Someday I fear health insurance will be a thing of the past.

[Marionnette]

Yes, some people have the idea that universal health care means we'll all have "free health care". That'll never happen. If we go that direction, it'll mean our taxes'll be much higher and the government'll have more say-so in our health care. We'll pay for it one way or the other.

I'm quite certain, too, that health insurance is one of the reasons medical care is so expensive. Hospitals and doctors raise the rates because insurance'll pay. Over the years it's spiraled out of control.

Need evidence? A couple weeks ago I received a bill for a doctor visit. Somehow they made a mistake and labeled us a "self-care patient". The bill was something like $450, and the bill gave us a "self-care patient discount", knocking the bill down to something like $175. I was shocked. I take that to mean that the REAL COST of the visit was $175 -- that was enough for the doctor's time, the nurse who did the check-in, the building, the utilities, whatever else -- but they added in all that other money because 1) they know insurance'll pay, 2) they know they're going to have to wait weeks for insurance to get around to paying, and that waiting has to be worth their while, 3) they have to pay someone to file the insurance. Again, I was shocked at the price difference.

Have you ever seen what insurance companies pay the doctors? Believe me, that $175 that you were billed as a self-paying patient was still higher than what the insurance company actually paid the provider.

My primary charges $175 for a routine physical. I have a $30 co-pay which I pay before I even see my doctor (or more likely the nurse practitioner). The doctor then submits a claim to the insurance company and he gets....nothing more than the $30 co-pay that I gave him. The insurance company pays him nothing.

 

[DarthKTrava]

I don't have insurance because it's too expensive. It's not for poor people who make too much to get medicaid. Which is sucky too. Just like regular insurance. Only thing that seems to be ok is medicare. If it's still there when I retire.

And the medical profession is dictated to by two main groups: the big insurance companies with big pockets to get what they want in the govt and lawyers who take cases to sue doctors and hospitals for malpractice for huge amounts.

 

[DISNEYSIX]

Our worthless government could screw up a two car funeral so why on earth would you want those idiots (who are too good to partake in the system) controlling your healthcare? The answer is to allow health insurance carriers to cross state lines and create competition and, therefore, lower costs. The government won't allow this because they want private health insurance to fail so they can gain more power.

 

[sparklynails23]

It's past time for universal healthcare. Health insurance costs are contributing to the death of the middle class. I would much rather see a government run system than one run by the few giant insurance carriers.

 

[Svhadden]

LOL

No not at all. primarily because we don't really have health care we have a for profit billion dollar sick care industry.

Health care insurance companies have no vested interest in getting you healthy, they make their money when we are sick.

No I don't worry because bottom line Aetna, USHealthcare, blue cross blue sheild like any other corporation know exactly how to price their product so the majority will be able to pay some thing. Do you really think they don't know exactly how to maximize their profits?

Thats like worrying disney is going to raise it's ticket prices to the point where no one can come. They know exactly what the market will bear and they are not in the business of losing millions of customers.

Ditto.

 

[Cathy baby RN]

It cost you 7 grand because of the other 24 women ahead of you who had just recently gave birth and didnt have to pay a penny.

So true. I am an OB nurse in a hospital and the majority of the patients are on public aid. Most also don't speak English....they're from all over the world. I had a patient last week from Mongolia and a few months ago from Morocco. The patients are lovely. I do not judge them. What I wonder is how so many can get publlic assistance from the tax payers when they are not citizens?
I carry the health insurance for our family because my husband owns a small business and can no longer afford to offer health insurance. Also, with all the taxes he has to pay, including huge property taxes, another small business in our community will most likely soon be closed. I ty to keep an open heart and be thankful for what we have, but it is sometimes so discouraging.

 

[hambirg]

Run for Congress.

 

[DISNEYSIX]

Only thing that seems to be ok is medicare. If it's still there when I retire.

Which is a government run health care system for the elderly that is seriously undercapitalized and seriously flawed. Cuts in benefits, increases in taxes and rationing of care is right around the corner. This is what happens with all government run healthcare systems.

 

[crisi]

Which is a government run health care system for the elderly that is seriously undercapitalized and seriously flawed. Cuts in benefits, increases in taxes and rationing of care is right around the corner. This is what happens with all government run healthcare systems.

