Spinoff, does money equal happiness?

[LSmith]

I'd say that the converse is more true: Lack of money is likely to cause UNhappiness.

Poverty is pretty much always a miserable place to be. I've made a lot of compromises in my life to avoid going back there, and I'm sure that I will continue to do so as long as I retain free will.

Wealth doesn't buy happiness, but I believe that a certain level of financial security is necessary to maintain it. My idea of that level really isn't especially high, but includes a home in relatively good repair, a reliable and relatively safe vehicle to drive and fuel to drive it; heat in winter, a/c in summer, health insurance, decent shoes that don't hurt to wear, and not going hungry.

Well said.

 

[topolino]

Unless you've been in a place where you didn't have enough money to pay your bills, you have no idea just how happy money can make you.

More accurately though, I feel that lack of money can make you miserable. By definition then, money can remove that misery and therefore give you, at least to some degree, happiness.

EDIT: Just realized that NotUrsula already said basically the same thing. I really should read the whole thread before posting.

 

[Sparkly]

No, it doesn't.

Personally, as long as I had a decent house/flat in a safe area, a stable job, plenty of food to eat, no worry about paying my bills (comfortable), and could afford a few extras like holidays I would be perfectly happy.

 

[IheartMickey]

On the boarding school thread, it has been brought up that some parents would want to steer their children towards very lucrative careers. Not just ones that are likely to result in employment (so, we are not talking about just having a back up plan in case your band never takes off, we are talking being a social worker or a public school teacher or fire fighter any other mediocre paid job is a no go if Mom has nay say in the matter), but ones that are likely to result in very high paying employment.

So it got me thinking--I know there is the old saying "Money doesn't buy happiness" but how has that worked in your own life?

Have you been truly happier at times when you are the most well off financially?

Have you been unable to be happy when struggling financially (but let's assume still able to pay rent and eat and have medical care)?

Do the majority of people you know whom you would describe as generally happy have lots of money? Not much money? Is there ANY correlation from happiness to money (beyond having basic needs met) that you see in your life and that of friends?

I've been seen both ends of the spectrum and I can say life was a hell of a lot easier when I had money. I don't think just having money makes you happy, but the luxury of not having to worry about making ends meet sure would make me happier right now. I miss being able to buy whatever I wanted (within reason, I was never RICH). When I got my settlement for my injury I used to walk around the mall without a care in the world, would go out to eat without a second thought. Now that I'm older and the money is gone I can't just buy whatever I want or spend it on eating out without wondering if I could have stretched the money further or spent it better on something more important. I think it also has to do with being more mature. I received my settlement when I turned 18, and at 27 I can see all of the mistakes I made with it.

Anyway, back to the point. I think without the stress of wondering how to pay the bills you can definitely be happier.

 

[violetrose]

I've always thought health, not wealth, buys happiness. Without health, not much use for wealth.

 

[married2mm]

Not having enough money for the basics -- decent housing, food,clothes, insurance, transportation, some left over for fun -- can certainly make you miserable.

But no, money absolutely does not buy happiness. In fact, we see over and over again that the chase for money makes many people absolutely miserable. It's like getting addicted to heroin: you need more and more and more to be satisfied, and it's never enough.

I quite agree.

I know family members who have cars that cost more than our house,but I truly believe we are happier than they are. They always seem to have some drama in their lives,whereas we just tick over nicely.
But,you never know,maybe that's how they enjoy living their lives?

 

[design_mom]

I don't think money buys happiness, but I think having some money helps. We are not wealthy but we live comfortably within our means. If we were living paycheck-to-paycheck I would have trouble being happy (too stressful). On the other hand, we could earn more money if my DH took a job with more travel. However, I think I'd be less happy if that happened.

Although I want my child to do something they care about for a living, I also want them to be able to earn a comfortable living doing it. Although I definitely DON'T think higher paying job = better job, I would want my kids to consider the earning potential of the career and decide whether they can be happy with that overall.

