Spanking

[luvsJack]

Actually, I said she sees her mom twice a month. Which is still not a lot. That may very well be part of the problem and she is in counseling to help deal with that. But that does not give her a free pass to hit DD, kick the cat, pee on her bedroom floor, draw on the floor, throw tantrums when she doesn't get her way, lie, and break any and all household rules she just doesn't feel like following.

DD11 is also a child of divorce and her biological father has actually been dead for the last 8 years. No one, and I mean no one, makes excuses for her behavior due to the fact that she never sees her father. It is always very interesting to me that in blended family situations the sympathy is ALWAYS given to the mans children but very little consideration is given to the womans children who are also stepkids who don't live with both parents. It's really boggling to me.

Has the counselor suggested that it may be something besides not seeing her mother? Not saying that is not it, but there very well could be other things going on with her.

I really do feel for you. That's a lot to deal with. And your own child dealing with the loss of her dad too. It must be challenging. And you are right, she can't get a free pass.

When my sons were young and yds started acting out, the first dr immediately went to his lack of a relationship with his dad. And he said that ds didn't act out when he saw his dad because he didn't trust him but he was honestly acting out with the people he knew loved him (me and dh). Almost like he was seeing if he could push us away like his dad went away. Broke my heart.

Later he was diagnosed with ADHD. I think it was a combo of the two things. But either way, neither gave him a free pass to bad behavior.

We had to learn to do things that were immediate. And it was different things for different offenses. But taking away privileges to the point that he pretty much lost everything didn't help because he just felt like he wasn't going to get to do anything anyway. Or taking away the family outing coming next week didn't help because he just didn't think that far ahead.

It had to be right now and it had to be something that truly made him realize what he had done and why he was being punished. It wasn't easy. And it was hard being consistent on a constant basis.

Do what you find works. That's really all you can do. It can be so tempting to just throw your hands up, especially with something like lying.

I will say that with DS, we had to teach him that the punishment was harsher for lying than telling the truth. So there were a few things that most parents would have punished for but he told us the truth so we had to let it pass as it finally started to get through to him to tell the truth.

One question, is her behavior better or worse after she sees her Mom?

Hugs and pixie dust to you and your daughters. Blended families can be so hard.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

Certain people seem to be way too invested in arguing with internet strangers here. I barely have enough time to read each individual reply, let alone keep arguing with those who are obviously not going to change their opinion. I just don't get it...

And yet, busy and uninvested as you claim to be, you're back to chastise.

 

[EveDallas]

I think I explained quite clearly that it is the only experience I had so I was interested in hearing from someone who challenged my previous observations. I think that’s how most controversial conversations usually go. Disagreeing can be part of it. I don’t see the point in continuing to waste your time following a thread if you have nothing meaningful to contribute other than the occasional jab.

Well it's a good thing I don't need your approval to follow a thread.

 

[LSUmiss]

Certain people seem to be way too invested in arguing with internet strangers here. I barely have enough time to read each individual reply, let alone keep arguing with those who are obviously not going to change their opinion. I just don't get it...

Yet here you are

 

[DisneylandDarling]

And yet, busy and uninvested as you claim to be, you're back to chastise.

Yet here you are

I'm just making an observation. This is a discussion board, correct? Doesn't seem to work well when a select few people dominate the discussion.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

I'm just making an observation. This is a discussion board, correct? Doesn't seem to work well when a select few people dominate the discussion.

The irony. That's all.

 

[DisneylandDarling]

The irony. That's all.

I could say the same thing. But, you know, I'm not here to chastise.

Have a good day! (and I do mean that sincerely ).

 

[sk!mom]

I'm just making an observation. This is a discussion board, correct? Doesn't seem to work well when a select few people dominate the discussion.

Someone dominating a conversation in person is rude and tends to kill a discussion but... is it possible for someone to "dominate" a conversation when it's on a board and everyone can post as often as they like, simultaneously, one after the other, or however they choose?

A few people are continuing to discuss an issue that they have strong feelings about. If you are "over it" why not just move on?

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

I could say the same thing. But, you know, I'm not here to chastise.

Have a good day! (and I do mean that sincerely ).

What's ironic about my posts? You have commented on this particular thread NINE times and are chastising others for having too much time on their hands and continuing to post, and...you continue to post.

 

[DisneylandDarling]

Someone dominating a conversation in person is rude and tends to kill a discussion but... is it possible for someone to "dominate" a conversation when it's on a board and everyone can post as often as they like, simultaneously, one after the other, or however they choose?

A few people are continuing to discuss an issue that they have strong feelings about. If you are "over it" why not just move on?

