Stupid stunt

[Goofyuk]

People seem to be under the impression that Disney went overboard trying to find the idiot to punish him when they would have been trying to save him.

You have a guy who jumped into a lake inhabited by gators & snakes, with boats regularly crossing it. It's dark so he can't be seen and may be disoriented. He could be drunk or even suicidal. Until they found him they had to work on the possibility he was still out there and in trouble. Helicopters with searchlights would provide a safe way to carry out this kind of search & rescue mission.

After the event, they would look at blame and depending in Floridian law he would either be arrested or face civil charges. His friends would have been drained to get info to help in the search and in the hopes the idiot would contact them if he was safe.

 

[mzadell]

...Disney went overboard...

What you did there - I see it.

 

[kay1864]

Likely they would detain them briefly, find out what they knew, and when. Then either cut them loose or hold them for further questions if thier story doesn't add up or they seem to be hiding something.

Um, no. You can only detain someone you suspect of a crime. Once again, it is not a crime to merely know someone who did something illegal, nor is it a crime to video said person. It is also not a crime to "hide something" (i.e. knowledge) from Disney security.

Security (even Disney) cannot "hold someone for further questions" just because they might know the guy. That opens up Disney to a major lawsuit. Disney security can step in when a person is seen committing criminal behavior. But only that person can be detained, not his/her acquaintances.

 

[ParrotBill]

Pretty sure you can't detain or question someone just for (a) being friends with someone who jumped from the boat or (b) taking a video of that person.

If they aided the guy in the crime (like opened a gate on the side of the boat), yes.

But if they're just his friends, and taking a video, no. Not even at Disney.

I'll bet the Sheriff could come up with a dozen potential crimes for the collaborators. At a minimum, detain at request of Disney on basis of trespassing so they can revoke their passes and declare them banned from Disney's private property.

 

[kay1864]

I'll bet the Sheriff could come up with a dozen potential crimes for the collaborators.

I specifically mentioned Disney security, not the county sheriff. However, (1) Disney security could not detain his friends (for the reasons mentioned above), and (2) even for the sheriff, being his friend or videoing his activities are not crimes.

At a minimum, detain at request of Disney on basis of trespassing so they can revoke their passes and declare them banned from Disney's private property.

Disney guests are not trespassers, and detaining them on that basis would open Disney up to a lawsuit. Revoking their tickets and banning them would have the same effect.

Once again, Disney security can step in when a person is seen committing criminal behavior. But only that person can be detained, not his/her acquaintances.

 

[Friendlyadvice2]

I specifically mentioned Disney security, not the county sheriff. However, (1) Disney security could not detain his friends (for the reasons mentioned above), and (2) even for the sheriff, being his friend or videoing his activities are not crimes.

I see this thread has gone awry and I'm not even sure what state or federal statute has been violated here, but for informational purposes, the landmark case of Terry vs. Ohio has long since set the standard to detain somebody without violating their 4th Ammendment rights as, a "reasonable suspicion" that a crime has been or is about to be committed. I don't know what law enforcement authority Disney security has, but, based on the totality of the circumstances, any official law enforcement officer responding to the scene, including the sheriff, would have had more than enough "reasonable suspicion" to detain the acquaintances to determine the extent of any conspiracy and their involvement.

You also mentioned above that wihholding "knowledge" is not a crime, however, in my state and at the federal level as well, it is a crime to lie (witholding information from a law enforcement officer in an official capacity is a lie) to a law enforcement officer; it's charged frequently. In short, detaining acquaintances without reasonable suspicion would not be allowed as you pointed out, but detaining acquaintances with reasonable suspicion of their involvement in a larger conspiracy is something completely different and would not have been a problem here if a state/federal law was violated; breaking Disney policy is not a crime.


[/QUOTE]Once again, Disney security can step in when a person is seen committing criminal behavior. But only that person can be detained, not his/her acquaintances.[/QUOTE]

Any person can "step in" when a person is seen committing a crime; it may not be wise, but it happens frequently.

 

[kay1864]

I see this thread has gone awry and I'm not even sure what state or federal statute has been violated here, but for informational purposes, the landmark case of Terry vs. Ohio has long since set the standard to detain somebody without violating their 4th Ammendment rights as, a "reasonable suspicion" that a crime has been or is about to be committed. I don't know what law enforcement authority Disney security has, but, based on the totality of the circumstances, any official law enforcement officer responding to the scene, including the sheriff, would have had more than enough "reasonable suspicion" to detain the acquaintances to determine the extent of any conspiracy and their involvement.

Disney security are not "official law enforcement officers". And being friends with someone who jumped in a lake is still not a crime, nor is videoing that person. Only if security witnessed the friends aiding him in his crime can they detain them (for example, them opening a boat gate--as I've already mentioned).

Disney security cannot legally detain anyone for watching, being friends with, or taking a video of someone jumping in a lake. And Disney security knows this.

**IF** a sheriff happened to get there in time, he/she could certainly detain the friends based on probable suspicion. However, Disney security cannot detain them on that basis, even if only to hold them for the sheriff.

You also mentioned above that wihholding "knowledge" is not a crime, however, in my state and at the federal level as well, it is a crime to lie (witholding information from a law enforcement officer in an official capacity is a lie) to a law enforcement officer.

