Reducing the Disney "Experience"

[Doug7856]

I agree, all sign point to things beginning to happen at DHS and DAK, but they are very late. Modern Disney management, particularly in Orlando, continues to extract higher prices (well above inflation) without significant increases in value. Declining by degrees is true across the Disney Orlando parks. In my opinion, current Disney management only sees the Disney Parks as revenue sources and really don't understand the parks or the people who do love the parks.

All you have to do is look at the financials, growth in profits from the Disney parks is down and I argue it's because of shortsighted management that started at the top. They don't have realistic pricing on accommodations. The company's reinvestment in park attractions is lower than ever. Prices on food are skyrocketing and the quality is dropping. Current management sees the Orlando Disney parks simply as a revenue source and doesn't understand that those profits are the result of years of investments -- many from the Eisner era. They have lost the heart and soul and imagination that makes Walt Disney World such a special place for so many people.

 

[minnie mum]

I agree, all sign point to things beginning to happen at DHS and DAK, but they are very late. Modern Disney management, particularly in Orlando, continues to extract higher prices (well above inflation) without significant increases in value. Declining by degrees is true across the Disney Orlando parks. In my opinion, current Disney management only sees the Disney Parks as revenue sources and really don't understand the parks or the people who do love the parks.

All you have to do is look at the financials, growth in profits from the Disney parks is down and I argue it's because of shortsighted management that started at the top. They don't have realistic pricing on accommodations. The company's reinvestment in park attractions is lower than ever. Prices on food are skyrocketing and the quality is dropping. Current management sees the Orlando Disney parks simply as a revenue source and doesn't understand that those profits are the result of years of investments -- many from the Eisner era. They have lost the heart and soul and imagination that makes Walt Disney World such a special place for so many people.

Thank you. Very well stated.

 

[ArwenMarie]

Didn't they just do a summer long coronation parade at DHS? As for DAK, good riddance.

Have to speak up on the parades...Parades make a big difference to a lot of people. I will watch almost any parade and enjoy it. Losing the DHS and DAK parades was a huge deal to me. I loved having that those to look forward to during the day. And no, the coronation parade was not a parade, it was about 4 minutes long and even Disney didn't call it a parade...they called it a "Processsion" and "Welcome."

exactly what they want you'll be back at your resort taking a break and some one else will fill you spot

This is so true. Nothing is done at Disney without a reason, including bench removal. They absolutely don't want people sitting around on benches relaxing...if you want to relax, they want you to go back to your resort. It's all part of my theory that one of the goals of My Magic is to have people visit for about six hours a day and then go "enjoy your WDW resort."

 

[tzolkin]

My biggest issue with the changes is NOT that changes are being made, but that things are being eliminated and replaced with… NOTHING. Look at Epcot and all the empty buildings; Horizons replaced with nothing, Wonders of Life replaced with nothing (except the occasional party center). The Viking Ship in Norway is gone (and now Maelstrom, but at least something will replace it), acrobats in China, the masquerade characters in Italy, Miyoshi in Japan, living statues in France, Mo Rockin', Off Kilter (replaced with something that requires too large a venue to be done appropriately in that little spot). Does the Ooompah Band still play in the courtyard in Germany so everyone can Chicken Dance together? What happened to the Lights of Winter (or just the light arch that was there otherwise) and the fountain that danced to the music playing along with the water show? Tapestry of Nations? At one time, ALL of these were a part of Epcot. Now none (or almost none) are...

This is exactly what I have been thinking about since reading some of the changes posted on the Disboards.

Epcot is our family's favorite and we are finally planning a trip where we will stay in the Boardwalk/Beach Club area (for the purpose of being able to enjoy Epcot.)

We took a two-year break from Disney and now that I'm getting back into planing mode it seems like I read something every day that has been removed. If things were being replaced, we would look forward to those new experiences. But I'm starting to wonder what will be left in Epcot (especially WS entertainment/atmosphere) and if it will be worth spending half our trip there anymore.

