The Vaccine Discussion Thread

[spiders]

UPS has already built a freezer farm at Louisville which can hold it at -80. I’m not sure how long the coolers will be good for but Louisville is the main UPS hub. Flights begin leaving at about 3am. Many of their flights land by 5am local time at their destinations. The actual time in transit will be minimal.

 

[sabrecmc]

I saw that Ticketmaster is talking about starting live events again in 2021 with the caveat that people would have to show verification of vaccination or a negative Covid test within like 72 hours of the event. I wonder if cruise ships will end up doing something similar.

 

[snappy]

Fauci’s comments this morning very positive. “Vaccines are going to have a major impact.” It’s coming. Coming to CVS and Walgreens per reports. We personally can stay at home mostly until we get ours. As Gottlieb says, stay in your ecosystem. Actually my husband and I are in quarantine right now out of an abundance of caution (and following medical advice) as mom was exposed in her assisted living apartment at a senior facility by the nurse who brings her medicines multiple times a day. We are in quarantine because I spent 8-9 hours during the “contact period” taking her to appointments and checking on her when she broke a tooth at the gum line and needed oral surgery. Frustrating because we are forever cautious that we were exposed. Proves that the virus doesn’t care if you are cautious or not. It’s lurking behind the curtain and ready to pounce.

 

[lanejudy]

... actual time in transit will be minimal.

I beg to differ on "actual time in transit" being minimal. Actual time in transit will largely depend on proximity of the final destination to the airport and local UPS warehouse as well as proficiency of the local UPS. UPS has been absolutely lousy getting packages delivered to my area in a timely manner, even though their local warehouse is only ~30 minutes away -- often 2-5 days delayed after status bounces between on the truck and at the warehouse. Hopefully deliveries to a medical facility are handled better, I'll only believe it when I see it.

 

[spiders]

I beg to differ on "actual time in transit" being minimal. Actual time in transit will largely depend on proximity of the final destination to the airport and local UPS warehouse as well as proficiency of the local UPS. UPS has been absolutely lousy getting packages delivered to my area in a timely manner, even though their local warehouse is only ~30 minutes away -- often 2-5 days delayed after status bounces between on the truck and at the warehouse. Hopefully deliveries to a medical facility are handled better, I'll only believe it when I see it.

I have had very few issues with UPS during the pandemic. A small percentage of ground packages have received delays but air packages are still, for the most part, on time and meeting before 10:30 commitment times even though FedEx and UPS suspended the guarantees months ago.

Actual in transit time will be minimal. There is no way any vaccine shipment will be treated as anything less than the highest priority. You can get regular packages from FedEx and UPS delivered to most major metropolitan areas by 8:00 AM.

But like everything else that is premium in life....it comes at a significant cost...significantly more than overnight by 10:30 and especially more than overnight by end of day.

 

[lanejudy]

We don't all live near major metropolitan areas...

FedEx has been much more reliable in my area than UPS. I can't say why, but it clearly has. Even the USPS has been quicker and more reliable than UPS around here.

 

[LizzyDragon]

Moderna's vaccine will need to only be kept at -20C/-4F. Still cold, but it would be in the range that most commercial freezers can handle. I believe they are still on track to apply for an EUA before the end of the year. The more vaccine options that get out there, the better off we'll be.

 

[Starwind]

They also shift to using dry ice at some point in the distribution process. FedEx and UPS have both applied for exemptions to certain rules for transporting dry ice on aircraft because of the amount that will be needed for transporting the vaccine. Pfizer has created special transport boxes for the vaccine that use dry ice and in addition to transport can also act as local storage for a defined period of time [the dry ice needs to be replenished after a defined period of so many hours]. I read a good article about it that had a diagram of the box and everything, though I can't find the link now.

I'm not as concerned about the FedEx/UPS distribution of the product as I am of the issues that may arise at the local level with handling of the vaccine. Once it it out of the deep cold storage there are some pretty strict rules about how it has to be handled to keep the vaccine viable. Rules that normal vaccines don't have. People are going to have to be very diligent and a lot of things are going to have to "go right".

 

[spiders]

We don't all live near major metropolitan areas...

FedEx has been much more reliable in my area than UPS. I can't say why, but it clearly has. Even the USPS has been quicker and more reliable than UPS around here.

There is no way of telling the future but there is little doubt that the logistics will be challenging. Those not in major metros may end up having to personally travel to one.

 

[tvguy]

If Walmart can't keep ice-cream cold, how are they ever going to keep a vaccine this cold!

It would be impossible to roll out this vaccine in a 3rd world country.

