Santa and Judiasm

[frndshpcptn]

I know we have talked about this topic on the CB before ( I remember reading the threads) but I have never actually experienced it in "real life." I am on the planning committee for our company holiday party and we had our first meeting yesterday.

We were talking about how to make sure the party is all-inclusive for Christmas, Hannukkah and Kwanza and one of the guys at the meeting said "Well, we have a Christmas tree, ornaments and Santa decorations/activities. Those are secular - everyone sees those as general holiday symbols for all religions."

I was really surprised. Now, I know as a Jewish person that Santa and a Christmas tree are NOT part of any Hannukkah celebration I grew up with. Am I in the minority here? I see Santa and Christmas trees and I think "Christmas" - which is a Christian holiday.

BTW - we did decide to have latkes and a fruit basket to incorporate Hannukkah and Kwanzza (after a bit of debate).

 

[scubamouse]

i recommend a festivus pole and leave it at that


(that's tag worthy isn't it?)

 

[Tiggeroo]

if they were landing on the same date you could have a mennorah. Have some hannukah themed cookies. Do people at your work celebrate Kwanzaa and exclude Christmas. Most people I know who celebrate kwanzaa still do Christmas so they won't mind. Since you are Jewish I'm sure you can come up with a way to help others who are Jewish feel included.

 

[Microcell]

i recommend a festivus pole and leave it at that


(that's tag worthy isn't it?)

Its a Festivus miracle!!!!!!

You could have the feats of strength too!




Seriously, I grew up Jewish and all the Jewish people I know did not care if Chanukah was incorporated, as it is really a minor holiday. Have a happy Christmas and don't worry about me is usually the Jewish way of thinking.

Nice of you to think about others though.

 

[Chicago526]

Well, a Christmas tree is considered "secular" from the point of view of the courts, that's why government buildings can have Christmas trees and not get sued by the ACLU. But as a practical matter, it is still a symbol of Christmas and not any other holiday, so I can't see puting one up at a holiday party that's supossed to be "all inclusive" unless you're going to put up a menora and.....whatever it is people put up for Kwanza.

If you REALLY wanted to be religion "neutral", your best bet is to go with a "winter theme", snowmen, snow flakes, that kind of thing.

 

[stinkerbelle]

If you REALLY wanted to be religion "neutral", your best bet is to go with a "winter theme", snowmen, snow flakes, that kind of thing.

I totally agree with this.

to ward off any "debates" growing up in a mostly jewish town...it was decided that any "holiday party" in the schools would be "winter themed".

 

[mom2grace]

You could also approach it from a celebration of lights. I think these holidays all have some type of light as a symbol. Then, include all of the food you want!

 

[akhenaten]

My former BIL was Jewish and they used to have Chaunaka Claus at their family gathering . I always thaought that was strange...I think he dressed as batman once C. CLAUS) talk about confusing mixed images!!??

His daughter my dear niece has since converted and is now Orthodox....
I have enjoyed learning about her faith and her spiritual journey...

Holiday partys:
Nothing can be more offensive that what happened at the scene shop my DH worked at when we were first married...they had a Christmas party and it included families....MY dh and I were leaving the party and his boss says"you are not leaving are you? We have a surprise coming.."
SO we stay figuring..maybe santa is coming for the few kids there (we had no children yet) or maybe a christmas bonus for the staff/crew.....

well imaging my surprise when a hardcore...female lap dancing stripper arrives and puts on a show (lap dances for one of the guys included)

We left right away and the boss says "I hope we did not offend you!" and I said "quite frankly you did",,,,

Let me tell you NOTHING can be more offensive than that!!!


SO put up a tree, menorah, kwanza candles..snowflakes. whatever..just please no christmas strippers!!!

 

[frndshpcptn]

I don't think we are looking for "neutral" so much as all-representative. I am happy to have a tree (we are making ornamnets), Santa decorations, etc. We just also want to have something to note Hannukkah and Kwanzaa. To be honest, none of us knew about Kwanzaa so someone in the office will be looking it up. We settled on latkes for the Hannukkah part of the party (we all like to eat!).

I just found it strange that we had someone who thought that Santa represented everyone in the office as a secular holiday symbol.

