Tracking Cruising Restart: News and Updates

[sullivan.kscott]

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has seemingly lightened up on its complex cruise regulations, releasing an update to its COVID-19 operation guidelines for cruise lines wanting to operate from U.S. ports under the agency's Conditional Sail Order.

While the CDC stressed its mask order remains in effect, it said that "cruise ship operators, at their discretion, may advise passengers and crew that—if they are fully vaccinated—they may gather or conduct activities outdoors, including engaging in extended meal service or beverage consumption, without wearing a mask except in crowded settings."

The CDC also noted that cruise lines may allow fully vaccinated passengers to go ashore on their own, instead of having to participate in organized group tours.

"Cruise ship operators, at their discretion, may advise passengers and crew that—if they are fully vaccinated—they may engage in self-guided or independent exploration during port stops, if they wear a mask while indoors. The cruise ship operator is additionally advised that foreign jurisdictions may have their own requirements," said the guidelines.

More news is expected to follow on Wednesday afternoon.

https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/...ens-up-on-cruise-mask-and-shore-ex-rules.html
Glad to see the CDC looking at reasonable changes.

Another report from the Royal Caribbean blog (which may be overinterpreting some of the requirements based on the debates I have read here - its blog has a generally negative tone towards the CDC requirements, so keep that in mind):

In the CDC's email, they outlined a few key areas of change:

• Vaccinated passengers are no longer required to wear a mask outside (except in crowded spaces), but unvaccinated passengers still must, including while sunbathing on lounge chairs spaced 6 feet apart and in between bites and sips during outdoor meal service.
• All passengers (vaccinated or not) must still wear a mask in between bites and sips while dining indoors.
• The ban on independent shoreside exploration for all passengers (vaccinated and not) has been moved from a requirement to a recommendation
• Buffets are still prohibited, even on fully vaccinated sailings.
• The new update continues to treat vaccinated sailings the exact same as sailings that include a mix of vaccinated and unvaccinated passengers. It treats vaccinated and unvaccinated passengers differently in some scenarios, but continues to impose the same requirements for cruise ships that require 100% vaccination as compared to those that will allow a mix.

https://www.royalcaribbeanblog.com/2021/05/12/cdc-updates-some-of-its-rules-cruise-ships
I am trying to envision how this would work on lines that don't require vaccinations - people would have to wear some sort of "I am vaccinated" identifier, and no line is going to go there.

It all seems like a back door way to get a vaccine mandate without calling it one. Perhaps in a few months if everything continues going well it won’t matter, but the short term play seems to be toward the mandate by any other name. I continue to say that’s a good thing.

 

[WB1971]

This all just sounds awful. Sad to think how many years of cruising will be ruined. We are at 2 and counting.

 

[mostlytraveling4food]

Aside from participating in a sail away party or the buffet, I’ve never felt I was in a crowded situation.

The really interesting piece is how they will perform muster drills.

My bet, is that CDC eventually issues guidance that you should wear a mask and socially distance, cruising has inherent risks, and that you should just assume that anyone not wearing a mask has been vaccinated.

 

[LambertLion]

Aside from participating in a sail away party or the buffet, I’ve never felt I was in a crowded situation.

The really interesting piece is how they will perform muster drills.

My bet, is that CDC eventually issues guidance that you should wear a mask and socially distance, cruising has inherent risks, and that you should just assume that anyone not wearing a mask has been vaccinated.

Other cruise lines have figured out muster drills quite well. They do a virtual muster. You have it watch a video in your room and at the end of the video, you get a unique code. Then you have like two hours to check in at your muster station. Pretty simple but effective. I hope Disney does theirs similar. No way to do it the old way and not be all crowded.

 

[Intr3pid]

The full wording for the revised mask use:

------------------------------------

Mask Use

At this time, all persons, including port personnel, crew, and passengers are advised that CDC’s Mask Order remains in effect and requires the wearing of masks on conveyances entering, traveling within, or leaving the United States, and in U.S. transportation hubs. (see Maritime-specific Frequently Asked Questions).

- While the Order permits temporarily removing a mask for brief periods of time while eating or drinking, removal of the mask for extended meal service or beverage consumption would constitute a violation of this Order.

- Masks do not have to be worn while inside one’s own cabin.

- Travelers should not wear a mask when doing activities that may get the mask wet, like swimming at the beach or in recreational water facilities. A wet mask can make it difficult to breathe and may not work as well when wet. This means it is particularly important for bathers to maintain physical distancing of at least 6 feet (2 meters) when in the water with others who are not traveling companions or part of the same family.

Fully Vaccinated Travelers

- Cruise ship operators, at their discretion, may advise passengers and crew that—if they are fully vaccinated—they may gather or conduct activities outdoors, including engaging in extended meal service or beverage consumption, without wearing a mask except in crowded settings.

