Problem in education

[chicagodisneyfan]

Are you serious? Those children can learn how to do other things that help with daily living or help them adapt to their disability. Some of them can learn some math and reading, etc but it takes a bit more.

Learning to do things that help with daily living - sounds like a rehab center to me .... not a school.

 

[Goofyluver]

Not at all. Children from two-parent families outperform those from single parent families, unless the household income is equivilant (meaning the single parent would have to earn as much as a two-parent household - not likely).

This is a not bash on single parents. It's just true. Especially in inner city areas.

I seem to remember someone on TV in the last few days...sorta sayin' the same things...

That's a very narrow-minded view, and doesn't take into account confounding variables that exist in many families.

Signed,

Jen/Single Mom

 

[chicagodisneyfan]

Hey...maybe you should fight to change the laws. You know...the ones that grant an education to them "children with disabilities".



When we really all know...there ain't no hope for a...what didja call 'em? That's right...the "mentally retarded". Them kiddos can't learn.

For the record I called no one mentally retarded - that was a direct quote from Time Magazine, August 2007.

 

[portocall]

Teaching to a test...
Removing funding from a poorly performing school.

Look, I agree that throwing money to a poor school won't solve a thing, however, if the resources are targeted (and in some cases, specific teacher's and admin removed) I believe they could start to show improvement.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Trying to bring up to or keep every student at the same standard regardless of ability.

Your answer was shorter than my rant but this is shorter and what the major problem is in a nutshell.

 

[Feralpeg]

I know this will not be a popular opinion. I feel the biggest problem is parents who have so over done the "my kid is special" thing that the kids think they are above learning. When I was teaching, the kids had the attitude that they didn't have to do anything because life would always be good to them. Their parents told them they are wonderful and everyone else would think so and treat them accordingly. I think parents need to let their kids realize that life means facing hardships and working for what they want.

 

[smartestnumber5]

Not at all. Children from two-parent families outperform those from single parent families, unless the household income is equivilant (meaning the single parent would have to earn as much as a two-parent household - not likely).

This is a not bash on single parents. It's just true. Especially in inner city areas.

Don't you see a correlation/causation problem with the way you've presented things--originally saying "single parents" are the problem?

As you've said it's not being a single parent that leads to poor performance. It is low income.

Low incomes (whether single parents, two parents, three parents, etc are the problem) are what's doing the causation here.

It has a very different ring to it when you make the causation/correlation distinction.

If there's simply something magic about being raised by one parent instead of two then no amount of money would make a difference. The only solution would be to add another parent to the household. But since it's not the number of parents that is causal, but the money, then other solutions are available (like injecting more money into single parent households).

 

[Goofyluver]

For the record I called no one mentally retarded - that was a direct quote from Time Magazine, August 2007.

Well, that makes the rest of your posts here just fine then.

Even where you insinuated that these children are incapable of learning and that the school system is acting as a babysitter.



And why did you edit out the rest of my post?

Did it bother you that I speak from experience? Does it bother you that I take issue with your statements because my child is disabled?

Are you willing to tell my son that you think he shouldn't be able to go to school? That they're doing nothing but babysitting anyways? That he should go to a rehab center?

You seemed pretty adament in your earlier statements.

 

[Alyssa88]

I'd need to see a link to substantiate that claim. Schools in more affluent areas tend to do better because there are more two parent homes and the parents have a higher level of education. This isn't rocket science. Boards of education spend as much or more on underperforming schools as they do on those that perform well. Until we recognize that socioeconomics and lack of parental guidance at home are a large function of the success of education, we will continue to throw money in the pit...

Of coutrse those things effect their education but there is definitely a lack of funding for these areas. Schools around here do not have recent textbooks that they can bring home. They also don't have things like doors on all bathroom stalls. I have been inside a few inner city schools and they are so much worse than the any of the schools I attended.

The lack of guidance is mostly due to single parents who have to work. While that (as well as safety issues, peer issues, etc) plays a role, it is quite obvious that these schools are not receiving near as much, and it hinders potential.

I provided the website, but I cannot link it (on my phone). I think its teachforamerica.com, but if you google teach for america you can find it.

