Screaming children

[lenshanem]

Interesting.

So my three year old has a tantrum in a grocery store. I move the cart to the side and walk out quickly with her screaming. Along the way I get dirty looks from people like your mother and yourself adding to the stressful moment - looks like you should spank that child, this child needs discipline.

OK... So what if I did spank my child? Would you - the same person that was giving me looks like back in my day I would have been disciplined then shake your head in disgust? Would you call the authorities cause I was spanking my child?

This society really gives parents a very confusing idea as to how to discipline our kids.

Ya know what? I'm sorry if my three year old has a fit and you had to listen to her cry for a few minutes before I could walk out with her. I'm sorry that you or your mother might have to walk past my car as she finishes out her tantrum. I'm sorry you had such a strict mom that it has now caused you to not want to have kids of your own. And I'm sorry that my youngest is a little more strong willed than my oldest. I love them both the same and I'm now more tolerant of other moms going thru a stressful moment with their toddlers. I will not add to the moment by shaking my head and making faces.

If children irritate you, maybe you should find another vacation destination to visit, cause I can safely bet WDW will always have kids there!

 

[Mikelly1221]

As a parent, it has completely mortified me when someone would comment on my children's behavior-I can't imagine getting snotty with someone if my child was offending them. (Then again, I can't imagine letting my children do some of the things described here-WOW!!!) I have been on the receiving end of that occasionally and it's not fun. In that situation, I've found that action from me (taking the child out, stern warnings, etc.) coupled with a sincere apology really makes things better. I think what people want is parents that will ACT when the child misbehaves.

However, I have also been on the receiving end of comments that weren't necessary or appropriate and my polite but firm response is "Thank you-I'll handle it from here" with a look that says "Keep walking, nothing to see here".

 

[thaggie]

I must agree that a child throwing a tantrum is a real pain to be around and have to listen to. Believe me I know. I have twins almost 3. I enforce my rules and expect good manners. However, my girls are 2, not 10 or 15 or adults. They are generally well behaved, but they DO have their moments, which I do deal with. I'm sure during those moments we have annoyed some.

To all who do not have children, I too once felt and said "I would never allow my child to act like that". Well I have eaten those words on many occassions and I by NO means let my kids get away with anything. However to today, when I see a child being embrassing and obnoxious I no longer immediately blame the parent. Mostly I thank God that its not me at the moment and feel sorry for them because I know how it feels.

I do understand that that some parents do let their children act however and do not discpline. This makes life harder for us all. But this is life. And yes it is very annoying. You will encounter this no matter where you go. If you want a nice relaxing vacation without the possibly of unrulely children, go somewhere that children most likely won't be vacationing.

 

[jkovick]

I read this whole thread and the majority of the posters to it were not saying they hate children or that they didn't want them allowed at WDW. The majority of posters, with children and with out children, had issue with parents who do nothing when their child misbehaves and it disrupts everyone around them.

 

[underdesea]

jkovick, you are correct. We become upset when parents make no effort to control an unpleasant, out-of-control situation at the expense of all those around them, with and without children. My husband and I are happily child-free, but many of our neighbors, co-workers and family have children that we love being around. An occasional tantrum is understandable. We know this, as do the majority of childfree couples. But the reactions of some of the posters here are representative of what we encounter in the "real world." Some parents become very defensive if you so much as suggest that not every public behavior should be allowed to continue simply because it is coming from a child. We would never give obnoxious looks to a parent who was trying his or her best to get a situation under control, even if that attempt wasn't currently successful. But we do find it upsetting when parents simply ignore the behavior of an out-of-control child and expect everyone around them to endure the behavior at the expense of whatever we are all trying to experience. BTW, we would be equally upset if an adult was "acting out" and causing a disruption at a typically "adult" event. Of course, in that case, the person causing the problem would be the one solely responsible for his/her behavior. But I can't see someone saying, "Well, this is an event for adults, and if you don't like adults, don't go to the (fill in the event name here)."

 

[Deb & Bill]

Shan, you are getting a bit defensive about this thread. People aren't saying they hate kids, they are saying they hate have their vacation time ruined. If I saw you taking your child in the middle of a trantrum out of the store/restaurant/etc, I would look at you and think "Poor dear, how difficult for her." If I saw you ignoring your child with a tantrum and allowing her to disrupt everyone's dinner/movie/show/etc, I would think "I wish she would take care of her child and allow me to enjoy this event."