------------------------------------

This should create the following cruising scenarios:

1. Fully or sufficiently vaccinated cruises

(a) Masks are not required during meals, in water, and in your own cabins including on balconies. This is easy to implement.

(b) If you can control crowds on the pool deck and create a true outdoors area, masks are not required. This will be very difficult to enforce, however. I don't expect many cruise lines to go down this path.

(c) Masks are not required on private islands representing a true outdoors environment - though any indoors spots at the islands will still impose the requirements.

I think these cruises will be marketed primarily at those traveling without young kids (until we have vaccine approvals for kids under 12). We aren't going to see too many young families on NCL, for example, for the time being. This will also work well for adults-focused cruises, including premium/luxury categories.

2. Cruises not requiring vaccines or not meeting the 95% hurdle

(a) Masks are required everywhere on board except in water and inside your cabins (incl. balconies). You can temporarily remove them while dining.

(b) You still need masks on the private islands.

I think Disney, Carnival, and RCL will fall in this category for the sheer number of young families cruising with them. RCL and Carnival could temporarily restrict the cruises to 12+ ages, but they also have so many more ships to fill. We might see them divide their fleet or brands into those requiring vaccines and those that are not.

 

[BadPinkTink]

What was the guidance from the CDC in the UK that led DCL to not require, but recommend masks for children 10 and under?

The American CDC has no jurisdiction in Europe. The Magic for the UK summer cruises has to comply with the UK Government Guidance For Cruise Ships

The mask requirements for children on The Magic UK sailings is from The UK Government Face Coverings Requirements and Recommendations

Children under the age of 11 do not need to wear a face covering (Public Health England does not recommend face coverings for children under the age of 3 for health and safety reasons)

 

[lanejudy]

But can't the cruise lines still make their own rules, such as requiring vaccinations of all passengers?

Yes, they can make stricter rules than the guidance if they so choose.

 

[Princess Merida]

The American CDC has no jurisdiction in Europe. The Magic for the UK summer cruises has to comply with the UK Government Guidance For Cruise Ships

The mask requirements for children on The Magic UK sailings is from The UK Government Face Coverings Requirements and Recommendations

Children under the age of 11 do not need to wear a face covering (Public Health England does not recommend face coverings for children under the age of 3 for health and safety reasons)

Lol.. I thought there was a separate CDC there. Thanks for the info! I hope our government or the cruise lines adopt a similar policy. Hopefully we will find out soon!

Edited to add: Any guess from anyone on when the Florida judge will come to a decision?

 

[kathi]

Interesting concept that DCL/Carnival/RCL could elect to have both fully vaccinated and 95/98% vaccinated cruises. That could make everyone happy (although some folks would need to change their booking). We are fully vaccinated and with the new mask guidance, I’m not inclined to pay DCL concierge prices and still have the stricter mask requirements.

 

[AquaDame]

Interesting concept that DCL/Carnival/RCL could elect to have both fully vaccinated and 95/98% vaccinated cruises. That could make everyone happy (although some folks would need to change their booking). We are fully vaccinated and with the new mask guidance, I’m not inclined to pay DCL concierge prices and still have the stricter mask requirements.

I still would be happier masked if vaccination were not required to sail; obviously if almost everyone is on the ship then I'd feel comfortable without masks even in crowds. Carnival and RCL especially with the number of ships they have could run both... and see which works better for them.

 

[brentm77]

Any guess from anyone on when the Florida judge will come to a decision?

It's almost impossible to predict. The oral hearing seemed rather standard, but long from what I can determine. The transcript is not available yet, but one news report said the judge asked Florida how it planned to regulate cruises if the injunction was issued. I think the judge is genuinely considering the issue, but I will still be surprised if he issues the injunction. Legal merits aside, I just don't see many judges making bold decisions. They take the path or least resistance. I also think there are legal concerns with Florida's arguments, including standing problems.

The judge could issue the order any day, or take weeks.

 

[brentm77]

Royal Caribbean is not requiring masks atPerfect Day. "At Perfect Day at CocoCay, because it is our private destination and everybody who lives on the island will have the vaccination and all guests will be vaccinated who are 18 and older, you will not have to wear a mask when you're at Perfect Day at CocoCay. . ." Note, this is because the ship is not sailing from the US. This would not be allowed if the sailing was subject to CDC jurisdiction.

I love to see the above, as I think both science and common sense dictate dropping masks for vaccinated groups, particularly outdoors. I know some here lean towards the super cautious, slow lifting of restrictions. I genuinely understand those arguments, can see where people are coming from, and don't think my opinion is better - just different. I tend to be a little less risk adverse and willing to take a small level of risk to start getting back to normal life post-vaccination.

