Tipping is it really necessary??!!

[DAD AT DISNEY]

This argument makes no sense. If Disney paid their employees more money, then the price of the cruise would go up and you would still be paying this money. I wish that Disney would just do what other cruise ships do and make the tips an absolute part of the cost of the cruise. You would pay $10 to $12 more per person, per day to cruise. Then we wouldn't be having these, sometimes, heated discussions. The employees on the ship, that work 70 hour weeks, for 6 months with no days off, deserve to make living wage.

The employees that work 70 hour weeks, for 6 months with no days off are not forced to work on the ship. If they don't like the hours, go find another job!!

 

[Forever42]

And I find your second paragraph shocking and offensive - 'I can afford to take a cruise, but if you can't afford the cruise and tips then go away!'
Saving for another year is not a realistic solution for most people - each year the cost goes up and for some the price increase will be equal to or greater than their saving rate. I am no socialist and I don't think some organization should step in to make sure everybody can afford a cruise, but telling people they don't deserve a cruise if they can't afford any more than what they already have to pay is elitist and rude. I am glad Tinkerone's friend was able to take her daughters on a cruise, and I hope I never develop an elitist attitude that some people don't deserve to be able to fulfill their dreams.

This is a completely unrealistic idea. No, everyone does not "deserve" to cruise - my husband and I are fortunate and lucky that we were able to save for a couple years to go on our cruise, but it's not a RIGHT to have a vacation. That's unfortunate. But in the end, it's not a right.

You shouldn't live beyond your means, you shouldn't take on purchases that you can't afford. No, everyone does not deserve to cruise, and that's not elitist, or rude. That's exactly the problem with the economy today - people living beyond their means.

 

[Mickeyhugger]

This argument makes no sense. If Disney paid their employees more money, then the price of the cruise would go up and you would still be paying this money. I wish that Disney would just do what other cruise ships do and make the tips an absolute part of the cost of the cruise. You would pay $10 to $12 more per person, per day to cruise. Then we wouldn't be having these, sometimes, heated discussions. The employees on the ship, that work 70 hour weeks, for 6 months with no days off, deserve to make living wage.

Rob

 

[Tent Camping Mom]

The idea of DCL paying their employees peanuts and asking us to make up for it is insane? I know all about how the "cruise industry" works, but why is this our problem to pay their employees.

It's not just the "cruise industry" it's also the "restaurant industry"...actually it's "any tipped positions in the USA."

It's our problem because we support our law makers. Until the laws change, it's going to remain customary for us to pay the tipped workers their wages.

I don't know about other states, but Alabama employers who have tipped employees, uses these guidelines to abide by the law and pay the minimum they can get away with:

Waiters, waitresses and other employees who receive tips on a regular basis start out at $2.13 per hour. If they make at least the minimum wage per hour and above the employer does not have to pay any additional wages. However, if a tipped employee’s tips make up less than minimum wage that employer is required to make up the difference.

That's why I always pay at least the minimum for any service in a tipped position.

 

[mommasita]

We could and ARE beating this subject to death.

We all have our viewpoints on what we should do, and can not convince anyone opposing that otherwise. Or at least that is what it seems.

Belittling others is against DIS guidelines, so please keep this in mind folks. Sarcasm is not needed, and really does nothing but heat this subject more that it already is. This also is against DIS guidelines, so maybe we all should just turn the other cheek here.

 

[DAD AT DISNEY]

We could and ARE beating this subject to death.

We all have our viewpoints on what we should do, and can not convince anyone opposing that otherwise. Or at least that is what it seems.

Belittling others is against DIS guidelines, so please keep this in mind folks. Sarcasm is not needed, and really does nothing but heat this subject more that it already is. This also is against DIS guidelines, so maybe we all should just turn the other cheek here.

I think everyone is getting along just fine. We are just having a friendly discussion.

 

[Tent Camping Mom]

I think everyone is getting along just fine. We are just having a friendly discussion.

I agree.

 

[adlgel]

This is a completely unrealistic idea. No, everyone does not "deserve" to cruise - my husband and I are fortunate and lucky that we were able to save for a couple years to go on our cruise, but it's not a RIGHT to have a vacation. That's unfortunate. But in the end, it's not a right.

You shouldn't live beyond your means, you shouldn't take on purchases that you can't afford. No, everyone does not deserve to cruise, and that's not elitist, or rude. That's exactly the problem with the economy today - people living beyond their means.

I second this. While in a pie in the sky world, everyone could afford everything they want, that's not the world we live in. We need to make choices about how we spend our money. And as the current economic crisis has shown, there are repercussions to spending beyond your means. While yes it was nice that Tinkertone's friend was able to take her 2 daughters on a cruise, was it also nice that the server and assistant server waiting on them lost out on $28/$21 per day for the duration of their cruise? Is the happiness of Tinkertone's friend more important than that of the servers (or the families they are supporting with their tips)?

