Things not going well with the DDP changes

[keishashadow]

Did that person call the servers greedy?

Guess i'm a person no, i'm union born & bred it's the likely excuse/term that those who don't think it's fair for people to earn a living wage will trot out.

 

[keishashadow]

Please tell me where I called the servers "greedy".

I think the change was two-fold. (1) Cut expenses by eliminating tip and appetizers (about 25-30% of the cost of the 2007 plan) and (2) Move the guests through faster. I would bet money that the 2008 DDP guests are now skipping appetizers instead of paying OOP and cutting the time spent at the table. That means that they can probably seat at least one more family every night and sell more food.

of course you didn't call the servers greedy

unfortunately, many people think it's a dream job (wonder if they ever worked in the service industry-no cakewalk) It strikes a nerve with me, i have seen it both posted & infered here on the boards many times...and it's just so unfair.

much easier to point the finger at the unionized employees for changes to an offering that was well received, in lieu of going back to the source-Disney.

imo, anti-union sentiment is very previlant among those who are in management or are envious of those who do work in a strong union environment.

i thought u were championing them

 

[robinb]

i thought u were championing them

Yup, we're on the same side. Thanks mom2my3kids for digging up my previous post .

I think I understand what you're saying now. You were using my comment to make a general statement and not one specific to me. If the union re-negotiation results in an increase to the DDP which would cover an automatic gratuity some people will blame the "greedy servers" instead of unhappy guests like robemcdo. Then, we'll be back to people complaining that they don't have control over how much they tip ... and the increase in price of course!

 

[keishashadow]

Yup, we're on the same side. Thanks mom2my3kids for digging up my previous post .

I think I understand what you're saying now. You were using my comment to make a general statement and not one specific to me. If the union re-negotiation results in an increase to the DDP which would cover an automatic gratuity some people will blame the "greedy servers" instead of unhappy guests like robemcdo. Then, we'll be back to people complaining that they don't have control over how much they tip ... and the increase in price of course!

you've got it thanks for spelling it out far more eloquently than i did

 

[TLSnell1981]

of course you didn't call the servers greedy

unfortunately, many people think it's a dream job (wonder if they ever worked in the service industry-no cakewalk) It strikes a nerve with me, i have seen it both posted & infered here on the boards many times...and it's just so unfair.

much easier to point the finger at the unionized employees for changes to an offering that was well received, in lieu of going back to the source-Disney.

imo, anti-union sentiment is very previlant among those who are in management or are envious of those who do work in a strong union environment.

i thought u were championing them

I have been in the restaurant buisness.... I worked right beside my employees and never asked them to do anything I wouldn't. Disney servers do have good jobs. They can count on a stable income in restaurants that are continuously full.

I personally think it is unfair for a superior employee to not only have to take up the slack for a lousy one, but to also receive the same pay......regardless of your work ethic. Unions make it very difficult to fire an employee that is underperforming.

Unions were introduced long before fair labor laws were. Times and things have changed. The only ones truly benefiting nowadays from the union......is the union.

 

[keishashadow]

I have been in the restaurant buisness.... I worked right beside my employees and never asked them to do anything I wouldn't. Disney servers do have good jobs. They can count on a stable income in restaurants that are continuously full.

I personally think it is unfair for a superior employee to not only have to take up the slack for a lousy one, but to also receive the same pay......regardless of your work ethic. Unions make it very difficult to fire an employee that is underperforming.

Unions were introduced long before fair labor laws were. Times and things have changed. The only ones truly benefiting nowadays from the union......is the union.

i'm not going to get into a debate over unions (especially, in this situation where the employees don't have to join or pay dues in order to reap union representation - a majority signing cards authorizes them to represent as i understand it in a right to work state)...i've found that it's usually the small business owner and jr management who fears dealing with unions.

That said, not sure what unions you are familiar with .

ask anyone who belongs to a "good one" (teachers, steelworkers, etc. in the northern industrial states) if their union is benefiting them; you'd be quite surprised as to their support of the union.

Know that many unions re-opened contracts & gave concessions to the company in order to keep more of the rank and file working/keep jobs in the area; while retaining the salaries and benefits

fyi, "bad/underperforming" employees are terminated even in a strong union (after receiving the formal warning process and chance for improvement). Trust me, their union brothers don't want to pull a lazy bums' slack either.

