Things that make you shake your head!

[DMRick]

That wasn't said just for you. But I have yet to meet someone myself, who would agree to double their taxes to help the people many on this thread think need help to make good choices. I know I'm not willing to pay twice the taxes I pay already.

We are screaming for help at these places, so I'm sure you know you are appreciated if you are donating time and money to educate them. Again, we need to catch them young.

I'm already involved, no need to assume I'm just blowing smoke.

 

[DMRick]

Mich Minnie..the OP actually wasn't sure (see a later post) if there was also food in the cart..she didn't look. So it's guessing as to how much of the cost was candy.

This is a shame. Makes me very angry to see where my tax dollars go. I used to work in a grocery store in high school and a family would come in every day and do things like this. They were just total burn outs. They'd spend $100 on lottery tickets and then go back to the meat counter and buy 2 whole New York Strips ($70 each). They'd use food stamps for the meat then buy a couple cartons of cigarettes!

 

[zscfan]

I think we all can agree that some (probably most) people on welfare and/or food stamps are correctly using it as a temporary help to get over a few bumps in the road.

However, the government needs to do more to weed out the people who are way too comfortable and see welfare as a life/career choice. Unfortunately, I see that more and more often.

 

[DMRick]

I don't think I'll see that in my lifetime. No way can you punish the parents without punishing the children.

However, the government needs to do more to weed out the people who are way too comfortable and see welfare as a life/career choice. Unfortunately, I see that more and more often.

 

[nunzia]

But we weren't talking about this type of person. At least, I should say, we have no idea if this type of person is what we were talking about. We were talking about someone in a market, who may or may not have spent a lot of money on candy with foodstamps, since the OP didn't really look in her cart to see what else she may have had to cost $174.
It's the judging of what we don't know that is troublesome IMO.

I think I am reading that when you were on food stamps it was OK because everyone could tell..you had paper food stamps. But now that the government has tried to give people a little pride and give them a card, that looks much like other people's charge card it's less likely people will comment on what is being bought, and you feel that is wrong? That it is being abused more now, since people can't always tell who is using food stamps? So maybe they will get to buy certain items and not feel the distain of those around them?

I think you are saying that because it's our tax dollars, we have the right to watch and judge what is being bought?

Will you as the taxpayer also get to decide for those who are on medicaid, which medical treatments they are worthy of? Maybe just the necessities, like vaccines, but not the expensive chemo?

And the schools we pay taxes on, should those who are poor not be allowed to take the extra classes, like music, or should they just be allowed to take reading writing and arithmatic. Because if they aren't paying into the tax system, why should they be allowed the extra's?

Sure starts to sound like a different country to me.

Sure, my tax dollars are being spent in ways that may not benefit me, but really, in spite of what many people here are saying, there are a lot of people this system is helping, that is short term (we are certainly seeing that here, just by those posting they were or are on food stamps). Watching what people put in their cart in a supermarket and commenting to them or the person next to you to try to embarrasse them will never help the situation and may hurt those like the people on this board who need some help, that are trying to hold it together.

Well..not to judge but certainly to have an opinion on what I constitute a good use of tax dolalrs. Do you trust the governemtn to do this? I don't, even though that's all we have. Slippery slope once again..No, I'm not going to 'judge' if someone needs chemo on Medicaid..a doctor does that..I'm not 'judging' if someone buys 174.00 worth of candy, but why should my tax dollars go to that? yes, I think maybe it's good to have the paper food stamps..maybe making it a little harder can be a good thing..maybe not..people who have pride and want to take care of themselves and not rely on you and me to do the work for them probably won't care one way or the other. I never said people shouldn't have help or pride..I've said that when you are in that position of needing help you should maybe be considerate and thoughtful of those who are helping and treat the gift with respect. WIC is regulated and no one seems to have an issue with that. Why shouldn't food stamps? And why shouldn't food stamps have a requirement that the user show ID to prove they are using the gift? It is a gift..from us, with the government as the middle man. I don't agree with ALOT the government does and how it spends money I and you work hard for..I have an opinion on how it's spent..don't you? I'd rather food stamps go to help those truly in need get wholesome food..I'd like there not to be abuse, and I'd like our goverment to be a better steward. There's only so much to go around, so I'd like it to be used in a more repsonsible fashion in many ways. I'm not a big old baddie because I want my tax dollars spent well instead of foolishly.

