Southwest to have assigned seating

[Smugpugmug]

I know people are talking about seat saving but what you will likely see now instead of majority of the seat issues being worked out by passengers and amicably in majority of cases to what you see happen on more airlines where passengers will ask other passengers to swap seats or sit intentionally in someone else's seat.

I fly semi frequently and I've only had this happen to me once and that was maybe 6 years ago? I said no to moving and the other person was huffy and puffy about it but eventually went back to their seat which was in the middle at the very back of the plane.

Meanwhile I witness attempts of seat saving on every single Southwest flight I've taken within the past few years.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I fly semi frequently and I've only had this happen to me once and that was maybe 6 years ago? I said no to moving and the other person was huffy and puffy about it but eventually went back to their seat which was in the middle at the very back of the plane.

Meanwhile I witness attempts of seat saving on every single Southwest flight I've taken within the past few years.

SWA doesn't have a policy against nor for seat saving. FAs have the discretion to do it on their flight if they want to but people aren't doing anything against SWA's policy even if it annoys some people and I think people trying to save multiple rows are pressing their luck (and passenger empathy).

On the other hand sitting in someone's seat when it's not assigned to you is against policy. We had that happen on British Airways las year the row behind us though it was an honest mistake on the people's part but it did make the family immediately on the defense and upset whose seats it should have been which then got the FAs involved and it was more of an issue than I've ever seen on SWA. There's been other instances where passengers just up and decide they are going to sit in a seat that isn't theirs and see if the passenger will let it slide most taking on the "ask for permission after", way too many stories about that one. There was a man recently enough (like this year or last year maybe) that ended up getting arrested for just up and claiming a seat that didn't belong to him and refusing to move.

 

[Genie+]

That's one of the reasons I'm not so keen on this adjustment even knowing it was likely to happen. It overcomplicates a system that was largely simple enough creating more opportunities for friction among passengers.

I figured assigned seating would reduce friction among passengers by removing any competitive nature.

I’ve traveled Jetblue the most over the years. They used to have complementary assigned seating, now there’s different pricing levels attached. It’s been pre-assigned as far back as I can remember. Seat picked during purchase. FA’s look at people’s tickets and that’s where the people sit. Enough people know the drill it’s normalized. Nobody puts up a stink because before it comes to that, the FA explains there are many reasons why people cannot pick a seat other than what they bought.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I figured assigned seating would reduce friction among passengers by removing any competitive nature.

I’ve traveled Jetblue the most over the years. They used to have complementary assigned seating, now there’s different pricing levels attached. It’s been pre-assigned as far back as I can remember. Seat picked during purchase. FA’s look at people’s tickets and that’s where the people sit. Enough people know the drill it’s normalized. Nobody puts up a stink because before it comes to that, the FA explains there are many reasons why people cannot pick a seat other than what they bought.

I don't think it removes the competitive nature especially in recent years because that's also part of human nature. None of the airlines I've been on with assigned seating have felt any less competitive, they are more competitive and I think part of that ties into cost of the seat, seat configuration, etc. When you put a price on something it naturally makes people more prone to frustration, irritation and grumpiness. when they don't get their way or when they feel they aren't being treated fairly. Add to that when people can't get seats by each other AND they know this in advance of their flight it only adds to stress and anxiety. Yes there absolutely was stress before flights with SWA hoping to get a seat next to your traveling party but knowing in advance you didn't get one the person(s) you now directly deal with on trying to adjust that is the passenger in the seat you want and it will happen more frequently now with assigned seats.

With open seating you may have wanted that seat but you weren't any more entitled to it than the next passenger. Now if you've paid for that seat or you happen to like your assigned seat (if they do a free option) you've got more at stake. Prior to this adjustment SWA's extra cost or higher fares were not related to a specific seat.

 

[Gary M]

When I flew on SWA several years ago I saw on more than one occasion people that had pre-boarded with a disability sitting in the exit row seats arguing with the flight attendant when asked to leave and get another seat. They finally moved but put up a real fuss.

When SWA had the real cattle call boarding I think numbers like 1-30 then 31- 60 and 61-90 and so on would board. The first call was for 1-30 to board but not in 1,2,3,4 ..... order. This could get ugly with people getting in line well before boarding. I once saw about 5 or 6 people put their baggage on the floor in the line to "save" their spot and then sit in the waiting area. We just walked around the baggage while they complained that was their place in line.

 

[Tigger's ally]

And even that hardly ever happens these days, because Delta has gotten so very good at filling the plane.

