Teenage Bullying-What do we do?

[themilesfamily]

That is a sad story, themilesfamily.

THANK YOU for caring. That really means a lot. It's sooo hard to know this happened to someone you love. My brother is such a gentle guy.

I just want people to know how ugly and awful bullying can get.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I thought this was an interesting profile of a bully. It's good to see it in writing.

What Causes Bullies?
by Jane St. Clair

Psychologists used to believe that bullies have low self-esteem, and put down other people to feel better about themselves. While many bullies are themselves bullied at home or at school, new research shows that most bullies actually have excellent self-esteem. Bullies usually have a sense of entitlement and superiority over others, and lack compassion, impulse control and social skills. They enjoy being cruel to others and sometimes use bullying as an anger management tool, the way a normally angry person would punch a pillow.

All bullies have certain attitudes and behaviors in common. Bullies dominate, blame and use others. They have contempt for the weak and view them as their prey. They lack empathy and foresight, and do not accept responsibility for their actions. They are concerned only about themselves and crave attention.

Bullies are not born that way, although certain genetic traits are often present. Some children's personalities are naturally more aggressive, dominating and/or impulsive. Children with Attention Deficit Hyperactive Disorder (ADHD) are more likely to become bullies. However, having such inborn traits does not mean that a child will automatically become a bully. Bullying is a learned behavior, not a character trait. Bullies can learn new ways to curb their aggression and handle conflicts.

Bullies come from all backgrounds. Researchers have not been able to find a link between bullies and any particular religion, race, income level, divorce, or any other socio-economic factor. Girls are just as likely as boys to bully and abuse others verbally, although boys are three times more likely to be physically abusive.

There are different types of bullies produced in different types of homes. Author Susan Coloraso identifies seven kinds of bullies. Among them are the hyperactive bully who does not understand social cues and therefore reacts inappropriately and often physically. The detached bully plans his attacks and is charming to everyone but his victims. The social bully has a poor sense of self and manipulates others through gossip and meanness. The bullied bully gets relief from his own sense of helplessness by overpowering others.

Bullies are often victims of bullies themselves. According to Dr. Peter Sheras, 40% of bullies are themselves bullied at home or at school. Dr. Nathaniel Floyd's research shows that a victim at home is more likely to be a bully at school. The reason may be that when a bully watches another child appear weak and cowering, it disturbs him because it reminds him of his own vulnerability and behavior at home.

Bullies have immature social skills and believe other children are more aggressive than they actually are. If you brush up against a bully, he may take it as a physical attack and assault you because "you deserve it, you started it," etc. Drs. Kenneth Dodge and John Coie's research indicates that bullies see threats where there are none, and view other children as more hostile than they are. The hyperactive bully will explode over little things because he lacks social skills and the ability to think in depth about a conflict.

A bully's parents may be permissive and unable to set limits on their child's behavior. From early on, the bully can do whatever he wants without clear consequences and discipline. His parents may have been abused themselves as children and view disciplinary measures as a form of child abuse. While their lax style may have been fine for an easy-going, older sibling, it will not work on this more aggressive child. This bully may be allowed to dominate younger siblings and even take over his entire family - everything will revolve around his agenda.

A bully's parents often discipline inconsistently. If his parents are in a good mood, the child gets away with bad behavior. If the same parent is under stress, he or she will take it out in angry outbursts against the child. This child never internalizes rules of conduct or respect for authority.

Self-centered, neglectful parents can create a cold, calculating bully. Since his parents do not monitor his activities or take an interest in his life, he learns to abuse others when no authority figure is looking. His bullying can be planned and relentless, as he constantly humiliates his victim, often getting other children to join him.

A bully has not learned empathy and compassion. The parents of bullies often have prejudices based on race, sex, wealth and achievement. Other people are just competitors who stand in the way. Their child must always be the best in sports or academics, and others must be kept in an inferior position. A University of Chicago study led suggested that bullies watch more aggression on television and in family interactions. Aggression is rewarded and respected, and humiliating others is tolerated. Compassion and empathy seem like weaknesses.

http://www.byparents-forparents.com...l denial in bullying&__utmv=-&__utmk=50813225

 

[themilesfamily]

That's really good info. I found this statistic from a study on bullying:

"Nearly 60 percent of boys who researchers classified as bullies in grades 6–9 were convicted of at least one crime by the age of 24; 40 percent of them had three or more convictions by 24."

