S/O: Angel Trees- Long, winded VENT

[Cindy B]

So, as a teacher, could you tell anyone which family needed a little extra help this year? Would it violate some code? I'm really trying to find one family who is needy to give to unexpectedly. I think calling the schools in a bad area would be a good start, but I'm worried they won't be able to tell me anything, or worse, someone within the school would give me info on their kids and keep the gifts. I doubt it, but I guess after reading all the theft and funneling away gifts I've read about here, you never know.

Great questions. I would ask either the school office or guidance counselor. Check you local areas as well.. as you know there are many people that still "look" like they aren't struggling, but they are.

It's basically a trust issue. The black market exists. Even if you do find a needy family, it is hard to determine what they can/will do once given the gifts. I guess you would just have to trust the issue and move on.

 

[hinodis]

The purpose of an angel tree should be to help those who are TRUELY in need. I fully understand how the OP feels. First of all a child that has a NEED will want mittens for Christmas because they NEED to keep warm. DH came from a poor family with 15 kids. He got one very small gift at Christmas. If he got mittens and that was his only gift he would have been very grateful. He was not overindulged like kids today. He appreciated everything he had. He is one of the most giving people you will ever meet. Society puts way too much emphasis on material things. I think there is alot of greed out there. People can't afford to buy a Wii so they hope someone else will buy it for them. We have a six figure income and my kids don't have half the stuff their friends have. My DD11 does not have a need for a cell phone, a Wii, a DS, an MP3 or an Ipod. I can't believe the thread on here about what to buy a tween girl and everyone was on there buying their kids Uggs, coach bags, ... Not here. DD does not care about "name brands". Maybe because we don't put much value on "things" in this house. Where is all my money spent? Tuition. I am buying them an excellent education instead of "things". My 20 year old is really appreciating it as he works toward becoming a doctor. He told me yesterday that he really understands the value of his classes he is taking and how important his education is for his future. That was my Christmas gift this year.

 

[Kickapoo Joie Juice]

In our paper, they print letters to Santa.
It's usually cute, but PARENTS write these letters for their kids, also.
There was one printed last night from an EIGHTEEN MONTH old child, asking for a 25inch LCD tv for her room, a WII, an AG doll, and a Power Wheels.
WHY WOULD A PARENT write this stuff and have it published in anewspaper???
I really can't stand it, personally.

It's a very specific mentality that believes that because YOU have more than them that they DESERVE some of what you've got. There is the ingrained belief that those who have more somehow "got lucky" and therefore should be sharing with those who have less.

In reality, luck has very little to do with it, and in truth most people are poor because they've made some very bad choices, and either can't own the bad choices and make better ones going ahead, or believe that those choices or risky behaviors were not their responsibility but in fact 'bad luck'.

Without going into specifics, I have a personal, close up perspective on this, and again, it is jmo. I donate to the angel tree because I firmly believe that the offspring of adults who make poor choices should have a little bit of light in their life, while at the same time acknowledging that my giving to those children reinforces the paradigm that those with more are expected to give to those with less, and that those children may not be appreciative, but expectant.

But I hold out hope that one day they can break the pattern of their parents, or maybe the parents can learn from their mistakes-because we all make mistakes-it's what you do moving forward that helps to determine your path.

I would add that for me, people who were the victims of catastrophic illnesses in the family are the exception-one bad illness can wipe out your savings, ,your peace of mind, everything. Next year it's those people who I'm going to look to help, I think.

 

[Disneyluvr]

I would feel upset about those types of items being asked for too.

I work on the Navajo reservation (teach kinder.)where we have several families that are very poor. We have an angel tree and I always pick a child that is in my class because I KNOW what they need!

This yr the little girl I have is in a very bad situation! They live in a plywood house (nothing else, just plywood walls nailed together and a roof!) they have no electricity and no water. There are 6 kids under the age of 10. She has no coat and that's all she wanted really bad. So I feel really good about buying her things I know she needs. Actaully I already gave her the coat because it has been so cold here and I didn't want her to freeze for a few more weeks! She was over the moon! She wanted to wear it all day and had to show it to everyone we saw and let them feel how warm it is!

