Safely returning to sailing: "Healthy Sail Panel" recommendations

Starwind

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 7, 2014
See my bolded questions at the end for the DCL context.

According to


"
New recommendations from a panel of medical and scientific experts say that by relentlessly focusing on prevention and other measures, including the testing of guests and crew, public health risks associated with the pandemic can be mitigated in a cruise ship environment, according to a joint project from Royal Caribbean Cruises and Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings.

The Healthy Sail Panel submitted its recommendations today to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), in response to a CDC request for public comment that will be used to inform future public health guidance and preventative measures relating to travel on cruise ships.

The Healthy Sail Panel's 65-plus-page report includes 74 detailed best practices to protect the public health and safety of guests, crew and the communities where cruise ships call, according to a statement.

Recommendations include testing, the use of face coverings, and enhanced sanitation procedures on ships and in terminals.

..."

See: https://www.royalcaribbeangroup.com/healthy-sailing/

Full report: https://www.royalcaribbeangroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Healthy-Sail-Panel_Full-Recommendations_9.21.20_FINAL.pdf

Press release: https://presscenter.rclcorporate.com/press-release/115/experts-recommend-heightened-protocols-for-the-healthy-return-of-sailing/

A couple of the recommendations that stood out to me that have been discussed in this forum previously:

Some of the recommendations are identified as "Modify (M): Recommendations that can be scaled down, modified, or discontinued over time"; Others are "Keep (K): Recommendations that should continue to be implemented to address SARSCoV-2 and other infectious diseases".

M - "All guests joining a ship, regardless of method of travel to the ship, should be tested for
SARS-CoV-2 between 5 days and 24 hours before boarding and receive a negative result
that is shared with the cruise operator, before coming on board."

M - "Cruise operators should conduct once-daily temperature checks for guests and crew on
board."

M - "To prevent the spread of SARS-CoV-2, cruise operators should require guests and crew to
wear cloth face coverings/face masks in accordance with CDC recommendations."

K- "All cruise operators should upgrade the HVAC systems on their ships to, ideally, MERV 13
filters to minimize pathogen dispersal from infected guests and crew."

M - "During the initial return to sailing, cruise operators should only allow guests debarking
from a ship at a destination port to participate in cruise line-sponsored or verified
excursions as a way of limiting potential exposures in the destinations they visit."

M - "Cruise operators should offer indoor excursions only if physical distancing, use of masks,
and other recommended protective measures can be implemented."

M - "Crew should be placed in single-occupancy crew cabins whenever possible to minimize
extended periods of close contact with other crew members."

Note that more detail for each of these and all of the other recommendations is included in the discussion section of the report. For example, for the testing of passengers there is discussion of the possibility of testing at port of rapid tests are available.

Thoughts ?

If CDC were to accept this report and return to sailing looked a lot like the picture it paints and therefore DCL were to implement it.... would you sail ? would you wait until some of the (M) items were removed ? Which ones ?

What would it mean for DCL's return to sailing ?


SW
 

Starwind

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 7, 2014
FYI this is the full language on testing for guests, from page 22:

QUOTE

Testing for Guests
Recommendation 4: All guests joining a ship, regardless of method of travel to the ship, should be tested for SARS-CoV-2 between 5 days and 24 hours before boarding and receive a negative result that is shared with the cruise operator, before coming on board.

As discussed throughout this document, testing for all individuals boarding cruise ships is a critically important step in reducing the likelihood of virus introduction on board the ship. All guests and shortterm vendors, contractors, startup employees, and shoreside employees boarding a cruise ship should be tested 24 hours to 5 days before the cruise, so that they are able to receive a negative result prior to beginning their travel via land or air transportation to the port for embarkation. If a guest receives a positive result, they and their close contacts should not travel to the embarkation point.13

As discussed in the crew testing recommendation, if rapid, reliable, and clinically valid testing options become widely available, the addition of a second test at the pier or immediately before boarding would improve confidence in the testing regimen’s ability to prevent SARS-CoV-2 from entering the ship. Using adequately sensitive testing methods, the likelihood of missing a SARS-CoV-2 infection in an individual because of false negatives is extremely low under this double testing scenario. Therefore, if logistically and financially feasible, the Panel recommends this as the standard protocol. However, the Panel emphasizes that a single test at the point of embarkation is not a substitute for an initial test performed before a guest departs their home location; rather, the second test supplements and provides additional confidence in the ability of cruise operators to identify infected guests prior to boarding.


