Texas Mommies: Will the School District really prosecute me for taking DS to WDW?

[ekatiel]

So, I was reading the long thread about taking kids out of school to go to WDW, and since we are hoping to go back in the fall of 2010, when DS will be in kindergarten, I decided to look up some local attendance policies. We live in the Houston area and plan on moving into either the Friendswood or Clear Creek districts before DS enters kinder, so I looked on their websites and found basically the same info. They can prosecute you if your kid misses more than 3 consecutive days of school without a doctor's note! Is this for REAL??!! There was also some vague info about "unusual circumstances" etc, that might provide an out for a family vacation, so I'm just wondering what ya'lls experience has been. I am a former teacher and I recall one student (in another teacher's class) missing at least a week (maybe two) to go to Europe. It didn't seem like it a was problem. Anyhow, I'm just looking for first hand experience. Do school districts tend to turn a blind eye to those taking kids out to go on vacation, or do they really prosecute?? I can understand not missing a week of highschool, but KINDERGARTEN??--Katie

 

[Doc CW]

When I was a kid my mom took me out of school all the time to go to WDW and the teachers almost never got upset about it. My thought is that your the childrens parent you can take your children out of school if you want to, besides family comes first and foremost so if you take your kids out of school to take them on vacation I would definitely do it. If I was ever prosecuted for taking my child out of school I would tell them that is was my parental right to take my child out of school and that its none of their buisness what my child is doing out of school whether or not the child is sick.

 

[Ariel on Land]

I have no idea about those rules, but if I was putting in my .02 about the districts, I'd go with Friendswood for sure. I think if I were you, I'd just pick up the phone and call the school. Sometimes the "legal-ese" on paper is different that how things really work. So I'd just call and ask!

 

[WDWAtLast]

I am in Houston - CyFair district. I have never heard of anyone being prosecuted (it may have happened - just haven't heard of it) , but I have heard of children being held back a year - just because of missed days. If they go over a certain number of missed days (even all being excused) they are automatically held back. Part of it has to do with lost tax dollars, I am sure.

I think it is a bit harsh - especially if the student is an "A" student, but those are the CyFair rules. I wouldn't plan a trip until you have talked to the actual school your child will be in. Although they must follow district rules, some schools seem to be more flexable than others.

 

[taitai]

When I was a kid my mom took me out of school all the time to go to WDW and the teachers almost never got upset about it. My thought is that your the childrens parent you can take your children out of school if you want to, besides family comes first and foremost so if you take your kids out of school to take them on vacation I would definitely do it. If I was ever prosecuted for taking my child out of school I would tell them that is was my parental right to take my child out of school and that its none of their buisness what my child is doing out of school whether or not the child is sick.

It might be your parental right to take your kid out of school. However, it is the school district's right to penalize you for violating the rules. It is all about funding for every district and about neglectful parents for some districts. Federal funds are tied to attendance. Every missed classroom day means a decrease in funds. That is why the schools have these draconian policies. If you don't like the policy, home school, go to private school, advocate for changes in No Child Left Behind. However, if you go to public school, abide by the rules. Or, if you violate the rules, accept the penalties without complaint.

As a poster stated very well on the other thread, kids are only in school 180 of the 365 days of the year. Surely, there is another time to go to Disney.

taitai

 

[thechesters420]

It might be your parental right to take your kid out of school. However, it is the school district's right to penalize you for violating the rules. It is all about funding for every district and about neglectful parents for some districts. Federal funds are tied to attendance. Every missed classroom day means a decrease in funds. That is why the schools have these draconian policies. If you don't like the policy, home school, go to private school, advocate for changes in No Child Left Behind. However, if you go to public school, abide by the rules. Or, if you violate the rules, accept the penalties without complaint.

As a poster stated very well on the other thread, kids are only in school 180 of the 365 days of the year. Surely, there is another time to go to Disney.

taitai

I'm planning on taking my child out for a week at Christmas for Disney and I don't consider myself a sub-par parent.

 

[allyphoe]

They can prosecute you if your kid misses more than 3 consecutive days of school without a doctor's note! Is this for REAL??!!

http://ritter.tea.state.tx.us/legal/general.html

Question: May an absence be deemed excused but still be used to file truancy charges?

Answer: Texas Education Code Section 25.091 provides that a complaint or referral for failure to attend school is to be filed after a student has a certain number of absences "without excuse". Section 25.087 provides that a student's absence may be excused for "any cause acceptable to the teacher, principal or superintendent". (04/2002)

From the relevant Texas statutes (http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/ED/htm/ED.25.htm#25.094)

Sec. 25.094. FAILURE TO ATTEND SCHOOL. (a) An individual commits an offense if the individual:
(1) is required to attend school under Section 25.085; and
(2) fails to attend school on 10 or more days or parts of days within a six-month period in the same school year or on three or more days or parts of days within a four-week period.