I would never expect you to spank your child. I don't spank mine and he has turned out great. I never was spanked as a child and I turned out okay, too. You can choose your own form of discipline. It's just that the people around you just might expect you to do something, so their evening isn't ruined just as yours would likely be. I'd ignore comments from others about offering to spank my child.

When you have kids, they are yours for life. Sometimes you think they are the best things in the world and wouldn't give them up for anything. But other times you like to sell them to the next bidder.

And WDW will always have kids visiting it, just like it will have families without kids, etc. We just have to respect everyone's right to an enjoyable vacation.

Regarding a previous comment: As for tousling a child's hair, I think a parent would be highly upset with me, a complete stranger, touching their child.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

As far as I'm concerned there is also a big difference between ignoring a tantrum in the grocery store vs a restaurant or theater. I have to buy groceries... A few days ago my 4yo was making a scene in the grocery store and I told him he wasn't behaving properly, that he was having time out when we got home, and that next time I wasn't going to bring him. He continues to yell, had time out when we got home and I went to the store yesterday without him. Most people don't go to the grocery store for quiet relaxation, they go for food.

I handle outbursts at restaurants totally different! My 4yo is taken out as soon as he starts to pitch a fit, which doesn't happen often. He did recently, though, and spent more time out of the restaurant than in it (turned out he was coming down with something, which explained his awful mood).

Like I've stated before, I have 4 children and have gone through my share of tantrums, etc. There is no excuse for a parent to ignore bad, noisy behavior of their kids and to subject other patrons to that behavior.

I'll have to say, though, that I'm shocked at the behavior of many adults in public. I'm so tired of them talking loudly to each other as if they are at home engaging in a noisy conversation and/or carrying on long, loud cell phone conversations, not putting their ringer on mute if they need the phone on (or turning the phone off when it doesn't really need to be on). Some of these people make my 4yo's antics look angelic.

Bottom line is that we should all have a problem with rude, loud behavior from everyone.

T&B

 

[lenshanem]

Yes, Deb I have gotten defensive on this thread. I am very sensitive to this topic.

I want people to understand not all kids are "angels", some require more work regardless of the parents' skills. While my youngest may be stressful, she also gives me more hugs and kisses than anyone else. She can throw the biggest tantrums, but then also gives the biggest hugs.

And contrary to what people believe, her tantrums are not based on wanting things such as toys and candy. Usually, it is over odd things like her clothes don't feel right, etc. This is our biggest problem and very hard to fix! It is amazing the things that set her off!

We don't go out too much, but I've had my fair share of cold food and take out boxes for sure!

 

[hookedondizney]

Well, I have to say something here. I have 2 children. They are 5 & 2. My 2 yo is a screamer and has been since he was 6mos old. If he gets angry he will just scream and scream. It does nothing to tell him to hush-he likes it and will continue. Therefore, I will ignore him.Sometimes I will grab his hand and make sure he is looking at me and tell him that is unacceptable behavior-and we will not act like this. But he is a very difficult child. It has nothing to do with my parenting either. My first child is very well behaved and gets compliments all the time about her manners. I am raising both of my children the same way-but has anyone thought about what makes each child different? I know he is only 2 and it will take time for him to understand. But, who has ever tried to reason with a 2 yo to stop screaming. P-L-E-A-S-E! How crazy is that? So, I am one of those parents you all are griping about. Yes, my child loves to have tantrums and in a certain situations I will leave. But on the other hand if I did do that I would never be able to leave the house. Then I would be on another thread talking about how my child has been locked up in the house because he is a screamer and has emotional problems because of it. So, yes I have my work cut out for me. Because he will grow up and who knows he may grow out of it. But, for right now I won't run away for the sake of everyone else if he gives out a few screams-get over it! That is just what kids do.......I have had so many ugly looks from people and ya know what-leave if you don't like it......I can't leave so therefore I have to deal with it because I am the parent. So, anyone want to flame me? Oh, and you know what is usually the only thing that can get him to listen when he is screaming-I tell him we are going to see MICKEY. He goes crazy for him in every way. If he sees any picture or commercial for him he of course SCREAMS Mickey!!!!! You gotta love that!
Hookedondizney

 

[Tigger&Belle]

hookedondizney, you can one up me--my screamer didn't start until he was 13 months old JUST before his first WDW trip. He could have waited a month!

Mine is now 4 1/2 yo and can still pitch a fit. My other 3 were nothing like this, even my first born who was a handful (and still is at 16yo). It's not parenting, that is for sure, but instead very different personalities.