 

[sabrecmc]

My July 2 DCL cruise is now gone from My Reservations

 

[My2Kidzmom]

My July 2 DCL cruise is now gone from My Reservations

As is my July 17th DCL cruise. I kinda knew it was coming but still sad

 

[DisneyKrayzie2]

As is my July 17th DCL cruise. I kinda knew it was coming but still sad

our July 17th is gone too, just a couple days ago we though we were actually going to be going and started getting excited.

 

[brentm77]

I know the pending July cancelations are disappointing. But does anyone else feel a momentum change happening?

Between the bill that bypasses Canada to open Alaska cruising passing the Senate (and the House expected to pass it), the CDC catching up to the science on vaccinated individuals' real risk levels, California expected to widely open in June (and drop masks for most things), the CDC giving every indication it actually wants sailings to resume and even loosening some restrictions, and Disney indicating there will be changes to their park capacity and restrictions, I have the impression that there is an accelerating momentum shift regarding pandemic that makes me hopeful about the near-term future in the US. I think our biggest hurdles ahead won't be from restrictions, but from logistics and material and labor supplies desperately trying to catch up.

I could see some quick advances in cruising in the next two months and possibly quick pull back of restrictions while sailing once they have sailed for a month or two (especially for some non-DCL lines).

Update: The tide is turning fast - no more masks outdoors at Universal Orlando (and indoors in Costco, Walmart where states/localities allow it).

 

[Princess Merida]

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/busine...0210519-yu5wgqmcpnaetileu6ga25nuqm-story.html

 

[brentm77]

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/busine...0210519-yu5wgqmcpnaetileu6ga25nuqm-story.html

I pulled the court docket this morning to get the details. The judge ordered that the parties mediate by June 1. He is hoping the parties can reach a resolution so he doesn't need to make a ruling on the motion for preliminary injunction. I do think it is a sign he is at least sympathetic to Florida's position, as I think many judges would have simply denied the preliminary injunction motion (which is by far the most common result). But, I am sure the biggest reason for forcing mediation is a sense that the parties could reach a resolution given recent developments from the CDC.

I am hopeful that Florida will mediate in good faith and the parties can agree on a path forward that helps the cruise lines a bit, but I have my doubts given the political optics of the case. In a perfect world, in my humble opinion, Florida would cave on allowing vaccination requirements on ships leaving its ports, and the CDC would drop some of the harsher requirements.

 

[Intr3pid]

I know the pending July cancelations are disappointing. But does anyone else feel a momentum change happening?

Between the bill that bypasses Canada to open Alaska cruising passing the Senate (and the House expected to pass it), the CDC catching up to the science on vaccinated individuals' real risk levels, California expected to widely open in June (and drop masks for most things), the CDC giving every indication it actually wants sailings to resume and even loosening some restrictions, and Disney indicating there will be changes to their park capacity and restrictions, I have the impression that there is an accelerating momentum shift regarding pandemic that makes me hopeful about the near-term future in the US. I think our biggest hurdles ahead won't be from restrictions, but from logistics and material and labor supplies desperately trying to catch up.

I could see some quick advances in cruising in the next two months and possibly quick pull back of restrictions while sailing once they have sailed for a month or two (especially for some non-DCL lines).

Update: The tide is turning fast - no more masks outdoors at Universal Orlando (and indoors in Costco, Walmart where states/localities allow it).

Domestic reopenings will very well be the theme this summer and the next. The experience of places such as Australia (and others in Asia) tell us that if you get the virus under control, you can operate normally within your borders.

International travel, not so much. Vaccination requirements themselves are a major restriction, as more than half of the US isn't there yet - and it's looking likely that the number won't get above 60% anytime soon (if ever). I am expecting a trend towards travel bubbles in 2022 - like between North America and Europe.

 

[brentm77]

I pulled the court docket this morning to get the details. The judge ordered that the parties mediate by June 1. He is hoping the parties can reach a resolution so he doesn't need to make a ruling on the motion for preliminary injunction. I do think it is a sign he is at least sympathetic to Florida's position, as I think many judges would have simply denied the preliminary injunction motion (which is by far the most common result). But, I am sure the biggest reason for forcing mediation is a sense that the parties could reach a resolution given recent developments from the CDC.

I am hopeful that Florida will mediate in good faith and the parties can agree on a path forward that helps the cruise lines a bit, but I have my doubts given the political optics of the case. In a perfect world, in my humble opinion, Florida would cave on allowing vaccination requirements on ships leaving its ports, and the CDC would drop some of the harsher requirements.

Small update - Mediation is set for 9:30 a.m. on May 27, 2021.