I have strong feelings about it as well. It's just hard to try to get a different perspective when you know the same person is going to reply to your post with the same response. When you've already made you're position clear, why does it need to keep getting repeated over and over again? Different replies to different people with the same general response.

But I understand what you're saying. I'm not going to get anymore out of the conversation and have nothing different to contribute so will move along.

 

[sam_gordon]

When you've already made you're position clear, why does it need to keep getting repeated over and over again?

I barely have enough time to read each individual reply, let alone keep arguing with those who are obviously not going to change their opinion.

Doesn't seem to work well when a select few people dominate the discussion.

when you know the same person is going to reply to your post with the same response.

 

[Hikergirl]

I don't believe that I said that those who spank don't also employ other methods. I also don't think that I've resorted to name calling as you just did.

Well I said the idea of ......... is ignorant so if you took that as me calling you a name then I don't really know what to tell you.
And you are right you never actually said that spankers don't employ other methods, but your posts sure do imply you think that way.
You don't want to spank your kids, that is great for you. Others do and that is great for them. Whatever discipline methods works for you is what you should use no matter your stance on this issue.

 

[mummabear]

I never understand this line of thinking of "well you wouldn't do it to another adult so how could you do it to your child". The clear difference is that we are tasked with raising our children and sometimes that includes discipline. You could say the same about any other form of discipline - you would have no right to tell another adult what to do in general, or confiscate their belongings, to ground them in their room, to limit their TV time, to give them a time out, prevent them from attending social activities, etc etc etc...any form of discipline we use with our kids would be inappropriate to use on an adult and would be abusive if we did - it's not the same relationship at all so the comparison makes no sense.

So what about your boss? They are tasked with keeping you in line, they have the legal right to discipline. They can put you in time out (suspension) etc
But I assume you would t find it appropriate if they spanked you?
What about your parent now that you are an adult? I mean you never stop being a parent. Can they still correct your behaviour with s quick pop to the butt?

Except many of us who did spank saw it accomplished the goal (presumably stopped the child from doing whatever bad thing they were doing) with no long lasting harm.

It seems many in the anti group are unwilling to acknowledge that maybe spanking can and does work, when used appropriately.

More that we feel there are many other options that would achieve the same goal that don’t involve striking a child.

I'd just like to point out again that no one is saying you HAVE to spank a child. If you don't want to, don't. Simple.

No we don’t, and nothing stops us from judging those that do either.

I will just throw this out there as an example for you. DD11 is one of those extremely compliant, sensitive kids who responds very well to "the look" and generally would even start crying when I shot her the look because she knew she had disappointed me. SD7 is a tougher nut to crack. She lives with us full time and only sees her biological mother every other weekend or so. When she was younger, say around 4 years old, she would run in the house on a regular basis. Not terribly unusual behavior for a child but the problem was our house was very small with tight corners and hallways and there just wasn't a lot of room to run around. For two solid years, every single time she ran in the house we would put her in time out, nose in the corner, for however long it took for her to stop throwing a fit which was anywhere from 20 to 45 minutes depending on how stubborn she decided she wanted to be in that particular moment. We did this for 2 years and it never worked. What was so problematic about her running in the house was because she would run at full speed through the house looking behind her and run headfirst into the door jamb so hard she would ricochet off it and land flat on her back and have absolutely no idea what happened. She did this over and over again and just would not learn not to run in the house. After 2 years of it DH finally spanked her, open hand on the butt, for it and she never did it again. We do not use spanking often but unfortunately we have had to resort to a time or two when we just can't find anything at all that she responds to.

And did you try nothing but time out before you resorted to spanking?

I agree with your second quote about kids, but this idea that pro-spankers don't try other methods with their kids is just ignorant.

See above quote from @Turn the Page
They say they did tome out then resorted to spanking.

Here's the two posts... the second one sounds to me like he DID see a child's pants pulled down. But your reading is probably correct.

I read this as he didn’t want to see this not that he did see it.

Certain people seem to be way too invested in arguing with internet strangers here. I barely have enough time to read each individual reply, let alone keep arguing with those who are obviously not going to change their opinion. I just don't get it...

Are you new to be DIS?

 

[Hikergirl]

See above quote from @Turn the Page
They say they did tome out then resorted to spanking.
/QUOTE]

I'm not sure what your point is, that IS using another method besides spanking. The time out method didn't work, so they tried spanking and that worked.
Maybe you think they should have had a spread sheet of all discipline methods to check off before resorting to spanking, but that is you, it isn't the pp. In her case, spanking worked for that issue, you can argue about how something else could have worked too but in the end what the pp and her dh did worked.
Again another example of anti-spankers telling pro-spankers they are wrong even when the spanking works. Funny you don't see it the other way around though.