The bullies of today are the spousal abusers, child abusers and all-around criminals of tomorrow. Again, law enforcement needs to get these people on their radar sooner rather than later.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

THANK YOU for caring. That really means a lot. It's sooo hard to know this happened to someone you love. My brother is such a gentle guy.

I just want people to know how ugly and awful bullying can get.

I definitely understand. Thanks for sharing your story. I hope your brother is doing well today.

I was talking to a friend tonight and she shared with me that her DH was bullied all through school as well. His father was a police officer, too, but times were different then and his parents' attitude was that he should just suck it up, turn the other cheek, etc.

I guess we have a lot of work to do to figure out how to effectively deal with these issues today.

I got a lump in my throat when I read your story and some of the other stories on this thread, and I am incredibly sad for Pheobe and her family.

 

[MyManGoofy!]

Jersey Janice - I'm not trying to pick on you, but the myth that the Columbine shooters were bullied was perpetuated by the media in the chaos of the event. There's a really good book called Columbine published a year or two ago (I think) that details the bullying they did throughout HS. They did not target popular kids or jocks - in fact, it was random. The sad thing is that they were two smart kids with plenty of friends. There were a lot of myths that came out of that story that the media did not bother to go back and fix.

Um - yeah. I am from the area and personally know one of the girls that was injured but survived. Whatever the book says I will believe her account. She said the jocks and the in crowd had targeted those boys as "weird" for years and treated them accordingly. The police and FBI reports back this up. In fact, I remember talking to her a year or so after the massacre and her talking about how the bullying situation was as bad as ever at Columbine. Now - do I think this excused what Klebold and Harris did? No way. But I am going to believe someone who was there and lived it over a book written by someone years after the fact.

Two of the segments for that HBO special "Middle School Confessions" were filmed where my son attended school for a short time. Bullying was a huge problem in that school even after the controversy over that documentary. My son was bullied and harassed for not being a Christian. I received NO help from the school and none from the police when I involved them. You would think that schools in Littleton, CO would be hyper-sensitive to bullying after Columbine. But no. Once it became physical, I not only moved my son from that school district - we left the state all together.

There is waaay too much emphasis placed on how a bullied child should handle or cope with the abuse and not nearly enough punishment for those that engage in it. We do not tolerate this kind of behavior anywhere else - why is it ok for children?

 

[luvsJack]

Um - yeah. I am from the area and personally know one of the girls that was injured but survived. Whatever the book says I will believe her account. She said the jocks and the in crowd had targeted those boys as "weird" for years and treated them accordingly. The police and FBI reports back this up. In fact, I remember talking to her a year or so after the massacre and her talking about how the bullying situation was as bad as ever at Columbine. Now - do I think this excused what Klebold and Harris did? No way. But I am going to believe someone who was there and lived it over a book written by someone years after the fact.

Two of the segments for that HBO special "Middle School Confessions" were filmed where my son attended school for a short time. Bullying was a huge problem in that school even after the controversy over that documentary. My son was bullied and harassed for not being a Christian. I received NO help from the school and none from the police when I involved them. You would think that schools in Littleton, CO would be hyper-sensitive to bullying after Columbine. But no. Once it became physical, I not only moved my son from that school district - we left the state all together.

There is waaay too much emphasis placed on how a bullied child should handle or cope with the abuse and not nearly enough punishment for those that engage in it. We do not tolerate this kind of behavior anywhere else - why is it ok for children?

This is so true. Its expecting a lot to expect a tormented kid that may have started to believe they are worthless to deal with this. If more severe punishment is not dealt out (BEFORE a tragedy happens) to bullies, it will never stop.

 

[agnes!]