 

[Grammyof2]

These threads never go well and I try very hard not to respond but since today I experienced something this thread has touched on I feel the need to have my say.

First there are abuses in every program and it is not only the poor that abuse the system but they seem to get the wrath of “These are our tax dollars.” and have little voice to be heard.

I am a retired Home Economics teacher and not by choice. This program has been basically removed from all school systems and is usually called Family and Consumer Science where it does exist. We do not teach our children about budgets and shopping and real life experiences they need to know about because of budget cuts. Many of the households the children come from do not have the knowledge themselves to teach these things so the kids have no way of knowing without guidance.

I have always been very active in my community and taught in a very poor school district. I have forged relationships with many kids though the years and try to remain active in their lives whenever possible. Today I accompanied several girls to the grocery with their WIC checks to help them choose. WIC has very strict guidelines about what you can purchase. Each grocery store seems to have their interpretation of what is permitted and what is not. The WIC checks used today clearly stated store brand cheese only but the only cheese we were permitted to get was Kraft Deli Deluxe cheese which was a full $2.00 more than the store brand. Peanut butter must be store brand but the sale item this week was Skippy peanut butter and you could get twice as much for the same price but it is not allowed per WIC guidelines. One girl wanted to buy Old Fashioned Oats for her cereal allotment but it was not permitted yet she could purchase single serving instant. I want to add the three girls I went with today are working through a local training program and trying very hard to improve their lives. This is just to show that even a very controlled program such as WIC doesn’t always make the choices some would consider the best choices.

I also shop with EBT for several disabled/elderly community members. We sit each month and make out menus and try very hard to use their allotments in a way that allows them the best nutritional and financial value. If anyone thinks you can buy a cart load of fresh fruits and vegetables with food stamps they aren’t being realistic. Those things are terribly expensive.

I personally shop for a disabled elderly couple whom receive $138 a month in food stamps and have a monthly income of $1200. They both worked their entire lives and have outlived their savings due to serious illness. Really $138 doesn’t go far for a cart of healthy foods.

The poor are not the only folks who feel entitled. There are more than a few on the DIS and they have all saved enough money to keep them forever and would never be in a situation where they may need help. Those folks are only blowing smoke up their own stacks.

As far as making bad choices – having a child with a man or woman that years later turned out to be a bad choice you shouldn’t have to pay for is a giant joke to me. Do you have any idea of the divorce rate and all those folks aren’t the working poor.

Just in case you didn’t know WIC checks are paper checks and everyone knows you are using them and in my neck of the woods you need to have them approved at the courtesy counter before you ever make it to the check out.

I don’t pretend to be an expert on EBT or WIC but do know my own experiences. It is not a way of life I would choose if given a choice but I am not ashamed to use them when shopping for those less fortunate then myself. I could care less what anyone behind me in line thinks. I am at least doing something to try to help someone in need. Instead of complaining I feel that I am at least helping in some small way.

Now do I condone buying a ton of candy? Of course not but by the OP’s own admission she is not even sure that happened. I have read the budget board for years and there is tons of abuses right here. You don’t have to shame a stranger in the store to see one. I see people on here with designer shoes and bags and having more and more kids depending on public assistance and staying at the Poly for a trip because the values are beneath them. Truly I don’t know how they do it but they must be bringing in more money than public assistance.

If you think the government deciding what you should purchase that would be healthy is a good suggestion take a hard look at government controlled school lunches as someone earlier mentioned. Watch Food Nation and see what the government feeds your children.

Remember that the more the government decides for others will eventually become what they decide for you too. Be careful what you wish for.