As to taking them out, like I said, it really depends on where it's at. I'm not so concerned about ruining someones shopping trip, but I'm not going to let him stay in a restaurant screaming. I'm not saying that one scream lands them outside, but really loosing control sure does.

T&B

 

[KathAnn]

I inadvertently seemed to have caused offence to people here, and for that I am truly sorry. I've read through all the postings since I made mine, and the vast majority of writers here seem to be folks who've had days or events spoiled by one or two alleged adults who seem to think that vacation time means vacation from work AND from the responsibility of supervising their children. Most folk with children who've written have freely admitted their children are not angelic - and I can't ever claim to have been either. I am one of the minority of women who actively DON'T want children and never wanted to have them. Nephews and nieces are family - but they're not mine, so naturally I have a different perspective on children than most of the commenters here.

My mother does not make comments about the way other people rear their children. It's something that's as personal as a choice of partner, car, house or job. She'd no more do that than fly to the moon. Indeed, she's the one who gets on at me when some child starts throwing a fit in the supermarket because they didn't get the toy/book/game/sweets they wanted, and I start grinding my teeth. I think she's one of the most patient and caring women on this planet - and have thought so for years.

I've had meals at EPCOT ruined because some PARENT has let their dear offspring run around tables holding a beaker of cola. And, yes, I've got soaked because darling little angel tripped and doused me. I've ended up throwing out a pair of pure silk shorts and matching tshirt because someone at MK was concentrating more on feeding HIS face than watching what HIS son was doing. Result: olive green silk covered in ice cream and an unscheduled return to the hotel room to wash and change. I've also been forcibly bundled away from a chosen spot to view parades when some Neanderthal decided that was just the spot for HIS kids to see the show. When I tried to stand my ground, one of his kids kicked me. I ended up with bruised shins and, after calling a CM, he got shifted. He walked off with said children mouthing the words "f*c*ing b**ch" at me.

Most of the parents posting here are well aware that sometimes their child goes into meltdown mode. I understand and appreciate it. It can be embarrassing, frustrating and exhausting on you when they do. But the point I'm trying to make is I have no problem with little Johnny going ape in the supermarket/chemist/shopping centre. What I DO have a problem with is the adults who do nothing about it.

I'm sorry this has turned into such a long post - but I too feel strongly about having my "once every 2 years" holiday spoiled by a tiny minority of selfish parents who seem to think that vacation for them means a break from work and not having to bother about WHAT their children get up to.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

KathAnn, *Again* , parents should remove screaming children from restaurants, shows, etc because they are otherwise ruining the experience for paying guests.

I don't have sympathy if your grocery shopping trip is ruined because of a screaming child that the parents are not removing. The last time I checked everyone needs food, sundries, etc, and it's irritating to me to lump all the places together.

I think that is why many parents are getting defensive.


T&B

 

[KathAnn]

Hi T&B

I understand where you're coming from. I was trying to say I can understand a meltdown in a department store at any time; but what I can't understand is the adults who don't do something about it. Case in point happened a couple of hours ago - and it involved me, albeit indirectly. My sister took her 2 year old on a trip to a local shopping centre as she wanted to buy a new pair of jeans and a wedding gift. 2 year old threw a fit because we bypassed the toy department, and kept screaming, and howling. She was making so much noise you would have thought she was actually being beaten. However, sister was SO intent on getting HER stuff done - she completely ignored the hissing, spitting, screaming, struggling, hurricane and left ME to deal with it. Eventually I had enough and got hold of Little Miss Typhoon - who by now was sitting on the floor of the shoe department and throwing the display shoes about - and dumped her unceremoniously in her mother's arms. Sister's reaction? "How can I do MY SHOPPING with that din going on. Can't YOU keep her quiet??". We then left the shop - and were slow-handclapped out the front door. I was so mortified that I've already written a letter to the manager to apologise. What other people thought of Jessica's (sister) lack of action and Courteney's (niece) behaviour, I dread to think.

So, I'm sitting here now, after quite a few tears wondering what to do next. Another Sunday shopping trip has been ruined, I didn't get done what I wanted, and my sister's not speaking to me now.

Ah well, it's Monday tomorrow and all I've got to cope with is a kranky boss, temperamental computer system and a photocopier that eats master copies of documents - after today, it's a breeze!

