The Running Thread—2023

[mtnmjd]

Another shoe question...
I ran in Brooks for years and had no issues. My entire circle of running friends have all been running in Sauconys for awhile, and love them, so I decided to give Sauconys a try.
I am on my second pair of Saucony Guides (I need a stability shoe), and it seems like the soles wear out very quickly. I could almost always get 400+ miles on my Brooks, but I haven't even hit 300 and part of the Saucony sole is gone (happened with both pairs).
Does anyone have any experience with this issue with Saucony? My running friends don't seem to have this problem, but they run in neutrals.

I used to run in Guides, now I primarily use Saucony Triumphs. I have never had an issue with the soles wearing away. I do find that I lose cushioning and feel it in my shins after ~300 miles with both Guides and Triumphs.
But I enjoying buying new running shoes and will recycle my run shoes to everyday shoes so I don't find it to be an issue. Plus when I've run in Hokas I tended to only get 200-250 or so out of them so to me the Triumphs feel "long lasting".

 

[avondale]

Something you just don’t notice when it’s a little at a time

Works with poison, too.

 

[avondale]

The really "funny" thing is that there are two particularly bad hills in that area that deter me from running there. Both were part of this course. In addition, they managed to find and incorporate a 3rd hill even worse than those two into the course! It was so steep I could barely keep my rate of descent under control when it was dry. As it got muddier, I 100% would have taken a nasty fall there before the race was over as I fatigued.

You are quite correct that I should have counted that as like 4 's. I still would've registered, most likely...

As much fun as a trail ultra in January sounds (or not), I'll be at MW running Dopey on blessed pavement thinking about how much better the Blizzard Beach parking lot is than a trail!

You're welcome to join me at Blackbeard's Revenge on the NC outer banks in March!. It's run 100% on pavement on the side of Highway 12. Haven't decided on 100k or 100 miles yet, though...

The 50k in January shouldn't have snow/ice; I believe the average high is 45 - 50 F.

But sorry, I won't do an ultra on pavement. I know you really like that race, though, so I hope you do well!

 

[RunWI1265]

heads up to anyone who runs in Brooks Hyperions…they are currently pretty heavily discounted around $80ish per pair depending on color. I grabbed a couple pairs and considering grabbing a third in case they are changing the design (please no!). This might be old news but I just noticed it this week.

 

[nancipants]

I did my last 5k pace run before my race in two weeks and thought I was going to die. I came home and jumped in the pool. But I PRed at 40:25 even with taking rest intervals in between miles, so yay?? Only 25 seconds to shave off to meet my goal!

 

[azrivest]

Congrats on the PR @nancipants !

 

[dobball23]

heads up to anyone who runs in Brooks Hyperions…they are currently pretty heavily discounted around $80ish per pair depending on color. I grabbed a couple pairs and considering grabbing a third in case they are changing the design (please no!). This might be old news but I just noticed it this week.

I waiting for some Brooks Adrenaline 22s to go on sale (down to at least the $80ish/pair you noted). It just isn't happening!

 

[kps7795]

I hope that @DopeyBadger or someone else could help clear up my confusion regarding pacing for a 1:50 half marathon (unfortunately, I am not aerobically fit to reach this goal yet but that is my goal before the cutoff for 2025 MW). McMillan shows that one's pace should be 8:24/mile for a 1:50 half marathon, but Hanson's half marathon book indicates that one should be running 8:46 for a 1:50 HM. Simple math says that McMillan is right, multiplying 8.4 times 13.1. Am I missing something or reading the Hanson's book wrong somehow?

 

[mmm_texas]

I hope that @DopeyBadger or someone else could help clear up my confusion regarding pacing for a 1:50 half marathon (unfortunately, I am not aerobically fit to reach this goal yet but that is my goal before the cutoff for 2025 MW). McMillan shows that one's pace should be 8:24/mile for a 1:50 half marathon, but Hanson's half marathon book indicates that one should be running 8:46 for a 1:50 HM. Simple math says that McMillan is right, multiplying 8.4 times 13.1. Am I missing something or reading the Hanson's book wrong somehow?

I have no knowledge of either book, but by any chance is Hanson talking about a training pace goal, not a race day pace?

 

[Mr_Incr3dible]

A 1:50 half marathon has to be at an average pace of 8:23/mile, assuming the math is correct in the chart I'm looking at.

I would also guess that the Hanson number is a training pace. Recalling previous posts/threads and what I've read, "run slower to go faster", i.e. do your training at a slightly slower pace, I believe with the goal of going farther in your training runs.

All of which can be easier said than done. My normal running rhythm is around 10:30/mile (yeah, so I'm nowhere near that 1:50 goal either) and of late I've tried to run slower to go faster. Instead, I wind up at about the same pace, or even a touch faster. Even my 8-mile run last weekend, with deliberate 50-step walk intervals each mile, wound up with an avg 10:40 pace. I'm hoping that is an indication that my training is working, but I can say that it can take a conscious effort to slow down.

