Taking your children for holidays during school is illegal in the UK

[kollerbear]

Truth be told, kids in poverty situations may not be able to travel regardless of whether or not they have time off from school.

That's true. And their families might not be interested in traveling. I just think that, for those families who really wish they could bring their kids somewhere interesting and really couldn't afford to do it (or couldn't occupationally, for all the reasons we've already heard about) except during certain substantially cheaper dates, it wasn't illegal.

 

[soccerdad72]

That's true. And their families might not be interested in traveling. I just think that, for those families who really wish they could bring their kids somewhere interesting and really couldn't afford to do it (or couldn't occupationally, for all the reasons we've already heard about) except during certain substantially cheaper dates, it wasn't illegal.

I agree, especially about making it illegal.

 

[Luv Bunnies]

They can't do that.

Actually, a school can dis-enroll a student if they don't show up on the first day. Our neighborhood school is considered the most desirable in our district. It's a K-8 and many parents like the idea of their kids attending the same school through middle school. It always has a waiting list at the beginning of the school year. Parents are sent a letter during the summer saying if their child does not show up on the first day of school and parents did not call ahead of time with a valid excuse (illness, not an extended summer vacation), their child may be dis-enrolled and assigned to another district school. The school district has to provide a placement, but not necessarily at your school of choice.

And the real issue is....our kids are not being educated. Cracking down on unnecessary absences may not be the best answer, but taking kids out for vacation isn't a better solution.

I don't agree with this statement. Our kids are being educated. My son is halfway through high school and has been a public school student since kindergarten. He's doing very well. He comes home everyday telling me about something interesting a teacher said, or a cool experiment they did in science class. They created an entire socialist society in World History and schemed to over-through their leader. He couldn't wait to get to school each day since deals where being made in the halls between classes. He learned more in that simulation than he ever could have from a book or a worksheet. It required being present at school, every day. We support him in any way we can. The key to education is that the student has to be fully engaged and the parents have to provide support. Make sure they have the right materials. Help them along if they get stuck. Find a tutor if you can't help them with something. Make sure they're completing their homework. Participate in back-to-school nights and parent/teacher conferences. If you have time, volunteer at the school. Most of all, make sure your child is at school, on time, every day unless they're sick or there are other extenuating circumstances. That's how you can ensure your kids are being educated.

 

[DizBelle]

But why? Why should I skip a year when I could take two vacations for the price of the one. That IMO is silly.
My kids have never had more than two hours of make up work on the 1-2 week holidays we have taken. They always get good grades.
If schools can spend this afternoon doing a bully free walk and another for cancer and another for track and field and another for a play etc. I feel quite within my rights as a parent to choose when we take our vacations.

So 1 week of school can be made up with 1 hour of make up work. If this is really the case, why don't we save a TON of tax money and do all of school like this. The 36 weeks that is currently spent in school can be done with 36 hours of work. Voila!

 

[DizBelle]

Sigh. I miss cyber school. We were on the self-study track; basically, they gave us curriculum for free, I taught the lessons, my son did his paperwork-which had to be turned in to the school for grades. The fact that, when my son was in cyber school, we only needed a three day school week, 4 hours or less per day, to cover all the lessons and do all the work and tests, says to me that public school is mostly busy work. I loved the flexibility of cyber school; unfortunately my son hated being away from his friends all day, isolated at home. I keep hoping he'll change his mind and choose to go back to cyber school, but I won't force him. Let's face it, the majority of Americans use public school as free daycare and that's about all the value it carries with them. I have no problem with parents taking kids out of school for vacation at any age, my family has done it.

No, public school is structured to provide an education to the masses. The masses require all that time for instruction. Some students would require less. Some students would require more. But all will be getting the same instruction.

 

[DizBelle]

I really feel like this is truly a to each their own issue. I don't understand why it's another parent's concern whether I take my child out. Nor do I think it's my concern when they choose not to take their children out.

Seriously, what's it to you?