I'd like to point out that this family were people who had just moved to the U.S. from another country. The mother did go to the school and did talk to the administration several times. Maybe the mother was leery of making too many waves, maybe the daughter told her to stop going to the school it wasn't helping, maybe she lied and told her mom that things were getting better. To sit at your computer and somewhat cold-bloodedly say that the parents [in this case, the mother] failed, that "since their child is dead I think its a pretty safe assumption that they didn't[do all they could]" ...let me tell anyone who thinks that the parents somehow should have known?... that every family-member, every friend of a suicide-victim asks themselves in the aftermath if they did enough. The "if-onlys" will haunt the survivors for a long time, if not forever. I *know*.

I'd also like to point out that the only parents from that school who have made statements to the media in abundance and who are throwing blame around are some of the parents of the bullies. I'm thinking what are they bellyaching about anyway, their kids are still alive. The mother of this girl has not come to the media and said she is suing the school, suing the teachers, suing the administration... so maybe she doesn't need anyone else to blame *her*, maybe she's doing that sad job already.

By the way, the "girl's" name was Phoebe Prince. Phoebe was 15. Phoebe had brown wavy hair and blue eyes. Phoebe grew up in the small seaside town of Fanore in County Clare, Ireland. Phoebe left behind a mother, three sisters and her father.

Here's her picture:

agnes!

 

[babyrich]

Without reading all the posts and mind you I dont have children but I think bullying is the parents fault. I dont know if the story I read is the same one the OP is speaking of but one of the parents of the bullying teen is blaming the child who killed herself. Parents need to be responsible for their children. Bullying is a part of life now because parents dont tell their children not to do it.

My niece is 14 and is being bullied at school now. Part is her fault, I admit; but her mom, my sister, cannot admit it. My niece is not the warmest kid and she expects to be spoken to first before she speaks. This makes her come across as very snotty. There are several kids in her class who tell her on a daily basis how much everyone hates her. Now I shouldnt say this is her fault. No matter what, you should not be bullied. If you dont like someone ignore them.

My sister called one of her friends, whose son is one of these kids who says this to my niece and the mother said, oh, c'mon children do these things. Her son did tell her what he did and she only scolded him when my sister complained.

Big difference between being disliked by your classmates and being bullied by them.

It is different now than it was when we were kids because there are more forums to use against the person. We have land lines, cell phones, texting, blogs and etc.

The kids responsible for the incident the OP talks of should be held responsible, so should there parents. They raised them.

 

[Pikester]

I'd like to point out that this family were people who had just moved to the U.S. from another country. The mother did go to the school and did talk to the administration several times. Maybe the mother was leery of making too many waves, maybe the daughter told her to stop going to the school it wasn't helping, maybe she lied and told her mom that things were getting better. To sit at your computer and somewhat cold-bloodedly say that the parents [in this case, the mother] failed, that "since their child is dead I think its a pretty safe assumption that they didn't[do all they could]" ...let me tell anyone who thinks that the parents somehow should have known?... that every family-member, every friend of a suicide-victim asks themselves in the aftermath if they did enough. The "if-onlys" will haunt the survivors for a long time, if not forever. I *know*.

I'd also like to point out that the only parents from that school who have made statements to the media in abundance and who are throwing blame around are some of the parents of the bullies. I'm thinking what are they bellyaching about anyway, their kids are still alive. The mother of this girl has not come to the media and said she is suing the school, suing the teachers, suing the administration... so maybe she doesn't need anyone else to blame *her*, maybe she's doing that sad job already.

By the way, the "girl's" name was Phoebe Prince. Phoebe was 15. Phoebe had brown wavy hair and blue eyes. Phoebe grew up in the small seaside town of Fanore in County Clare, Ireland. Phoebe left behind a mother, three sisters and her father.

Here's her picture:

agnes!

 

[Embel]

I think that parents need to understand that the social heirarchy of middle & high school is such that all children are in a position to be bullied at some point...and to be a bully at another point. There is a pecking order there, and it is maintained through power & intimidation.

It's more comfortable to assume that our children are only capable of being the angel, the innocent bystander, or even the victim. If parents can only see their children that way, then children will only see themselves that way.

