They did what?! Resale issues

[dvc lover 1970]

Wow! They should have to pay you for those points they used. Is there anything in your contract about them paying you per point usage? If they used points that were listed with their contract then they should have to pay your for those points.

 

[dvc lover 1970]

They used 142 points. There was no provision in the contract to be reimbursed for missing points. We are asking $19/point since that is the going rate to rent or transfer points, a year of dues, and split the closing cost. Doing the math it comes to about $30/per point for the points they used. We are firm on this. If they say no, we are out.

Wow!! I can't beleive someone would do that. 142 points is a lot of points. Just curious what was the price of the contract? Was it a really good deal or meh?

 

[dvc lover 1970]

UPDATE: This morning when I checked my phone I had a voicemail but no missed call. My agent called yesterday afternoon and it sounds like there may be a mix-up. It sounds like the seller has more than one contract with the same amount of points for the same resort. From his initial assessment, all of the current use year points are there but the banked point amount isn't adding up. He has to do more verifying and get back to me. I am glad he is being thorough. Crossing my fingers that this was all a big misunderstanding.

okay this makes sense now. I have multiple contracts. There have been times when booking a reservation, MS has pulled from teh wrong account. A couple years ago, I lalmost lost 200 points because they booked my vacation with current points and left my banked points. I chalked it up to the MS person was probably new and was thankful I caught the error in time to rearrange my points. But I can see how a mistake can happen with multiple same contracts in same use year.

 

[Ronaldo17]

They used 142 points. There was no provision in the contract to be reimbursed for missing points. We are asking $19/point since that is the going rate to rent or transfer points, a year of dues, and split the closing cost. Doing the math it comes to about $30/per point for the points they used. We are firm on this. If they say no, we are out.

No matter, I would still bail, they lost your trust.

 

[RoseGold]

Apparently it happens before and AFTER closing, in part because Disney is taking so long to transfer ownership. And those are not my words - I wish I could find the article - it came from an experienced DVC resale person.

OP does not have this issue because it has not closed. That’s why they checked before it closed.

Im totally confused why there isn’t something like $25/point in the contract though.

 

[Sandisw]

No matter, I would still bail, they lost your trust.

I am going to add though that it does sound like it may have been in error,

Last year when I was selling BWV, I booked on the contract by mistake because I had 3 UYs at the time and didn’t pay attention that I was using the BWV contract being sold and not my BWV contract in the other memvership,

I realized my mistake right when I went back to the dashboard and canceled. Problem was I was within 31 days of the trip so ended up with holding. I freaked out, called Ms, explained it may have just cost me a sale, and they were so nice and took out of holding,

I informed the broker just so they were aware after it was fixed,

So, i can see for someone with multiple contracts, how it could be an innocent mistake. Unfortunately these sellers used points so the solution isn’t going to be easy like it was in mine.

 

[Halle]

There are stories here about it not getting caught -- that's why it's so important to check when they populate! They handle it with the compensation of the contract.

There are also stories here of the reverse -- free points!

I was one of the lucky ones that received a full year of points that I wasn't expecting.

 

[dvc lover 1970]

Just curious any updates?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I was one of the lucky ones that received a full year of points that I wasn't expecting.

I also received approx 14 or so unexpected points in one resale purchase.

 

[RoseGold]

the day Disney waives ROFR, the points should be verified against the written contract and the account should be frozen. Oh for a perfect world...

What actually happens: you are on your own and your broker and title will likely require you to sign a "hold harmless" document in the closing papers.

You are leaving a whole lot out.

I have a contract in delayed closing right now. ROFR cleared months ago, and thus months before closing. The seller is taking a holiday trip, as was planned in the contract. Of course Disney isn't going to freeze the contract and not let them go on their trip. Usually, this process is ASAP to close, but it doesn't has to be.

At closing, the title company will check the points, like OP's title company did, and then close the transaction. If the points don't line up at closing, they owe me $X, or I can cancel the whole deal. I'm out nothing (except hassle) and the sellers still owe the commission. If they don't take their holiday trip, I get the points, or they could cancel the whole deal, and still owe commission, ouch.

The problem is those days in between recording and actually transferring the points, which Disney could fix. Sellers here have reported having access to their accounts/points long after closing. This problem seemed especially bad when resale was taking several weeks in Covid. It's unclear to me what would actually happen to those points. But that isn't what is happening to OP, as this was caught as close, as it should be.

 

[DebbieB]

My VGC contract from January was $20 per point.

 

[LilyJC]

Hopefully everything worked out for the OP.

I was one of the fortunate buyers who ended up with more points than expected. When my CCV points loaded last month, we found 122 more points than we were supposed to get!

 

[EE_Mom]

Well, it is over. Sorry I didn't update right away. Things have taken some time.

Last I left off we found out the seller had 2 identical contracts and the agent had checked the other contract. After double-checking and verifying the information, the seller had used 46 of the banked points but the upcoming year was untouched. We offered $19/pp and the seller pays closing costs. They countered only closing costs. We countered again, 19/pp, and half closing cost and that was our final offer and we gave a time limit that we wanted an answer by today at 5 pm. Plus, we wanted it written in the addendum that if any more points went missing before the transfer they would owe us $30/pp and we asked for the title company to hold funds until points were in our possession (Thank you for the info shared here in my post!). The seller agreed. We signed the addendum.

I wish I could say that this was the end. As I was getting ready to scan the doc and send it back I got another phone call from the agent. Turns out the sellers had some doubts about the addendum and had questions. The agent felt something was off and asked a few more questions of the seller and learned they were preparing for bankruptcy. Deal over. Our agent said we don't want anything to do with that. If they sold the property to us during the bankruptcy process that means we could get sucked into that because it is a big no-no to sell any property during that process. The courts could come after us to get the property back apparently.