It affects other children in the class if the teacher has to take time out of lesson B (which is supposed to build on lesson A) to teach lesson A to your child that missed it while you were on vacation last week. THAT'S how it affects others.

 

[kamik86]

Actually, a school can dis-enroll a student if they don't show up on the first day. Our neighborhood school is considered the most desirable in our district. It's a K-8 and many parents like the idea of their kids attending the same school through middle school. It always has a waiting list at the beginning of the school year. Parents are sent a letter during the summer saying if their child does not show up on the first day of school and parents did not call ahead of time with a valid excuse (illness, not an extended summer vacation), their child may be dis-enrolled and assigned to another district school. The school district has to provide a placement, but not necessarily at your school of choice.



I don't agree with this statement. Our kids are being educated. My son is halfway through high school and has been a public school student since kindergarten. He's doing very well. He comes home everyday telling me about something interesting a teacher said, or a cool experiment they did in science class. They created an entire socialist society in World History and schemed to over-through their leader. He couldn't wait to get to school each day since deals where being made in the halls between classes. He learned more in that simulation than he ever could have from a book or a worksheet. It required being present at school, every day. We support him in any way we can. The key to education is that the student has to be fully engaged and the parents have to provide support. Make sure they have the right materials. Help them along if they get stuck. Find a tutor if you can't help them with something. Make sure they're completing their homework. Participate in back-to-school nights and parent/teacher conferences. If you have time, volunteer at the school. Most of all, make sure your child is at school, on time, every day unless they're sick or there are other extenuating circumstances. That's how you can ensure your kids are being educated.

It sounds like your son attended an amazing school. Mine wasn't amazing. I graduated valedictorian and still think I wasted the majority of the time I spent there. Most of it felt like busy work. I liked my shop classes and what I learned during that half (it was a vocational school) but to have that I gave up having anything good on the academic side. english classes were a total joke. It took our HONORS english class 3 months to read MacBeth. The same amount of time the drama club (which was only half school sponsored, it was held at school but directed an run by a local theatre that did a festival with all the area high school) managed to put on MacBeth... which included staging it and memorizing all the lines. The highest math class was trig, no pre calculus at all. No foreign language or arts classes.

This BTW was only 11 years ago that I graduated.

 

[kamik86]

It affects other children in the class if the teacher has to take time out of lesson B (which is supposed to build on lesson A) to teach lesson A to your child that missed it while you were on vacation last week. THAT'S how it affects others.

See I can see saying "Classes won't be held up for a student that missed class it is the students responsibility to cover anything they missed on their own". Then just not holding up Lesson A and teaching Lesson B.

Giving an automatic failure even if the student would only get a B with all 0s for the week or call truancy officers isn't just doing that though that is failing them just because they didn't show up, that is what I have a problem with.

 

[Colleen27]

Our school district has a strict attendance policy so we took our vacation the day after school let out.

And see, that's something I'd be less likely to do than to pull the kids out of school... because going over the built-in snow/weather cancellation days could mean "the day after school gets out" becomes "final exams". And that's virtually impossible to make up at the middle/high school level. I don't plan anything for the first week of my public schooler's break (the private schools don't do make ups for snow days) because of that. Missing 3 days in Feb is easy to make up; having non-refundable plans for June should anything delay the end of the school year is a major problem.

See I can see saying "Classes won't be held up for a student that missed class it is the students responsibility to cover anything they missed on their own". Then just not holding up Lesson A and teaching Lesson B.

I agree. Our kids have two days for every day they miss to complete work, but since we have to notify the school in advance my kids tend to do a lot of their make-up work before we leave. Teachers don't have to provide the work ahead of time but most do; only a few wait and give what was missed when the child gets back to school. But given that starting point, it is the student's responsibility to complete that work and cover the reading and lectures that were missed. My kids get notes or audio recording of lectures from their friends, submit assignments via e-mail on time rather than waiting until their return if that is the teacher's preference, and otherwise manage to keep up on their own/with my help. They aren't expecting anyone to work on their lunch break to get them up to speed.