There are families out there that are truly in need!! And there are some that just want what they can get for free. You just have to look around to find the right families!

 

[dzorn]

I must agree I handle the angel tree for our church and we have been taking 25-30 names every year from a LCFS and the request this year are quite expensive requests. Previous year the parents have always asked for household items or clothes or an occasional tool or possibly a vacuum this year Macy's gift cards and jewelery. It was even on the two year olds request. The teens wanted expensive items. Mind you the organization says to spend about 30 dollars so I would think they would give them guidelines for requests.

Kids in general even family members have been requesting large ticket items. No sorry a lap top for a 13 year old is not in my budget neither is a $200 phone.

My kids are quite spoiled, mostly because they don't mind hand me downs from their cousins. They are getting DSs this year of course they have asked for them the past three years.

Michigan is hard hit right now especially when the future of the big three is up in the air. A local charity was had a article about another organization that is seeking donations. I am sure they go a lot of good for many people but I thin they did a great disservice in featuring the family requests that they did. A 12 year old may want a lap top and I-pod but with so many requests I would rather see 14 kids get a $50 gift that to give one child so much.

Just as it irritates me to see someone pay for and expensive steak with food stamps at the grocery store I will not be buying Macy's certificates for someone in need. I could shop at Macy's but I get more bang for my buck elsewhere. That is the reasonable thing to do. Heck my kids could not even tell you what Macy's sells.

We will be sticking with the tree at DD school. Hats and mittens and food drive.

Denise in MI

 

[livndisney]

I understand the frustration and disgust you fill but at the same time, remember that *poor* kids and families want the same things that we have. How sad that a 13 year old may only get a new sweater while her friends have MP3 players or the other hot things out there. MP3 fyi can now be bought relatively cheap ($30). Its one thing to say that the parents should be responsible and "be happy" with any help they may get, but these kids don't know any different other than to ask for what they truly want. Christmas is all about that.

I ran a program for disadvantaged kids and families for 7 years. We coached the parents....."list 2 things your child would like that are within reach of a program like this". We also provided Christmas dinner and groceries for a week with our delivery. In all those years we only had one time where a child asked for a tv or a bike. He got neither but did get a GC to a local store that was within the scope of what we can afford. Whoever is posting these items on the tree needs to be working more closely with the parents to sort this out. But the kids...yeah, they're going to dream and ask, just like I did with the Sears Book when I was little and my list was 10 pages long.

But I think what a lot of people are saying is the things on the lists are things they don't have for themselves. My DD does not have a $300 game system or an Ipod. She doesn't even have diamond earrings . As far as saying "well don't take the tag that asks for an Ipod", in some cases you don't get to "choose". I have seen Angels trees were the rule was "take the one you touch". I have also seen cases where items have been bought for children from Angel trees and the items were returned for cash by the receiving parent (Yes I know it is much harder to do now adays with receipt requirements). And I am not even going to comment on an 18 month old asking for an LCD TV.

 

[Ashlotte]

One whose mother wants to wear them.

Or sell them.

 

[disneyagogo]

BeckyScott, you have hit the nail on the head. I'm amazed at the amount of energy and emotion that is spent on these threads. My voyeuristic side comes out when I read these and I think that I need to just stop reading and get back to my "to do" list.

disneyagogo

 

[zachsmomie]

That's the thing that is really making me crazy about this thread. Many of these kids don't know they are on an angel tree. They don't know they are asking for donations. They get asked what they want for Christmas and someone writes it down. This isn't the case in every situation but when I was a social worker we did our best with the younger ones for them not to realize they were a part of a charity drive. The older ones obviously did but we worked hard in those situations to make sure we did our best to allow the children and their families to keep their pride. I wanted that four year old who believed Santa was going to bring him a bike to think that Santa did. I wanted them to feel like other kids on Christmas morning. To not go to school or church and wonder why Santa brought the other kids big gifts and not them. I understand that there are abuses to every system. I wish there weren't. I think there are alot of old values that this society is losing and I understand alot of peoples frustration at the attitudes of some. On the flip side I was taught that you gave in quiet and that you didn't judge. That's an old value that some on this board seem to be losing. These are children. Let them be children. Lets not saddle them with the percieved inadequacies of their parents. We are making alot of assumptions about children we don't even know.

