Switching of diabetes pump for vacation

[BethCPTSD]

Right I understand that. My point was that the DSD's are said to alert more accurately to needing the dose, which would then allow you to administer it. But it may not be relevant, or the right thing for the OP! Thanks, Gap.

 

[gap2368]

I so wish I could PM you but do not know how. Yes a diabetes alert dog ( DAD) is a good resort for some like if you do not feel lows. But it is not right for everyone. Even with a DAD you still have to test a DAD could alert you to a low but they can not tell you if you are 30 or 75 each needing something different. Or heights so testing is still important

I am not trying to ague with you I am pretty sure you do not have diabetes and yes a service dog can be great ( I have meet a few DAD) and they all have helped they owners greatly

 

[BethCPTSD]

Gap -- I'm not sure how to PM either! But that's okay. Yes, I am aware the DAD's work this way. I was only giving a little information to the OP in case she was not aware of this option and she thought it could be helpful. Like I said several times, it may not be right for their situation. But I do know how it works...it's just like you've said. Some people use them, some people don't. For some people they would be helpful, for others they would not. And you are correct in saying I am not diabetic. I am not. But I have read extensively on service dogs for all sorts of disabilities and am pretty aware of how many kinds function. Anyway, I am not wanting to argue either. But I don't think we are on different pages here. Besides, no one has to look into the information I offered if it wouldn't suit them. Only the individual (whoever it may be, would know what would suit them the best.) I am sorry however, if I upset you somehow. Please take care. No hard feelings, at all.

 

[gap2368]

I think one region why I am a little more sensitive On this is that I have heard from so many ph you have a CGM or a DAD ( no I do not have a DAD) so you do not have to test even for other D but yes you are right a DAD can be great for some ( I have thought about getting one some time soonish

 

[buffettgirl]

Right I understand that. My point was that the DSD's are said to alert more accurately to needing the dose, which would then allow you to administer it. But it may not be relevant, or the right thing for the OP! Thanks, Gap.

Gap -- I'm not sure how to PM either! But that's okay. Yes, I am aware the DAD's work this way. I was only giving a little information to the OP in case she was not aware of this option and she thought it could be helpful. Like I said several times, it may not be right for their situation. But I do know how it works...it's just like you've said. Some people use them, some people don't. For some people they would be helpful, for others they would not. And you are correct in saying I am not diabetic. I am not. But I have read extensively on service dogs for all sorts of disabilities and am pretty aware of how many kinds function. Anyway, I am not wanting to argue either. But I don't think we are on different pages here. Besides, no one has to look into the information I offered if it wouldn't suit them. Only the individual (whoever it may be, would know what would suit them the best.) I am sorry however, if I upset you somehow. Please take care. No hard feelings, at all.

actually, I'm not purposely trying to sound rude, but you have absolutely no idea how this works.

 

[BethCPTSD]

Lol. Well. I won't argue about it. But I haven't really explained my "understanding" of it. I'm sorry if there has been any confusion or people are upset that I made a suggestion. All I was referring to, are DAD's that alert to blood sugar highs and lows. If that is not relevant, that's is completely okay. But I know there are dogs that do that, and that was the only thing I've made reference to. No one has to take a suggestion It's only there in case it applies to anyone...

EDIT: By the way, Buffettgirl...it sounds like you may have a lot of experience with this kind of service dog. As I was just trying to offer some information, maybe you could tell your experience, especially if you feel I'm incorrect. The more info people have the better. I just thought it could be helpful for the OP, or anyone looking to know, if they had more options; and I've always read that the service dogs are often more reliable than some of the pumps available in terms of catching when there is a problem. Please share, if you can! Thank you.

 

[bfamily5]

Does he take less lantus or the regular amount (for him I mean), if you don't mind sharing? Does he test for highs more (and then bolus)? Does he have any trouble switching back?

Thank you.

