School field trip, bathing suit guidelines

[unhinged]

I think crying "sexist" over the wording is the same as crying "bully" because someone says something not so nice too you. 6th grade boys have raging hormones, so while some women (even their mother's) may not like to hear it, the truth is, half dressed girls are going to be a distraction to some of those boys. Its nobody's fault, it is just the facts. Not stating that in the handbook doesn't really change that.
Oh, and half dressed boys will be a distraction too, but again the fact is that compared to the way girls dress, boys are generally more covered up. Anyone who has been in a school in the last 10 years knows this, admitting it doesn't make you sexist.

I don't think you are giving 6th grade boys enough credit. As mentioned, we don't have a dress code. We have girls in short shorts and camisoles all the time. At our splash days, girls are in bikinis, sometimes a bit skimpy and boys wear their speedos from swim team.

And yet, academically, it seems all those boys are just fine keeping their concentration in school as the school is ranked #1 in the state. And it is not just based on test scores, which the DIS knows is not accurate. The students win statewide math olympiads, science fairs, spelling bees, geography bees and Destination Imagination.

Boys being sexually distracted by a spaghetti strap is just a myth.

 

[ronandannette]

Totally off topic, but I can't think of anything that would have been worse than having to wear a bathing suit and take a field trip to a water park in middle school. I seriously would have been absent that day.

Of course, I grew up in Huntington Beach, CA...so we just went to Disneyland or Knott's for a fun field trip day.

So right, and I think the reality of that is getting lost in the rhetoric of gender politics and morality here. My DS and many, many other boys I've known, during their early adolescence (12-14) were so self-conscious that they wouldn't have gone shirtless, even in the water. I didn't raise a girl, but I imagine some of them must go through the same phase, especially these days when body-image is so critical to kids at younger and younger ages. That's such a tough stage of life...

If I were running such a field trip the guidelines would be simple: Wear any kind of swimsuit you want and everybody put a t-shirt over top; boys and girls alike. Solves a lot of problems (including sun burn) and you can have just as much fun at the water park that way.

 

[unhinged]

So right, and I think the reality of that is getting lost in the rethoric of gender politics and morality here. My DS and many, many other boys I've known, during their early adolescence (12-14) were so self-conscious that they wouldn't have gone shirtless, even in the water. I didn't raise a girl, but I imagine some of them must go through the same phase, especially these days when body-image is so critical to kids at younger and younger ages. That's such a tough stage of life...

If I were running such a field trip the guidelines would be simple: Wear any kind of swimsuit you want and everybody put a t-shirt over top; boys and girls alike. Solves a lot of problems (including sun burn) and you can have just as much fun at the water park that way.

Seems a bit drastic to make everybody wear a t-shirt because a very few are uncomfortable. Why not just say you can wear a t-shirt if you prefer?

6th grade boys are only distracted if that is what they have been taught.

 

[robinb]

Well I would do it if I had to, but I wouldn't be happy about it and I would make sure she knew that she wasn't doing anything wrong by wearing those types of clothing.(Not saying you didn't Robin )

There was no way I was going to get a 13-year old 8th grader in bermuda shorts. The 3.5" seam (I actually just checked my email to the teacher, it wasn't 5") was close enough as far as I was concerned *and* I had to pay full price for them since her usual shorts were even shorter. The email I received from the teacher specifically said that the dress code was so the boys can have a better learning environment.

Here is a bit from my email:

I do admit that I am also struggling with the dresscode. I want to say that I am 100% in agreement with the "no boobs, no bellies, no butts" rules, but the "finger tips" shorts rule really has me scratching my head. It is very difficult to find shorts that are to her fingertips that are not completely out of style. No 8th grader wants to dress like her grandmother. I was also totally OK with the "three finger width" tank top rule, but she tells me that now ALL tank tops are banned and girls must have their shoulders covered. I can't help but think what might need to be covered next with the dresscode. Elbows and knees? Ankles? Hair? Will girls have to dress in a burka lest they distract the boy next to them? I certainly don't want my daughter to dress like a tramp, but I also don't want her to be forced to dress ultra-modestly because the boys have ants in their pants. In my mind that is one step away from blaming young women for sexual assaults because of the way they are dressed.

 

[Gracie09]

I think crying "sexist" over the wording is the same as crying "bully" because someone says something not so nice too you. 6th grade boys have raging hormones, so while some women (even their mother's) may not like to hear it, the truth is, half dressed girls are going to be a distraction to some of those boys. Its nobody's fault, it is just the facts. Not stating that in the handbook doesn't really change that.
Oh, and half dressed boys will be a distraction too, but again the fact is that compared to the way girls dress, boys are generally more covered up. Anyone who has been in a school in the last 10 years knows this, admitting it doesn't make you sexist.

I'm sorry but why is it the girls responsibility that the boys can't concentrate because they might see girl shoulders? All that is is victim blaming. It's a step away from saying it's the college woman's fault she was raped because she had a couple drinks. If boys can't concentrate that is the boys fault.