 

[mickeylove2]

I have a really good friend of about 2 years and his GF and I went to HS together. We graduated 10 years ago and believe it or not he and I were talking recently about getting the kids together and going to the beach. He brought it up and I said what's *Missy* think about that? He says, well she doesn't want to go but said I could take the kids. I asked him why she won't go and he told me, well, I've never told you before but she is very uncomfortable around you. I laughed thinking he was joking and said what do you mean? He says well, she told me that you picked on her all through school!

Now, I am the sweetest nicest kindest person you could ever meet, I don't recall ever bullying anybody in school! She swears up and down that I did and because of the way she was treated in school (by others as well) that for a long time she wanted to kill herself!!!! She has still not gotten over it, here it is 10 years after graduation and she still feels uncomfortable around me! I felt horrible about the way she felt, but I SWEAR I do not remember picking on her. I apologized to her about anything that I may have said or done to her, she has not accepted it but I did what I could do.

I was never really picked on or bullied at school but there were times when I wouldn't get along with someone and would have to deal with the problems that come with not being friendly with a kid and then all their friends decide they don't like you, but I always got over it and never let it bother me. I looked at it as kids will be kids, if I get into a fight with this girl then we fight, and things would be back to normal...but now as an adult, I see things in a different light.

 

[skater]

Um - yeah. I am from the area and personally know one of the girls that was injured but survived. Whatever the book says I will believe her account. She said the jocks and the in crowd had targeted those boys as "weird" for years and treated them accordingly. The police and FBI reports back this up. In fact, I remember talking to her a year or so after the massacre and her talking about how the bullying situation was as bad as ever at Columbine. Now - do I think this excused what Klebold and Harris did? No way. But I am going to believe someone who was there and lived it over a book written by someone years after the fact.

Two of the segments for that HBO special "Middle School Confessions" were filmed where my son attended school for a short time. Bullying was a huge problem in that school even after the controversy over that documentary. My son was bullied and harassed for not being a Christian. I received NO help from the school and none from the police when I involved them. You would think that schools in Littleton, CO would be hyper-sensitive to bullying after Columbine. But no. Once it became physical, I not only moved my son from that school district - we left the state all together.

There is waaay too much emphasis placed on how a bullied child should handle or cope with the abuse and not nearly enough punishment for those that engage in it. We do not tolerate this kind of behavior anywhere else - why is it ok for children?

I'm sorry I don't agree with your assessment of the shooters. They bragged in their journals about picking on freshmen and "f**gs. They played with pipe bombs and weapons and even terrorized one particular kid - whose parents tried as hard as you did to get someone to listen to them -called the police, etc. But anyway, we don't have to agree on the details of Columbine to agree that bullying is scary and people don't take it seriously enough. And you're absolutely right - a bullied child should not be blamed and expected to just "deal with it." For some kids, its like going to a war zone every day.

It sounds like you handled the situation in exactly the right way. If I worked at a job with people like that, I would find another one (if it couldn't be worked out). You protected your child when nobody else would. I've heard too many stories like yours. My DDs best friend was chased down in the halls and harassed repeatedly because she wouldn't sign a gay/straight alliance petition. She wasn't judging homosexuals - she just couldn't go against what she believed. She just wanted to be left alone. The intolerance was astounding and she lost her entire group of friends because of it. She is now homeschooled and extremely happy with a large group of friends and a great social life.

 

[racefanof88]

When my DD was in 10th grade we had a situation with a girl at her school. The girl came up to my daughter, at a football game, and told her she was going to kill her. My daughter did not even know this girl. The situation was brought on by my daughter's ex boyfriend. He had lied to this girl and told her my daughter had broken up with him and caused him so much heart break and blah blah blah.........but, HE actually broke up with my daughter to date someone else.

As soon as my daughter and son(who was also at the game and heard the threat)told me about it I went into action. The threat happened on a Friday night, Saturday morning I called my daughter's new boyfriend on the phone(he also heard the threat) and got his story. Next, I had the police at my house. While the police were there the ex-boyfriend called and wanted to make like he had nothing to do with the situation. I told him the police were at my house and it would be in his best interest if he never called my house again nor talked to my daughter or son again. I filed a report with the police department and he told me they would take care of it.