(And if I can maintain that pace for 26 miles, I will be happy, because that will mean a sub 5-hour marathon). Goals

 

[Zutroy]

I hope that @DopeyBadger or someone else could help clear up my confusion regarding pacing for a 1:50 half marathon (unfortunately, I am not aerobically fit to reach this goal yet but that is my goal before the cutoff for 2025 MW). McMillan shows that one's pace should be 8:24/mile for a 1:50 half marathon, but Hanson's half marathon book indicates that one should be running 8:46 for a 1:50 HM. Simple math says that McMillan is right, multiplying 8.4 times 13.1. Am I missing something or reading the Hanson's book wrong somehow?

These seem to be training paces, not HM paces. In reality you’ll need to be faster than either pace to hit a 1:50 half, since it’s unlikely you’ll run exactly 13.1 miles.

 

[WillRunForPizza]

Hanson's half marathon book indicates that one should be running 8:46 for a 1:50 HM

8:46 pace would be a 1:55 HM, so maybe there was some kind of printing issue with the chart. It could also be an "equivalent" marathon pace? Seems optimistic, but the calculators usually are.

 

[Mr_Incr3dible]

These seem to be training paces, not HM paces. In reality you’ll need to be faster than either pace to hit a 1:50 half, since it’s unlikely you’ll run exactly 13.1 miles.

Good point. I’m going to have to remember the extra distance factor for my own self…

 

[RunWI1265]

I waiting for some Brooks Adrenaline 22s to go on sale (down to at least the $80ish/pair you noted). It just isn't happening!

I hope it happens for you! I always cringe when I have to get new shoes and am reminded of the price. I just checked my Saucony endorphin Speed 3's and they're still full price at $170. I plan on stretching my current pair to the max so I only need to get on pair before MW. Whoever said running is cheap is a liar!

 

[DopeyBadger]

I hope that @DopeyBadger or someone else could help clear up my confusion regarding pacing for a 1:50 half marathon (unfortunately, I am not aerobically fit to reach this goal yet but that is my goal before the cutoff for 2025 MW). McMillan shows that one's pace should be 8:24/mile for a 1:50 half marathon, but Hanson's half marathon book indicates that one should be running 8:46 for a 1:50 HM. Simple math says that McMillan is right, multiplying 8.4 times 13.1. Am I missing something or reading the Hanson's book wrong somehow?

Can you post a screen shot of the page with chart you’re looking at?

 

[dis_or_dat]

Interesting article about some elite runners ditching fancy watches and going more on feel or old school paper and pen.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/16/sports/gps-watches-professional-runners.html

 

[Dopey 2020]

I hope that @DopeyBadger or someone else could help clear up my confusion regarding pacing for a 1:50 half marathon (unfortunately, I am not aerobically fit to reach this goal yet but that is my goal before the cutoff for 2025 MW). McMillan shows that one's pace should be 8:24/mile for a 1:50 half marathon, but Hanson's half marathon book indicates that one should be running 8:46 for a 1:50 HM. Simple math says that McMillan is right, multiplying 8.4 times 13.1. Am I missing something or reading the Hanson's book wrong somehow?

I think it’s the tendency of people to equate decimals and seconds but that isn’t the case. There are 60 seconds in a minute so every .1 minutes is 6 seconds. Therefore 8.4 minutes is equal to 8 minutes 24 seconds. The difference between . and : is easy to miss or for someone building a web site to overlook. 8:24 is definitely what you need for a 1:50 half.

 

[dobball23]

Interesting article about some elite runners ditching fancy watches and going more on feel or old school paper and pen.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/16/sports/gps-watches-professional-runners.html

I am not one of those people who can run without a GPS watch. I love data.

For much of my running history I ran exclusively on a treadmill because I wanted to know how far and how fast I had gone. I finally got a GPS watch in 2019 and I have been an exclusively outside runner since 2020, and it is because I have that data.

As I've gotten more serious about running and training, the watch is key in evaluating my paces. I'm not so good at listening to my body like some of those elite runners.

 

[Mr_Incr3dible]

I think it’s the tendency of people to equate decimals and seconds but that isn’t the case. There are 60 seconds in a minute so every .1 minutes is 6 seconds. Therefore 8.4 minutes is equal to 8 minutes 24 seconds. The difference between . and : is easy to miss or for someone building a web site to overlook. 8:24 is definitely what you need for a 1:50 half.

I’m not sure I’m seeing your point.

And I’ll see myself out…

 

[Mr_Incr3dible]

Interesting article about some elite runners ditching fancy watches and going more on feel or old school paper and pen.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/16/sports/gps-watches-professional-runners.html

I love my watch.

And my pencil and paper kept getting wet at the water stations…