Well, while we lost this contract we learned a lot about this process. Thanks to the advice and info shared here in this post we know what to ask for when we decide to try again. We have a perfect contract in mind and if one comes available we will consider it but we think we are going to wait until spring. At that point, we will probably be in an even better position to buy a bigger contract. We were pretty disappointed when the closing was initially stopped but we are at peace with how things ended. There will be other contracts.

Thanks again to everyone here for their advice and info! It is definitely appreciated!

 

[Lorana]

Well, it is over. Sorry I didn't update right away. Things have taken some time.

Last I left off we found out the seller had 2 identical contracts and the agent had checked the other contract. After double-checking and verifying the information, the seller had used 46 of the banked points but the upcoming year was untouched. We offered $19/pp and the seller pays closing costs. They countered only closing costs. We countered again, 19/pp, and half closing cost and that was our final offer and we gave a time limit that we wanted an answer by today at 5 pm. Plus, we wanted it written in the addendum that if any more points went missing before the transfer they would owe us $30/pp and we asked for the title company to hold funds until points were in our possession (Thank you for the info shared here in my post!). The seller agreed. We signed the addendum.

I wish I could say that this was the end. As I was getting ready to scan the doc and send it back I got another phone call from the agent. Turns out the sellers had some doubts about the addendum and had questions. The agent felt something was off and asked a few more questions of the seller and learned they were preparing for bankruptcy. Deal over. Our agent said we don't want anything to do with that. If they sold the property to us during the bankruptcy process that means we could get sucked into that because it is a big no-no to sell any property during that process. The courts could come after us to get the property back apparently.

Well, while we lost this contract we learned a lot about this process. Thanks to the advice and info shared here in this post we know what to ask for when we decide to try again. We have a perfect contract in mind and if one comes available we will consider it but we think we are going to wait until spring. At that point, we will probably be in an even better position to buy a bigger contract. We were pretty disappointed when the closing was initially stopped but we are at peace with how things ended. There will be other contracts.

Thanks again to everyone here for their advice and info! It is definitely appreciated!

I wish the forum had the FB "care" icon, because you deserve a big hug after this fiasco. I'm so sorry that this didn't work out and you had to go through all of this, only to end up with nothing to show for it! But at least you didn't get sucked into the seller's bankruptcy woes!

 

[CarolMN]

@EE_Mom - thank you for sharing your experience. I learned a lot, too.

Maybe it was a blessing in disguise. Had the sale gone through originally, maybe you would have gotten caught up in a real mess!

Good luck on your next attempt!

 

[RoseGold]

WOW. That was a dramatic update!

I'm sorry you had such a yuck experience. This whole situation is just wow. But your attitude seems great! There are plenty of honest sellers out there just moving on from this Disney phase, and nothing wrong with that. Next time will be easier than this mess!

Nothing wrong with waiting until Spring, or maybe even just keeping an eye out for your dream contract. It will come!

 

[Stitchescape]

Well, it is over. Sorry I didn't update right away. Things have taken some time.

Last I left off we found out the seller had 2 identical contracts and the agent had checked the other contract. After double-checking and verifying the information, the seller had used 46 of the banked points but the upcoming year was untouched. We offered $19/pp and the seller pays closing costs. They countered only closing costs. We countered again, 19/pp, and half closing cost and that was our final offer and we gave a time limit that we wanted an answer by today at 5 pm. Plus, we wanted it written in the addendum that if any more points went missing before the transfer they would owe us $30/pp and we asked for the title company to hold funds until points were in our possession (Thank you for the info shared here in my post!). The seller agreed. We signed the addendum.

I wish I could say that this was the end. As I was getting ready to scan the doc and send it back I got another phone call from the agent. Turns out the sellers had some doubts about the addendum and had questions. The agent felt something was off and asked a few more questions of the seller and learned they were preparing for bankruptcy. Deal over. Our agent said we don't want anything to do with that. If they sold the property to us during the bankruptcy process that means we could get sucked into that because it is a big no-no to sell any property during that process. The courts could come after us to get the property back apparently.

Well, while we lost this contract we learned a lot about this process. Thanks to the advice and info shared here in this post we know what to ask for when we decide to try again. We have a perfect contract in mind and if one comes available we will consider it but we think we are going to wait until spring. At that point, we will probably be in an even better position to buy a bigger contract. We were pretty disappointed when the closing was initially stopped but we are at peace with how things ended. There will be other contracts.

Thanks again to everyone here for their advice and info! It is definitely appreciated!

I’m sorry to read your update but from all you say it seems like you may have had a narrow escape. Better for it to go off now than be taken in a bankruptcy. Your perfect contract will be there when you are ready, best of luck.

 

[Theta]

How does a buyer ensure they don't get involved with a seller going through bankruptcy?

Doesn't the broker make sure the title is free and clear?

 

[EE_Mom]

How does a buyer ensure they don't get involved with a seller going through bankruptcy?

Doesn't the broker make sure the title is free and clear?

The title would not show anything at this point. It sounds like the seller had a lawyer and is preparing to file. I think there may be some rules about selling anything within a time period before initiating or filing for bankruptcy. I believe it could be considered fraud. It is possible that we could have gone through with the deal and not had an issue but there is a chance the court may question the sale. We don't want to take any chances by being involved with that situation.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The title would not show anything at this point. It sounds like the seller had a lawyer and is preparing to file. I think there may be some rules about selling anything within a time period before initiating or filing for bankruptcy. I believe it could be considered fraud. It is possible that we could have gone through with the deal and not had an issue but there is a chance the court may question the sale. We don't want to take any chances by being involved with that situation.

Since most courts consider timeshares to be worth nothing you probably are correct that it wouldn't have even been given a second look.