 

[RadioNate]

Special education does cost districts a great deal of money. However, disabled children are every bit as entitled to an education as abled children. Schools should be funded such that all children are getting an appropriate education. Years ago, children with special needs where simply warehoused. Thank goodness there is some improvement, but there's a long way to go.

It's funny how adequately funding education is so often termed "throwing money at it." The day we view adequately funding the military as "throwing money at it" is the day that argument is worthy of consideration.

The problem is that public schools nearly always spend more per student than private schools so more money isn't necessarily the answer.

I really believe it boils down to parents. When you choose to pay for your child's education you are more involved. You are invested. That isn't to say that all public school parents don't care (my school aged child goes to public school) obviously many do but in 'failing schools' I'd bet you see a lot less parent involvement.

 

[disneyjunkie]

I seem to remember someone on TV in the last few days...sorta sayin' the same things...

That's a very narrow-minded view, and doesn't take into account confounding variables that exist in many families.

Signed,

Jen/Single Mom

Can I add my name?

LaTanya/ Single Mom and we live in the inner city

My son is an honor student senior ( a real one ), his SAT scores are awesome. He started taking the SATs in the 7th grade in order to take part in the John Hopkins Talented Youth Program. He scored high enough to spend that summer taking a Biology class in PA.

College acceptance letters should be coming in pretty soon.

 

[Pigeon]

The problem is that public schools nearly always spend more per student than private schools so more money isn't necessarily the answer.

I really believe it boils down to parents. When you choose to pay for your child's education you are more involved. You are invested. That isn't to say that all public school parents don't care (my school aged child goes to public school) obviously many do but in 'failing schools' I'd bet you see a lot less parent involvement.

Public schools have to teach the children who live in the district. All the children, including the special ed kids, the gang bangers, the discipline problems. Private schools do not. They don't have to take any special ed kids (and often they don't), and they don't have to abide by a host of other regulations that public schools have to follow. It's apples to oranges.

 

[chicagodisneyfan]

Did it bother you that I speak from experience? Does it bother you that I take issue with your statements because my child is disabled?

Are you willing to tell my son that you think he shouldn't be able to go to school? That they're doing nothing but babysitting anyways? That he should go to a rehab center?

You seemed pretty adament in your earlier statements.

The only thing I know about you is that you are a single parent raising a child with disabilities. I have no idea whether or not your son is capable of learning.

However, can he learn the appropriate things to move to the next grade? Can he do math, memorize history facts, write papers, read short stories (depending on grade of course). If not, I stand by my statement that he does NOT belong in school.

As regards to rehab - if someone needs life skills or to be taught how to live with their disability - thats what rehab is for. That is not for a public school to teach.

 

[Goofyluver]

Can I add my name?

LaTanya/ Single Mom and we live in the inner city

My son is an honor student senior ( a real one ), his SAT scores are awesome. He started taking the SATs in the 7th grade in order to take part in the John Hopkins Talented Youth Program. He scored high enough to spend that summer taking a Biology class in PA.

College acceptance letters should be coming in pretty soon.

Pssssst...congratulations to you and that kid o' yours.

 

[chobie]

The problem is that public schools nearly always spend more per student than private schools so more money isn't necessarily the answer.

I really believe it boils down to parents. When you choose to pay for your child's education you are more involved. You are invested. That isn't to say that all public school parents don't care (my school aged child goes to public school) obviously many do but in 'failing schools' I'd bet you see a lot less parent involvement.

Does that number per child factor in special education? I'm all for IDEA, but it is, for the most part, an unfunded mandate. If the amount per student just takes all the money spent and divides by the amount of students, then it is an unfair comparison to private schools who do not have the expense of special ed (Yes, I think all children should get a free and appropriate education), but the one poster is right --special ed is expensive.

 

[disneyjunkie]

The only thing I know about you is that you are a single parent raising a child with disabilities. I have no idea whether or not your son is capable of learning.

However, can he learn the appropriate things to move to the next grade? Can he do math, memorize history facts, write papers, read short stories (depending on grade of course). If not, I stand by my statement that he does NOT belong in school.

As regards to rehab - if someone needs life skills or to be taught how to live with their disability - thats what rehab is for. That is not for a public school to teach.