Monday morning I was at the school having a meeting with the resource officer. I told her the situation and told her I had kept my children home from school because I feared what this girl might do. Well, I do have to say the school system here handled it very well. The girl was lead out of the school in handcuffs and taken to the youth center. Two weeks later, the girl was again arrested at the school because she had brought alcohol to school. She was then expelled.

 

[skater]

When my DD was in 10th grade we had a situation with a girl at her school. The girl came up to my daughter, at a football game, and told her she was going to kill her. My daughter did not even know this girl. The situation was brought on by my daughter's ex boyfriend. He had lied to this girl and told her my daughter had broken up with him and caused him so much heart break and blah blah blah.........but, HE actually broke up with my daughter to date someone else.

As soon as my daughter and son(who was also at the game and heard the threat)told me about it I went into action. The threat happened on a Friday night, Saturday morning I called my daughter's new boyfriend on the phone(he also heard the threat) and got his story. Next, I had the police at my house. While the police were there the ex-boyfriend called and wanted to make like he had nothing to do with the situation. I told him the police were at my house and it would be in his best interest if he never called my house again nor talked to my daughter or son again. I filed a report with the police department and he told me they would take care of it.

Monday morning I was at the school having a meeting with the resource officer. I told her the situation and told her I had kept my children home from school because I feared what this girl might do. Well, I do have to say the school system here handled it very well. The girl was lead out of the school in handcuffs and taken to the youth center. Two weeks later, the girl was again arrested at the school because she had brought alcohol to school. She was then expelled.

Its good to hear a story where things were handled correctly.

 

[luvsJack]

I'd like to point out that this family were people who had just moved to the U.S. from another country. The mother did go to the school and did talk to the administration several times. Maybe the mother was leery of making too many waves, maybe the daughter told her to stop going to the school it wasn't helping, maybe she lied and told her mom that things were getting better. To sit at your computer and somewhat cold-bloodedly say that the parents [in this case, the mother] failed, that "since their child is dead I think its a pretty safe assumption that they didn't[do all they could]" ...let me tell anyone who thinks that the parents somehow should have known?... that every family-member, every friend of a suicide-victim asks themselves in the aftermath if they did enough. The "if-onlys" will haunt the survivors for a long time, if not forever. I *know*.

I'd also like to point out that the only parents from that school who have made statements to the media in abundance and who are throwing blame around are some of the parents of the bullies. I'm thinking what are they bellyaching about anyway, their kids are still alive. The mother of this girl has not come to the media and said she is suing the school, suing the teachers, suing the administration... so maybe she doesn't need anyone else to blame *her*, maybe she's doing that sad job already.

By the way, the "girl's" name was Phoebe Prince. Phoebe was 15. Phoebe had brown wavy hair and blue eyes. Phoebe grew up in the small seaside town of Fanore in County Clare, Ireland. Phoebe left behind a mother, three sisters and her father.

Here's her picture:

agnes!

It is way too easy to sit here and say what they should have done especially when we don't know what conversations went on in that household and we don't know everything her parents were doing.

My prayers are with this family. I cannot begin to imagine what they are going through. I thank God that things turned out differently for ds, it could have been so much worse.

 

[nd5056]

Just like every accident is blamed on texting at the moment every suicide will be blamed on bullying for the time being. Parents will look for someone other then their child to blame when they commit suicide and bullying is the hot topic at the moment. Suicide is ultimately the decision of one person regardless of the outside influences.

I read the whole article but using being put in a garbage can in PE class as the reason for a suicide would be laughable if it weren't for an actual death. There was not a single mention of another "bullying" behavior.

I was shoved in the shower once while changing after gym in 7th grade. Almost everyone in my class was at some point, it was something that was done in the boy's locker room. All of us survived long enough to graduate.

The level to which the MA girl were bullied and this kid are not the same. Just like things that are not sex crimes (peeing on a tree for example) are lumped into the same category all of a sudden the standard kid stuff that happens will all start to be banded into the same category as raping a classmate. Pretty soon not wanting to play with a kid at recess will be grounds for expulsion. The MA case was an outlier for kids picking on kids (aka bullying), getting put into a garbage can is pretty much standard practice for junior high kids. It sure as heck was when I was in junior high and it wasn't all that long ago in the grand scheme of things.