So true! I have been reading these posts debating about responding. My family is very blessed and even as a child, when money was tight, my parents would take an angel off the angel tree and buy hats, mittens and a toy. As an adult, I continued to do that. My son is aware of the angel tree and knows that we participate in it every year. He is almost 16 now. The years we have not done it is when my husband's company supported a needy family (one yr. that was a family the guidance couselor at my school - I am a teacher-put the HR person in contact with..to this day, I do not know who the family was). That's the background to lead up to my response.

When my son was 8, his biological father was arrested and incarcerated for a particularly horrible crime. The following Christmas, a nice person knocked on the door of my fully decked out upper-middle class home. She said she had a package for my son from the Angel Tree. WHAT I never filled anything out like that (if fact we had just turned in our angel tree gifts the week before). I told her there must be a misunderstanding and that she should direct that package to another boy my son's age but she insisted we had to take it. Inside was a warm-up suit and a basketball. My son wanted to know how his name got on an angel and my husband and I had no idea. It took 3 weeks of calls to determine that his father (in prison) had signed him up and it took forever to make sure it never happened again. As I said, we are blessed and my son did not need that gift and the thought of a child who did need it going without broke my heart.

I haven't done an angel tree since because of it. We've wanted to make sure that the families we supported were truly in need. But this year, I watched all the people walk by the lady at the mall sitting near the tree and it broke my heart. My husband and I search for one that found right and got an 12 month old boy whose tag said: coat, 18month clothes and Elmo. We bought 3 toys on sale at KBee and some clothes on sale at JCP and took them back to the tree the same day. The lady put both smaller bags in one bag and put the tag on the outside. I am choosing to believe they will go to that child.

You don't give to get...you give to make the world a better place. That's what we teach my son. That giving is part of being a Christian and part of being a member of the human race. When you are blessed, you bless in return because if you give with good intentions, only good can come of it...even if you never see the outcome.

 

[PilotWife]

How in the world is a 10-year old who has little, and sees some of her friends at school with so much, wanting what THEY have greedy?

When you were 10, would you have been happy getting mittens as your only Christmas gift?

Face it...how many of our OWN kids NEED a Wii? None of them...NONE of them...but we buy things that they want because it makes them happy.

So why can't you keep the spirit of the angel tree and accept that you are fulfilling a wish for a kid who has no other hope of getting something they really want. Nothing says you can't still get them a pair of mittens...but consider that what really makes a kid happy on Christmas is getting something they want rather than need.

I have to agree with you here. I dont think that a child even knows the entire concept of Greedy. They hear the stories of Santa and Toys. And when you were a child - I doubt that you only included a new coat and clothes for what you wanted for christmas. These children see all the commercials and ads for these games with friends all having them....and you know - I feel that Christmas shouldnt be all about what a child NEEDS.

And really if you are going to donate you money, I feel that you should give it freely, with no "strings attached". If you dont like what a child asks for then donate you money to an organization who will just apply the money where it is needed. That way you have no clue where you money goes.

Jennifer

 

[happygirl]

I haven't read through all the responses. I don't mind people putting down what they want. Kids want what they want. No kid is going to say they want mittens or what not. Just because they have it wrote down doesn't mean you have to get that for them

 

[Cindy B]

Or sell them.

That is what some of the families do. They get the high ticket goods and sell them for cash.

It is what it is.

 

[deanna2426]

How in the world is a 10-year old who has little, and sees some of her friends at school with so much, wanting what THEY have greedy?

When you were 10, would you have been happy getting mittens as your only Christmas gift?

Face it...how many of our OWN kids NEED a Wii? None of them...NONE of them...but we buy things that they want because it makes them happy.

So why can't you keep the spirit of the angel tree and accept that you are fulfilling a wish for a kid who has no other hope of getting something they really want. Nothing says you can't still get them a pair of mittens...but consider that what really makes a kid happy on Christmas is getting something they want rather than need.