Germany has a pretty good one. Sweden. There are lots of Government run health care programs that are run with lower total costs than the U.S. Health Care system and better outcomes. But there are big differences. In a lot of countries, doctors work directly for the government. Hospitals are non-profit. There are not huge corporate insurance lobbies handing out large campaign donations. Do they ration - often, yes - but the alternative is that those who can afford care or insurance get it - at a high price - and those of us that can't don't. So it might take you six months to get knee surgery.

Ask yourself this - if a voluntary federal alternative to private insurance is so horrible in terms of cost/benefit - why did the private insurance companies start screaming "but then we can't compete!" when it was part of the package.

We have very complex system. We have very high costs for a LOT of reasons - from complicated insurance, to emergency room treatment of the uninsured, to poor regulation, to over regulation. MANY hospitals operate at a loss because most of their work is charity work for which they may or may not get paid at all.

I've worked in the health insurance industry - its an industry where they are making money hand over fist.

 

[21hearts]

I do think that health insurance is getting really high.

My DH got medically retired from the Army and one of the benefits is that we can keep our coverage for free and just pay 20% of everything or pay $460 a year for coverage for everyone in our family. This is one bill I happily pay every year on its due date with no problems.

 

[fakereadhed]

LOL

No not at all. primarily because we don't really have health care we have a for profit billion dollar sick care industry.

Health care insurance companies have no vested interest in getting you healthy, they make their money when we are sick.

Actually, insurance companies make their money when they don't pay out claims. So they have an interest in keeping you well. Ours offers free wellness seminars, cooking classes, smoking cessation programs, free 12wk Weight Watchers, gift card drawings for getting your kids immunized.

Let's not keep confusing health care with insurance.

We do have health care in this country- fabulous health care. We do not have insurance for everyone although we do give free care to anyone who needs it even if you are breaking the law being in the US. Our health care is so good, that people are living longer and surviving all kinds of things that they wouldn't have in the past, that the prices are rising. Pretty good problem to have!

As far as insurance prices go, I think it would be easier to pay the high costs if everything else- food, clothing, gas, utilities prices- wasn't doubling.

 

[eliza61]

Which is a government run health care system for the elderly that is seriously undercapitalized and seriously flawed. Cuts in benefits, increases in taxes and rationing of care is right around the corner. This is what happens with all government run healthcare systems.

not really. and please lets stop with the rationing scare tatics. first of all, right now we have rationing except we call it capitalism. If you have money or insurance you get the care, if you don't have money believe me your health care is most definitely rationed.
Next medicare is a great program, why the heck to do you think seniors are fighting tooth and nail to keep it? Now it is seriously undercapitalized for the same reasons effecting companies and private citizens. Health care cost are increasing 10X's.
lastly it is evident you have no experience with all universal care because many countries have excellent care. Portugal, where my husband is from and where my kids spend their summers has some of the best health care around. Now I totally admit that Portugal is a small country compared ot the states and they too are in financial straits but there is no "rationing" and they donot wait "years" for procedure.

It's not an all or nothing proporsition. the object is to find the best systems available and see what can be adapted and what is a waste.

 

[MrsPete]

Germany has a pretty good one. Sweden. There are lots of Government run health care programs that are run with lower total costs than the U.S. Health Care system and better outcomes. But there are big differences. In a lot of countries, doctors work directly for the government. Hospitals are non-profit. There are not huge corporate insurance lobbies handing out large campaign donations. Do they ration - often, yes - but the alternative is that those who can afford care or insurance get it - at a high price - and those of us that can't don't. So it might take you six months to get knee surgery.

One addition: Those countries who run their universal health care systems for less than we pay here in America NEVER develop any new medicines or procedures. Those things are developed here, on our dime, then other countries adopt them. So while I don't disagree with what you're saying, we do want medicine to move forward, we do want new treatments for painful diseases, and that takes money.

 

[MrsPete]

I totally understand that taxes would go up. I guess I'm just assuming that not having to pay monthly for the private insurance that we pay for now would equal things out, and folks like us would end up better in the long run because we would no longer be paying an additional ~$5000 OOP on top of the taxes for something as necessary as an emergency appendectomy, as I mentioned we have done this year.

Do you know what people in some European countries are paying in taxes? We think ours are bad here in America, but they really have it bad.

My SIL, who's an insurance executive, says that universal health care will cost us an astronomical amount of money -- more than we're paying now in premiums. And she's in a better position than I am to know the facts. Yeah, since an insurance comopany pays her bills, she does have reason to be biased . . . but I also know that she's an intelligent, reasonable person who's studied the facts.