 

[kamik86]

And see, that's something I'd be less likely to do than to pull the kids out of school... because going over the built-in snow/weather cancellation days could mean "the day after school gets out" becomes "final exams". And that's virtually impossible to make up at the middle/high school level. I don't plan anything for the first week of my public schooler's break (the private schools don't do make ups for snow days) because of that. Missing 3 days in Feb is easy to make up; having non-refundable plans for June should anything delay the end of the school year is a major problem.



I agree. Our kids have two days for every day they miss to complete work, but since we have to notify the school in advance my kids tend to do a lot of their make-up work before we leave. Teachers don't have to provide the work ahead of time but most do; only a few wait and give what was missed when the child gets back to school. But given that starting point, it is the student's responsibility to complete that work and cover the reading and lectures that were missed. My kids get notes or audio recording of lectures from their friends, submit assignments via e-mail on time rather than waiting until their return if that is the teacher's preference, and otherwise manage to keep up on their own/with my help. They aren't expecting anyone to work on their lunch break to get them up to speed.

Wow I didn't even think of the possibility that kids could now get recordings of the lesson from friends... yeah even easier to make up time in that case. Besides the one time I had to travel and had a test at the same time I traveled often when I was doing grad school, since it was being done remotely and I watched all my classes online I just continued doing the work from wherever I was at the time, sometimes business trips sometimes vacations.

 

[smiths02]

In the U.S., the reason why this is even an issue is that states provide money on a per student / per day basis. If a child is not in school, the local school district loses money so many school districts frown on the practice. If this was just a concern about the child's education, parents and teachers could work together on making sure the child makes up the missing assignments either during or shortly after their vacation.

It's the money per day per student AND it was also No Child Left Behind and Annual Yearly Progress. With too much absenteeism, no matter how high the test scores improved, AYP would not be met, then the district would lose more money and also possibly have to pay to send kids to other schools in the district at parent request.

Also, around here, there is a threshold amount where the kid is flagged. My son missed 3 days the first week of school last year (he was really ill), and he was flagged in the system. In the district I worked in previously, more than 9 absences (total, not consecutive) without a doctor's note would end up in a referral to the social worker and possibly court.

 

[cjbcam]

It affects other children in the class if the teacher has to take time out of lesson B (which is supposed to build on lesson A) to teach lesson A to your child that missed it while you were on vacation last week. THAT'S how it affects others.

That's when parents that take their children on vacations come in to play. Anything they miss during vacation time they can teach their children.
My experience has literally been one or two hours of helping them catch up what they missed while we have been gone. My experience is definitely the reason I think it's no big deal to take kids out.

 

[eliza61]

I also don't have kids but even as a student I found all of those "You must be in class or you will fail" to be stupid. I had one of these in college where they would make you fail if you missed more then 3 classes of calculus no matter what your grades on the tests were. That is insane. If I know the material and pass I should pass the class.

I missed days in high school all the time. Sometimes for vacations, sometimes for other school activities (If not missing a few days of class is SOO important why could school let us miss classes for sports or other competitions and activities?) Frankly in the US the schools really care that we are there because of the money they lose every day a student is absent. It has nothing to do with the quality of education anyway.

I don't think its insane at all. if a professor did that, people would be screaming about how they pay all this tuition money and the professor isnt there. you want to vacation 24/7 find a school that has a flexible attendance policy. College classes are all voluntary at any time you can quit.

If someone wants to take their kid on holiday, pay the fine and go. Sorry but I find these attitudes the height of entitlements. schools, countries and jobs should all change there policy so people can go on vacations???

When did vacationing become an unalienable right??? life, liberty and vacation

 

[bethy]

Most of all, make sure your child is at school, on time, every day unless they're sick or there are other extenuating circumstances. That's how you can ensure your kids are being educated.

I can tell you with absolutely certainty that this is NOT true for one of my kids. The only parts that do improve her education is the full parental support and her own full engagement in learning.

