I believe it goes back twenty years. The decommissioning of Mr. Toad's Wild Ride and Horizons. The ending of Surprise Mornings and introduction of the Character Caravan. Not expanding the monorail. The building of budget resort hotels. Rides that use plywood cutouts instead of well built sets. Maybe these things weren't brought up here on disboards, but I remember there being things to complain about very consistently.

I just went to look when Mr toad closed because I really thought it was more recent than that..16 years! I really did not think it had been so long...I feel old

 

[vacationer1954]

Yes, 16 years ago. Horizons closed almost 15 years ago. Character Caravan was 13 years ago. I think the dining plan started about the same time. The budget resorts are 20 years old.

 

[momof2n2]

Really?? I can say 100% that my family was not "ready to be upset". My 8 year old loves to go to Disney and cried when I told him that he may only get to ride his favorite, Splash Mountain, one time because we have to travel during peak times of summer with crowd levels at 8 and 9 and most years we get 1 day at MK. He remembers going when he was 7 and riding Splash AND BTMR 3 times each with the old system. So was he "ready to be upset" or was he just disappointed that things changed? I love Disney parks. I hate some of the changes they have made and the direction it is going. Nothing more....nothing less. To try and blame and invalidate my families feelings is a bit crazy. "It can't be that Disney is doing something we don't like. It HAS to be that my family was just ready to be annoyed and upset with Disney."

I'm not embellishing when I share this.
Last year at this time I was lamenting all these changes and the decisions I was needing to make about our May 2014 trip. We had our DCL cruise booked, and two-weeks booked at a vacation rental house. Our original plan was to do 5- or 6-day passes for WDW. At this point last year it was still not clear what was going to be the plight of off-siters. As the new year loomed I finally just brought this angst to the dinner table and shared with my kids (13, 11, 9, 7, 3, infant at the time) what we were possibly up against. My boys, 13 and 11, came away with something like this, "So you mean if we go there, we might not get to ride some of the rides, or we might only get to ride them once?" I confirmed that. They asked what we could do in Florida instead and I shared we'd do Busch Gardens Tampa and SeaWorld and Aquatica. They looked those parks up online and within a day they decided they'd much rather go somewhere new than go back to somewhere they loved and maybe not get to do WDW the way they were used to.

This was a family decision and we did Plan B and had a blast.

Disney changed. I get that. We all get that. Some people are either happy with the change, or find it didn't change their way of enjoying vacation enough to impact the decision to go or not. Others of us see what is being offered right now and know that it is too different to enjoy. My kids enjoyed riding TSMM three times and RnRR three times when we were there. They skipped GMR and Disney Jr. and ToT and other stuff for the chance to do what they like repeatedly.

We weren't "ready to be upset." Well - I guess you can say we were upset, but we were still having a good time... somewhere else. And they spent their hard-earned money they'd saved all year by the bucketful on SeaWorld and BG souvenirs.

 

[vacationer1954]

I suppose we won't see eye to eye.