The whole point of this post is it does not make me feel superior to others to look down my nose at them. Until you walk in their shoes don’t judge. Too many judgments are made on this board everyday. A person complaining that if they can post on a message board then they should give up internet to afford other things is a classic example. The internet is available many places and it costs nothing to use. We are all quick to jump to conclusions.

I have real concerns about where my tax dollars go but if 75% of those receiving food stamps use them as intended I am happy to see tax dollars go there. Eating is a necessity. Much of what our tax dollars pay for are not.

 

[DMRick]

That was a wonderfully written letter (much better said than anything I wrote)..thanks so much for your point of view.

These threads never go well and I try very hard not to respond but since today I experienced something this thread has touched on I feel the need to have my say.

First there are abuses in every program and it is not only the poor that abuse the system but they seem to get the wrath of “These are our tax dollars.” and have little voice to be heard.

I am a retired Home Economics teacher and not by choice. This program has been basically removed from all school systems and is usually called Family and Consumer Science where it does exist. We do not teach our children about budgets and shopping and real life experiences they need to know about because of budget cuts. Many of the households the children come from do not have the knowledge themselves to teach these things so the kids have no way of knowing without guidance.

I have always been very active in my community and taught in a very poor school district. I have forged relationships with many kids though the years and try to remain active in their lives whenever possible. Today I accompanied several girls to the grocery with their WIC checks to help them choose. WIC has very strict guidelines about what you can purchase. Each grocery store seems to have their interpretation of what is permitted and what is not. The WIC checks used today clearly stated store brand cheese only but the only cheese we were permitted to get was Kraft Deli Deluxe cheese which was a full $2.00 more than the store brand. Peanut butter must be store brand but the sale item this week was Skippy peanut butter and you could get twice as much for the same price but it is not allowed per WIC guidelines. One girl wanted to buy Old Fashioned Oats for her cereal allotment but it was not permitted yet she could purchase single serving instant. I want to add the three girls I went with today are working through a local training program and trying very hard to improve their lives. This is just to show that even a very controlled program such as WIC doesn’t always make the choices some would consider the best choices.

I also shop with EBT for several disabled/elderly community members. We sit each month and make out menus and try very hard to use their allotments in a way that allows them the best nutritional and financial value. If anyone thinks you can buy a cart load of fresh fruits and vegetables with food stamps they aren’t being realistic. Those things are terribly expensive.

I personally shop for a disabled elderly couple whom receive $138 a month in food stamps and have a monthly income of $1200. They both worked their entire lives and have outlived their savings due to serious illness. Really $138 doesn’t go far for a cart of healthy foods.

The poor are not the only folks who feel entitled. There are more than a few on the DIS and they have all saved enough money to keep them forever and would never be in a situation where they may need help. Those folks are only blowing smoke up their own stacks.

As far as making bad choices – having a child with a man or woman that years later turned out to be a bad choice you shouldn’t have to pay for is a giant joke to me. Do you have any idea of the divorce rate and all those folks aren’t the working poor.

Just in case you didn’t know WIC checks are paper checks and everyone knows you are using them and in my neck of the woods you need to have them approved at the courtesy counter before you ever make it to the check out.

I don’t pretend to be an expert on EBT or WIC but do know my own experiences. It is not a way of life I would choose if given a choice but I am not ashamed to use them when shopping for those less fortunate then myself. I could care less what anyone behind me in line thinks. I am at least doing something to try to help someone in need. Instead of complaining I feel that I am at least helping in some small way.

Now do I condone buying a ton of candy? Of course not but by the OP’s own admission she is not even sure that happened. I have read the budget board for years and there is tons of abuses right here. You don’t have to shame a stranger in the store to see one. I see people on here with designer shoes and bags and having more and more kids depending on public assistance and staying at the Poly for a trip because the values are beneath them. Truly I don’t know how they do it but they must be bringing in more money than public assistance.

If you think the government deciding what you should purchase that would be healthy is a good suggestion take a hard look at government controlled school lunches as someone earlier mentioned. Watch Food Nation and see what the government feeds your children.

Remember that the more the government decides for others will eventually become what they decide for you too. Be careful what you wish for.