I travel often for work, going everywhere from Finland to Scotland to Disneyland to Disneyworld and this point here is part of the problem. IN earlier years, the flights were never full. Now they always are. More travelers and less flights are the reason. My guess is the overhead baggage space is not enough for every passenger to put a carry on in it as that never happened back in the day with flights being 67% full on most occasions.

I don't mind gate checking my stuff if the airports in question have the gate check pick up either right by the exit of the plane or at the top of the ramp. Don't like having to gate check and pick up on the carousel of slow progress!

 

[sam_gordon]

I travel often for work, going everywhere from Finland to Scotland to Disneyland to Disneyworld and this point here is part of the problem. IN earlier years, the flights were never full. Now they always are. More travelers and less flights are the reason. My guess is the overhead baggage space is not enough for every passenger to put a carry on in it as that never happened back in the day with flights being 67% full on most occasions.

But airlines are in this to make money. It's to their benefit to fly their planes full (or nearly so).

 

[Genie+]

Add to that when people can't get seats by each other AND they know this in advance of their flight it only adds to stress and anxiety.

Honestly I’ve never seen this on Jetblue. A few times I saw a single person sitting and the FA kindly let them know they need to be in assigned seat. Never a family complaining the only seats they could purchase were split and they it resolved. Maybe they asked at check-in desk? Never seen it inside the plane.

 

[karen4546]

Assigned seats are great, but I think they should board the back of the plane first. Unless they are first class - because they should board first if they paid for it either by cash or elite status. The few times we have flown FC, the Fc seats were to the left on most of the larger planes.

Of course there would need to be a FA making sure the people boarding didn’t use overhead space not in their seating area.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I passed 1M miles on Delta this summer, so I've flown a fair bit. I've seen these things so rarely that I can probably count them on one hand.

Almost all of those were a pair who booked A/C (or D/F), hoping that B (E) would remain open. When someone shows up in that middle seat, they offered to swap the aisle or window with them. I've never met someone who really wanted that middle seat, so it was smiles all around.

And even that hardly ever happens these days, because Delta has gotten so very good at filling the plane.

But that just proves the point though that people do ask to switch seats and then furthermore intentionally book seats with the hope that the middle stays empty. Whether you have no problem with the seat change request is a personal thing.

As far as middle well that's where I sit 99% of the time and we do book seats that sit next to each other. The only time where we do an aisle and a window is after boarding is complete. We don't sit where the middle seat is empty on SWA nor do we book a seat on airlines with assigned seats that way. You're right very few want the middle seat.

 

[Tigger's ally]

But airlines are in this to make money. It's to their benefit to fly their planes full (or nearly so).

Oh I know that. I also know airlines are extremely slow in figuring out when they should add flights.

 

[sam_gordon]

Oh I know that. I also know airlines are extremely slow in figuring out when they should add flights.

I don't think it's as easy as "let's add a new flight", especially if one end of the flight is at a busy airport.

 

[Tigger's ally]

I don't think it's as easy as "let's add a new flight", especially if one end of the flight is at a busy airport.

Then how bout a bigger plane?

You need to meet my wife.

 

[focusondisney]

That's one of the reasons I'm not so keen on this adjustment even knowing it was likely to happen. It overcomplicates a system that was largely simple enough creating more opportunities for friction among passengers.

I don’t really think SW’s system is all that easy. For a regular flyer, it’s ok. For first timers or infrequent flyers, it isn’t. I’ve had to explain how it works to a few people. The need to check in the exactly at 24 hours is stressful for a lot of people. And as we can see from the last few pages, the open boarding/ seat saving causes plenty of friction. Or at the very least, negative feelings towards the airline.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Honestly I’ve never seen this on Jetblue. A few times I saw a single person sitting and the FA kindly let them know they need to be in assigned seat. Never a family complaining the only seats they could purchase were split and they it resolved. Maybe they asked at check-in desk? Never seen it inside the plane.

There's a plethora of stories that describe the situations people encounter. But that's nice it's not as prevalent on JetBlue in your experience.

Delta is a big one where seats get split up most often due to an aircraft change. Then there's schedule changes and more. Last year when we flew Air France and British Airways both flights were changed 7 and 8 months in advance AFTER we had purchased our seat selections. Luckily it didn't impact us but our British Airways flight was completely cancelled and moved to hours earlier than originally booked.