 

[mhsjax]

The employees that work 70 hour weeks, for 6 months with no days off are not forced to work on the ship. If they don't like the hours, go find another job!!

well if that were the case in the workforce then you my friend would feel it in the the clothing and toys that you purchase. I am sure that you have seen the slave labor practices in new reports. If Disney and other companies couldn't find people to work for that amount of money we would all be paying alot higher practices, and before anyone flames me, Yes I thing it is a deplorable practice, but all companies are out to make a buck and usually greedy. By the way, we tip more than the suggested amount.

 

[DAD AT DISNEY]

well if that were the case in the workforce then you my friend would feel it in the the clothing and toys that you purchase. I am sure that you have seen the slave labor practices in new reports. If Disney and other companies couldn't find people to work for that amount of money we would all be paying alot higher practices, and before anyone flames me, Yes I thing it is a deplorable practice, but all companies are out to make a buck and usually greedy. By the way, we tip more than the suggested amount.

Then why isn't DCL under the microscope like the clothing and toy companies are?

 

[dursin]

I support anyone's right to be "anti-tipping". However, I think it is then unfair of someone who is of an anti-tipping belief to willingly choose to patronize establishments where tipping is expected and customary (meaning those establishments where the wages paid to the employees are below minimum wage and expected to be significantly supplemented by their receipt of tips). If you choose to eat at a sit-down service restaurant or go on a Disney Cruise, in my mind you are making the choice to avail yourself of a service where tipping is customary and expected. If you are "anti-tipping", then don't make those choices.

One of the differences with a cruise is that there is 75-90 days between the time you can no longer get a refund and the time you actually go on the cruise. Financial emergencies can arise during that time period which could effect a persons ability to pay the full recommended gratuities. When you walk into a restaurant, not much changes between the time you order your meal and the time comes to pay the check.

 

[adlgel]

I think the situation you describe is quite the exception and not the scenario that was raised by the OP and is under general discussion here.

 

[adlgel]

Then why isn't DCL under the microscope like the clothing and toy companies are?

Maybe because Disney isn't violating any labor laws.

 

[mhsjax]

Then why isn't DCL under the microscope like the clothing and toy companies are?

Probably cause even though the pay is horrible, the working conditions are not as deplorable as those depicted in the news, and they are getting tips so it does make up the difference. That would be my guess.

 

[Tent Camping Mom]

Maybe because Disney isn't violating any labor laws.

Exactly. They are abiding by the laws.

Until the laws change, it's going to remain customary for the customers to pay the tipped position wages.

 

[DAD AT DISNEY]

Exactly. They are abiding by the laws.

Until the laws change, it's going to remain customary for the customers to pay the tipped position wages.

Or you could look at it this way......when we quit tipping, the cruise industry will no longer receive free labor. They will be asking for better wages from DCL.

 

[Tent Camping Mom]

If we quit tipping, we wouldn't be hurting DCL but we would be hurting the CMs. DCL would be required to up their wages to the federal minimum wage...just a tiny pinhole in DCL's pocketbook. The service would definitely not be to par...who would want to work 70 hours a week on minimum wage?

 

[Mickeyhugger]

Or you could look at it this way......when we quit tipping, the cruise industry will no longer receive free labor. They will be asking for better wages from DCL.

Or you could look at it this way... when they are no longer in a tipped position there is little to no incentive for them to bust their butts and provide quality service.

Rob

 

[Silly Little Pixie]

And I find your second paragraph shocking and offensive - 'I can afford to take a cruise, but if you can't afford the cruise and tips then go away!'
Saving for another year is not a realistic solution for most people - each year the cost goes up and for some the price increase will be equal to or greater than their saving rate. I am no socialist and I don't think some organization should step in to make sure everybody can afford a cruise, but telling people they don't deserve a cruise if they can't afford any more than what they already have to pay is elitist and rude. I am glad Tinkerone's friend was able to take her daughters on a cruise, and I hope I never develop an elitist attitude that some people don't deserve to be able to fulfill their dreams.

It's elitist and rude to have the money for all the cruise expenses? It's not about "deserving" a cruise. It's about the affordability of one. There are more affordable lines than Disney, for sure. I saw NCL advertise $249/pp for an inside room on a 7 day Western today. Probably not as magical as DCL, but probably still a good time to be had.

If it's elitist to need the money to pay for things, well then, on my next trip I want to stay at AKL! Because that's what my family really wants, even though we only have enough money to stay at POP or POR...

In all seriousness, Disney is a very expensive cruise line. It's not realistic for someone to save the cruise fare (in the thousands of dollars) and not manage to also save the amount for tips (a few hundred max)? Surely anyone who can afford even a cat 12 room, does pretty okay with saving and budgeting. Most Americans couldn't afford it, to begin with. DCL charges what they charge, because they're a business and want to maximize their profits. As do all businesses. Most of us book far in advance, not only to save money but to have enough time to save up for the cruise. And many people do indeed postpone when circumstances arise and they don't have enough money to comfortably justify the expense. It's sad when it happens, but it does.

 

[mhsjax]

Or you could look at it this way......when we quit tipping, the cruise industry will no longer receive free labor. They will be asking for better wages from DCL.

And then Disney up up their price for cruising accordingly, and then you can complain that they raised the prices. I don't care either way myself, I just want to make sure that if they continue to pay the amount that they do, I will absolutely tip the recommended amount. Those people bust their butts.