Read more carefully. My statement was "It is also not a crime to "hide something" (i.e. knowledge) from Disney security." (in response to a PP who thought Disney security could detain someone on that basis).

 

[CarolMN]

Personally, I don't much care if other people take risks or do stupid stunts - as long as the consequences to their actions don't fall on others.

I strongly object to paying for those selfish people who can't think beyond the end of their own nose. The cost of all that Disney and law enforcement went through to find that guy couldn't have been trivial.

If he's caught, I say he does community service every evening and weekend for at least the a year. Maybe that will help him think about consequences before he actually does something else stupid.

 

[Friendlyadvice2]

**IF** a sheriff happened to get there in time, he/she could certainly detain the friends based on probable suspicion.

I'm glad you agree. Although "probable suspicion" is not a legal standard to detain anyone; that standard as stated is "reasonable suspicion". If that suspicion is confirmed, then "probable" cause has been established to make an arrest.

 

[bumbershoot]

Not excusing the behavior, but if they saw the guy exit the water safely, why call out S.W.A.T? I understand alerting security to be on the look out for some bad guys with this description, but helicopters? Isn't that overkill x100?

When I read the OP I didn't see that the guy got out. Just that the friends did.

hope they find you and your two stupid friends who were taking video of your stunt and took off running. I hope you weren't hurt but I hope you turn yourself in so Disney knows you're not floating out there somewhere.

I separate "you" from "your two stupid friends", so I think the friends took off running, but the jumper was still in the water. The OP goes on to wish that the jumper lets Disney know he isn't just floating out there somewhere, so it doesn't sound like anyone saw the jumper get out of the water.

They were trying to save him, IMO.

 

[gometros]

Looks like Disny may need to install lap bars on the friendship boats like they did on Splash Mountain.

Actually, I'm glad they did. It got my wife to ride for the first time in 15 years (long story, don't want to detract from the thread).

Sent from my Nexus 7 using DISBoards

 

[MHSweb79]

I keep checking this thread to see if the jumper & friends have been caught yet. I think they probably will- of course they wouldn't have recorded the stunt if they didn't plan to post it somewhere. Probably just waiting for the heat to die down.

 

[kay1864]

I keep checking this thread to see if the jumper & friends have been caught yet.

And if the friends were caught, what would they be charged with, exactly? Using their video camera while on a Disney boat?

 

[diz4ever]

It was dark and you could see the guy swimming for a little while but then he disappeared into the darkness. So we never saw him reach the shore. It did take a little while for the boat to dock and for authorities to be notified. People did tell the captain that some one jumped off but it all happend so quickly. The guys friends definitely did not want to be "caught" as they took off running through the crowd . I did not think that Disney over reacted at all. The last thing I I want to see is a floater on my way to the studios!

 

[diz4ever]

Oh and the last I heard yesterday as they hadn't caught the guy.

 

[Kellykins1218]

Wow, I'm surprised Disney doesn't have an official police force. Cedar Point Police are real officers with the power to arrest people.

 

[plumsiren]

And if the friends were caught, what would they be charged with, exactly? Using their video camera while on a Disney boat?

Conspiracy? Withholding information? IDK

 

[tpettie]

LOL

So many people in the world. So few of them with sense. Yes, good sense is very uncommon, alas, and it often seems as if much of the world has gone slightly bonkers, especially WRT that youtube thing and the social media thing. The 'Lookatme! Lookatme! Lookatme!' Syndrome. It's like living in a world populated by rampaging, selfie taking, napless two year olds. ITS ALL ABOUT ME! LOOK AT MY VIDEO OF IT BEING ALL ABOUT ME! I DID THIS! I DID THAT! I INCONVENIENCED THOUSANDS! I'M SO COOL!

Yeah.

FWIW, I live in Texas, and I would NEVAH swim in the lakes around here in the summer. Early spring, providing there was recent and decent rainfall, is the cut off for fresh bodies of water. The lakes are just giant petri dishes rife with bacteria, IMHO. I grew up surfing, body surfing, water skiing, white water rafting, blah blah blah, so I am not risk adverse; I just don't see the point in taking pointless risks.

I drive, but I don't tailgate or text while doing so. Cuts the risk. I fly, I don't fly American. Cuts the risk--at least of rude flight attendant behavior. As far as other travelers' behavior, well...I will just have to keep praying for a return to civility. .

If that happens, I'm sure it will be on youtube, don't you think?

have to say my hats off to you for putting to words my thoughts on this.

 

[3CW]

As long as you wear nose plugs, you are safe from the Amoeba.

This is true. It attacks the brain through the cribriform plate, where the olfactory nerve goes up to the brain. That's why when it was in Lousiana drinking water, people ingested it and had no issues, but the neti pot user who put that water in her sinuses contracted PAM and died.

Uh...he needs to get out of the lake somehow!

Yes, but quickly passing through shallower water on your way out is a greatly reduced exposure as compared to playing around in the shallows, the way most people playing in bodies of water do. You tend to hang around the areas where you can stand up when you want to. Same thing with a water park using lake water - slides, wading pools, etc. This is all shallower, wamer water that people are splashing around in for much longer than it would take to simply exit the body of water.

 

[CaliTex]

Conspiracy? Withholding information? IDK

Being friends with a stupid, self-centered ignoramus, in the 2nd degree.

We better build more prisons.