Question about Tithing

[Galahad]

We are Methodists. I have heard two discussions of tithing by two different pastors that I thought were interesting. The first was an explanation that interprets the specific text of the Bible in the context of the time it was written. I don't remember the details of the logic, but the upshot was that tithing doesn't mean 10% each and every year but a number that is somewhat lower than than given what it meant to harvest, store, process etc. the grain and livestock that people lived on in those days. The second was more persuasive and what we tend to do. the 10% figure does not need to be taken to mean 10% to your church specifically. We give about 17% or so of our total gross income each year in charity. That includes what we give to our church, but the amount we give to our church is less than 10%. This does not include our volunteer time of course. All-in-all I'm fairly certain God probably hasn't put us in a "does-not-tithe" database.

 

[jimmiej]

I'm Southern Baptist. We teach that tithing is an act of obedience to God. God expects it. It's a sign of spiritual maturity. It's an investment in your eternal future. It should come off the top (before anything else is paid). Anyone seeking membership in our church is told this. We back up those statements with scripture. They are also told that the decision whether to tithe or not is between them & God. The only time our ministers inquire about someone's giving is when they are being looked at for a leadership position (deacon, teacher, etc.). They simply ask if person X gives consistently. I know this because DW is our assistant finance officer.

That being said, our church falls in line (like many others I assume) with Pareto's Principle - The 80-20 Rule. 80% of the money (and effort) is given by 20% of the people.

I must also add that DW & I were Christians for many years before we realized the blessing of tithing.

Below are a few passages re: tithing/giving from the OT & NT (including the words of Jesus).

Proverbs 2

9 Honor the LORD with your wealth,
with the firstfruits of all your crops;

10 then your barns will be filled to overflowing,
and your vats will brim over with new wine.

Malachi 3:7-9

7 Ever since the time of your forefathers you have turned away from my decrees and have not kept them. Return to me, and I will return to you," says the LORD Almighty.
"But you ask, 'How are we to return?'

8 "Will a man rob God? Yet you rob me.
"But you ask, 'How do we rob you?'
"In tithes and offerings. 9 You are under a curse—the whole nation of you—because you are robbing me.

Matthew 23:23

23"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cummin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former.

Matthew 6
Treasures in Heaven

19"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
22"The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are good, your whole body will be full of light. 23But if your eyes are bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!

24"No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.

Do Not Worry
25"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? 26Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? 27Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?
28"And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. 29Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 30If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. 33But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

Luke 6

38Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

 

[DisneyMomx7]

Sorry but I can't see how giving money is an investment in my eternal future.

I think how I treat others and conduct myself is my investment in my eternal future.

JMHO but I would never belong to any church or religion who felt they were entitled to see DH's paycheck or our tax returns. To me that's not what religion is all about. Yes, I know the practicalities and I believe people should give what they feel they can afford and are comfortable with. However, I would not have my children go without necessities or education in order to give to any church, and I just don't believe God would require that. I donate heavily to what I feel are good causes, (CHildren's cancer foundations, Make a Wish, Habitat for Humanity etc). I like choosing which organizations I feel could make best use of the money.

 

[Disney Doll]

I give what I can afford, which s not 10% of my income. I am catholic.

I do have colleagues who are Pentecostal and they do give 10% of their gross income. I have discussed this with them, asked them what happens if they can't afford to pay a bill or buy food because they are tithing 10% and they tell me God will provide.

It is a very strong faith.

 

[Lewski709]

I'm Catholic and have never known of a Catholic church who didn't insist on tithing and have always heard of the 10% suggested rule. I was surprised you hadn't heard of this before. The most I give is $25.00/week. According to them and what I should be tithing, it's more than that. They say what you give comes back twofold. I just am too frugal to give more than I do.

 

[Michelina]

I'm Catholic and I've never heard tithing mentioned at the church I grew up in or at the one I'm currently attending. They pass down the basket and some people use envelopes but we don't. When we joined this church, they asked in our membership application whether or not we wanted envelopes. I checked no cause I figured why waste paper? I just throw in $10 or $20 for me and DH.

 

[DisneyMomx7]

I'm Catholic and have never known of a Catholic church who didn't insist on tithing and have always heard of the 10% suggested rule. I was surprised you hadn't heard of this before. The most I give is $25.00/week. According to them and what I should be tithing, it's more than that. They say what you give comes back twofold. I just am too frugal to give more than I do.