He takes the same amount of lantus that he was on prior to going on the pump. With the pump his endo has it programmed to release a small "background" dose every hour. So when he removes the pump he just replaces that with his old dose of lantus. He tests about as frequently as he would with the pump on. In the a.m, before each meal, if he feels like he's high or low, and at bedtime. If we decide to grab an ice cream or something he'll bolus based on his mental carb calculation and then test before the next meal and correct if (when) he's off, lol. As far as switching back. The lantus is a 24 hr insulin. He takes it at bedtime, so the night before we leave he takes his lantus. We'll fly/ travel all day and usually get in around 8 or 9. He'll set the pump back on and away we go...easy peasy! HTH.

 

[buffettgirl]

in the OPs situation, a diabetes alert dog will not help. It's a completely irrelevant suggestion for what she is asking. A diabetes alert dog does not do what you assume it does. Again, I don't deliberately want to be rude, but I can't understand why you are continuing to suggest something, and talk about something that you don't know anything about.

Lol. Well. I won't argue about it. But I haven't really explained my "understanding" of it. I'm sorry if there has been any confusion or people are upset that I made a suggestion. All I was referring to, are DAD's that alert to blood sugar highs and lows. If that is not relevant, that's is completely okay. But I know there are dogs that do that, and that was the only thing I've made reference to. No one has to take a suggestion It's only there in case it applies to anyone...

EDIT: By the way, Buffettgirl...it sounds like you may have a lot of experience with this kind of service dog. As I was just trying to offer some information, maybe you could tell your experience, especially if you feel I'm incorrect. The more info people have the better. I just thought it could be helpful for the OP, or anyone looking to know, if they had more options; and I've always read that the service dogs are often more reliable than some of the pumps available in terms of catching when there is a problem. Please share, if you can! Thank you.

 

[BethCPTSD]

Buffettgirl, it's okay we don't agree. But we must be talking about different functions of these dogs. I have articles that verify that some individuals who use pumps, choose to use dogs instead -- but not all. I was only talking about the alert aspect of the job they provide, and I've said all along that it may not apply to the OP and even if it did, it may not even be of interest to her. (As a quick aside, I'd like to apologize to the OP, as this has conversation has become a diversion from the original intention of the post -- both mine and the OP's.) I am simply including this information because many people come to this board and have different kinds of issues they are dealing with and while one suggestion may not work for one person it may work for another. That's always considered when people post on this board.

I don't know you at all and assume you are very well intended, but it is hard not to be a bit taken aback at how strongly you are coming across on this. I've made a suggestion for anyone it applies to and that's all. If you have any additional information you'd like to provide that would be helpful, rather than trying to make a point of me being " absolutely wrong", I think that might be more effective. Besides, myself, and anyone else reading this understands at this point that you feel I've offered incorrect information. If that is what has happened, that is okay, I'm not perfect. But please just offer what you feel is the CORRECT information, and move on. I apologize to all for continuing to defend myself here. I feel my own disabilities have been pretty activated by feeling attacked, so I'll make a conscious effort to stop here. I try to be always as considerate as possible on these boards and don't want to speak out of turn. Take care, Buffettgirl. I hope we can have more effective interactions in the future.

 

[buffettgirl]

Buffettgirl, it's okay we don't agree. But we must be talking about different functions of these dogs. I have articles that verify that some individuals who use pumps, choose to use dogs instead -- but not all. I was only talking about the alert aspect of the job they provide, and I've said all along that it may not apply to the OP and even if it did, it may not even be of interest to her. (As a quick aside, I'd like to apologize to the OP, as this has conversation has become a diversion from the original intention of the post -- both mine and the OP's.) I am simply including this information because many people come to this board and have different kinds of issues they are dealing with and while one suggestion may not work for one person it may work for another. That's always considered when people post on this board.