13 Individuals who are unable to submit to testing due to a disability, or for whom testing is medically contraindicated, should be referred to a secondary medical screening where a case-by-case assessment of the individual’s fitness for travel will be made, and a recommendation to allow or deny boarding will be based on the fitness-for-travel determination.

END QUOTE


Understandable, but could present a definite hurdle for guests from some areas where testing is difficult to access or testing results don't come back that quickly.

Also, what about those who have travel between leaving home and the cruise. For example, someone may have a week at WDW before a cruise, or several days in another departure port before their cruise.

For our upcoming Alaska cruise we were planning to have at least a few days in our departure city before the cruise. When we sailing in winter out of Port Canaveral, we arrive at least 3 days beforehand to allow for winter flight cancelations and give us the possibility to drive down on short notice if our flights are canceled with no prospect of rescheduling before the cruise.

A rule such as this would require us to rethink how we cruise (in terms of being a tourist pre-cruise and when we arrive in the departure city) and might preclude us from cruising until the rule is removed (in terms of testing result timelines).

SW
 

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  • Starwind

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    May 7, 2014
    This is a neat little tidbit, from page 38; glad to see some science being done:

    QUOTE

    The University of Nebraska Medical Center & National Strategic Research Institute recently conducted a bioaerosol assessment on Royal Caribbean’s “Oasis of the Seas” vessel. This study involved releasing billions of 1μ aerosol-sized microspheres, each containing uniquely DNA barcoded inert virus surrogate, throughout the ship at certain pre-selected spaces (i.e., crew cabins, guest staterooms, and adjacent public spaces including the casino, Studio-B & Disco/Lounge) to determine the efficiency and effectiveness of the vessel’s indoor air management strategies, as well as to understand the spread of the aerosols through the HVAC system and in between the adjacent private and public spaces. Unpublished data from this assessment highlights that an HVAC system equipped with MERV 13 filtration41 and an energy recovery wheel did not transport a significant number of aerosols into adjacent rooms and spaces served by the same air handling unit, and in most cases the airborne contamination was undetectable. Furthermore, study results show that in public areas, guest staterooms, and crew cabins, airborne contamination disappeared or microspheres were not detectable in less than an hour from the space they were released. This was accomplished by the combination of ≥6 air changes in the room and filtration of air through the MERV 13 filters. While not yet published, the
    results of this study provide confidence that a variety of indoor air management strategies,
    appropriately managed, can reduce presence and transmission of SARS-CoV-2 through the air.


    41 MERV stands for Minimum Efficiency Reporting Value, a system used to evaluate the efficiency of an air filter based on how effective it is at catching particles of various sizes. The higher the MERV rating, the higher the air filtration capabilities of a particular filter. MERV ratings range from 1-20, with 1 being the lowest level of filtration and 20 being the highest. Additional detail on MERV filter recommendations is provided later in this document.

    END QUOTE
     

    DCLDVC1

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Sep 1, 2015
    See my bolded questions at the end for the DCL context.

    According to


    "
    New recommendations from a panel of medical and scientific experts say that by relentlessly focusing on prevention and other measures, including the testing of guests and crew, public health risks associated with the pandemic can be mitigated in a cruise ship environment, according to a joint project from Royal Caribbean Cruises and Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings.

    The Healthy Sail Panel submitted its recommendations today to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), in response to a CDC request for public comment that will be used to inform future public health guidance and preventative measures relating to travel on cruise ships.

    The Healthy Sail Panel's 65-plus-page report includes 74 detailed best practices to protect the public health and safety of guests, crew and the communities where cruise ships call, according to a statement.