 

[smiths02]

I think our dress code did have something about distraction and offensiveness, but it wasn't sexualized. We weren't allowed to have blue hair or paint our faces with kabuki make-up either.
I don't think girl's shoulders are distracting to boys, but boobs or butts hanging out are distracting for many people (just because it's not the norm-not even being sexual ly attracted to it)...I know some of the rules are silly, but I think some of them exist because some people don't have common sense.

 

[Geoff_M]

However, a thong and pasties is as asinine for swimming as the old fashioned picture everyone is using to make fun of us prudes with.
Modesty is still a virtue.

It seems you didn't get the memo. Nowadays in most circles what is valued is the ability to express ones self in a means that one wishes... to push the envelope... to be provocative. Any effort to counter this will most often be seen as unnecessary heavy-handedness, a "forcing" of one's morals on others, etc.

 

[Geoff_M]

I'm sorry but why is it the girls responsibility that the boys can't concentrate because they might see girl shoulders? All that is is victim blaming. It's a step away from saying it's the college woman's fault she was raped because she had a couple drinks. If boys can't concentrate that is the boys fault.

Consider the following exchange:

Teenage Girl: "Stop staring at my butt!!!"

Teenage Boy: "If you don't want people to stare there, perhaps you shouldn't wear shorts with large words printed on your backside... just sayin'!"

If one wish to pretend that kids (of both sexes) don't at times select attire that accentuates certain "assets" they may have in an effort to attract attention within their social groups, then so be it. But schools see and understand this concept all of the time and thus sometimes set a bar for all to follow. One may disagree with where the bar is sometimes set, but it's hard to deny the underlying need for a bar in many situations.

 

[Dizlvr]

As a mom of a 6th grade boy (and 11th grade boy), I am around them all if the time (and have further insight having a. 6th grade daughter). Most 13 year old boys do not have raging hormones. Most of them are definitely still children, and really not interested in the opposite ***.

ETA - and so what if they are distracted? Do you think they are going to drown? I witness these kids swim in our pool all summer, all girls in bikinis (nothing hanging outs - most girls are just starting to develop), and the boys and girls mostly goner each other.

I have 3 children, one of them a current 6th grade male, so I do have some knowledge about what I am talking about. I certainly don't mean all boys, but you are naive if you think there aren't enough out there that are interested in the opposite sex, its nature and you can't really fight it. Also, maybe where you are there aren't 6th grade girls who look like freshmen in highschool, but that isn't the case here. Do you believe schools just pull the dress code out of a hat? Nope, not how it works, its there because things become problems, and girls dressing provacitively has become a problem in the younger grades. If it hasn't where you live, great but that doesn't mean the problem doesn't exists outside of Mayberry.
I was speaking about a school dress code, and IMO if its a distraction to learning it doesn't belong in the classrooms. I also see nothing wrong with a school expecting the same dress code on a field trip that they would expect while at school.

 

[Dizlvr]

I'm sorry but I am not okay with telling my daughter that she can't wear something because boys can't be expected to stay on task or focused.

Do you even have a daughter, I was under the impression that you had sons.

I have a daughter, and sons, and when my dd was that age I had no problem with making sure she did not dress in a way that drew sexual attention to herself from those she was around all day, including classmates. I also have no problem with a school stating the same. Its okay that YMMV but its hardly sexist to point out facts.

 

[Dizlvr]

I don't think you are giving 6th grade boys enough credit. As mentioned, we don't have a dress code. We have girls in short shorts and camisoles all the time. At our splash days, girls are in bikinis, sometimes a bit skimpy and boys wear their speedos from swim team.

And yet, academically, it seems all those boys are just fine keeping their concentration in school as the school is ranked #1 in the state. And it is not just based on test scores, which the DIS knows is not accurate. The students win statewide math olympiads, science fairs, spelling bees, geography bees and Destination Imagination.

Boys being sexually distracted by a spaghetti strap is just a myth.

Um, okay, I'm talking about nature. Boys are attracted to girls, even at the very young age of 11 and 12. Does that mean they aren't capable of keeping their mind on anything else, of course not.
Look, its okay that some people don't think a dress code is needed, but your opinion is not based on anything more than your inability to see logic, you are thinking more in an emotional way. That is okay, but the world sometimes needs to be based on what is logical, and that includes things like dress codes in schools.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

Do you even have a daughter, I was under the impression that you had sons.

I have a daughter, and sons, and when my dd was that age I had no problem with making sure she did not dress in a way that drew sexual attention to herself from those she was around all day, including classmates. I also have no problem with a school stating the same. Its okay that YMMV but its hardly sexist to point out facts.

Yes I do have a daughter. I have boy/girl twins.

And I still disagree very strongly.

 

[Dizlvr]

Yes I do have a daughter. I have boy/girl twins.

And I still disagree very strongly.

That is okay, I'm not trying to change your mind, you are free to think what you want.