Maybe it's a regional thing. It seems the Catholic churches in NJ and PA don't do tithing. I never even heard of it until I came to these boards. As I said before we give what we feel is proper - no one is telling us what we should give.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I wonder how they track mine and DH's attendance? We get envelopes every two months. When they arrive, I write the amount for each and then send them all in the mail with one check. This is how a large part (per our church) of our members do it. I know that when both DH and I were confirmation sponsors, we got our letters.

Someone painstakingly goes in and records the envelope from the mass collections.

It is so annoying. I mean--what really stops someone from just walking in, handing an envelope to an usher and leaving.

I think it is ludicrous---I can't ever remember the envelope (and yes, you must use the envelope)--and the priest sees me each week and knows me (from ministry work). We've opted to homeschool, so it is a non-issue...but I just always thought the attendance recording was a bit silly.

And yes--even if you can't put a check in one week, they would like you to turn in an empty envelope .

The attendance is how they know you are a parishioner for the parishioner rate. A simple parish registration by itself does not suffice.

 

[jimmiej]

Sorry but I can't see how giving money is an investment in my eternal future.

"Giving money" isn't...being obedient to God is.

Matthew 6
Treasures in Heaven

19"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

I think how I treat others and conduct myself is my investment in my eternal future.

Ephesians 2
Made Alive in Christ
1As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath. 4But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

I do have colleagues who are Pentecostal and they do give 10% of their gross income. I have discussed this with them, asked them what happens if they can't afford to pay a bill or buy food because they are tithing 10% and they tell me God will provide.

Luke 6

38Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

Matthew 6

25"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? 26Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? 27Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?

 

[Lyn5]

They pass down the basket and some people use envelopes but we don't.

I am Catholic also and we have collections done at mass. Our family gives what we choose to give to the church and we donate to other worthy organizations also. I once went to a Protestant function with a college roommate and it was quite interesting, when they were about to pass around the basket the service leader made it clear that you could give what you wanted and if you were in need you could take out money. I thought that was very cool.

But, I have to agree with DisneyMomx7 that maybe not all organizations are on the up and up. We have a local church were some members voluntarily and some members are pressured to give the 10%. Which for me is difficult to grasp when their leader and his wife have a BMW and multimillion dollar homes. Now, I don’t think that a leader should live in poverty by any means, but it seems that he/she should not have their followers live in poverty while they have a luxurious lifestyle. Our priest has a nice home next to one of our churches on the church grounds and when the parish purchased a new station wagon for him, I thought that was fine since it was something that would be reliable for him and the church was o.k. with buying it for him. He is someone I feel is really leading the flock by his own example. Had he gotten a Hummer, I would have thought twice about what I put in the basket....

 

[Cindy B]

The LDS isn't the only one that is vigiliante about money.

Our former church, not only required tithing --they also had statements, but also a "special contribution" twice a year which equaled a 25-35% percent of your weekly tithe.

So, you already tithe.. then the special contribution comes along. Of course the special contribution was never enough then it was "Pay brothers and sisters until it hurts".

Then we found out that the main minister was pulling in a six figure income (for a 1000 member church), and his spouse, yes, the spouse had a 50-60K income for only "part time". Plus the minister had two homes in very affluent areas.

And yes we were strongarmed for the money as well. We were told we weren't right in Gods eyes if we didn't give, and that we would go to the place where there would be an account if we didn't give, (basically twisted the scriptures to what they wanted ) and that we could get kicked out of this "true church" if we didn't give.

SO, no, its not only the LDS.

 

[disykat]

I also agree that "where your treasure is, there your heart will be also", so I think it's important to give and to give sacrificially. I would not go to a church, however, that required giving.

As far as the giving of professional talents - most nonprofits will give a reciept showing your hourly rate that you wrote off that you can use as a tax deduction.

 

[lbgraves]

I have been raised in the Catholic Church and attended Catholic school for 10 years. I know that most months my parents gave $20 to the church just so that it was something. I write a check quarterly for our offering. I don't use the checkbook much now & it is just a pain to write out lots of little checks each week or month. The pastor knows when we are there. The main thing for him is attendance, not money. Before you can have a child receive the sacraments your family has to be a regular member of the Church attending Mass.

 

[mickeyfan2]

When we were renting a home, we attended a church that we did not join, since we knew we would only stay for a while. We were saving to build a home in a another town and would attend a different church. We did go and did hand in checks. On day we got a letter from the priest that said he heard we were donating and not a member. Would we like to join, so we did. We moved a lot in our early marriage and never joined any. We joined our new church as soon as we moved into the new home.