So it's not just 3 consecutive days - the truancy statutes kick in if you take your kid out early 3 Fridays in a row, unless the school chooses to excuse the absence.

Note that the school statutorily (http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/ED/htm/ED.25.htm#25.087) *must* excuse in some situations:

(b) A school district shall excuse a student from attending school for:
(1) the following purposes, including travel for those purposes:
(A) observing religious holy days; or
(B) attending a required court appearance; or
(2) a temporary absence resulting from health care professionals if that student commences classes or returns to school on the same day of the appointment.

Not related to the OP's question, but related to kids being held back for missing too much school (excused or unexcused) http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/ED/htm/ED.25.htm#25.092:

Sec. 25.092. MINIMUM ATTENDANCE FOR CLASS CREDIT. (a) Except as provided by this section, a student may not be given credit for a class unless the student is in attendance for at least 90 percent of the days the class is offered.
(a-1) A student who is in attendance for at least 75 percent but less than 90 percent of the days a class is offered may be given credit for the class if the student completes a plan approved by the school's principal that provides for the student to meet the instructional requirements of the class.

 

[ireland_nicole]

we are in TX, but a different school district. I spoke to the principal and got his take on the vacation before I booked it. As long as they know in advance and the work is either completed beforehand or made up it is considered an excused absence.

 

[taitai]

I'm planning on taking my child out for a week at Christmas for Disney and I don't consider myself a sub-par parent.

I am sure no one else does either. Christmas at Disney sounds like fun.

 

[NotUrsula]

I'm not in Texas, but I've looked up the statute for you:

Here's the FAQ from the TEA: http://ritter.tea.state.tx.us/curriculum/early/kfaq.pdf
They have a really weirdly worded rule:

"... Children who are five years of age on or before September 1st are not required to attend Kindergarten. However, on enrollment in Kindergarten, a child shall attend school. Compulsory school attendance begins at age six. ..."

Now for the real law: http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/ED/content/htm/ed.002.00.000025.00.htm


"Sec. 25.085. COMPULSORY SCHOOL ATTENDANCE. (a) A child who is required to attend school under this section shall attend school each school day for the entire period the program of instruction is provided.(b) Unless specifically exempted by Section 25.086, a child who is at least six years of age, or who is younger than six years of age and has previously been enrolled in first grade, and who has not yet reached the child's 18th birthday shall attend school. (c) On enrollment in prekindergarten or kindergarten, a child shall attend school.

You have to go about halfway down the page to reach the section on compulsory attendance, but from Section 25.093, I get the following:

"PARENT CONTRIBUTING TO NONATTENDANCE. (a) If a warning is issued as required by Section 25.095(a), the parent with criminal negligence fails to require the child to attend school as required by law, and the child has absences for the amount of time specified under Section 25.094, the parent commits an offense."

Section 25.094 states that:
"FAILURE TO ATTEND SCHOOL. (a) An individual commits an offense if the individual: 1] is required to attend school under Section 25.085; and 2] fails to attend school on 10 or more days or parts of days within a six-month period in the same school year or on three or more days or parts of days within a four-week period."

Since Kindergarten attendance is not fully compulsory, I just do not see how any court would realistically agree to prosecute for short-term Kindie non-attendance, and especially not if the period that the child was out was no more than 9 weekdays. With public budget shortfalls occurring all over the place, I don't see any local government being foolish enough to spend the tax dollars in a situation concerning a pre-declared family vacation. (I'd say it is likely that there is a greater chance that pigs will learn to fly.)

All bark and very little bite, is my guess.

 

[lostatdisney]

I would also call the school and ask to speak with the attendance secretary. (You wouldn't even have to give your name.) I'm sure they see this a lot.

In Texas, an absence is counted if you don't have a doctor's note. Even if your child is home sick with the flu, if you don't have a note from a doctor's visit, you are counted absent. (One thing to keep in mind - attendance is taken across the state at about 10:15 a.m. each day. If your child is in elementary school and counted present at that time, they will not be counted absent if you pull them out at noon.)

I don't think you will have any trouble. Just don't make a habit of it. And obviously, as the kids get older, they just miss too much work to do something like this. But in kindergarten, don't worry about it! Keep in mind that it is more work for the teacher no matter how you do it.