    Recommendations include testing, the use of face coverings, and enhanced sanitation procedures on ships and in terminals.

    ..."

    See: https://www.royalcaribbeangroup.com/healthy-sailing/

    Full report: https://www.royalcaribbeangroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Healthy-Sail-Panel_Full-Recommendations_9.21.20_FINAL.pdf

    Press release: https://presscenter.rclcorporate.com/press-release/115/experts-recommend-heightened-protocols-for-the-healthy-return-of-sailing/

    A couple of the recommendations that stood out to me that have been discussed in this forum previously:

    Some of the recommendations are identified as "Modify (M): Recommendations that can be scaled down, modified, or discontinued over time"; Others are "Keep (K): Recommendations that should continue to be implemented to address SARSCoV-2 and other infectious diseases".

    M - "All guests joining a ship, regardless of method of travel to the ship, should be tested for
    SARS-CoV-2 between 5 days and 24 hours before boarding and receive a negative result
    that is shared with the cruise operator, before coming on board."

    M - "Cruise operators should conduct once-daily temperature checks for guests and crew on
    board."

    M - "To prevent the spread of SARS-CoV-2, cruise operators should require guests and crew to
    wear cloth face coverings/face masks in accordance with CDC recommendations."


    K- "All cruise operators should upgrade the HVAC systems on their ships to, ideally, MERV 13
    filters to minimize pathogen dispersal from infected guests and crew."

    M - "During the initial return to sailing, cruise operators should only allow guests debarking
    from a ship at a destination port to participate in cruise line-sponsored or verified
    excursions as a way of limiting potential exposures in the destinations they visit."


    M - "Cruise operators should offer indoor excursions only if physical distancing, use of masks,
    and other recommended protective measures can be implemented."

    M - "Crew should be placed in single-occupancy crew cabins whenever possible to minimize
    extended periods of close contact with other crew members."

    Note that more detail for each of these and all of the other recommendations is included in the discussion section of the report. For example, for the testing of passengers there is discussion of the possibility of testing at port of rapid tests are available.

    Thoughts ?

    If CDC were to accept this report and return to sailing looked a lot like the picture it paints and therefore DCL were to implement it.... would you sail ? would you wait until some of the (M) items were removed ? Which ones ?

    What would it mean for DCL's return to sailing ?


    SW
    Deal breakers in red
     

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  • Starwind

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    May 7, 2014
    Some on this forum had speculated that the initial return to cruising may only involve short itineraries and going to the cruise lines' private islands....

    QUOTE

    Recommendation 57: In the startup phase, cruise itineraries should be as simple as possible, utilizing private, cruise line-owned and operated destinations or ports where there can be tight control of the onshore experience.

    While in the long term cruise operators will desire to return to a larger selection of available
    destinations, the Panel recommends that in the initial stage of return to service that they focus on
    cruises to their cruise-lined owned and operated destinations (private destinations) or tightly controlled ports if their own private destinations are not a reasonable option. In the case of sailing to a private destination, because the cruise operators have significantly more control over activities, social distancing, sanitation, use of PPE, staff wellness screenings, etc., they can greatly reduce the risk of exposure to SARS-CoV-2 at these destinations.

    If cruise operators must expand travel beyond their own private destinations, the Panel supports sailing to strictly controlled ports and destinations where cruise operators can ensure health and safety protocols are in place (e.g., social distancing, no crowding) and where they have confidence that those protocols are being followed. For many destinations, cruise operators may not have as much control over social distancing, sanitation, use of PPE, etc., which is why the Panel would prefer that initial travel remain at private destinations if feasible.

    The Panel recognizes that it is not sustainable in the long term to limit sailings to only private or strictly controlled destinations. But as a test case, in the initial phase of sailing, the Panel believes there is a significant advantage to starting in these locations. Not only will these destinations reduce overall risk during the first trips taking place when sailing resumes, but traveling to such controlled destinations will provide an opportunity for cruise operators to assess other health and safety protocols without the additional factors introduced by travel to various ports of call. Assuming that these initial, more controlled trips proceed with no incidents, it would be appropriate for cruise operators to expand their destination options for future trips.