You'd probably be shocked to know that most of workers hired in the last 30 years in our area's largest mill have college degrees.Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the bullk of the servers in the better WDW TS restaurants are also well-educated and "the cream of the crop" certainly understand that they need all the bargining power they can muster.

 

[TLSnell1981]

i'm not going to get into a debate over unions (especially, in this situation where the employees don't have to join or pay dues in order to reap union representation - a majority signing cards authorizes them to represent as i understand it in a right to work state)...i've found that it's usually the small business owner and jr management who fears dealing with unions.

That said, not sure what unions you are familiar with .

ask anyone who belongs to a "good one" (teachers, steelworkers, etc. in the northern industrial states) if their union is benefiting them; you'd be quite surprised as to their support of the union.

Know that many unions re-opened contracts & gave concessions to the company in order to keep more of the rank and file working/keep jobs in the area; while retaining the salaries and benefits

fyi, "bad/underperforming" employees are terminated even in a strong union (after receiving the formal warning process and chance for improvement). Trust me, their union brothers don't want to pull a lazy bums' slack either.

You'd probably be shocked to know that most of workers hired in the last 30 years in our area's largest mill have college degrees.Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the bullk of the servers in the better WDW TS restaurants are also well-educated and "the cream of the crop" certainly understand that they need all the bargining power they can muster.

My husband's grandfather was a labor attorney....for the unions. I have seen too many small buisnesses have the life sucked out of them because of unions. Bottom line......no company.....no job......no wages.

There are too many that would have...should have been fired, but couldn't be because of the protection of the unions.

I have talked with quite a few CMs that feel many of the negative changes at WDW is a result of the union. I won't go into details (there are many) You have your opionion....I have mine.....we disagree. We are way off topic and I don't want to see this thread closed.

 

[keishashadow]

So now we have the unions & the servers as potential suspects for negative changes to DP & WDW in general...i think we should add Stitch to the list (he's an alien you know )

Nice to be able to agree to disagree

 

[sandym718]

You'd probably be shocked to know that most of workers hired in the last 30 years in our area's largest mill have college degrees.Wouldn't surprise me to find out that the bullk of the servers in the better WDW TS restaurants are also well-educated and "the cream of the crop" certainly understand that they need all the bargining power they can muster.

This doesnt' surprise me at all. We have a lot of auto plants here and the workers there - most without degrees - make FAR more than I do in social work with my degree. Great pensions, etc, too that I don't have. I'm sure there's a lot of people with degrees who, if they can be happy and satisfied in that job, would make that choice. Then they still have that degree to fall back on should the plant/mill close, etc. Not a bad decision!! I'm the sort who could never do that sort of work, I can't even stand being in one building all day, LOL, let alone doing the same thing. It does present the question though - what's truly important in our society? When some jobs are paid so much more than others that seem quite important? Ah well, that's a debatefor another place. Plus, the thing that I always come back to - in almost every case, with a little research, you know what you're getting into $$-wise when you take a job/choose a career. It's a choice!! I certainly didn't choose social work thinking I'd be rich, LOL!

 

[glitzybabes]

I have a question. I do not mean it mean in any way. I just really want to know. I've always wondered?????

Why are severs paid so little and why do you tip them? Why can't they be paid a "NORMAL" wage like everybody else? Does it have with the restaurants?

 

[sjaakie]

I have a question. I do not mean it mean in any way. I just really want to know. I've always wondered?????

Why are severs paid so little and why do you tip them? Why can't they be paid a "NORMAL" wage like everybody else? Does it have with the restaurants?

Exactly my question.
Why don't they get payed like "normal" people????
What's the big secret?

 

[keishashadow]

i've always wondered the same thing

I moonlighted as a bartender in between husbands ; always gave a small portion of my tips to barbacks, cooks...not because i was forced to...because they appreciated it and "had my back"

The waitresses complained about lousy tips & how they had to pay income tax on a minimum $ amount for tips regardless of whether they earned it or not

I agree 100% about payscales being unevenly distributed; society we live in i suppose. DH followed the "show me the money" route, too many mouths to feed to not take on a dirty and dangerous job.