Many things that are described as "cyber-bullying" really aren't. For example, I can hate Joe Smith and start a website ihatejoesmith.com. I can put on that site why I hate Joe Smith and that I am not going to invite him to my birthday party. Other people who hate Joe Smith are allowed to post their reasons. I can make my Facebook status that I hate Joe Smith and am free to do so. As long as I am not putting anything libelous on the site (like Joe Smith killed his wife when he actually didn't) I am exercising my right to state my opinion publicly. It may not be nice but it is allowed. If a parent doesn't want their kid posting their opinion online they can stop them but it is not bullying it is expressing free speech. Many of the things I see reported as cyber-bullying are pretty much what I described here. In reality cyber-bullying is more along the lines of hacking accounts to graffiti someone else's site or threatening recourse if they dont' vote a certain way or support a specific candidate or agenda and things like that. One of the results of having free speech is that there will be not nice speech. This happens every day on the web. Joe Smith can very easily just not type the address ihatejoesmith into his browser address bar. There is ihatemichaelmoore.com and most gossip sites are full of dislike for people.

Kids pick on kids, they always have and they always will. Parenting your children to not allow it to bruise their self esteem, like my parents did, is a much more effective cure to the problem then trying to stop childish behavior by children.

Just my opinion of course.

Valid points, we do tend to jump to conclusion too early.

But there is also the fine line between prank and deliberate intent to be cruel & intimidating.

Kids are raised in a world without consequences (too stressful for them), what do they fear today? What will stop them from bullying, fighting or even shooting someone, feeling bad for the other person?

I do remember how I did fear my father that he would beat the crap out of me, however I don’t recall him ever do such a thing. Perhaps I’ve been spanked when I was little? I know I wasn’t abused, but I was spanked couple of times.

The punishment today is just “go to your room”. We just forget the simple fact there most likely there’s a TV, PC, CD/MP3 player, cell phone, etc. in that room available, what kind of punishment is that?

.

 

[luvmy3]

I'd like to point out that this family were people who had just moved to the U.S. from another country. The mother did go to the school and did talk to the administration several times. Maybe the mother was leery of making too many waves, maybe the daughter told her to stop going to the school it wasn't helping, maybe she lied and told her mom that things were getting better. To sit at your computer and somewhat cold-bloodedly say that the parents [in this case, the mother] failed, that "since their child is dead I think its a pretty safe assumption that they didn't[do all they could]" ...let me tell anyone who thinks that the parents somehow should have known?... that every family-member, every friend of a suicide-victim asks themselves in the aftermath if they did enough. The "if-onlys" will haunt the survivors for a long time, if not forever. I *know*.

I'd also like to point out that the only parents from that school who have made statements to the media in abundance and who are throwing blame around are some of the parents of the bullies. I'm thinking what are they bellyaching about anyway, their kids are still alive. The mother of this girl has not come to the media and said she is suing the school, suing the teachers, suing the administration... so maybe she doesn't need anyone else to blame *her*, maybe she's doing that sad job already.

By the way, the "girl's" name was Phoebe Prince. Phoebe was 15. Phoebe had brown wavy hair and blue eyes. Phoebe grew up in the small seaside town of Fanore in County Clare, Ireland. Phoebe left behind a mother, three sisters and her father.

Here's her picture:

agnes!

Let me ask you this, if the parents and the school had done all they could to ensure this girls torment was over do you think she would still have killed herself? I don't.
If her parents had to go to the school several times that means they knew of the issue and that is was ongoing. It was their responsibilty to not just take her word for it, but to make sure it really had stopped. They are her parents, they brought her into the world and it is their job to make sure she is always safe, period. Its disturbing to see that people think the school should be held more accountable than this girls own parents, however its certainly isn't surprising in this day and age when everyone thinks everyone else is responsible for them. Just like people are saying things about the bullies parents should have known what was going on but Pheobe's own the could just take her word for it is insane. Yes, the school is at fault, they witnessed this girl being bullyied and did nothing, but if the parents were more forceful, like going to the superintendant, or going to the darn police, who knows maybe the school would have done something more. The blame lays at the bullies, the parents and the school, but I guarantee that poor Pheobe was counting on her parents to help her more than any of the others, and thats heartbreaking. So in that sense, they failed her more than anyone.
Do I feel sympathy and sadness for these parents, I sure do, they no longer have their dd and will go on the rest of their lives thinking they could have done more, and the sad reality is that they could have. You can call it cold hearted, but that doesn't mean it isn't true.