    Recommendation 58: Cruise operators should initially return to service with shorter length trips.

    As mentioned above, during the initial return to service phase, simplicity and reduction of risk factors is advisable. Therefore, the Panel recommends trip lengths of no more than ten days at first. Cruises longer than that usually entail stops at several ports, and introducing this level of risk early in the return to service phase would be inadvisable.

    END QUOTE
     

    Husker Mike

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Mar 25, 2019
    My #1 concern is this:

    One way that cruise operators can facilitate physical distancing is by reducing overcrowding on board the ships. Therefore, the Panel believes that it is appropriate for cruises to sail at reduced capacity once sailing resumes as a way to facilitate physical distancing, especially as procedures are being tested to ensure they are working properly. Capacity can be gradually increased as conditions permit.
    I don't know what this means, but Disney throwing out 70% as "reduced" seems like only token acceptance of this concept. If anything, I think starting at 30% makes far more sense, and then it's something that can be ratcheted up gradually.
     

    brentm77

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jan 17, 2013
    My #1 concern is this:



    I don't know what this means, but Disney throwing out 70% as "reduced" seems like only token acceptance of this concept. If anything, I think starting at 30% makes far more sense, and then it's something that can be ratcheted up gradually.

    Let's assume the demand is high for cruising and most early cruises next year are already booked past 30% capacity. What would be the fair way to get it down to 30%? I assume the fairest method would be voluntary method first, with increasing incentives for individuals to move to later cruises. But, later cruises might quickly reach capacity, leaving no place to move volunteers, and DCL may still not get enough volunteers. Is it first-in last-out at that point? Status level? Any method is going to leave lasting negative impressions on those forced out.

    I have plane tickets, rental car, hotel, travel insurance, etc. all lined up for next March. We are also traveling with family from another state after coordinating dates with college and high school and work. It's one thing if the cruise is canceled, but if the ship sails without us, I might end up with a bad taste for DCL. On the other hand, if it gets the ships moving again, maybe I would get over it quickly and just book down the road. It is difficult times and there is no easy solution.
     

    T & R

    More cowbell !!!
    Joined
    May 8, 2017
    I don't know what this means, but Disney throwing out 70% as "reduced" seems like only token acceptance of this concept. If anything, I think starting at 30% makes far more sense, and then it's something that can be ratcheted up gradually.
    If you look at a lot of the recommendations it uses the words in order to test them ("But as a test case, in the initial phase of sailing"). Just a guess but if you only have 30% capacity, it would not be enough onboard to accurately test if the additional measures are actually working. 30% would be such a few number that the crew would actually outnumber the guests. With such a few number of guests, the efficacy of the above measures could not be accurately weighed and therefore you could not determine if/when you could safely increase the percent of capacity. It comes down to the number of vacant rooms you need to cover an outbreak and quarantine the sick plus the number of additional rooms you need to allow crew to have single cabin. 30% open rooms is adequate for helping with social distance and for having empty available rooms thus making sailing with 70% capacity reasonable. 70% capacity is a lot, that's more than 1 out of 4 people removed from the ship, should free up a lot of room and still allow for the cruiseline to financially recover instead of turning them into charity cruises that they operate at break even or loss.
     
  • jane01jp

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Mar 13, 2008
    See my bolded questions at the end for the DCL context.

    According to


    "
    New recommendations from a panel of medical and scientific experts say that by relentlessly focusing on prevention and other measures, including the testing of guests and crew, public health risks associated with the pandemic can be mitigated in a cruise ship environment, according to a joint project from Royal Caribbean Cruises and Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings.

    The Healthy Sail Panel submitted its recommendations today to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), in response to a CDC request for public comment that will be used to inform future public health guidance and preventative measures relating to travel on cruise ships.

