Retheme Splash Mountain?

[maxiesmom]

Ooooh...disagree vehemently. If you want to stop the HoP from being political, just stop people form cheering when the presidents are introduced - they are the ones making the attraction political. Speaking for the silent majority, the people who are cheering (and jeering) are the only ones who care - honestly. It's a celebration of US History and that's it. If you don't like our history then the power is in your hands to change our future. That's the message I take from it anyway.

Well, yeah. That is what you get if you just look at the attraction for what it is, and don't try and dissect the backstory. You enjoy it for what it is showing you. Kind of like Splash Mountain isn't a racist story.

People want to start making rides politically correct and make sure every aspect is clear. If you start with Splash Mountain, then they will move from ride to show to ride to attraction, and nothing will remain the same.

 

[snowwhite84]

A problem with converting it to Princess and the Frog as well would be that the movie itself also has it's own controversy that could be stirred up just as much for the depiction of Ray in the movie. It brought up controversy shortly before it's release and seen it brought up since. So it's kind of that same issue of where do you draw the line with cancel culture. There's probably something that could be pointed out for about an given attraction or IP in the parks that could be viewed as offensive to someone.

In the poll I voted for change it, though I’m not sure I would want it changed to PATF. I‘d be interested to see a poll just asking should it be changed, yes or no.

 

[mentos]

People want to start making rides politically correct and make sure every aspect is clear. If you start with Splash Mountain, then they will move from ride to show to ride to attraction, and nothing will remain the same.

I think a valid question is... should something remain the same for the sake of staying the same? I think it's a conversation worth having.

Like for example POTC, I'm comfortable with its portrayal of arson, water-based torture, etc... but the sexual crimes needed to be addressed. The attempted rape was done first, followed by human trafficking most recently. Did real pirates actually rape people and sell women into sexual slavery? Yes. Does it need to be portrayed at Disneyland? Probably not.

I don't think being PC is an all-or-nothing venture, it's about reevaluating from time to time.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Tiana deserves a new ride and multiple restaurants on property. Period.

Quoting myself because I don’t know why @Nebraska_Disney found this funny.

 

[snowwhite84]

I posed this question before directly to one poster, but I’d like to pose it again to the group at large, and I’m genuinely happy to hear from anyone: For those of you that voted it shouldn’t be changed, do you think offensive themes shouldn’t be changed, period, or is it that you don’t think Song of the South is offensive enough to warrant changing a ride?

I’m asking because I truly believe Song of the South to be incredibly racist material. I can’t imagine what it would feel like to be a black visitor walking past that ride, knowing what the source material is. Humbly, I will be surprised if it doesn’t get changed in the coming years.

So is it that you don’t think we should alter offensive rides, or that this one in particular is not offensive?

 

[GoingSince1990]

I posed this question before directly to one poster, but I’d like to pose it again to the group at large, and I’m genuinely happy to hear from anyone: For those of you that voted it shouldn’t be changed, do you think offensive themes shouldn’t be changed, period, or is it that you don’t think Song of the South is offensive enough to warrant changing a ride?

I’m asking because I truly believe Song of the South to be incredibly racist material. I can’t imagine what it would feel like to be a black visitor walking past that ride, knowing what the source material is. Humbly, I will be surprised if it doesn’t get changed in the coming years.

So is it that you don’t think we should alter offensive rides, or that this one in particular is not offensive?

Splash is not offensive because it’s not a “Song of the South” themed ride. If it was, I would support changing it. But it’s not; it’s a Brer Rabbit themed ride. The Brer story, which predates “Song of the South”, did make a brief appearance in the movie but that doesn’t mean that a Brer Rabbit themed ride is offensive and needs to be changed. The existing Splash does a positive service in reclaiming the Brer story from a racist movie that is fading into well-deserved obscurity. I doubt that even 5% of Splash riders have even heard of “Song of the South”.

 

[snowwhite84]

Splash is not offensive because it’s not a “Song of the South” themed ride. If it was, I would support changing it. But it’s not; it’s a Brer Rabbit themed ride. The Brer story, which predates “Song of the South”, did make a brief appearance in the movie but that doesn’t mean that a Brer Rabbit themed ride is offensive and needs to be changed. The existing Splash does a positive service in reclaiming the Brer story from a racist movie that is fading into well-deserved obscurity. I doubt that even 5% of Splash riders have even heard of “Song of the South”.