And just state on your note that it is for "personal reasons." Don't make something up that isn't true. When I taught fourth grade in Cy-Fair, I had a student who would go hunting with his dad, and then the mom would write a note that the boy was absent because he was sick. It made me mad because it was a lie, and it set such a poor example for the son.

But take the trip while you can, and have fun.

 

[jessica52877]

I am not in TX but in GA and they have prosecuted and jailed parents for this reason. I do believe they were trying to prove a point with it but the parents spent 24 hours in jail. This was about 2 years ago it was all over the news.

 

[allyphoe]

Since Kindergarten attendance is not fully compulsory

Actually, it's kindergarten *enrollment* that isn't compulsory. You're allowed to hold your kid out of kindergarten for one year if they make the 5yo age cutoff. But once you've enrolled your 5yo in kindergarten, they're subject to the compulsory education law. (The TEA explanation isn't weirdly worded - it follows the plain language of the statute. Kids who are already 6 and not yet 18, or who are enrolled in pre-K or K, are subject to the compulsory education law.)

Since the real issue is under the statute whether the school chooses to excuse the absence, you may as well get the answer from the person who would do the excusing.

 

[KARAJ]

I'm not in Texas, but I've looked up the statute for you:

Here's the FAQ from the TEA: http://ritter.tea.state.tx.us/curriculum/early/kfaq.pdf
They have a really weirdly worded rule:

"... Children who are five years of age on or before September 1st are not required to attend Kindergarten. However, on enrollment in Kindergarten, a child shall attend school. Compulsory school attendance begins at age six. ..."

Now for the real law: http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/ED/content/htm/ed.002.00.000025.00.htm


"Sec. 25.085. COMPULSORY SCHOOL ATTENDANCE. (a) A child who is required to attend school under this section shall attend school each school day for the entire period the program of instruction is provided.(b) Unless specifically exempted by Section 25.086, a child who is at least six years of age, or who is younger than six years of age and has previously been enrolled in first grade, and who has not yet reached the child's 18th birthday shall attend school. (c) On enrollment in prekindergarten or kindergarten, a child shall attend school.

You have to go about halfway down the page to reach the section on compulsory attendance, but from Section 25.093, I get the following:

"PARENT CONTRIBUTING TO NONATTENDANCE. (a) If a warning is issued as required by Section 25.095(a), the parent with criminal negligence fails to require the child to attend school as required by law, and the child has absences for the amount of time specified under Section 25.094, the parent commits an offense."

Section 25.094 states that:
"FAILURE TO ATTEND SCHOOL. (a) An individual commits an offense if the individual: 1] is required to attend school under Section 25.085; and 2] fails to attend school on 10 or more days or parts of days within a six-month period in the same school year or on three or more days or parts of days within a four-week period."

Since Kindergarten attendance is not fully compulsory, I just do not see how any court would realistically agree to prosecute for short-term Kindie non-attendance, and especially not if the period that the child was out was no more than 9 weekdays. With public budget shortfalls occurring all over the place, I don't see any local government being foolish enough to spend the tax dollars in a situation concerning a pre-declared family vacation. (I'd say it is likely that there is a greater chance that pigs will learn to fly.)

All bark and very little bite, is my guess.

I live in El Paso and we had a parent taken to court for truancy due to taking there PRE KINDER child out when there father was coming home from Iraq for a 2 week R&R. The school district chose to prosecute because once enrolled they are subject to the attendance laws, even if they are not of compulsary
attendance age.

I have known many military families that have had charges brought against them, because they were used to a different system. This is actually one reason my son is homeschooled here. (TX has very liberal Homeschool laws, Go figure) He has severe asthma and would have a hard time making the attendance requirements. I also would not have hesitated to take my child out for a couple of days before my DH left for Iraq again or when he got back, and that would leave me open for prosecution.


The Pre-K parents ended up with a warning from the judge and a notation in school records, no jail or anything but had to go to court. They did choose to remove their child and place him in private school after this though.

 

[ekatiel]

I have no idea about those rules, but if I was putting in my .02 about the districts, I'd go with Friendswood for sure. I think if I were you, I'd just pick up the phone and call the school. Sometimes the "legal-ese" on paper is different that how things really work. So I'd just call and ask!

I grew up in Friendswood, so it is definitely our first choice, but it's hard when you end up buying a 30 year old house in Friendswood ISD for the same price as a brand-spankin' new house jsut two miles down the road in Clear Creek. Since CCISD schools have a good rep, too (maybe not quite as good as FISD), I keep wondering if I just have some sort of wierd emotional attachment to Friendswood. So, I'd love to hear your reasons for preferring Friendswood over Clear Creek-- maybe I'll discover that I'm not crazy!