I don't know you at all and assume you are very well intended, but it is hard not to be a bit taken aback at how strongly you are coming across on this. I've made a suggestion for anyone it applies to and that's all. If you have any additional information you'd like to provide that would be helpful, rather than trying to make a point of me being " absolutely wrong", I think that might be more effective. Besides, myself, and anyone else reading this understands at this point that you feel I've offered incorrect information. If that is what has happened, that is okay, I'm not perfect. But please just offer what you feel is the CORRECT information, and move on. I apologize to all for continuing to defend myself here. I feel my own disabilities have been pretty activated by feeling attacked, so I'll make a conscious effort to stop here. I try to be always as considerate as possible on these boards and don't want to speak out of turn. Take care, Buffettgirl. I hope we can have more effective interactions in the future.

A dog is not a replacement for an insulin pump. Never, no how, no way, there are no articles that suggest that. There are a total of zero individuals that are able to use a dog as a replacement for a pump. I'm not really sure how to be any more clear on this subject. You have absolutely no understanding of what an insulin pump does. It's a completely invalid suggestion to the OP or to anyone. It would be like suggesting that someone who needs a wheelchair use eye glasses instead.

Again I am not sure how many more ways I can say it. An insulin pump provides insulin. A diabetes alert dog alerts to blood sugar. Unless a dog can figure out how to work a syringe, then there is no way a diabetes alert dog can be used by someone instead of a pump, which is what you keep suggesting. The op's original post was about an insulin pump. Diabetes alert dogs do not come into play here. The fact that you keep asserting otherwise, is about as misinformed as possible.

 

[gap2368]

I think beth is mistaking a CGM for a pump yes then some people uses a DAD instead of a CGM ( some use both) in that way I can see where beth is coming from but she is also using terms I have never heard before like "the dose" what does dose the dog alert to? Beth I do think you had good intention here all though they were ( I think I want to say misleading? but not on purpose)

 

[T00dles]

I have a cgm that I can also use as a pump. Usually I do not use the pump, but I find I like using it on days I go to the park. I split my lantus doses (half in am, half at night) so I can either take the lantus for that section or go to a basal depending my projected activity. I would say having both helps, and then using what seems to be right for the situation.

 

[BethCPTSD]

Thanks, Gap. I'm sorry for confusing you with the word "dose". You had used that word in your message, I realized later you meant the word "does", and so, I used it as in the "dose" of insulin when I replied... sorry about that, it was confusion on my part. I did go look this up again, to see if I've just seriously misunderstood something, but am still finding the same information. Obviously, I am not saying a service animal will give the person the insulin they need. My understanding is simply, like other medical alert dogs, it alerts to a problem with blood chemistry, alerts the person, and they know (by some accounts more accurately) when they need to test and possibly administer their own insulin. This is according to numerous things that I've read. I believe I have a right to say that, with that qualifier. As with anything else, this will never be every person's experience.

I can see that if there were more than one thing called an "insulin pump" there might be confusion, but I don't think so. This is what has been referred to in the things that I've read. If all the things I've read are incorrect, than, they are incorrect. As I said, that's all I'm going by. I will give one quick reference. If you go to: www.dogs4diabetics.com FAQ, it says that DAD's are often used for people who are in varying situations, including having used/needed an insulin pump. There are others, but this is the one I'm listing. I am seriously not trying to spread misinformation. But I am pretty certain when someone tells about something they've heard, the person who is interested goes and sees for themselves if it could apply or be helpful in their own situation. I'm not telling any particular person to get rid of their pump and go buy a dog. Buffettgirl, I'm sorry if I struck a sensitive chord with you. I was not trying to step on your toes. Thanks, friends.

 

[BethCPTSD]

Out of curiosity, would anyone like to talk about the difference between a CGM and a pump? I could look it up, but would love to hear about it if you want to say??