Unbelievable

 

[perla75]

Maybe I'm biased because I am a public educator, but the biggest issue in my town?

MONEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Our students lose out of alot & my special education kids do NOT get the services they should have because my school system just does not have the money to do it. Very frustrating to me....

 

[minnieandmickey]

lack of parent involvement
lack of parental support
parents undermining teachers
lack of respect for teachers by students and parents
standardized testing
NCLB
schools being glorified day cares
people relying on schools for children's basic needs (food, clothes)
teachers have to continually discipline instead of teach
disillusioned teachers
teaching to the test
helicopter parents

shall I go on????

How about the fact that Education is the first thing cut in a State Budget.
Seems to be my Govenators favorite thing to do. Then of course there is NCLB, good program if the Government had actually given schools funds to run it correctly. But as always it's a you must do this and figure out how to pay for it.
My teachers have made comments that they are not teaching anymore, they are test tutors.

Parents, parents, parents.

Look at how many threads are on the DIS - all complaining about teachers, schools, policies. They act like schools should exist only for them.

Then at the opposite end of the spectrum are the parents who do not care at all.


Secondly - Special Ed is killing the schools. That is the reason most kids I know go to private schools - no special ed kids - they use an incredible amount of resources.

How so?
From Time 2007 - American schools spend more than $8 billion a year educating the mentally retarded. Spending on the gifted isn't even tabulated in some states, but by the most generous calculation, we spend no more than $800 million on gifted programs.

Go to the disabilities board - see what some of the parents speak of - children who will never learn to read or write or do simple math. Yet they go to school with all sorts of taxpayer funded aides. What exactly are they being educated in?

The number of aides, the special accommodations, the distractions to other students - all of those have a large cost.

Public schools are failing the average and above average child.

First of all there are different degrees of Mental Retardation. My child is mild mental retarded and she has the ability to learn, maybe a heck of a lot slower than your "gifted" child, but she can. She is now in high school and part of the curriculum is job and life skills, you know so that she can actually go out and be a productive part of society. With your posts it sounds as if we should go back to the 50's and put these children back into asylums. Lucky for you ignorance isn't seen as a disability.

 

[CowboyCO]

I seem to remember someone on TV in the last few days...sorta sayin' the same things...

That's a very narrow-minded view, and doesn't take into account confounding variables that exist in many families.

Signed,

Jen/Single Mom

Hi Jen --

My comments were not that all children of single parents will underperform. It's not narrow-minded. There are many variables that children of single parents have to overcome in order to succed (again - not all). Income, Time with parent. School involvement. Level of education. And maybe most important - Supervision and guidance of the child. If a parent has to work 12-8, who is with the child in the afternoon and evening? If the parent has to work from 3-11, can they sit and do homework with their child?

There are plenty of children from one-parent families that succeed, but there are many more who do not when compared to two-parent families.

Being PC, saying that it doesn't matter won't help and there isn't a solution. Children out of wedlock is rising like the needle on Oprah's scale. Divorce is too. But, unlike Oprah, the needle won't go back down.

If you are the single parent of child that's doing great -- fantastic!

 

[Goofyluver]

The only thing I know about you is that you are a single parent raising a child with disabilities. I have no idea whether or not your son is capable of learning.

However, can he learn the appropriate things to move to the next grade? Can he do math, memorize history facts, write papers, read short stories (depending on grade of course). If not, I stand by my statement that he does NOT belong in school.

As regards to rehab - if someone needs life skills or to be taught how to live with their disability - thats what rehab is for. That is not for a public school to teach.

I'll tell ya' a little bit more about me. I'm an SLP that has worked in special education for years. Kiddos like this, are my life both at work and at home.

And I'll answer your questions.

Can he do math? A bit. But he is years behind grade level. And he has peaked in his learning. He will probably NOT progress beyond where he is now.

Can he memorize history facts? Sometimes. We never know what does and does not stick. There's no rhyme or reason to disabilities honey.

Can he write papers? No.

Can he read short stories? Yes. Years behind grade level.

He's in 7th grade and is functioning on a 2nd grade level. And he has essentially stopped progressing.

Now whatcha think?

Are you going to break it to him or not?