    The Healthy Sail Panel's 65-plus-page report includes 74 detailed best practices to protect the public health and safety of guests, crew and the communities where cruise ships call, according to a statement.

    Recommendations include testing, the use of face coverings, and enhanced sanitation procedures on ships and in terminals.

    ..."

    See: https://www.royalcaribbeangroup.com/healthy-sailing/

    Full report: https://www.royalcaribbeangroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Healthy-Sail-Panel_Full-Recommendations_9.21.20_FINAL.pdf

    Press release: https://presscenter.rclcorporate.com/press-release/115/experts-recommend-heightened-protocols-for-the-healthy-return-of-sailing/

    A couple of the recommendations that stood out to me that have been discussed in this forum previously:

    Some of the recommendations are identified as "Modify (M): Recommendations that can be scaled down, modified, or discontinued over time"; Others are "Keep (K): Recommendations that should continue to be implemented to address SARSCoV-2 and other infectious diseases".

    M - "All guests joining a ship, regardless of method of travel to the ship, should be tested for
    SARS-CoV-2 between 5 days and 24 hours before boarding and receive a negative result
    that is shared with the cruise operator, before coming on board."

    M - "Cruise operators should conduct once-daily temperature checks for guests and crew on
    board."

    M - "To prevent the spread of SARS-CoV-2, cruise operators should require guests and crew to
    wear cloth face coverings/face masks in accordance with CDC recommendations."

    K- "All cruise operators should upgrade the HVAC systems on their ships to, ideally, MERV 13
    filters to minimize pathogen dispersal from infected guests and crew."

    M - "During the initial return to sailing, cruise operators should only allow guests debarking
    from a ship at a destination port to participate in cruise line-sponsored or verified
    excursions as a way of limiting potential exposures in the destinations they visit."

    M - "Cruise operators should offer indoor excursions only if physical distancing, use of masks,
    and other recommended protective measures can be implemented."

    M - "Crew should be placed in single-occupancy crew cabins whenever possible to minimize
    extended periods of close contact with other crew members."

    Note that more detail for each of these and all of the other recommendations is included in the discussion section of the report. For example, for the testing of passengers there is discussion of the possibility of testing at port of rapid tests are available.

    Thoughts ?

    If CDC were to accept this report and return to sailing looked a lot like the picture it paints and therefore DCL were to implement it.... would you sail ? would you wait until some of the (M) items were removed ? Which ones ?

    What would it mean for DCL's return to sailing ?


    SW
    We won't go on cruises until the mask requirement is lifted and live shows are offered.
     

    Pens Fan

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Mar 27, 2014
    M - "During the initial return to sailing, cruise operators should only allow guests debarking
    from a ship at a destination port to participate in cruise line-sponsored or verified
    excursions
    as a way of limiting potential exposures in the destinations they visit."
    (Bolding is mine)

    The wording here is interesting to me. I wonder if this means that you could leave the ship while in port if you were on some type of independently arranged excursion as long as it was pre-approved by the cruise line. If that's the case, I would be more inclined to sail. It still wouldn't allow someone to just roam freely on their own, but might not limit everyone to excursions offered by the cruise line.

    Or maybe I'm just reading too much into that statement and our options will be the overpriced cattle call cruise ship excursions or staying on the ship. :confused3
     

    pumpkinqueen93

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Aug 18, 2020
    FYI this is the full language on testing for guests, from page 22:

    QUOTE

    Testing for Guests
    Recommendation 4: All guests joining a ship, regardless of method of travel to the ship, should be tested for SARS-CoV-2 between 5 days and 24 hours before boarding and receive a negative result that is shared with the cruise operator, before coming on board.