 

[Iggipolka]

I'm Jewish and my company is also having a "Holiday Party" with Santas and trees and ornaments and christmas music. Quite frankly, I'm really irritated by it. If they would just be honest and call it a Christmas party, that would be one thing, but to try and be politically correct and call is a Holiday Party, when it is clearly excluding anyone who doesn't celebrate Christmas, is wrong.
Christmas decorations are never a part of my hannukah celebration and I'm so so so sick of all Christmas stuff everywhere at this time of year.

 

[FutureAshleyDukes]

Target has Hannukkah ornaments for a Holiday? Tree. Is that what you would call it?

 

[frndshpcptn]

I think Hannukkah ornaments for a "holiday tree" is weird. Jewish people (for the most part) do not have Christmas trees.

 

[CheshireVal]

Maybe a lot of Jewish people are so used to the ubiquitous Christmas trees and Santas that pervade this time of year that they probably just naturally associate it with Hannakuh, too.

One of my best friends and old roommates was Jewish, and she always said she was glad to be my roommate during Christmas time because she kind of liked Christmas decorations!

 

[Sparx]

Have a menora and a christmas tree, and a ton of fruit. Pass out (I know I cant spell this)dredals and santa hats.

 

[AnaheimGirl]

You could always take the Ross Gellar route and plan a visit from the Holiday Armadillo.

As far as Santa, I know one Jewish family who takes their kids to see Santa and pretends that Santa brings them some Hannukah gifts, because all the other kids talk about Santa and they don't want the kids to feel left out. But I definitely think they are the exception, rather than the rule. I always thought everyone thought of Santa and trees as representing Christmas, and nothing else.

I think your solution sounds fine.

 

[FutureAshleyDukes]

I think Hannukkah ornaments for a "holiday tree" is weird. Jewish people (for the most part) do not have Christmas trees.

I thought the same thing when I saw them.

 

[Blondy876]

In my classroom I am really struggling this year. I have 14 students who all celebrate Christmas/Hanukkah/Kwanzaa. They want to play Christmas games, talk about Santa, sing Christmas songs, etc. However I have 1 student who is a Jehovah's witness and his parents have made it clear that he is to have nothing to do with Christmas. They originally told me that it was OK to discuss Christmas as a history lesson (I have 5 year olds) but so far I have been unable to come up with anything that they find acceptable. So instead of counting down the days to Christmas we are counting down the days to our winter break. We don't sing any Christmas songs and we have no decorations.

I can't seem to find a balance between what I need to do for my one student and what my other students want to do. I want to respect this child and his family but I also want to respect my other students.

It's getting harder and harder to do the right thing.

 

[gr8ful4Him]

I see Santa and Christmas trees and I think "Christmas" - which is a Christian holiday.

Ah, that's like saying I see a bunny in the spring and think of "Easter" - which is a Christian holiday! The latter of the statement is true, but the first part of the statement is definitely not...Santa is definitely secular! And as far as the tree goes...well, I know a lady that has a tree in her house that she decorates all year long for different occasions. We like to decorate ours with symbols of Jesus Christ's birth, but I've seen many that have really nothing to do with the "Christian Christmas".
To make everyone happy, well, I don't know that you can! Have a holiday party and theme it with no religion involved...but then again, that totally takes away from the "holy day" meaning of "holiday"

 

[frndshpcptn]

"Santa is definitely secular!"

Maybe I don't understand what secular mean? When I think secular- I think non-religious. Like snowflakes.

When I think of Santa, I think of the guy in the red suit that brings presents to good boys and girl on Christmas Eve and leaves them under the Christmas Tree. This sems to make him non-secular, as Jewish children (largely) don't celebrate Christmas and Santa does not visit thier home. If I wanted a visit from Santa as a child, I had to spend Christmas Eve at the home of one of my non-Jewish friends.

 

[beattyfamily]

"Santa is definitely secular!"

Maybe I don't understand what secular mean? When I think secular- I think non-religious. Like snowflakes.

When I think of Santa, I think of the guy in the red suit that brings presents to good boys and girl on Christmas Eve and leaves them under the Christmas Tree. This sems to make him non-secular, as Jewish children (largely) don't celebrate Christmas and Santa does not visit thier home. If I wanted a visit from Santa as a child, I had to spend Christmas Eve at the home of one of my non-Jewish friends.

I totally agree. Santa and Christmas trees aren't exactly the same as a crucifix or a nativity scene but they still symbolize/represent Christmas anyway. Santa Claus was a Catholic Saint.