My middle DS is a full-time (yet offically part time) policeman; no benefits and pitiful salary. He loves his job though , life is a series of trade offs

 

[TLSnell1981]

My middle DS is a full-time (yet offically part time) policeman; no benefits and pitiful salary. He loves his job though , life is a series of trade offs

This is one reason my feathers get ruffled when I hear that Dis servers should get at least 18% (plus the 3% from Disney)" because they have such a hard job". Many of them make as much or more than nurses, school teachers, policemen, firemen, etc. Waiting tables may be a hard job, but pales in comparison to others. I just get tired of the whining.

 

[sandym718]

I have a question. I do not mean it mean in any way. I just really want to know. I've always wondered?????

Why are severs paid so little and why do you tip them? Why can't they be paid a "NORMAL" wage like everybody else? Does it have with the restaurants?

I've always wondered this too!

 

[GreatLakes5]

I've always wondered this too!

It's part of the Fair Labor Standards Act. It allowed(allows) employers to consider tips as part of the wage their employees receive, thereby allowing them to pay less per hour knowing that the tips received place the worker at over the minimum wage.

There are percentages that must be met in terms of how much can be used as a wage credit where the employer is concerned. If the average tip combined with the minimum wage, divided by hours worked does not equal the current minimum wage standard, the employer must put the money in so the employee makes at least minimum wage. This can get changed around a bit when a union is involved.

Anyway - as for history I know the act began in 1938 and the tipping item was already part of it. I tried searching my old Business Law text for more history as to the "whys" of it and I could not find anything specific - perhaps someone else will.

Oh and as for the "normal wage" thing most servers come out ahead with tips compared to the minimum wage which employers could, by law, pay.

 

[TLSnell1981]

A lot of people are unaware that servers are guaranteed at least minimum wage. Years ago, I worked in accounting for a large company that had a restaurant division. My job was to go through payroll to ensure employees were making at least minimum wage and supplementing those who weren't. Almost always, more was claimed than was needed. The only supplements were in the same locations over and over. Their employees made more than enough in wages....they just wanted the "extra" from the company. Don't feel sorry for servers who don't a least make minimum wage.....they do and then some.

 

[pepperw23]

Give me a break. These idiots purchased the DDP without knowing all the details?

Talk about a bunch of entitled jerks.

I feel your pain with the whole entitlement thing...I see it everyday at work...and I work in an office lol.

However; as far as this is concerned; I think some people really didn't know. A lot of people probably booked trips last year, before the changes were even an idea. I remember when it was first announced...Oct/Nov time frame...a lot of folks were coming on here and asking if this would apply to already booked vacations (apparently not).

Imagine the people that did not have DIS and had no clue, only to show up and be told your package is different than what you booked. I would have been upset too. I doubt I would have made any kind of scene, but I would have gone to guest relations and filed a formal complaint.

Have a good night.

 

[sjaakie]

It's part of the Fair Labor Standards Act. It allowed(allows) employers to consider tips as part of the wage their employees receive, thereby allowing them to pay less per hour knowing that the tips received place the worker at over the minimum wage.

And what is the big advantage of this rule?

 

[kaytieeldr]

And what is the big advantage of this rule?

Y'know, why does it matter - aka, whose business is it - HOW much any private employee earns?

Tipping restaurant servers is customary in the United States. Period. Ultimately, it's not ANYONE'S concern if the server is paid $3.60 an hour, or $36.00 an hour. You choose to dine in a restaurant, you agree to follow all rules, laws, and customs of dining in a restaurant.

 

[sjaakie]

Y'know, why does it matter - aka, whose business is it - HOW much any private employee earns?

Tipping restaurant servers is customary in the United States. Period. Ultimately, it's not ANYONE'S concern if the server is paid $3.60 an hour, or $36.00 an hour. You choose to dine in a restaurant, you agree to follow all rules, laws, and customs of dining in a restaurant.

Just wondering why that's all and why there so many upset people on the board about this. If its customs then why maon about it??

And we do tip EVERY day. We own a transportation firm and if the cargo goes well the workers get a tipp.
We tipp for a huge amound every year and no pain about that.
So tipping isn't just a American way of living.