 

[larryz]

I'm heading to San Diego right after Thanksgiving and driving up to DL for two days with another couple. Never been there, so eager to see the 'mother land'! After that? Who knows. Lots of places to visit...probably won't be returning to WDW multiple times a year anymore.

Yule love it! We were just there for a 5-day visit, and had a great time riding the originals and uniques. And by going in at first light, we didn't even use one FP -- in fact, gave away a pair for Space Mountain.

 

[tjevans]

With all do respect, if you don't find magic in the things that I cited, but do find it in a trash can, you don't get it.

I never said the castle, fireworks, parades, etc. weren't magical. (Although I've marched in enough parades as a performer they have permanently lost all magic for me).

I'm sorry what I find magical isn't approved by you. Didn't mean to offend by suggesting I have a different opinion.

 

[tjevans]

I enjoy a good sarcastic retort. Everyone's magic is based on their own preferences. If a good portion size, a bench and a trash can is your thing, who am I to tell you otherwise. For me the magic lies in things I can't find at my neighborhood playground.

Where do you live? I want to move to where a moving, talking trash can is found at a neighborhood playground!

 

[tjevans]

with all of your complaining ive yet to read any of the constant complainers say there never going back.

I cannot speak for anyone else, but here's why I will at least make one more trip.

There was a skinny, four-eyed six-year old who had no friends. School was difficult for him, not because of academics, but because he was made fun of by everyone. He would come home every day and cry. He wanted a friend more than anything in the world.

One summer, his parents took him to Disney World. This was back in the mid 70's. There was just the Magic Kingdom. Things were different back then. Characters just roamed without any handlers, and they were not scheduled, so it was truly magic to run into them. (I understand why they don't do that anymore, though).

This kid and his parents ran into Donald Duck. Donald Duck took this kid by the hand and led him, skipping through the park. The child felt, for the first time in his life, like he had a friend, and he was happier than he had ever been.

In case you haven't figured it out, I was that kid. And as corny as it sounds, that magical moment changed my life, and really helped me come out of my shell.

I will come back to WDW, at least one more time, because when I go back, I still get as excited as I did as a six-year old. Just like that first time, I still sing "M-I-C-K-E-Y" when I see the sign saying "Welcome to Walt Disney World." But if I didn't have those magical experiences, and I made my first trip today, I don't think I'd ever want to come back.

 

[JanaDee]

Didn't they just do a summer long coronation parade at DHS? As for DAK, good riddance.



With all do respect, if you don't find magic in the things that I cited, but do find it in a trash can, you don't get it. As for giving more than what I expect, I still get it when I go. Sometimes it is from a CM going above and beyond, sometimes it's a magic shot I didn't know existed, on this past trip I didn't know about the midday dance party till a photog was taking a pic of us and told us to hang around for 5 minutes, but showed us exactly where to stand. 10 minutes later, my kid was dancing with Woody and Jessie, a spontaneous, mind blowing event. The magic from the unknown still exists, it's just different.

So people can only find magic in what you say they can? Who cares if they found magic in the AK parade, you didn't like it, so good riddance.

Got it.

 

[BuzzinDownToDisney]

So people can only find magic in what you say they can? Who cares if they found magic in the AK parade, you didn't like it, so good riddance. Got it.

You could have read my follow up post where I stated that it stinks when something you find magic in gets eliminated, so you can either harbor a grudge against Disney or try to find something else that brings you happiness, but attacking is easier, I guess.

 

[TuneTownMagic]

I cannot speak for anyone else, but here's why I will at least make one more trip.

There was a skinny, four-eyed six-year old who had no friends. School was difficult for him, not because of academics, but because he was made fun of by everyone. He would come home every day and cry. He wanted a friend more than anything in the world.

One summer, his parents took him to Disney World. This was back in the mid 70's. There was just the Magic Kingdom. Things were different back then. Characters just roamed without any handlers, and they were not scheduled, so it was truly magic to run into them. (I understand why they don't do that anymore, though).