 

[Tigger&Belle]

Sad that your neice had unrealistic expectations thrust upon her from her mom. It's great that you were there to help out, but for your sister to think that her own daughter was yours to deal with wasn't fair to you and most certainly not to her own daughter. It's not realistic for her mom to expect that she will be patient and shop for a long time without either doing something that she wants to do, taking a snack break, etc.

Two year olds (or 3yo's, as was the case with my oldest 2 children) do tend to be little alien creatures. They tend to be hard to reason with and prone to tantrums at the drop of a hat. Hang in there with your neice. I don't know if I would go shopping with the two of them anytime soon, though, especially of it's normal that you get stuck watching her while her mom shops. Helping you sister out is great, but she should be doing her share of watching her daughter, too!

T&B

 

[Goofydiane]

I don't have any kids, but I love going to Disney World because of all the happiness you see there. It almost brings me to tears to be waiting to see my favorite character (GOOFY) and then see the look of extreme joy on that childs face when they go up and give a hug to the big guy. That adds to the fun of the trip.

What takes away from the fun are the parents who think that they are the only ones in the attraction and it doesn't matter that their child, who they believe is perfect, is screaming, or talking, or climbing all over everything. What can add to that is the parent that talks in a regular level voice explaining the whole show to the kid! While this has happened many times, it is only recently that I've started saying something during the show or at the end of the show to the parent to the tune of "It was so nice that you felt the need to interpret the show for all of us around you, can I go to the next attraction with you and have you do it all over again?" Usually met with dirty looks, but then I think - I'm never seeing these people again, so I don't care if I upset them.

I've used this on a few trips when the little angels spend the pre-show kicking the back of my chair. I turn nicely to the parent and comment that I'd be happy to change places with them so their child can kick them in the back throughout a show and I can enjoy it in peace. Usually gets the parent to change sits with the child. I've also used this on airplanes - make the kid a deal - you don't kick the back of my seat, and I won't recline my seat for the entire flight, or accidently drop my drink on your belongings which are being stored under the seat in front of me.

Tolerance only lasts with me for about 3 minutes before I say something. I'm not going to see these people again, so I don't really care what they think of me. Maybe I need to gain a bit of tolerance with screaming kids and I do - outside while walking through the parks. In a show - now it is time for them to be quiet.

Diane

 

[Tigger&Belle]

Originally posted by Goofydiane
I've used this on a few trips when the little angels spend the pre-show kicking the back of my chair. I turn nicely to the parent and comment that I'd be happy to change places with them so their child can kick them in the back throughout a show and I can enjoy it in peace. Usually gets the parent to change sits with the child. I've also used this on airplanes - make the kid a deal - you don't kick the back of my seat, and I won't recline my seat for the entire flight, or accidently drop my drink on your belongings which are being stored under the seat in front of me.

Tolerance only lasts with me for about 3 minutes before I say something. I'm not going to see these people again, so I don't really care what they think of me. Maybe I need to gain a bit of tolerance with screaming kids and I do - outside while walking through the parks. In a show - now it is time for them to be quiet.

Diane

I was at a baseball game not long ago and I didn't realize that my son was bothering the man in front of us by pusing on his seat with his feet (he wasn't kicking the seat, by any stretch of the imagination). The man turned around and said a very nasty comment to me. I did my best to make sure that Jake didn't do that again, but I would have happily done the same if he had of been friendly and respectful of my son when asking the first time. If he had of asked nicely and my son had of continued to do it, then his nastiness would have been understandable, but that wasn't the case.

The funny thing is that he was the most irritating man and talked loudly with one of his friends the ENTIRE game. I know that it was a baseball game and chatting is ok, but he never shut up for longer than it take him to take a drink of his beer. And he thought my son was annoying. Oh, and this man wasn't even sitting in his assigned seat--when the men got to their seats they noticed that the seats next to them didn't have anyone sitting in them so the men spread out. So he chose to sit in front of a child. LOL

I would hope that you start out friendly when you ask the child not to kick your seat. If you wait your "3 minutes of tolerance" in silence and then get nasty you might change your approach and say something after a minute BEFORE you're mad, and then after a while longer (2 minutes, let's say) if the child is still kicking your seat you can then be a bit sharper in what you say. You'll still be within your 3 minute tolerance window and might end up achieving the same goal without nasty looks to and from anyone.

Personally, I do care what others think of me even if I'm not going to see them again. I sure don't want to be the one which makes anyones day less than magical (even when not at WDW) if I can avoid it, as long as I get the same respect back from them. I try to always start nice and only resort to witchy (as my daughter and I call it) when niceness doesn't cut it.