I enjoy what I do for a living (most days). If all jobs paid the same, or we're as easy to get, would I do the same thing? Maybe not. I'd still secretly like to be an astronaut! ;-)

 

[NHdisneylover]

I must have been too long winded in the OP. I specified: ASSUMING YOU HAVE ENOUGH TO COVER THE BASICS LIKE RENT N FOOD AND MEDICAL CARE--so a mid level paying job like a teacher, firefighter, etc.

Somehow there keep being posts about not having any money, food, etc



In my own life--we are doing pretty well right now and i have to say we have gotten used to those advantages and enjoy them--but I do not think we are really happier than we were at many other times when we made less. Heck, we were VERY happy when DD was a toddler and we qualified for WIC (but refused it becuase we did not need it; I only know we qualified because the LLL leader was also the county nurse and wanted to run the numbers on every one).

I think we were most unhappy during the times DH had terrible bosses and dreaded every moment at work, and his stress spilled over onto us all, even though he was making much better money than he had at previous, happier times. That, and the two years we were dealing with some serious anxiety issues with one of our kids--that was super stressful and hard on all of us and no amount of money would have fixed that.

I know some happy rich people. I also know some miserable rich people. Likewise, I know some very destitute people (my parents live in Mexico--there can be extreme poverty) who manage to be happy in spite of having almost nothing, and I know some people who struggle and are extremely miserable about it and in life.

In my own life, once basic needs are met, I have not seen much, if any, correlation between money and happiness.

My DD16 does have a shirt she loves that says "Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy books which is pretty much the same thing" so I guess maybe there's that

 

[JennaDeeDooDah]

Everyone on the DIS:

• went to/had offers to a boarding school
• is incredibly wealthy
• has gifted children who are also on the spectrum
• has a hidden disability
• is in great shape
• has no debt
• fully funded IRA

and most importantly are 99% full of crap

You know what I have learned in life? Those who have money don't go around telling people. They have no reason to do so. Those who are incredibly smart or gifted, or those who have children who are incredibly smart of gifted, do not go around telling people. They have no reason to do so as their words and/or actions usually speak for themselves. Those who are in excellent shape don't often go around telling people how far they ran that morning, what the bench, or that they can squat the latest truck rolled out of Detroit. Guess why. Yeap, no need to as it is obvious that they are in excellent shape.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Does money equal happiness? No, not necessarily.

Neither does a lucrative career, necessarily.

 

[LSmith]

You know what I have learned in life? Those who have money don't go around telling people. They have no reason to do so. Those who are incredibly smart or gifted, or those who have children who are incredibly smart of gifted, do not go around telling people. They have no reason to do so as their words and/or actions usually speak for themselves. Those who are in excellent shape don't often go around telling people how far they ran that morning, what the bench, or that they can squat the latest truck rolled out of Detroit. Guess why. Yeap, no need to as it is obvious that they are in excellent shape.

Absolutely. It's called class. Another thing money can't buy.

 

[Mrs. Ciz]

OTOH, having sufficient money to live comfortably makes me very happy.

I think, for me, there's a range. At the bottom, there is a point that I don't think I could be happy living below if I could not provide basic necessities and some relative comforts (like living in a fairly safe place). There is a range that more money would probably make me more happy because I would worry less. Then there is the point that it wouldn't really add anything to my happiness level. Right now, more money would make a few things easier (hiring cleaners! not worrying about dd's college costs!) and more fun (more vacations!), but would not increase my overall happiness, so I have been fortunate to live outside that range. But, I'm pretty cognizant of that, and have made decisions along the way that would hopefully prevent me from ever falling below my range.

I think you hit the nail of the head with your post. I totally agree.