This kid and his parents ran into Donald Duck. Donald Duck took this kid by the hand and led him, skipping through the park. The child felt, for the first time in his life, like he had a friend, and he was happier than he had ever been.

In case you haven't figured it out, I was that kid. And as corny as it sounds, that magical moment changed my life, and really helped me come out of my shell.

I will come back to WDW, at least one more time, because when I go back, I still get as excited as I did as a six-year old. Just like that first time, I still sing "M-I-C-K-E-Y" when I see the sign saying "Welcome to Walt Disney World." But if I didn't have those magical experiences, and I made my first trip today, I don't think I'd ever want to come back.

That is an amazing and lovely memory . I love reading things like this on the Dis. I'm glad WDW impacted you in that way. That's an interesting point you make about perhaps not returning if your first trip was now. That certainly makes you think.

so you can either harbor a grudge against Disney or try to find something else that brings you happiness, but attacking is easier, I guess. ��

With all due respect, as a loyal Disney fan, I don't find it difficult to understand why people want to discuss what is going wrong with Disney for them...it's been pointed out on multiple threads that the forums are a place for information exchange and honest discussion about what's going on at a vacation destination that is beloved for BOTH people who are satisfied and those who are disenchanted. I don't know why having what I consider stimulating discussion on the changes happening in the parks has to be interpreted as bashing someone else's good time or holding a "grudge". I have yet to hear any of the people on this thread say there is nothing whatsoever magical about Disney anymore. I would bet many still appreciate something or other at the parks that means a lot to them. And no, "attacking", as you put it, is not easier (although that's not the word I would choose to describe this discussion). For people who have built years of memories at the parks and still love or like the place, it's not easy to acknowledge that it might not be worth returning to. If you are so against criticism of WDW, why not start a thread about magical moments instead of trying to stifle the voices of a topic you don't care for?

 

[JanaDee]

You could have read my follow up post where I stated that it stinks when something you find magic in gets eliminated, so you can either harbor a grudge against Disney or try to find something else that brings you happiness, but attacking is easier, I guess.

 

[mmafan]

I cannot speak for anyone else, but here's why I will at least make one more trip.

There was a skinny, four-eyed six-year old who had no friends. School was difficult for him, not because of academics, but because he was made fun of by everyone. He would come home every day and cry. He wanted a friend more than anything in the world.

One summer, his parents took him to Disney World. This was back in the mid 70's. There was just the Magic Kingdom. Things were different back then. Characters just roamed without any handlers, and they were not scheduled, so it was truly magic to run into them. (I understand why they don't do that anymore, though).

This kid and his parents ran into Donald Duck. Donald Duck took this kid by the hand and led him, skipping through the park. The child felt, for the first time in his life, like he had a friend, and he was happier than he had ever been.

In case you haven't figured it out, I was that kid. And as corny as it sounds, that magical moment changed my life, and really helped me come out of my shell.

I will come back to WDW, at least one more time, because when I go back, I still get as excited as I did as a six-year old. Just like that first time, I still sing "M-I-C-K-E-Y" when I see the sign saying "Welcome to Walt Disney World." But if I didn't have those magical experiences, and I made my first trip today, I don't think I'd ever want to come back.

..........

 

[flicx]

It used to be, "Give 'em MORE than they expect, and they will appreciate the difference."

Now it's becoming, "Give 'em LESS than they need, and they won't know the difference."

Very true and very sobering!

 

[ArwenMarie]

I'm heading to San Diego right after Thanksgiving and driving up to DL for two days with another couple. Never been there, so eager to see the 'mother land'! After that? Who knows. Lots of places to visit...probably won't be returning to WDW multiple times a year anymore.

That's sounds like a great trip! That is on my list to do, I love San Diego.

 

[Planogirl]

That's sounds like a great trip! That is on my list to do, I love San Diego.

After our trip, I decided that if money were no object then I'd want to move to San Diego. We enjoyed the perfect weather and overall beauty of the area. Plus it was nice to see the "real" Grand Floridian and I decided that that was where I would stay. Again if money were no object.