 

[SueM in MN]

Just to clear the air.
The Original poster asked about an insulin pump.
An insulin pump does exactly what it says: it pumps insulin at a steady rate (the basal rate) and can also deliver a dose of insulin at the direction of the user (surge). That is usually given at mealtimes or other times when an extra dose is need. A dog can't replace an insulin pump.
Here is a reference for that information: http://www.diabetes.org/living-with...nd-care/medication/insulin/insulin-pumps.html

A continuous glucose monitor (CGM) reads the glucose level in the blood continuously during the day and night. It alerts when the reading is too high or too low. It doesn't give insulin and doesn't completely replace doing blood sugar measurements with a blood sugar meter.
This is a reference for that information: http://www.joslin.org/info/the_facts_about_continuous_glucose_monitoring.html

A diabetes service dog could possibly replace a continuous glucose monitor for some people. Some dogs can alert to changes in blood sugar level, but they just alert; the person would still need to take a reading with a blood sugar meter to verify whether the alert is 'real' or what the level was. The person would still need to decide what action to take.
So, in a way, a dog is like a smoke alarm - when the alam goes off, it could be just smoke, it could be fire or it could be that you were cooking and made too much steam. Is a piece of information that need to be checked to see what it really means.
This is a reference for diabetes alert dog information:
http://www.diabetesforecast.org/2014/11-nov/diabetes-alert-dogs-buyer.html

 

[lanejudy]

While a well-intentioned suggestion, a service dog is not an option for OP's situation. It sounds like her son is doing well with his insulin pump, the question lies in what to do while on vacation. A service dog is not a temporary solution for anyone looking for advice for managing diabetes on vacation.

Please, let's get this thread back on track with suggestions or experiences related to taking a break from an insulin pump during vacation.

 

[BethCPTSD]

Thank you, Sue! Lol. That was all I was saying. Thank you for saying it in a way it will hopefully be clearer.

Judy, I felt the same way. I didn't mean anything should be changed that was working. It was said because anyone reading the board could use the information, and you never know who that will be or when.

I'm done, folks. <3

 

[SueM in MN]

One further explanation post, then no more about dogs....

Thanks, Gap. I'm sorry for confusing you with the word "dose". You had used that word in your message, I realized later you meant the word "does", and so, I used it as in the "dose" of insulin when I replied... sorry about that, it was confusion on my part. I did go look this up again, to see if I've just seriously misunderstood something, but am still finding the same information. Obviously, I am not saying a service animal will give the person the insulin they need. My understanding is simply, like other medical alert dogs, it alerts to a problem with blood chemistry, alerts the person, and they know (by some accounts more accurately) when they need to test and possibly administer their own insulin. This is according to numerous things that I've read. I believe I have a right to say that, with that qualifier. As with anything else, this will never be every person's experience.

I can see that if there were more than one thing called an "insulin pump" there might be confusion, but I don't think so. This is what has been referred to in the things that I've read. If all the things I've read are incorrect, than, they are incorrect. As I said, that's all I'm going by. I will give one quick reference. If you go to: www.dogs4diabetics.com FAQ, it says that DAD's are often used for people who are in varying situations, including having used/needed an insulin pump. There are others, but this is the one I'm listing. I am seriously not trying to spread misinformation. But I am pretty certain when someone tells about something they've heard, the person who is interested goes and sees for themselves if it could apply or be helpful in their own situation. I'm not telling any particular person to get rid of their pump and go buy a dog. Buffettgirl, I'm sorry if I struck a sensitive chord with you. I was not trying to step on your toes. Thanks, friends.

This appears to be the part of the FAQs thread from dogs4diabetics you are talking about.

"what situations can these dogs help people with diabetes?
These dogs can be used in many situations and with all types of people, male, female, young and old. They are most valuable in situations where the diabetic is actively managing their blood sugar, with an insulin injections or a pump. These types of clients have more lows than persons using oral medications and they have the lows frequently. The dog is able to assist them in these situations. A diabetic that does not have frequent low blood sugar would not need a dog for this purpose. In the case of children, the dogs assist the parents in providing night time alert coverage. The parents must test multiple times during the night, and the dogs support the oversight beyond that testing. In the case of a new college student, away from home, the dog provides the support that parents previously did, to make sure that the student tests when low, day and night. Living alone is scary when you have this disease and the dog provides the support to make it manageable."