I know the original question stems from the Tiger Mom in the boarding school thread wanting to steer her kids into lucrative careers vs low paying careers. I don't consider myself a tiger mom or a helicopter parent, but I am a responsible parent. My DS15 will be applying to colleges soon. He is first in his class at school, has musical talent, is very good at math, plays sports and especially loves golf. My DH and I have been talking to him about what he'd like to study in college. DS has mentioned music, law, math, engineering, golf pro/golf course management...he really doesn't know, at 15, what he wants to do. We have told him to do something he enjoys that will also pay his bills and let him live the life he wants to live. If he want to live in a house on a golf course, he needs to choose a major that will get him a job that pays enough to buy that golf course house. We suggested that if he is really passionate about studying music, maybe he should choose a college that has a good music program and a good math ( or econ or engineering, etc) program so he can double major. He totally gets it...he said, "So I guess being a double major in philosophy and music wouldn't pay real well. What could I do with just a music degree - besides be a music teacher?" As parents, we will never choose a career or course of study for him, but we will make him think through all his options and consider his future goals. We have his college tuition taken care of, but there are so many kids who take on thousands of dollars in student loans to get degrees that do not lead to good paying jobs. They start their lives in horrible debt and can't get out of it. I don't want that for my children either. I think I am like most parents...I just want my kids to grow up to be happy, fulfilled adults.

 

[ManyMinnie]

I've lived both extremes, poverty and being very comfortable.

I know which one causes much less stress in our marriage and every day lives, as well as affords us luxuries we are happy to have.

So for me, yes, having more money does make our lives happier.

 

[Minnesota!]

I think happiness = basic needs covered + enough $$ to have some fun. You don't need to be flush with cash, or be able to afford EVERYTHING, but being able to be comfortable and have some fun - that's happiness.

We have been all over the place financially - lowest of lows, to very, very comfy. I like being in the middle..

 

[Kingdome8]

To me money can bring happiness. I'm not saying being super rich. But to have enuff money tO live comfortably and enuff extra money to take trips to Disney. Disney is not cheap and it takes money to go and Disney does make me and my family happy.
"quality of life" is important to me. Quality isn't always having everything but it is having the means to have the important things and some of the extras. Like kids sports activities and vacations

But if I had the chance to be super rich. I would

 

[Scrappy_Tink]

I'd have to say yes....in a way.

If I could afford to not worry about the up-coming sequester...
If I could afford to put my children through college.....
If I could afford to retire and not worry about being able to live/eat
If I could afford to help my mom in her senior years

If I could afford all those things, I would be less stressed and would be able to enjoy life more, so in essence, I guess you would say money would buy happiness.

I'm not talking being filthy rich, or being able to buy anything on a whim, I'm just talking about having enough money to lessen an enormous amount of financial uncertainty and stress.

It's hard to be happy when you're worried about financial obligations. However, I have a loving husband, grateful we can (although struggling) make ends meet, have our heath (with some issues) and are luckier than most. We are blessed.

 

[LittleMissMagic]

Okay, then.... assuming I have enough money for all of the basics.

I don't have a significant attraction to money itself, but rather what money can provide me. I'm happy when I can go on a nice vacation. Call me materialistic, but I'm happy when I go shopping - I like to purchase nicish (like quality, but not necessarily designer) clothes that look good on me. Like most women, I love shoes. So yes, I like being able to have extra money to spend.

Now, I have a friend who actually loves money. Therefore, she's a workaholic and will take on multiple jobs so that she can increase her income. However, she's so attached to her money that she won't spend it. She cheaps out on everything else... she'll back out on things because she doesn't want to spend the money. And it's not like she's investing or anything. I don't understand because what's the point of working your butt off for all of this money if you're just going to hide it under the mattress and count it on the weekends (okay, that's an exaggeration... I don't think she really does that), and in the mean time miss out on having fun with your friends.

 

[Wendy31]

I've lived both extremes, poverty and being very comfortable.

I know which one causes much less stress in our marriage and every day lives, as well as affords us luxuries we are happy to have.

So for me, yes, having more money does make our lives happier.

I think happiness = basic needs covered + enough $$ to have some fun. You don't need to be flush with cash, or be able to afford EVERYTHING, but being able to be comfortable and have some fun - that's happiness.

We have been all over the place financially - lowest of lows, to very, very comfy. I like being in the middle..

To me money can bring happiness. I'm not saying being super rich. But to have enuff money tO live comfortably and enuff extra money to take trips to Disney. Disney is not cheap and it takes money to go and Disney does make me and my family happy.
"quality of life" is important to me. Quality isn't always having everything but it is having the means to have the important things and some of the extras. Like kids sports activities and vacations

But if I had the chance to be super rich. I would

I'd have to say yes....in a way.