The whole point of this post is it does not make me feel superior to others to look down my nose at them. Until you walk in their shoes don’t judge. Too many judgments are made on this board everyday. A person complaining that if they can post on a message board then they should give up internet to afford other things is a classic example. The internet is available many places and it costs nothing to use. We are all quick to jump to conclusions.

I have real concerns about where my tax dollars go but if 75% of those receiving food stamps use them as intended I am happy to see tax dollars go there. Eating is a necessity. Much of what our tax dollars pay for are not.

 

[Leajess99]

I was at Walmart this morning doing the weekly shop. I came across this couple shopping for candy in the Halloween section. 2 adorable little kids. The mom started talking to me. Telling me how they are having a huge Halloween party and they had to buy lots of candy for said party. Well, that's wonderful, have fun I said back. I happened to get in the check out line behind them and she is talking back and forth between the cashier and myself about this great party. $172 worth of candy she bought!! Anyway, long story short she pulls out her card and I hear her tell the cashier it will be EBT-food stamps! I almost lost it right there! It makes me sick that some of us are there working our tail ends off and this person can throw a party and our tax $ paid for it!! I don't mind that the help is there for people who need it but, that is just not right!! Am I wrong to feel like that??

This happened to me a couple of years ago at Easter. This woman was making Easter baskets for her kids, grandkids, daughter's boyfriend's kids, etc and then bought a turkey and it cost well over $100 and she paid with EBT-Food stamps. I was livid. I know many who miss the cutoff by a couple of dollars and who struggle but can't qualify then you have these ones that buy all this junk and the ones who can afford cigarettes and alcohol and whatnot.

I used to have a neighbor who was getting all forms of welfare and she owned 2 cars (not cheap ones either as one was a Mercury Mountaineer and the other was a Nissan sedan). Her kids were always dressed in name brand and Nike clothes and had the best of everything to include numerous game systems. It really blew me away. I did find out when our kids were 4 that she was caught trafficking in drugs. Guess that explained how some of that extra money was coming into play. Very sad for her kids especially since she was in jail/halfway house.

 

[mjbaby]

I think they're all supposed to be taking cooking lessons from that Duggar woman's website - how to cook up a mess of ground meat and cheap starches to feed an army on $50 a week.

Of course, then people will complain about how their diet of hamburger and white starches is contributing to the obesity epidemic and be all outraged over the idea that the taxpayers might be paying for their health care.

Ain't it the truth. It's funny to me how the same people who want oversight over who gets to eat what (and when), who gets to vacation (including how often and in what fashion), who gets to carry cell phones (and with what features) and who has clearance for leisure pursuits (such as cable television) are so often the same ones who think that da gubmint shouldn't have any say whatsoever in how they lives their lives. The social contract applies only to the great un-named others who are safe to ignore because such misfortune could never, ever happen to them.

As for this issue specifically, we live in a world where teaching children to cook is either considered anti-feminist or not academically sound and wherein thousands upon thousands of children right here in the US live in sub-standard housing without adequate kitchen and hygiene facilities. Where's a hard-working, deserving, poor-and-yet-hoping-to-pay-taxes-someday mama (the only kind worth caring about, apparently) supposed to be baking her whole-wheat (flour bought on sale with a coupon!) bread if there is no oven? How can she water her organic tomatoes for lovingly simmered homemade pasta sauce when there is no running water?

 

[punkin]

The poor are not the only folks who feel entitled. There are more than a few on the DIS and they have all saved enough money to keep them forever and would never be in a situation where they may need help. Those folks are only blowing smoke up their own stacks.

You are so right. What's the expression...."these people were born on third base and go through life thinking they hit a triple".

 

[Leajess99]

What makes me the maddest about food stamps is that they can use them on any food item in a gas station. So they can go in and get fountain sodas and icees! I see it everyday when I go in. Grown men swiping their food stamp card for 2 candy bars and an icee but I work in their kids school and see how deprived their kids are. It makes me so angry. The other day some man got mad at the cashier because he couldn't buy nachos with food stamps.