 

[eliza61]

"Family Vacations" aren't a "right", which means people aren't entitled to one. And ok, maybe parents can't get vacation time while the kids are out of school. That doesn't mean they can't find other times for "family time"... weekends, evenings, mornings, SOMETHING. Saying it's "too expensive to go another time" is a cop out to me. "But, we can't go anywhere because we don't get good vacation time." Sorry, life isn't "fair".

And before someone brings up the "kids will learn more from vacation then a week at school", those learning opportunities are around you every day. Your kids don't need to go somewhere else to learn.

Lol not only should the world stop so kids can vacation, we must also make it affordable.

 

[cjbcam]

I don't think its insane at all. if a professor did that, people would be screaming about how they pay all this tuition money and the professor isnt there. you want to vacation 24/7 find a school that has a flexible attendance policy. College classes are all voluntary at any time you can quit.

If someone wants to take their kid on holiday, pay the fine and go. Sorry but I find these attitudes the height of entitlements. schools, countries and jobs should all change there policy so people can go on vacations???

When did vacationing become an unalienable right??? life, liberty and vacation

Vacation would fall under liberty. But then again I guess not since taking your kids out of school for vacation is no longer your decision since you can be fined for it.

 

[gwynne]

That's when parents that take their children on vacations come in to play. Anything they miss during vacation time they can teach their children.
My experience has literally been one or two hours of helping them catch up what they missed while we have been gone. My experience is definitely the reason I think it's no big deal to take kids out.

JMO....
In 2nd grade? Sure. In 7th or 8th grade? Iffy. In High School? No way. I'm not qualified to tutor or teach subjects like trig or AP European History....that was between my kids and their teachers.

 

[Colleen27]

Wow I didn't even think of the possibility that kids could now get recordings of the lesson from friends... yeah even easier to make up time in that case. Besides the one time I had to travel and had a test at the same time I traveled often when I was doing grad school, since it was being done remotely and I watched all my classes online I just continued doing the work from wherever I was at the time, sometimes business trips sometimes vacations.

My daughters' schools are really great that way. As I said before, we have some very dedicated athletes who attend both schools as well as a couple of kids with chronic health issues that cause them to miss much more time than just a family vacation, and the schools have worked out great distance learning options, up to and including "attending" class via Skype, to accommodate them and other kids who miss time for whatever reason. Students are encouraged to record lectures if they find that easier than taking notes (a lot of kids struggle to simultaneously take notes and listen attentively) so the files are there to share, and kids are strongly encouraged to turn to their peers and share those materials before asking for the teacher for accommodations.

 

[Colleen27]

If someone wants to take their kid on holiday, pay the fine and go. Sorry but I find these attitudes the height of entitlements. schools, countries and jobs should all change there policy so people can go on vacations???

When did vacationing become an unalienable right??? life, liberty and vacation

I'll be honest - I think it should be. I think our country is terribly backward in our attitudes toward leisure time and that it creates a culture that verges on toxic for families who are expected to squeeze in time together only if and when the competing obligations of multiple school and work schedules align in such a way that there is an opportunity, however fleeting. I think it is a damned shame that so much of our workforce gets little/no paid vacation time and that many of those who do get it know full well there are professional consequences should they actually use it and that schools can impose fines and other criminal penalties on families who can't just plan around the school calendar (which, by the way, often comes out too last minute for vacation time requests and changes on even shorter notice based on weather, power outages, and other uncontrollable factors).

 

[sam_gordon]

having non-refundable plans for June should anything delay the end of the school year is a major problem.

That happened to us once. School was scheduled to get out on a Wednesday. We made plans for the following Friday (10 days later) to fly to WDW. We had enough snow days that DD ended up missing the last day of 7th grade (yes it was "excused").

However, we still had to pay. In our school district, some 8th graders are allowed to go to the HS for first period and take HS Algebra as an 8th grader. The told the kids on the last day of 7th grade. DD was supposed to be one of the kids going to the HS the following year. We were never informed. She took 8th grade math. However, in order to get "back on track" in HS, she had to take 2 math classes her Sophomore(?) year.