But FWIW I wasn't talking about family as in meaning family with kids. Most people would like to sit next to the people they are traveling with, in addition some parents/guardians don't care if their 10 year old sits away from them. You'd probably be inclined to see families talk to gate agents though in advance of boarding the plane BUT that means they are moving someone else from their seat which can cause a cascading issue. I'm sure it doesn't happen super super often but then there's downgrading of seats which may happen now with SWA with having different classes of seats with the extra leg room. My husband could tolerate less legroom but if he books a seat and pays for a seat with extra legroom (or it's part of his status) he would be annoyed at having that removed. As is now with SWA he'll take the exit row if it's available but no harm no foul if he can't because it's not an expected perk/paid part of the airline.

 

[Sparrow'sLady]

Well that is actually an issue with allowing 3 items past the gate. If they were caught at the gate then their carry on (in your scenario roller bag or another carry on bag) would be gate checked. TBH I haven't seen your scenario occur. At most it's a shopping bag or a purse which still exceeds the 1 personal item and 1 carry on rule but isn't as egregious as what you described. That falls on gate agents. SWA has in recent months been even telling people the small travel neck pillows need to be put in bags which didn't count towards your personal item before.

But I don't think that would solve your complaint in that someone is putting both their personal item and their carry on in the overhead bin. However, that is allowable by airlines. When FAs anticipate there being a space issues they will generally announce as the boarding is going on multiple times that people start with personal items under the seats or small backpacks and can move to overhead bins if there's space. I agree with it's fair and considerate to put your personal item under your seat first when you have both a carry on and a personal item and I would agree if most did that you'd have less issues after the fact of trying to juggle things around or gate check people's bags purely due to someone having two large enough items up in the overhead bin. It slows down boarding when people decide upon themselves to just put everything above in the overhead bins rather than wait and see if there's space once boarding is completely to do so.

This thesis is too much for me to respond to. You are making way too much out of my initial comment.

 

[BrightMorningStar]

We have a friend who works from SWA. He said some of them will heavily enforce "no seat saving" if another passenger is upset about it.

You have been fortunate, because the Flight Attendants WILL tell people they cannot save seats if somebody wants to sit. We have seen it first hand as well with full planes.

I have seen/heard the opposite. I personally have asked if I could save 2 seats and the FA had no issue with it and told me it was perfectly fine to save a row. I have seen people booted off of a flight for being nasty towards those saving a seat. Only twice. Both times from Dallas to Orlando. Both times they were women.

 

[BrightMorningStar]

Yeah on my last Southwest flight there were announcements that everyone in the late B/all of C group had to check their bags due to zero available overhead space.

We travel with people (6 of them) about once a year who pack pretty big carry-ons in addition to their rolling carry-on and they take up about 2/3 of the overhead bin after they put both bags above their seats. It is insane and it make me and my husband mad that they do this. The FAs never say anything.

 

[Brian Noble]

But that just proves the point though that people do ask to switch seats

"Oh no! This person is asking me to switch from my favorite middle seat to an aisle in the same row! Whatever shall I do?"

This is not even remotely a problem for anyone. And again---I can count the number of times I've seen this after accruing 1M qualifying miles on one hand. It's hardly some rampant epidemic of seat switching, and nothing at all compared to the circus that is seat-saving/miraculous recovery/etc. etc. on Southwest.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I don’t really think SW’s system is all that easy. For a regular flyer, it’s ok. For first timers or infrequent flyers, it isn’t. I’ve had to explain how it works to a few people. The need to check in the exactly at 24 hours is stressful for a lot of people. And as we can see from the last few pages, the open boarding/ seat saving causes plenty of friction. Or at the very least, negative feelings towards the airline.

Yeah from someone not used to it all it can be confusing but I just mean that there's not a charge for a seat, not a charge for a different class of seat, not a charge for carry on, the types of seats are all the same too. In terms of Boarding there were 3 groups instead of Delta's gadzillion. In general people understand numerical order. What I think confuses people who haven't flown before on SWA is they confuse the Boarding group for their assigned seat. But to get that boarding group assignment you have to get there and I totally get how that can be hard to get when you're not used to it.

The 24 hour in advance thing exists on other airlines too, the ones where you didn't select your seats in advance. PLAY for example check in begins at 24 hours in advance and if you didn't pay for your seats during the book process you better be on at 24 hours to get your choice.

The seat saving issue is something that has long been covered in the main SWA thread. Mostly the situation is people assuming SWA has a policy against it but they have repeated and steadfastedly in the past said they don't. In recent years the pre-boarding mess I think put more pressure on seat saving because if half the plane is pre-boarding you're not left with as many options. Before you might see a seat or two saved but not 2 rows that you see now (most seems to be a pandemic thing annoyingly).