There is also a pizza place in town that sells their pizzas cold (its a take and bake place) and you can use food stamps there too! So wrong.

Sounds like Papa Murphy's and since it is not cooked it is acceptable with food Stamps. Honestly, I don't find that wrong as I figure it is a better alternative to some of the frozen pizzas since the toppings are fresh. Kids do like pizza so why punish them because their families cannot afford it?? I am very against the fraud that goes on with foodstamps but a small amount of junk is not an issue. It is when you get into a 100 dollars for candy or a huge amount for cigarettes and alcohol. If you need help than you should be doing everything you can to help yourself while getting a handup. You should NOT treat it as a handout or something you deserve.

 

[WheelCEO]

there is a guy who owns a company that my company purchases products from.. he is a multi-millionaire and he collects unemployment + food stamps. go figure

 

[disneymom3]

There is a family at our school system. Dad was out of work for awhile so kids on reduced lunches. No biggie BUT they all had the updated phones and got new ones every couple of months (4 kids). They had all the new clothes.

I had a friend whose kids went to private school, in otherwords, she paid tuition and her kids got free lunch. How does that work? If you can pay tuition why can't you send your kid to public school and pay for their lunch??
[

Please, if you feel strongly about this subject, consider giving a little of your time as a Resource Mother at your local Health Department (mentors young low income mothers) or call your local Cooperative Extension to ask about volunteering with 4-H or your local SNAP-Ed program.

I would love to do something like that. Do you know if that type of program exists pretty much everywhere?

 

[Leajess99]

The reason WIC works is that it is a very limited program: milk, cheese, cereal,juice, peanut butter. There are no fresh fruits, fresh veggies (or even canned/frozen fruits or veggies) or meats. It is not a complete diet. Think about trying to dictate every food item: steak not ok but hamburger is. chicken thighs are ok but not chicken breast. It can go on and on and on. Think of the resources need to dictate and evaluate every single food item in the grocery store and to keep it updated as new foods come in.

As for "sugary" items, it is such a slippery slope. So, no sodas, candy or cookies. How about a cake mix? What about a bag of sugar and chocolate chips? What about the choice between "regular" applesauce that has sugar added and "natural" that does not. Where do you draw the line and who gets to draw it?

At some point people need to be responsible for themselves.

I work with these people everyday. The ones who will be on public assistance for the rest of their lives. Yes, their food stamps are often twice my monthly grocery budget. I am so glad not to be in their shoes.

Our Wic now gives fruits and vegetables to all participants to include older babies still on baby food. I am glad they have started doing this as it helps more as some people do qualify for WIC but not for food stamps. http://www.fns.usda.gov/wic/benefitsandservices/foodpkgallowances.HTM They have even added bread for some age groups.

 

[Leajess99]

Oh yeah, I 'get' it. You can't afford to buy what she was buying (and having no idea how or why), so shame on her. People on food stamps should buy only cheap stuff, and preferable in a special store (and maybe just store brands) that only has what we (we as in those who pay the taxes, because for sure the person in the OP's story has most likely never worked or paid taxes in their life) judge to he healthy food, built with my tax dollars....RIDICULOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Between my parents they paid taxes for over 100 years combined..but that prob doesn't count.

I'm sorry but I CAN afford to buy what she was buying and I still agree with the pp that this is ridiculous. Feed your children with your food stamps and don't buy hundreds in candy. That is beyond ridiculous and I have also seen it happen here. Unreal that someone feels it is fine that this type of abuse is happening. Oh and for the record, i guess my cousins should all thank you and your parents for their years and years of welfare abuse since The mother on down to the grandchildren are all welfare recipients and have been since I was a kid. They learned the easiest way through life is to sit back and collect food stamps and get everything they can for free. Unfortunately my aunt was unable to teach them anything better even though she worked her butt off for her kids. This one particular kid and her kids and grandkids have no desire to work and welfare has yet to make them get off.

I grew up in a single parent household after my father died on active duty when I was 9. I saw my mom's struggles and we never once qualified for assistance. I stood in the lines for the free food with my mom who was there for my grandparents. I saw the ones there in their jordache and other name brand clothes and shoes waiting on their free food. It was funny how the ones there for family members were not dressed in all the name brand stuff while the ones there for themselves were in name brands.