 

[1stvisit0909]

I understand that you have no empathy for anyone else's sense of loss. I just don't understand WHY. If you actually cared about the Disney experience, I'd think that you would be aware that at the rate they are cutting and reducing what makes WDW special, things that ARE important to you (or your son...) just might be on the cutting block in the coming months.

A 1000x this. One mans magic is another's "garbage can". We like the rides, dont even mind the changes. But some of the "little touches" can't have been that expensive, and they make people light up.

We loved PUSH. Not enough that we will swear off WDW, but I won't every forget my DD giggling over him dancing. It rates right up there with being family of the day at OKW and seeing her face light up when the bus driver makes the announcement about disney royalty when she's dressed as a princess. Or stopping to watch the ducks.

None of these things are "required" but they do add the little magic touches that stick with you forever.

 

[clsteve]

I cannot speak for anyone else, but here's why I will at least make one more trip.

There was a skinny, four-eyed six-year old who had no friends. School was difficult for him, not because of academics, but because he was made fun of by everyone. He would come home every day and cry. He wanted a friend more than anything in the world.

One summer, his parents took him to Disney World. This was back in the mid 70's. There was just the Magic Kingdom. Things were different back then. Characters just roamed without any handlers, and they were not scheduled, so it was truly magic to run into them. (I understand why they don't do that anymore, though).

This kid and his parents ran into Donald Duck. Donald Duck took this kid by the hand and led him, skipping through the park. The child felt, for the first time in his life, like he had a friend, and he was happier than he had ever been.

In case you haven't figured it out, I was that kid. And as corny as it sounds, that magical moment changed my life, and really helped me come out of my shell.

I will come back to WDW, at least one more time, because when I go back, I still get as excited as I did as a six-year old. Just like that first time, I still sing "M-I-C-K-E-Y" when I see the sign saying "Welcome to Walt Disney World." But if I didn't have those magical experiences, and I made my first trip today, I don't think I'd ever want to come back.

I just had to say thanks. What a beautiful post.

Some wonder why we still post on this board - why we're such Disney haters - and why don't we just go away and spend our vacation dollars elsewhere and stop complaining.

That post is why.

You see, we're hooked and we remember why we're hooked. Whatever that one thing was, it was magical.

Pixie dust comes in many forms - but it's still just as addictive.

But over a period of time, many of our special things have been diluted, watered down, become generic, or been taken away altogether.

And what really makes it so hard is that we know it doesn't have to be that way. Disney can, without a doubt, be a company that focuses on the bottom line, while also still providing that patented magic to all ages and genders - and get back to leading in quality and innovation like it used to.

But, that's up to them - we hope they still want to - hope they still can.

It's that hope that keeps us going back and also hanging around here like a bunch of addicts.

You see, we're just wanting and waiting for that level of Pixie Dust that got us hooked from the start. Nothing more than that - for me anyway

 

[cakebaker]

A 1000x this. One mans magic is another's "garbage can". We like the rides, dont even mind the changes. But some of the "little touches" can't have been that expensive, and they make people light up.

We loved PUSH. Not enough that we will swear off WDW, but I won't every forget my DD giggling over him dancing. It rates right up there with being family of the day at OKW and seeing her face light up when the bus driver makes the announcement about disney royalty when she's dressed as a princess. Or stopping to watch the ducks.

None of these things are "required" but they do add the little magic touches that stick with you forever.

I'm sorry my grandson will never get to see Push- he would've loved it!

You're right about the little things tho-

We got more excited about getting a bus driver who really talked on our busses a couple of times more than just about anything else. Having a real driver, making real time announcements is what allowed us to get to see Fantasmic and the Frozen fireworks. The recording didn't know they had added a 2nd Fantasmic that morning.