The references all are saying the same thing because that is true. But, there is more to understanding it than just what is written and it appears you made some leaps because of not understanding.
For many years, the emphasis for diabetics was on keeping blood sugar levels from getting high because that can cause longterm complications and damage. But, the goal then was not to get to normal, just to stay in a range that was not real high and somewhere not too far above normal.
The part of the quote I bolded is talking about what is called "tight diabetes control" - that means keeping the blood sugar as close to normal blood sugar levels as it possibly can be kept safely. This change in emphasis was because the closer to normal the diabetic can keep the blood glucose levels, the lower the risk of serious complications.
One way to accomplish this tight control is to use a pump as I mentioned in the other post - a pump can simulate better how insulin is released in a non-diabetic's body by giving a constant basal dose of insulin and then extra doses when needed - to simulate the way insulin is released in response to food in a non-diabetic's body. Someone not using a pump would keep tight control with multiple insulin injections during the day.
It is very easy to get too low of blood sugar when trying to keep tight control, so tight control requires frequent blood sugar testing to make sure the blood sugar does not get so low that it is dangerous or fatal.
That is where a CGM or dog could help with alerting someone who has or is at risk of frequent low blood sugars. Aside from the fact that many people working on tight control are using insuln pumps, there is no connection between service dogs and insulin pumps.
This reference has a good explanation about tight control.
http://www.diabetes.org/living-with...d-glucose-control/tight-diabetes-control.html

 

[BethCPTSD]

Absolutely! I couldn't agree with you more! And I would not be the person to come to for that!

 

[dja14]

OP here---I would love for our son to have a dog. We do not have a continuous monitor either. I guess I am the monitor as I do the middle of the night testing as needed (which for obvious reasons I would like to not need to sleep half a day on vacation) I have looked into a dog but we are such a distance from a training location it just didn't seem feasible right now. Also, I cannot believe how expensive they are if you don't train them yourself.

For info-if your interested-
Right now he uses an omnipod pump which people have mistaken for a glucose monitor (for those not familiar it does not have tubing) His pump drips tiny amounts of insulin into his body. It it the best replacement for a pancreas right now. (things are always changing) The omnipod has a pod and a small cell phone sized computer that talks to the pod for bolus (meal insulin) We still have to test his blood sugar with a/the monitor separately, which is what a cgm would do. My understanding is the dog would draw attention when 'something' seemed off and then you would test. His lows can come from (seemingly) nowhere though so I am hopeful with his next pump we can look at a monitor as well. The reason we have even looked at a dog is for support when he moves from home. I have had several friends suggest it but it is not as easy as it sounds (unless it is, then please pm me LOL) and very $$$
Type 1 diabetes is more complicated (and never ending) than I ever dreamed, I really think unless you or a close family member deals with it, it would be hard to understand (and I am supported in that thought by our drs and nurse educator, the ones with type 1 understand a lot more, how could you not?) I always appreciate suggestions though

He takes the same amount of lantus that he was on prior to going on the pump. With the pump his endo has it programmed to release a small "background" dose every hour. So when he removes the pump he just replaces that with his old dose of lantus. He tests about as frequently as he would with the pump on. In the a.m, before each meal, if he feels like he's high or low, and at bedtime. If we decide to grab an ice cream or something he'll bolus based on his mental carb calculation and then test before the next meal and correct if (when) he's off, lol. As far as switching back. The lantus is a 24 hr insulin. He takes it at bedtime, so the night before we leave he takes his lantus. We'll fly/ travel all day and usually get in around 8 or 9. He'll set the pump back on and away we go...easy peasy! HTH.

bfamily5 Thanks so much! I wanted to hear this! This is exactly how our sons lantus and pump work. Hearing about how the testing (when switching back to lantus) would work is so helpful, especially from a type 1 adult. We do carb counts mentally a lot as well so I love you say if/when. That is what I was worried about, how 'off' his numbers would be. So pretty normal sounding (for us-I mean him LOL) Sounds like going back is easy enough as well (that is how we started on the pump, set for the evening to start)

Thank you everyone. We see the endocrinologist in a couple weeks and will decide on a plan (and a back up), then we will see them one more before we go. With our insurance it can take me a couple months to straighten changes so I appreciate the help before our appt.