I see your point, and I think it’s a fair one. I disagree though, as the Brer Rabbit character as we see it in Splash Mountain originated in Song of the South. And while I understand that the Uncle Remus and Brer Rabbit stories predate the Song of the South movie, there are racial problems with those stories as well. But again, I do see your point.

ETA: I think there’s a scenario where Disney removes certain elements from the ride that come from Song of the South, like the characters, and make just a few alterations. That wouldn’t surprise me. Sort of like with POTC, they just altered it a bit.

 

[Paul1955]

I posed this question before directly to one poster, but I’d like to pose it again to the group at large, and I’m genuinely happy to hear from anyone: For those of you that voted it shouldn’t be changed, do you think offensive themes shouldn’t be changed, period, or is it that you don’t think Song of the South is offensive enough to warrant changing a ride?

I’m asking because I truly believe Song of the South to be incredibly racist material. I can’t imagine what it would feel like to be a black visitor walking past that ride, knowing what the source material is. Humbly, I will be surprised if it doesn’t get changed in the coming years.

So is it that you don’t think we should alter offensive rides, or that this one in particular is not offensive?

Currently, we are focusing on the atrocities committed against People of Color, and rightly so. Unfortunately, atrocities have also been committed against other groups over the history of the world. How, or should, we determine that one atrocity is worse than another atrocity to warrant a change in the parks? Take for example the thematic use of storm troopers and the empire officers in Galaxy's edge, Star Tours, and Disney Springs. I have not heard a discussion that Disney should be rethinking these parts of the parks, but there really is nothing subtle about how the fanatical portrayal of storm troopers and the empire officers parallel the forces and officers that defended the Nazi Party both before and during the Holocaust. The Nazis referred to storm troopers as the sturmabteilung, and is it really coincidence that practically ever empire officer in the Star Wars movies speaks with a European accent? The Holocaust lead to the enslavement and death of millions of Jews, yet we as a modern society seem OK with Disney using cast members dressed as storm troopers and audio animatronics on Rise of the Resistance to entertain us by "patrolling" the parks to help maintain "order". Just because social media, protests, and news outlets are not currently focusing on the atrocities committed against the Jews should not make it any less of an atrocity that has been committed against People of Color. Again this is just another example, but I do not know how one or Disney can selectively begin modifying elements in the Disney parks without the selection being subject to unconscious bias.

 

[snowwhite84]

Currently, we are focusing on the atrocities committed against People of Color, and rightly so. Unfortunately, atrocities have also been committed against other groups over the history of the world. How, or should, we determine that one atrocity is worse than another atrocity to warrant a change in the parks? Take for example the thematic use of storm troopers and the empire officers in Galaxy's edge, Star Tours, and Disney Springs. I have not heard a discussion that Disney should be rethinking these parts of the parks, but there really is nothing subtle about how the fanatical portrayal of storm troopers and the empire officers parallel the forces and officers that defended the Nazi Party both before and during the Holocaust. The Nazis referred to storm troopers as the sturmabteilung, and is it really coincidence that practically ever empire officer in the Star Wars movies speaks with a European accent? The Holocaust lead to the enslavement and death of millions of Jews, yet we as a modern society seem OK with Disney using cast members dressed as storm troopers and audio animatronics on Rise of the Resistance to entertain us by "patrolling" the parks to help maintain "order". Just because social media, protests, and news outlets are not currently focusing on the atrocities committed against the Jews should not make it any less of an atrocity that has been committed against People of Color. Again this is just another example, but I do not know how one or Disney can selectively begin modifying elements in the Disney parks without the selection being subject to unconscious bias.

In the Star Wars universe, Stormtroopers and the Empire are portrayed as the villains. Any storytelling is going to have an antagonist. One of the (several) problems with Song of the South is not that it recalls slavery and Reconstruction, but that it glamorizes it, that it looks on the era with nostalgia. That’s just one of the things that turns the movie from being ABOUT race, to being itself inherently racist. There are a number of excellent videos on YouTube discussing this as it pertains to SotS.

 

[RanDIZ]

If you don’t like Splash Mountain the way it is, then don’t go to Disney. They’re not forcing anyone to go. It’s addictive enough that makes people come back.