It's a start but still a long, long road ahead!


-Paul

LOL. Takes days to get my ice cream from Walmart warm enough to serve. They should give FEDEX/UPS tips on keeping things cold. My wife's nephew ran the frozen food section of a Super Walmart for 5 years then went to a local grocery store chain. He was surprise how much warming the grocery store chain kept their freezers.

 

[lanejudy]

There is no way of telling the future but there is little doubt that the logistics will be challenging. Those not in major metros may end up having to personally travel to one.

Oh let's hope not or there goes any hope of herd immunity if people will need to travel to get a vaccine! It would be at least a 4-5 hour drive to get to a major metropolitan area, which is out-of-state and we have a travel quarantine in effect.

But since all states have been working on plans for getting vaccine distributed I don't expect we'll need to travel that far. I just don't trust UPS for delivery to this area.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Also, apparently they are not testing for covid unless the people develop symptoms, so they do not know how many might be infected but asymptomatic [and possibly or not contagious].

This is the part that makes me twitch. A good trial would be executing at least weekly home tests on all subjects.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

a negative Covid test within like 72 hours of the event.

The uncruise voyage in Alaska over the summer and the small ship near Barbados would like to have a chat with Ticketmaster about that. Also, several of the clusters that happened at the White House.

Tests are moment in time.

 

[Karin1984]

In the Netherlands, HAL has restarted their tv commercials for cruises within Europe. They don't mention a date in their commercial, Europe cruises start in April (makes sense with the Winter season).
In addition, on their website I saw HAL also sells Australia/New Zealand, Mexico, Caribbean, and Asia cruises all with departures in January 2021.

 

[anricat]

This is the part that makes me twitch. A good trial would be executing at least weekly home tests on all subjects.

I know someone in the trail. She has no symptoms and said she has been tested multiple times along the way.

 

[AquaDame]

Oh let's hope not or there goes any hope of herd immunity if people will need to travel to get a vaccine! It would be at least a 4-5 hour drive to get to a major metropolitan area, which is out-of-state and we have a travel quarantine in effect.

But since all states have been working on plans for getting vaccine distributed I don't expect we'll need to travel that far. I just don't trust UPS for delivery to this area.

For the exceptionally rural spots perhaps red cross or some other entity would be entrusted with vaccines in those areas? I doubt those in charge would risk any number of vaccines to UPS if they can't guarantee their safety.

 

[spiders]

UPS & FedEx both go to great lengths to ensure on-time delivery, especially when it comes to air packages.

UPS & FedEx will both divert en route aircraft to other cities to pickup additional volume or otherwise begin recovery if an airplane is stuck on the ground for maintenance. FedEx will fly zigzag flights every night. Rather than go from say Fort Myers to Memphis, they'll fly mostly empty between Fort Myers up along the Florida coast, over Charlotte, then turn west over Atlanta and Birmingham before Memphis. That's so they have a plane over the appropriate markets at the appropriate times in case something goes wrong. If the plane in Charleston isn't going to make it then they can divert and get something on the ground quickly to begin recovery.

The USPS doesn't even fly...FedEx is the main air lift provider.

 

[disneyholic family]

Moderna's vaccine will need to only be kept at -20C/-4F. Still cold, but it would be in the range that most commercial freezers can handle. I believe they are still on track to apply for an EUA before the end of the year. The more vaccine options that get out there, the better off we'll be.

yes, moderna's will be much easier to transport and store
.

 

[disneyholic family]

UPS & FedEx both go to great lengths to ensure on-time delivery, especially when it comes to air packages.

UPS & FedEx will both divert en route aircraft to other cities to pickup additional volume or otherwise begin recovery if an airplane is stuck on the ground for maintenance. FedEx will fly zigzag flights every night. Rather than go from say Fort Myers to Memphis, they'll fly mostly empty between Fort Myers up along the Florida coast, over Charlotte, then turn west over Atlanta and Birmingham before Memphis. That's so they have a plane over the appropriate markets at the appropriate times in case something goes wrong. If the plane in Charleston isn't going to make it then they can divert and get something on the ground quickly to begin recovery.

The USPS doesn't even fly...FedEx is the main air lift provider.

fedex is horrible. If you need something to actually arrive on time, use DHL
.

 

[deliela999]

For the exceptionally rural spots perhaps red cross or some other entity would be entrusted with vaccines in those areas? I doubt those in charge would risk any number of vaccines to UPS if they can't guarantee their safety.

Maybe it's just my state but I remember something about having the national guard distribute. Someone I know questioned it and I pointed out logistics and security in one, since people are crazy.