 

[iScrap]

My biggest issue with the changes is NOT that changes are being made, but that things are being eliminated and replaced with… NOTHING. Look at Epcot and all the empty buildings; Horizons replaced with nothing, Wonders of Life replaced with nothing (except the occasional party center). The Viking Ship in Norway is gone (and now Maelstrom, but at least something will replace it), acrobats in China, the masquerade characters in Italy, Miyoshi in Japan, living statues in France, Mo Rockin', Off Kilter (replaced with something that requires too large a venue to be done appropriately in that little spot). Does the Ooompah Band still play in the courtyard in Germany so everyone can Chicken Dance together? What happened to the Lights of Winter (or just the light arch that was there otherwise) and the fountain that danced to the music playing along with the water show? Tapestry of Nations? At one time, ALL of these were a part of Epcot. Now none (or almost none) are.

PP commented "Will they take the Castle away?" Actually, in a sense, they have. You used to be able to go IN the Castle, to walk through it from the hub to FL, see the beautiful mosaics on the wall. CRT used to have the FairyGodmother sitting in the lobby; queue up for a meet&greet while awaiting your meal… or if it wasn't busy, go meet the FG anyhow! The Castle Forecourt shows are fun, and a nice addition, but isn't there some other way to produce them than to close the Castle to visitors?

Look at how experiences in the restaurants have changed. Little things- venue-specific napkins, mickey-head butter pats, mickeyroni and cheese, etc.- have changed, food quality is lower, variety limited/offerings more generic, etc. All this adds up. DIsney USED to be able to give a terrific dining experience, but not anymore- and many believe it was in the chase for the dollar that the restaurants lost much of their individuality and quality. It's all about money.

Entertainment? I remember when live shows had pre-shows, actual entertainers to make the 30-60 minute wait pass more quickly. There were singers and jugglers at Fantasmic and 4-for-a-Dollar at Beauty & the Beast. The "counselors" at Camp Mickey-Minnie used to teach the crowd at Festival of the Lion King the hand-bop, so they could "play" along with Hakuna Matata. Why did all this end? Money.

It never surprised me that they closed PI; of course, during its heyday, I had small kids and didn't have the luxury of adult-only entertainment. Now I look at WDW when the parks closed and think "what do we do now?" We stayed on the Boardwalk last week and the Dance Hall was almost empty all the time, and JellyRolls? We listened to the off-key, lame singing from the 10 people inside and decided it wasn't worth the cover charge. While PI might have been TOO great an undertaking, some of it was popular; I'd love to experience the Adventurer's Club. I understand the business decision, but once again, Disney took away something to replace it with NOTHING.

AK? I remember when it opened. There was an amazing pre-park show ("The Awakening) that included about 20 dancers, dressed as different creatures and bugs, entertaining for the last 10 minutes before the park opened. Just inside the ticket stalls there were CMs with cages of all kinds of interesting bugs, small amphibians or reptiles, etc., (NOT MY THING, btw) to entertain and educate the kids. There were CMs stationed along the Discovery Trails on the way to the Bridge across the river, to talk about the animals lining the pathways, as well as some stationed on the paths around the Tree of Life, to explain what all these animals were, their lifestyles, habitats, etc. Is any of this still there, or has it all been eliminated- not replaced by new, exciting, updated things, but gone, to save money?

Many "newer" DIsney fans whine because the "old timers" complain, but I am lamenting the things that have been LOST and not replaced in any way, shape, or form. It's not this little thing or that… it's ALL the little things adding up, being replace with NOTHING. More money, less value. In the past, I always felt like Disney wanted to be the industry leader in giving people more than expected- more experiences, more opportunities, more entertainment, more customer service, more value and worth- than any other company in the industry. They prided themselves on giving the guest MORE than they'd dreamed possible. Now they just take more away, take more money, take more happiness. It's sad...

Very well said and I completely agree. I miss the little things that used to make Disney magical and different from other amusement parks. Those magical little details are disappearing a little more each year and the parks are becoming a little less appealing with each visit for me. It really makes me sad. I suspect that our visits will happen less often and that we'll branch out and try some new attractions when we travel to Orlando.