T&B

 

[lenshanem]

Good grief! Just when I thought I was over these threads...

It sounds like we have some pretty bad ADULTS, not kids.

I feel sorry for anyone who only has a tolerance level of three minutes. Must make life very hard.
I don't know how anyone can complain about rude behavior when they in return are doing the same?!?

I also wouldn't be writing a letter apologizing to the store manager, but would be writing a letter COMPLAINING regarding the clapping as you left the store! How is that any more mature than the sister not taking her daughter out of the store?!?

How can kids in today's society learn to be compassionate, understanding, tolerant and patient when adults behave this way?!? Three minutes and a dirty comment?!? I agree with T&B a little politeness in BOTH respects can go a long way...

EDIT TO ADD the comment I was referring to ...

Tolerance only lasts with me for about 3 minutes before I say something. I'm not going to see these people again, so I don't really care what they think of me.

 

[Goofydiane]

Originally posted by Goofydiane

I've used this on a few trips when the little angels spend the pre-show kicking the back of my chair. I turn nicely to the parent and comment that I'd be happy to change places with them so their child can kick them in the back throughout a show and I can enjoy it in peace.

Tolerance only lasts with me for about 3 minutes before I say something. I'm not going to see these people again, so I don't really care what they think of me. Maybe I need to gain a bit of tolerance with screaming kids and I do - outside while walking through the parks. In a show - now it is time for them to be quiet.

Diane

I notice that two posters commented to my last paragraph regarding how long my tolerance lasts, and neglected to note that I've already turned nicely to the parents and commented on the child's behavior. While I didn't say, I comment nicely, I do ask nicely about changing seats, or asking the child not to kick the back of a seat. So yes, if I've commented once and it still continues after a few more minutes - say 3 - I'm going to say something again. Once a show starts, you don't want to make comments that would disrupt the show for those around you, so I will comment again before the beginning of the show.

If they think I'm rude or insensitive, that is their choice, as it is mine to say something again to them. We have all paid the same general amount for our admission tickets and we should all be able to enjoy a show. I would also expect someone to turn around and mention to me if I'm hitting the back of their chair with my feet or knees - being tall and having a bad back, it is hard to sit in one position for the entire length of a show, especially in some of the areas in WDW where legroom is at a premium. My comments were directed at areas - i.e. shows, airplanes, etc - that I cannot leave as easily, not throughout the park in general. If there are children screaming outside in the parks, I can just walk the other way, or go sit elsewhere, I understand kids and meltdowns, I'm sure I challenged my parents with my fair share when I was growing up.

The unfortunate thing is that the number of well behaved children probably out counts the number of missbehaved, screaming children on any given day in any of the parks. We don't always notice all the well behaved children, sitting nicely in their strollers, or walking next to their parents, or standing nicely in line because they blend into the theme of the park. It is the child or children that make the most noise that we focus our attention on because they are distrupting or drawing our attention away from the enjoyable time we are all having.

I'm sure my comments regarding tolerance levels may continue to be a focus and the comments regarding turning nicely the first time may be ignored. If that's the case, that's the result for providing my opinion.

 

[Disney Princess 6]

After all - Disney isn't the place to go if you do not want to see or hear children. I am not a bad parent just because we go to Disney World and my 3yo child has a melt down. Just because you may view me dealing with a temper tantrum or working through a bad situation does not mean I am not a good parent - or anyone else for that matter.

ALL parents deal with these events at one time or another. And let me tell you - after 20 hours in the car to drive to Disney and all the high expectations that come with such a trip - there is bound to be some sort of trouble. Most parents try their best to handle it as well as they can.

Unless there is some sort of abuse going on, you can't judge a parent - or a child- by seeing them for 10 minutes in a theme park. And if you want a quiet, adult vacation, I'd go someplace other than Disney.

 

[lenshanem]

I turn nicely to the parent and comment that I'd be happy to change places with them so their child can kick them in the back

THEN...

I notice that two posters commented to my last paragraph regarding how long my tolerance lasts, and neglected to note that I've already turned nicely to the parents and commented on the child's behavior. While I didn't say, I comment nicely, I do ask nicely about changing seats

Somehow that first quote doesn't seem nice, seems more sarcastic to me...

I don't know why I keep drawing myself into this debate. I should be watching the Star Wars documentary on A&E.
These threads are driving me !!!