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

Currently, we are focusing on the atrocities committed against People of Color, and rightly so. Unfortunately, atrocities have also been committed against other groups over the history of the world. How, or should, we determine that one atrocity is worse than another atrocity to warrant a change in the parks? Take for example the thematic use of storm troopers and the empire officers in Galaxy's edge, Star Tours, and Disney Springs. I have not heard a discussion that Disney should be rethinking these parts of the parks, but there really is nothing subtle about how the fanatical portrayal of storm troopers and the empire officers parallel the forces and officers that defended the Nazi Party both before and during the Holocaust. The Nazis referred to storm troopers as the sturmabteilung, and is it really coincidence that practically ever empire officer in the Star Wars movies speaks with a European accent? The Holocaust lead to the enslavement and death of millions of Jews, yet we as a modern society seem OK with Disney using cast members dressed as storm troopers and audio animatronics on Rise of the Resistance to entertain us by "patrolling" the parks to help maintain "order". Just because social media, protests, and news outlets are not currently focusing on the atrocities committed against the Jews should not make it any less of an atrocity that has been committed against People of Color. Again this is just another example, but I do not know how one or Disney can selectively begin modifying elements in the Disney parks without the selection being subject to unconscious bias.

I must admit that the first time I rode RofR and heard the English CM barking orders in a German accent, as we were herded into the tunnel, I felt slightly queasy. And yes, I know that it is true to the film.

 

[RanDIZ]

I must admit that the first time I rode RofR and heard the English CM barking orders in a German accent, as we were herded into the tunnel, I felt slightly queasy. And yes, I know that it is true to the film.

Yea the first time I went to Epcot I was a bit nervous in Italy. Wasn’t sure if it was mafia related. Or in Japan where thoughts of Pearl Harbor came to mind.

 

[pigletto]

I don’t think it matters what I think. If black people are polled and find it hurtful , offensive , or racist then that is enough for me to want to see it changed. A bunch of white people sitting around talking about whether it should be viewed as offensive is pretty much the problem.

 

[snowwhite84]

Yea the first time I went to Epcot I was a bit nervous in Italy. Wasn’t sure if it was mafia related. Or in Japan where thoughts of Pearl Harbor came to mind.

I understand you’re being sarcastic, but your joke only works if you assume someone would equate Italians with criminals and the Japanese with bombers. Such a person would be showing their prejudice, and shouldn’t be catered to anyway.

 

[snowwhite84]

I don’t think it matters what I think. If black people are polled and find it hurtful , offensive , or racist then that is enough for me to want to see it changed. A bunch of white people sitting around talking about whether it should be viewed as offensive is pretty much the problem.

I agree, I would much prefer have this conversation with a group of black Disboarders. Perhaps this topic will make it to the podcast, and black opinions could be featured.

 

[GoingSince1990]

I don’t think it matters what I think. If black people are polled and find it hurtful , offensive , or racist then that is enough for me to want to see it changed. A bunch of white people sitting around talking about whether it should be viewed as offensive is pretty much the problem.

How would you know the race of the participants in the discussion? Most here do not seem to use a picture of themselves as their avatar.

 

[JM23457]

Ugh. Please, no. Stop. If all old movies have to pass militant political correctness standards, we won't be able to watch old movies anymore.

This kind of thing is having a chilling effect on the arts: film, literature, etc., all now has to pass a political test before being released to the public, and old art forms that don't pass the test are being condemed. This is very wrong.

I am part African-American, btw. Not that it makes any difference, but I guess to some people, it might... Just putting it out there that as an artist & an art lover, I find this defacto censorship appaling.

 

[pigletto]

How would you know the race of the participants in the discussion? Most here do not seem to use a picture of themselves as their avatar.

Did I say that I did ? Nope. But I’m going to assume that since not a single person in the discussion has identified themselves as such, that’s its likely. You‘re free to assume otherwise.

 

[pigletto]

Did I say that I did ? Nope. But I’m going to assume that since not a single person in the discussion has identified themselves as such, that’s its likely. You‘re free to assume otherwise.

* eta - Until the above poster

 

[snowwhite84]

How would you know the race of the participants in the discussion? Most here do not seem to use a picture of themselves as their avatar.

I would assume in an online conversation about race, if someone from the race being discussed joined in, they would identify as such. That’s just my assumption, and assumptions can be messy.