Someone said up thread modesty is a virtue, and they were correct. Some parents don't think they need to teach that because theyfeel it should be the opposites sex job to not be distracted at what their child chooses to show off. Clearly there are many who do believe that, that is why dress codes are put in place.

 

[Art 1]

It's too bad the school feels the need to remind parents to dress their children appropriately.

 

[Dizlvr]

It's too bad the school feels the need to remind parents to dress their children appropriately.

Its too bad they need to remind parents.

 

[Soldier's*Sweeties]

That is okay, I'm not trying to change your mind, you are free to think what you want.

Someone said up thread modesty is a virtue, and they were correct. Some parents don't think they need to teach that because theyfeel it should be the opposites *** job to not be distracted at what their child chooses to show off. Clearly there are many who do believe that, that is why dress codes are put in place.

Tanks tops and the like are hardly showing things off for the most part.

But whatever. Continue on with your bad self. You might want to be a little less condescending though.

 

[Gracie09]

Consider the following exchange:

Teenage Girl: "Stop staring at my butt!!!"

Teenage Boy: "If you don't want people to stare there, perhaps you shouldn't wear shorts with large words printed on your backside... just sayin'!"

If one wish to pretend that kids (of both sexes) don't at times select attire that accentuates certain "assets" they may have in an effort to attract attention within their social groups, then so be it. But schools see and understand this concept all of the time and thus sometimes set a bar for all to follow. One may disagree with where the bar is sometimes set, but it's hard to deny the underlying need for a bar in many situations.

Oh please if a teenage boy can't read what is in a pair of pants without staring he should be evaluated for a reading issue. Besides most of those items of clothing would pass dress code. How About teaching the boys that girls are not sexual objects regardless of what they are wearing. Our middle school principal had an assembly for the girls only telling them that they shouldn't wear skinny jeans and leggings because the boys can't concentrate. Those items are completely within the school district dress code. However, she did not have an assembly for the boys telling them that the skinny hipster pant they wear that leave nothing to the imagination are inappropriate. Double standard anyone?

 

[Mkrop]

As a mom of a 6th grade boy (and 11th grade boy), I am around them all if the time (and have further insight having a. 6th grade daughter). Most 13 year old boys do not have raging hormones. Most of them are definitely still children, and really not interested in the opposite ***.

ETA - and so what if they are distracted? Do you think they are going to drown? I witness these kids swim in our pool all summer, all girls in bikinis (nothing hanging outs - most girls are just starting to develop), and the boys and girls mostly goner each other.

I have a 6th grade son and a hs junior son, I also work at a school, yes these kids, both sexes are distracted by each other. You should hear their conversations. I also own a pool and have many kids here over the years, the boys do "talk" after the girls have left, "wow she was hanging out etc".

I really do not get what the big deal is about guidelines and dress codes, been living with it all my life and so have my kids since they attend uniform schools. It gets hot here in PA and we wore uniforms so I dont get the big deal if your poor child cant wear a tank top bc it is hot...oh boo hoo. And yes I have been to FL and none of us wear tank tops and we all survive. Am I saying never to wear a tank top...NO, if you like them wear them! But if the school says no to the tank top, they are not going to suffer if they have to wear a regular tshirt for the day. Wear the tank top when you get home or on the weekends.

I also realized the other day why the spaghetti strap sundresses might not be allowed, as you know that guy was in the news bc his 5 yr old had to change. Well we were in Mass last weekend and I saw two different girls, not siblings, wearing what would have been really cute sundresses, EXCEPT the straps kept falling down bc the dresses did not fit. And many times the actual dress fell down, and the girls were pulling them up and their chest was exposed. Yes I know there is nothing there but there are creeps out there and regardless it is not a good idea to have their chests exposed. I am sure it is much, much easier for a school to say no to these dresses/tops etc then to have to worry or tell little girls to pull up the dresses constantly.

 

[Thumper1066]

As long as the expectations are addressed prior to the field trip it is appropriate. I am a middle school teacher and along with the dress code requirements being sent in the permission slip. Both boys and girls have a sit down with the teachers arranging the outing to iron out any questions. One problem in middle school is the dear darlings leave the house in one suit approved by Mom and Dad and then change in the bathroom to an outfit neither would approve of. We have a similar discussion a few weeks before the spring formal and again right before. Most misunderstandings regarding dress code are because of poor communication of the expectations.

 

[Dizlvr]

Tanks tops and the like are hardly showing things off for the most part.

But whatever. Continue on with your bad self. You might want to be a little less condescending though.

Maybe not the tanks you buy, but there are plenty of tops that show things off. I'm not sure why people have such a hard time admitting the truth, and I have no problem pointing that out. If you feel that is condescending then maybe its because it strikes a nerve.
Just because some people don't want to believe that boys can become sexually aroused by girls wearing camis/tanks and short shorts doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And guess what your daughters get aroused too. Its human nature, and yes it happens when puberty strikes, which for many is around 6th grade. Why do some of you have a problem acknowledging that?