She also says that she's sure universal health care will happen in America. She predicts sooner rather than later, and she predicts that then the majority of us will be very sorry.

 

[eliza61]

Actually, insurance companies make their money when they don't pay out claims. So they have an interest in keeping you well. Ours offers free wellness seminars, cooking classes, smoking cessation programs, free 12wk Weight Watchers, gift card drawings for getting your kids immunized.

Let's not keep confusing health care with insurance.

We do have health care in this country- fabulous health care. We do not have insurance for everyone although we do give free care to anyone who needs it even if you are breaking the law being in the US. Our health care is so good, that people are living longer and surviving all kinds of things that they wouldn't have in the past, that the prices are rising. Pretty good problem to have!

As far as insurance prices go, I think it would be easier to pay the high costs if everything else- food, clothing, gas, utilities prices- wasn't doubling.

But the problem is its a symbiotic relationship. You don't get good health care without insurance (or some ability to pay) for it. So to say we have fabulous health care is like saying we've got fabulous steak dinners. It's only fabulous if you can actually eat it. If you do not have the money to pay for it, it's not so fabulous at all.

People once again are living longer if they are the availabity to good long term health care. but the poor have higher incidents of dying from heart attacks, strokes, cancer (poor and minorities have a much higher fatality rate than the wealthy and white) directly related to the access to health care.

So your statement is true if you are one of the "right" people. I'm not a big advocate of universal health care but I am an advocating of getting rid of this myth that anyone, anywhere can walk into a doctors office or hospital and recieve first class health care.
I volunteer every day with the poor people in Camden NJ (murder capital of the US a few years back) almost 90% of the population is well below the povery line nad I can tell you with 100% assurance they do not get great health care.

 

[dvcgirl]

This is one worry I don't have, as we are a military family.

Yes, but one of the first things that they'll do to "decrease military spending" is to have military members pay more for their benefits.

Unfortunately, none of us are exempt.

 

[dvcgirl]

Do you know what people in some European countries are paying in taxes? We think ours are bad here in America, but they really have it bad.

My SIL, who's an insurance executive, says that universal health care will cost us an astronomical amount of money -- more than we're paying now in premiums. And she's in a better position than I am to know the facts. Yeah, since an insurance comopany pays her bills, she does have reason to be biased . . . but I also know that she's an intelligent, reasonable person who's studied the facts.

She also says that she's sure universal health care will happen in America. She predicts sooner rather than later, and she predicts that then the majority of us will be very sorry.

We're either going to pay much more in taxes for universal health care (single payer system), or we're going continue to see our private health insurance premiums skyrocket. To me it's starting to feel like six or a half a dozen.

 

[DisneyMomma81]

Yes, you do pay as much as we do. It's just paid differently. Yours goes in taxes.

Exactly...

 

[justbishop]

Do you know what people in some European countries are paying in taxes? We think ours are bad here in America, but they really have it bad.

My SIL, who's an insurance executive, says that universal health care will cost us an astronomical amount of money -- more than we're paying now in premiums. And she's in a better position than I am to know the facts. Yeah, since an insurance comopany pays her bills, she does have reason to be biased . . . but I also know that she's an intelligent, reasonable person who's studied the facts.

She also says that she's sure universal health care will happen in America. She predicts sooner rather than later, and she predicts that then the majority of us will be very sorry.

Well, as I've said, I'd much rather pay higher taxes and not have to pay OOP for deductibles and the stupid "OOP maximum" (which I also think is ridiculous...if I'm going to have to come up with $x when something happens, why not just call THAT my deductible?!) on top of it.

And the higher taxes can't be all that bad. From what I gather, people in many countries with universal care live lives that are equal to ours in quality.

We're either going to pay much more in taxes for universal health care (single payer system), or we're going continue to see our private health insurance premiums skyrocket. To me it's starting to feel like six or a half a dozen.

Exactly. Except the universal care wins in my eyes for the reasons I've already mentioned.

 

[MinnieForMe]

I have a pre-existing condition (although my doctors say I'm healthier than most non handicapped individuals) so health insurance is NEVER optional for us. We paid crazy COBRA payments equal to our mortgage when my husband was laid off (thank goodness for a well padded emergency fund) because an insurance company can refuse to take me if there is ever a lapse in my insurance.