If I could afford to not worry about the up-coming sequester...
If I could afford to put my children through college.....
If I could afford to retire and not worry about being able to live/eat
If I could afford to help my mom in her senior years

If I could afford all those things, I would be less stressed and would be able to enjoy life more, so in essence, I guess you would say money would buy happiness.

I'm not talking being filthy rich, or being able to buy anything on a whim, I'm just talking about having enough money to lessen an enormous amount of financial uncertainty and stress.

It's hard to be happy when you're worried about financial obligations. However, I have a loving husband, grateful we can (although struggling) make ends meet, have our heath (with some issues) and are luckier than most. We are blessed.

I agree!

Money may not buy happiness, but it can buy security. And feeling secure goes a long way toward being happy.

In the past, when we have struggled to pay bills or pinched pennies to buy groceries, I honestly can say I wasn't too happy... stressed, worried, anxious. But not really all that happy.

And, as another PP mentioned, there is much less stress between DH & myself when we have enough money. Most of our arguments in the almost 18 years of our marriage have been centered around money or being worried about the lack thereof.

That's not to say that I think everyone should strive for high-paying careers. I'm going to be just as happy for my children whether they're teachers, firefighters, homemakers, CEOs, or doctors. But I do want financial security for them.

And, like others have said, I'm a lot happier when we can easily pay our bills, put a little into savings, & have some left over for fun stuff.

And, just being honest here, but I'd love the chance to see whether or not I could be happier w/ more money!

Edited to add (after discussing this w/ DH) - I think you can be rich & be miserable, & I think you can be rich & be happy. There are other things in life, in addition to your bank balance, that contribute to your overall happiness. And inner joy & peace is, perhaps, separate from happiness.

 

[StephMK]

There are plenty of rich, miserable, unhappy people out there. On the other hand, there are plenty of poor people who feel truly blessed and are genuinely happy.

Exactly, look at the celebrity deaths lately. Sadly, being rich and famous doesn't mean everyone's happy.

There's a saying: Money can't buy happiness, but it's like a half-off coupon!

That being said, when they've studied such things, they found that the happiness curve with respect to money flattens after a certain point (around $75,000 in annual income, in the last study I read). When you're really poor, more money makes you a lot happier, but once you're at a point when you've got all of your needs and most of your wants, more money stops making you very much happier.

I agree with that curve. We are tighter than normal right now & it's not fun. But once we get our needs & some wants met, we're pretty happy. Not anywhere close to rich but comfortable for a low cost of living area salary wise.

I must have been too long winded in the OP. I specified: ASSUMING YOU HAVE ENOUGH TO COVER THE BASICS LIKE RENT N FOOD AND MEDICAL CARE--so a mid level paying job like a teacher, firefighter, etc.

Somehow there keep being posts about not having any money, food, etc

I think we were most unhappy during the times DH had terrible bosses and dreaded every moment at work, and his stress spilled over onto us all, even though he was making much better money than he had at previous, happier times. That, and the two years we were dealing with some serious anxiety issues with one of our kids--that was super stressful and hard on all of us and no amount of money would have fixed that.

I know some happy rich people. I also know some miserable rich people. Likewise, I know some very destitute people (my parents live in Mexico--there can be extreme poverty) who manage to be happy in spite of having almost nothing, and I know some people who struggle and are extremely miserable about it and in life.

In my own life, once basic needs are met, I have not seen much, if any, correlation between money and happiness.

My DD16 does have a shirt she loves that says "Money can't buy happiness, but it can buy books which is pretty much the same thing" so I guess maybe there's that

I'm glad you posted this because I wondered the same thing after reading through that thread earlier. Love your DD's shirt!

DH & I both chose to leave career paths that would have put us in a good financial place but made us both miserable. I am so much happier now, despite less salary. We chose to balance time with our family & job satisfaction over careers that were not fufilling. I know it's different for everyone and sure it would be nice if we loved high paying careers, but we don't & are ok with it.

 

[Pooh Girl 71]

Money affords opportunities.


Happiness comes from within.