    As discussed throughout this document, testing for all individuals boarding cruise ships is a critically important step in reducing the likelihood of virus introduction on board the ship. All guests and shortterm vendors, contractors, startup employees, and shoreside employees boarding a cruise ship should be tested 24 hours to 5 days before the cruise, so that they are able to receive a negative result prior to beginning their travel via land or air transportation to the port for embarkation. If a guest receives a positive result, they and their close contacts should not travel to the embarkation point.13

    As discussed in the crew testing recommendation, if rapid, reliable, and clinically valid testing options become widely available, the addition of a second test at the pier or immediately before boarding would improve confidence in the testing regimen’s ability to prevent SARS-CoV-2 from entering the ship. Using adequately sensitive testing methods, the likelihood of missing a SARS-CoV-2 infection in an individual because of false negatives is extremely low under this double testing scenario. Therefore, if logistically and financially feasible, the Panel recommends this as the standard protocol. However, the Panel emphasizes that a single test at the point of embarkation is not a substitute for an initial test performed before a guest departs their home location; rather, the second test supplements and provides additional confidence in the ability of cruise operators to identify infected guests prior to boarding.


    13 Individuals who are unable to submit to testing due to a disability, or for whom testing is medically contraindicated, should be referred to a secondary medical screening where a case-by-case assessment of the individual’s fitness for travel will be made, and a recommendation to allow or deny boarding will be based on the fitness-for-travel determination.

    END QUOTE


    Understandable, but could present a definite hurdle for guests from some areas where testing is difficult to access or testing results don't come back that quickly.

    Also, what about those who have travel between leaving home and the cruise. For example, someone may have a week at WDW before a cruise, or several days in another departure port before their cruise.

    For our upcoming Alaska cruise we were planning to have at least a few days in our departure city before the cruise. When we sailing in winter out of Port Canaveral, we arrive at least 3 days beforehand to allow for winter flight cancelations and give us the possibility to drive down on short notice if our flights are canceled with no prospect of rescheduling before the cruise.

    A rule such as this would require us to rethink how we cruise (in terms of being a tourist pre-cruise and when we arrive in the departure city) and might preclude us from cruising until the rule is removed (in terms of testing result timelines).

    SW
    I thought of the same thing when it comes to testing. I would rather there be a rapid test on site of the port. Heck before even going through the parking gate. Or something. Have everyone stick to their arrival times. Some places take a while to get the results back. Unless they make it a week instead of 5 days. But still I feel onsite would be the better call. Just cause you never know someone could be so sneaky and selfish as to fake a test result to not lose money.
     

    Intr3pid

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Mar 2, 2018
    Reads pretty much like what MSC etc. are already using in Europe. The recommendation about using private islands is new but quite expected.

    DCL will likely wait to see how it all comes together once the limited sailings resume. They aren't exactly in a rush.

    And the CDC will still not do anything about this submission until after the elections.
     

    ajo

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Feb 26, 2015
    The plan also recommends a "phased" opening with several test-runs without paying guests, including at dockside and an overnight cruise, followed by a cruise to one port (preferably the cruise line's private island) to practice all of the new protocols. And that's after a 7 day onboard quarantine for all the crew that return to the ship.

    Seems really unlikely this will all get off the ground in 2020.
     

    mevelandry

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 22, 2013
    Being tested 5 to 1 day before the cruise... I'm flying from Canada. Where and when am I supposed to get tested?

    It can take up to 6 days to receive our results right now.

    I sure hope the cruise lines will test us.
     

    BartmanLA

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Apr 26, 2013
    No way practical to implement testing! So you need to arrive anywhere from 5 days to 24 hours prior to sailing, get a test, then what? You quarantine someplace (who's going to pay for this? I sure ain't) How guaranteed this will work, you get the test then while you're "waiting" you come in contact with a guest at the hotel you're staying at a worker there or someone in a restaurant or shop or where ever and might be exposed then, then HOW do you know if you get on the ship after this you're not positive, you won't be passing it on to your family or other guests or crew on the ship? This just doesn't make sense, with out an IMMEDIATE test at the DOOR of the port terminal with rapid results right then (5 min) where you are sure you're negative (of course this doesn't speak to the exposure incubation period from contact as stated above from someone you just before you go to the port) I honestly don't see this as any kind of viable solution to resume cruising and protecting yourself, other guests and crew members.
     
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