Well said

 

[gaelic grace]

Exactly.

Maybe - maybe not. Seems like an unfair assumption. We buy nice gold earrings because of allergy issues. I watch and get them at a good price and we only have a few pair. I see plenty of little girls with nice earrings. I can't tell if they are diamond or not and if I saw that on a tag and chose to take it I would compare. If I could get a good quality cubic with sterling silver or gold posts I would probably buy that and send it. I'm not sure that anyone would think to write clear gem-like earrings. I think when someone says diamond earrings you automatically know the type of stone they are talking about.

 

[gaelic grace]

So true! I have been reading these posts debating about responding. My family is very blessed and even as a child, when money was tight, my parents would take an angel off the angel tree and buy hats, mittens and a toy. As an adult, I continued to do that. My son is aware of the angel tree and knows that we participate in it every year. He is almost 16 now. The years we have not done it is when my husband's company supported a needy family (one yr. that was a family the guidance couselor at my school - I am a teacher-put the HR person in contact with..to this day, I do not know who the family was). That's the background to lead up to my response.

When my son was 8, his biological father was arrested and incarcerated for a particularly horrible crime. The following Christmas, a nice person knocked on the door of my fully decked out upper-middle class home. She said she had a package for my son from the Angel Tree. WHAT I never filled anything out like that (if fact we had just turned in our angel tree gifts the week before). I told her there must be a misunderstanding and that she should direct that package to another boy my son's age but she insisted we had to take it. Inside was a warm-up suit and a basketball. My son wanted to know how his name got on an angel and my husband and I had no idea. It took 3 weeks of calls to determine that his father (in prison) had signed him up and it took forever to make sure it never happened again. As I said, we are blessed and my son did not need that gift and the thought of a child who did need it going without broke my heart.

I haven't done an angel tree since because of it. We've wanted to make sure that the families we supported were truly in need. But this year, I watched all the people walk by the lady at the mall sitting near the tree and it broke my heart. My husband and I search for one that found right and got an 12 month old boy whose tag said: coat, 18month clothes and Elmo. We bought 3 toys on sale at KBee and some clothes on sale at JCP and took them back to the tree the same day. The lady put both smaller bags in one bag and put the tag on the outside. I am choosing to believe they will go to that child.

You don't give to get...you give to make the world a better place. That's what we teach my son. That giving is part of being a Christian and part of being a member of the human race. When you are blessed, you bless in return because if you give with good intentions, only good can come of it...even if you never see the outcome.

Thank you for that story. You made me cry. I needed to read something encouraging.

 

[gaelic grace]

But I think what a lot of people are saying is the things on the lists are things they don't have for themselves. My DD does not have a $300 game system or an Ipod. She doesn't even have diamond earrings . As far as saying "well don't take the tag that asks for an Ipod", in some cases you don't get to "choose". I have seen Angels trees were the rule was "take the one you touch". I have also seen cases where items have been bought for children from Angel trees and the items were returned for cash by the receiving parent (Yes I know it is much harder to do now adays with receipt requirements). And I am not even going to comment on an 18 month old asking for an LCD TV.

So if your child doesn't have it it's not OK for another child to have it? I don't think I follow or agree with this line of logic. I don't know the circumstances or situations of any of these families. They are going to be as varied as the people on this board. I don't think you should participate in this type of program if you are going to attach so many qualifications or pre-conceived notions. Participate in a program that you have more control of. I guess I just can't wrap my head around the thinking that because someone is less fortunate or asks for something that some children don't have is wrong or a reason not to do it. Not being able to fulfull it is one thing but placing a judgement on whether a child is entitled to it or not is another.

 

[gaelic grace]

I haven't seen anyone address this. Maybe some of the posters that have posted that they work with the angel trees or community agencies or schools can explain if an MP3 player is a good gift? I would be happy to buy one but don't you need a computer with internet access as well as funds to buy music for the player? Also if the child receives a wii, a lot of the cool wii games are $50 or more. Guitar hero alone is like $100. So do you think it is okay to give the gift if you can't afford to give all the supporting items?? It's almost like it would be more of a disappointment for the kids in a way.