 

[mummabear]

I'm not sure what your point is, that IS using another method besides spanking. The time out method didn't work, so they tried spanking and that worked.
Maybe you think they should have had a spread sheet of all discipline methods to check off before resorting to spanking, but that is you, it isn't the pp. In her case, spanking worked for that issue, you can argue about how something else could have worked too but in the end what the pp and her dh did worked.
Again another example of anti-spankers telling pro-spankers they are wrong even when the spanking works. Funny you don't see it the other way around though.

I know it’s so funny how I don’t believe in hitting children.

Posters are saying some kids need to be spanked, because nothing else worked, trying one thing is not nothing else works. And again it is back to lazy parenting, rather than trying other things they do what is easiest.

 

[LSUmiss]

I know it’s so funny how I don’t believe in hitting children.

Posters are saying some kids need to be spanked, because nothing else worked, trying one thing is not nothing else works. And again it is back to lazy parenting, rather than trying other things they do what is easiest.

I think that’s exactly the point. I realize the 2 sides will have to just agree to disagree, but the anti group believes that it’s wrong so when you believe something is wrong it’s not about preference & what works & it’s hard to not be judgmental. Ppl get upset about the lazy parent comments & say things like you don’t my kid. Well my DS can be challenging. It’s not that he is just one of these kids that just complies more easily. But, we do what we have to do which sometimes means we miss out too. The OP’s post to me is an example of that. A spanking or threat of a spanking is easier than getting out of line & dealing with the child appropriately.

 

[sam_gordon]

No we don’t, and nothing stops us from judging those that do either.

Sure. Go ahead. Bottom line for me (and others apparently)...
1) Spanking "worked".
2) There was no long lasting impact.

Could other discipline methods have worked? Maybe, maybe not.

 

[jiminyC_fan]

AI think that’s exactly the point. I realize the 2 sides will have to just agree to disagree, but the anti group believes that it’s wrong so when you believe something is wrong it’s not about preference & what works & it’s hard to not be judgmental. Ppl get upset about the lazy parent comments & say things like you don’t my kid. Well my DS can be challenging. It’s not that he is just one of these kids that just complies more easily. But, we do what we have to do which sometimes means we miss out too. The OP’s post to me is an example of that. A spanking or threat of a spanking is easier than getting out of line & dealing with the child appropriately.

As a "professional" such as yourself, I would sure hope that you are not judging anyone here or ever in your practice. I would hope that the education you received and the uneducated people didn't get (from earlier posts), taught you not to judge.

 

[luvsJack]

I know it’s so funny how I don’t believe in hitting children.

Posters are saying some kids need to be spanked, because nothing else worked, trying one thing is not nothing else works. And again it is back to lazy parenting, rather than trying other things they do what is easiest.

The problem is you are assuming way to much while you are judging. You assume the parent has t tried anything else.

You assume the parent in the OP hadn't done anything else and wasn't willing to do something that unconvienced her. Maybe she was one Mom with two kids or more. Maybe they had already gotten out of line and she was t willing to make her other child sacrifice his/her trip. Maybe a lot of things. But because you don't believe in spanking you assume it's just lazy parenting when honestly you have no idea.

You are assuming the pp went straight from time out to spanking. The child was running through the house and practically knocking herself out but you think they need to take the 100 days to try every other method before spanking. Maybe spanking her bottom kept her from getting a concussion for Pete sakes. It sounds like the pp is at her wits end with a very challenging child. They have to do what works to get ahold of the child. But it's easier to judge than to support a parent right?

Judge away but stop assuming you can take take one little snapshot of someone's life and know exactly what is happening.

 

[LSUmiss]

As a "professional" such as yourself, I would sure hope that you are not judging anyone here or ever in your practice. I would hope that the education you received and the uneducated people didn't get (from earlier posts), taught you not to judge.

I would never judge anyone who seeks help. But, when they are told what works & what the research shows & refuse to consider it, it’s hard not to be a little judgmental then. But, thankfully that has not happened in my practice. Most parents that I met with were thankful to learn things. Most of them are uneducated & when they are taught proper techniques they were grateful b/c they worked. As far as on this board, this has nothing to do with my profession. Many of us believe it’s wrong & those who have posted don’t appear to be from the same demographic as the ppl I see so then they are just justifying hitting children. Sorry I can’t get on board with that. And, it’s hard not to judge ppl who should know better who think it’s ok to inflict pain on children.