I'm not in Texas, but I've looked up the statute for you:

With public budget shortfalls occurring all over the place, I don't see any local government being foolish enough to spend the tax dollars in a situation concerning a pre-declared family vacation. (I'd say it is likely that there is a greater chance that pigs will learn to fly.)

All bark and very little bite, is my guess.

Thanks for looking up the statute! I'm guessing you're probably right that they have better ways to spend their time/resources.

I would also call the school and ask to speak with the attendance secretary. (You wouldn't even have to give your name.) I'm sure they see this a lot.

That's a good idea about calling the attendance secratary. I think I'll do that next year before we book ! Thanks for all the replies, guys. --Katie

 

[EnchantedPrincess]

My kids go to Clear Creek ISD and this is from their handbook:

Compulsory Attendance - Truancy
Parent(s)/guardian(s) are responsible for student attendance. The parent/guardian is to contact the school when the student is absent. Students with excessive absences are referred to the District Attendance Officer who contacts the parent(s)/guardian(s).

Texas Education Code Section 25.095 Warning Notice:
The Texas Education Code requires school districts to notify a student’s parent in writing at the beginning of the school year that if a student is absent from school on 10 or more days or parts of days within a six month period in the same school year, or on three or more days or parts of days within a four week period:

A. The parent is subject to prosecution under Section 25.093; and
B. The student is subject to prosecution under Section 25.094

 

[EnchantedPrincess]

In Texas, an absence is counted if you don't have a doctor's note. Even if your child is home sick with the flu, if you don't have a note from a doctor's visit, you are counted absent. (One thing to keep in mind - attendance is taken across the state at about 10:15 a.m. each day. If your child is in elementary school and counted present at that time, they will not be counted absent if you pull them out at noon.)

I am in Texas as well, and I think the rules probably varies from school district to school district. We do not have to bring in a doctor's note if our child is sick and stay home. For the absent to be excused, the parents/guardian must sent in a signed note (within 3 days of the child being absent) and state the reason why the student wasn't in school. After 5 consecutive absences, a doctor's note will be required for the absence to be excused.

Also, if I were to pull my kids out of school at noon for a doctor's appointment, a note from the doctor/dentist verifying the appointment must be sent to the school within 3 days for it to be an excused absences. Same thing if your child comes to school late because of a doctor's appointment. Once I took my dd out half an hour before school ends, I was still required to provide a note from the dentist to verify that I took her out early for an appointment..otherwise, those absences will be subjected to the attendance rules.

 

[ekatiel]

Thanks for the reply, Jenny-- Sort of O/T, but how do you guys like Clear Creek? Like I said in my PP, I grew up in Friendswood, so I think I may have an emotional attachment to the district, but I've heard really good things about Clear Creek. I can't decided if I'm crazy or not wanting to be in FISD when I could have a much nicer house in CCISD!--Katie

 

[EnchantedPrincess]

Thanks for the reply, Jenny-- Sort of O/T, but how do you guys like Clear Creek? Like I said in my PP, I grew up in Friendswood, so I think I may have an emotional attachment to the district, but I've heard really good things about Clear Creek. I can't decided if I'm crazy or not wanting to be in FISD when I could have a much nicer house in CCISD!--Katie

We actually have a Friendswood address but we are in Harris County and we are zoned to CCISD. This is my dd's first year at CCISD, and she has had a really, really great year! We are very happy with her teachers, and her school. Which area are you considering in Friendswood/CCISD? Any idea yet?

Although they have strict rules about attendance, I have a friend who pulled her three kids out of school for two weeks last year without any problems. Then, there is another friend who took her kids out of a different school but didn't give them 2 weeks notice was threatened with notice to appear in court! So I honestly think that it really depends on the school/principal.

 

[ekatiel]

In Friendswood ISD, we like Falcon Ridge-- it is an older subdivision (at least the part we could afford to live in is older!), but its still really nice. We could probably get something there in the low 200's. If we move to CCISD, we were thinking about either Westover Park or Magnolia Creek. We actually were building a house in Magnolia creek last summer, but our current house never sold, so we had to back out of the deal . My DH still talks about that house-- and he's not one to get overly attached to a house! So, who knows what we'll do. We're holding DS (who will be 5 in July) out of kinder next year, so we have another year for the housing market to perk up before we need to sell our house. We are currently in Alvin ISD, and are in a new neighborhood with a lot of foreclosures, so it is not easy to sell our house right now . Hopefully, we'll be able to move next spring . --Katie