Most children have access to a computer at school where they can charge them. You can also buy a battery charger relatively inexpensively. I think I got my portable on sale for about $8. There are all kinds of free music that you can download as well as being able to load CD's on them. If someone is asking for Guitar Hero they probably have the supporting gaming station. You can rent games or borrow them or get them used relatively inexpensive at some of the gaming stores. Wii does come with some games and I know several people who have never gotten any other than what came with the console.

 

[RitaE]

My final thoughts
1. I have absolutely no opinion on anybody's right to "want" anything. Everybody has wants, sometimes they are practical, sometimes they are ridiculous. I do however have opinions on people being encouraged to make reasonable requests when they are asking for charity. When people ask me for gift ideas, I try to make my requests reasonable. I encourage my children to do the same and I have done so from the time they were first old enough to ask for gifts. I expect no less from the population served by Holiday Gift Charities.

2. Just because somebody "wants" something doesn't mean it is going to be coming in a gift from me. For instance, my 15yo wants this snake he saw in Petsmart last week. Won't shut up about the snake. It is the only thing his precious little soul has wished for so far this year and oh boy is he gong to be disappointed come Christmas morning. Poor kid. And yet I'll be willing to bet, he will like the gifts he gets just fine.

3. No matter who you are, only give when your heart tells you to give. I've been donating to various causes for many years and that is a lesson I've learned. If a particular cause does not match your values or interests, then find one that does. If your heart tells you it isn't where your money should be going, then it is perfectly ok to say no and you don't need to feel guilty at all. It is your money, use it in the way that you feel is best.

4. A person is not a bad person because they don't donate in the way you donate. They are simply a person with different values and beliefs.

5. Of course I don't think children should only receive mittens and underwear for Christmas. For goodness sakes, I'm not the Wicked Witch of the West. I think everybody can agree there is a huge middle ground in between a $300 Wii system and mittens and underwear. I will admit that the thought of a child in the midst of a Chicago winter without a coat bothers me far more than the thought of a child without a Video Game system. When I see one situation, I feel called to correct it immediately. The other, not so much.

 

[EthansMom]

My concern is that kids who are wish for a game system or other expensive electronics system are less likely to get something they want than kids who write down a moderately-priced idea. It would be far kinder for someone to recommend that they write down wishes that are reasonably-priced (say $50 or less per item) than that those children do without at Christmas.

 

[clownchk]

I work in a poor school district.
And don't get me started on all the expensive eyeglasses these same kids wear.....ON MY DIME! They claim they can't afford insurance, so they get it from the state and the kids (who probably really need glasses), get D&G and Versace frames!!!!!
Okay, I'm done ranting now!!

OK, first of all, you need to stop looking at the individual "things" and see the big picture.

My DD wears Tommy Hilfiger frames. Thy were 2/$69 and the best I could afford. Yes, brand name, but they were discontiued specials. My kids & I wear Abercromie, Crocs, Gap and other brand names. Guess what? I purchase them all at Salvation Army.

We have a 42 inch flat screen TV. DH worked very hard for a man who gave it to us in trade. HE needed work done and could not afford it, since he had 3 TV's, he offered us this one in return.

Now, we refused to have our names put on an angel tree (We work very hard, budget wisely and provide more than is needed for our kids, but still get reduced lunches).

Yup, we go to Disney every year. We scrimp and save and use our tax return.

We are up to date with our mortgage payment, but did file bankruptcy 6 years ago when I was forced to quit my job to care for our preemie DD.

You cannot judge a book by its cover, and you cannot stop others from making bad decisions. Yes, sometimes people are greedy and out for a quick buck. Other times people do whatever they can just to make ends meet and would feel blessed to have a $10 gift card to the grocery store!

It is very simple. No one is forcing you to use your money in a way you do not agree with. If you choose to give, give wisely. If you can't afford to give money, give time. If you can't afford to give time, then May God bless you. Please do not judge anyone that does not agree with you. Do not judge those that have/ have not. Just being able to read this means you are richer than a majority of the world. You have access to the internet. You can read! You CAN make wise choices! Please do so.