 

[rumrunnergirl]

.

 

[Leajess99]

If people are living off of what taxpayers contribute, then they have no right to whine about people being judgmental and they should be grateful for any and all help they get. Most(not all) pride themselves on how much they can get from the system. I have a relative on welfare and she brags all the time about this stuff.. She also keeps popping out kids. IMO , they should not give her another check until she gets her tubes tied. Yes, that will be expensive too(she's also on Medicaid) but in the long run it would less of a drain on society.

Obviously, there are some that need help..but, the abuse of the system is rampant. A PP is right, I will not read an article attempting tp excuse the abuse of food stamps. You can call me callous, go ahead. I am callous. I'm that way because I see people who are able bodied and intelligent enough to work brag that all they have to do is have another kid, and the gravy train will keep rolling in. I'm tired and I think many other people are too.

We used to have this thing called "shame" -shame is not always a bad thing. It can motivate a person to get up and do something.

In reference to the bolded, you do realize that soldiers/servicemembers and the Disabled veterans getting disability compensation as well as probably some others are also living off what "taxpayers contribute" right?? I do live off of taxpayers' money but I also paid into the system for many years before my medical issues caused by my military service. Just so it is known that not all getting taxpayers money are on welfare.

 

[Leajess99]

I'm really careful about how I choose my charities now..I don't give to those "adopt a family" programs . I would if it just covered the children..but the adults ask for stuff too, and even the kids ask for stuff that's way overboard(Nintendo DSi's, Ipods, etc). I tend to give to the programs for the elderly, sick children or orphans.

When I was back home after trying to reconcile with my ex, my kids qualified and were placed on the angel tree here. I had to fill out what each one would like for Christmas. I honestly put that my middle one would love a baby doll and my son liked some action figure (way too many years ago to remember). I was in line waiting to pick the stuff that was gotten for them up and the lady behind me was talking about the $600 her dad spent on each kid for Christmas as he was retired from a cigarette manaufacturer (cannot remember the name just remember what they were). She was talking about how they didn't really need this stuff but it was free so why not. I was so irritated and that was the last time I ever accepted help for Christmas. I also stopped doing names on the angel tree except for the one at the Post exchange where it is only military families. I know some of the adults listed on our trees are the adults with special needs, generally mentally delayed, but seeing a request for a Wii for a 3 year old is a bit ridiculous.

 

[DMRick]

I'm sorry but I CAN afford to buy what she was buying and I still agree with the pp that this is ridiculous. Feed your children with your food stamps and don't buy hundreds in candy.

Read on..she isn't sure there wasn't food in the basket adding to the amount she paid. We really don't know how much the candy came to, and in the original note, nothing was mentioned about this being an all adult party.

It was funny how the ones there for family members were not dressed in all the name brand stuff while the ones there for themselves were in name brands.

How could you tell who was getting for themselves and who was picking up for others. I can't tell, and I'm handing the food to them.

Now I'm not sure what to do with the 5 boxes of name brand clothes on my porch from my nephew. I was bringing them to the mission for the next serving day (they recently put out a request for hoodies and long pants (some of which cost a lot of money..you know, the kind that comes with the holes already in them), since the weather is turning cold), but but but..then they'll be accused of wearing name brand clothes instead of paying for their own food. What to do, what to do.

 

[4HppyCamprs]

The system is broken. It is not functioning how intended. How to fix it I am not entirely sure but when my family counts its pennies because so much of our check goes to taxes and somebody I know on all forms of government assistance works the bare minimum in order to get cash but not go over the income limits and quits if she gets close and goes to starbucks and mcdonalds and the bars every weekend, bowling league and baseball games and is on her 9th year of free schooling, had her parents had their house certified as daycare so they would get paid to watch their own grandchildren there is something wrong with the system. Some people need assistance and some people abuse the system. Assistance is not an income and I think some people forget it is supposed to be temporary.