 

[luvsJack]

FYI, my ds has been bullied so I have been there, granted not to the extent that this poor girl was. There isn't a single day that goes by that I don't assume its still happening. I talk with my ds about what goes on at school everyday so that I know exactly whats happening there. It doesn't end because I've had meetings with the PE teacher and the VP. Its not enough to just let the school handle it So, to answer your question about how the parents could have known what was going on, they could have asked. They could have checked facebook, myspace, her texts. They could have spoken to her sister or the few friends that tried to help. It certainly wasn't impossible for them to figure out that the problems were getting worse and not over. They could have seen the signs written all over their dd's face. It would be pretty hard for a girl whose torment was so great she needed to kill herself, to not show some sort of sign that something was going on. Maybe she was an excellent actress and could hide it, it still doesn't mean that the parents shouldn't have made sure for themselves that the problems they knew about were really done and over with. This torment went on for months, how could they not know
And, I didn't say the school wasn't at fault but I will disgaree that they were the ones who failed that poor girl in the worst way, her parents did. Who do you really think she wanted to protect her more, mom and dad, or the school?

This is just something that you and I disagree on.

Your opinion is based on your experience and mine is based on mine. If your child is saying over and over "its not happening" and their friends will not say it is happening (because the chances are that mom going to the school is making it worse), you won't suddenly become a mind reader. And if the school is refusing to take action, what possible good is it going to do to go down there if your kid is saying its not happening? Its not like they are going to suddenly say that it is happening when they just spent six months sticking their head in the sand. Until the day ds picked up a football helmet and hit the kid, we honestly thought that at least one of the people we had gone to had found a way to put a stop to it (we believed that the boy's step father had taken some action and got the boy under control). And I did go to the school and talk to his teachers and to the principal. I was the Booster Club VP and the PTO secretary; I was at the school ALL the time and I was communicating with them ALL the time. No one ever came to me and said "this is what is happening". Luckily the kid wasn't really hurt, but if action had been taken when we went to the school (over and over and over), then it would not have happened.


I can promise you one thing, if there is something your child is determined for you not to know about, chances are you will not know about it. You can sit and smugly say that is wrong, but your kid just hasn't been determined enough yet.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I personally think energy is better spent finding solutions than arguing about who's "more" at fault here.

Let's not let Phoebe's death be in vain.

Let's let it help us learn more and find solutions of how to deal with the tough issues of today - then her life and sad death has more meaning.

The name of this thread is "What do we do?"

What DO we do? I'd like to see more information along those lines. Anyone else?

 

[skater]

I personally think energy is better spent finding solutions than arguing about who's "more" at fault here.

Let's not let Phoebe's death be in vain.

Let's let it help us learn more and find solutions of how to deal with the tough issues of today - then her life and sad death has more meaning.

The name of this thread is "What do we do?"

What DO we do? I'd like to see more information along those lines. Anyone else?

This is very wise. I wish I had some wise input. It seems that sometimes there's this "Lord of the Flies" thing that happens when kids are thrown together in a huge setting. Too much peer contact or something. Obviously we know we should talk to our kids, but not all kids talk and some are very good at hiding their deepest feelings from their friends and parents. After all, how many kdis are abused - even by parents and never tell a soul?

I've chosen to homeschool and I love that my kids can be themselves without someone else telling them how they should be. I don't expect that everyone should homeschool - it just works for us. Since not everyone wants to or can homeschool, we obviously need to do something different in our schools and in our homes. I don't think we want to go overboard - we've all heard the ridiculous stories of kids being suspended for bringing a cake knife to cut a cake, etc. How do we balance zero tolerance with common sense?

Schools today have so much to deal with - they are trying to parent kids as well as educate them. I don't think its ever worked for the state to take over the role of parents and yet, many parents are giving up that responsibility.