PM EMH drops from THREE Hours to TWO Hours

[Violet Parr]

I don't think that this is happening because they are complacent because it is difficult to find rooms as someone said earlier. I just checked Expedia for two weeks from now. Rooms are available for 9 nights at CR, Poly, BW, YC, AK, BC, WL, CSR, PO, FW, Pop, ASports and CBR. (Sorry for the abbreviations but it's way too much typing otherwise. ) That's in just two weeks! The prices are crazy for some (the Contemporary for $508 a night - really?!) but that's another topic.

I bet that we'll continue to see these changes, one at a time, as they gear up for NexGen.

That might not be an indication of the general sales trend at WDW resorts. Expedia gets blocks of rooms. They don't reflect WDW direct bookings. So all of those resorts might be unavailable via CRO as they are fully booked there, and only the blocks of Expedia resorts remain. At this point, I think even most Disney newbies check WDW's website first for bookings.

VP

 

[Violet Parr]

i'm guessing it will cover costs on aoa, fl expansion and the complete re-furbs at resorts like por.

I don't think they are trying to cut costs, more like cover costs.

bingo.

 

[KellyNY]

What tactic? You said what you said, now you deny your own words, or you did not mean it back then?

Here, I am not good with quotes, but this is your post, you can check it, "Absolutely Unacceptable" thread, post#456.

I would want prior notice and the choice..

I've made no bones about it, if not for a non refundable deposit and disappointing my grandkids..we wouldn't be going this year. I'm not happy with the current management or the trend..

We normally visit, at least, twice a year, but after our spring trip (been booked, over a year)...no future plans. We've reached, the tipping point. We'd already cut back on dining. The quality and menu choices have decreased, but prices have increased. The merchandise is generic..half of MK is under tarp or closed...shows reduced, etc., etc.

So what changed your mind, considering your complains about Disney are strong as they used to be?

If that bright blue part was what she said, then there is nothing in there about not going back. I've actually seen her say at least once previous to this thread that they were cutting back from multiple trips per year, but never that she wasn't going back.

Check the bolded part, I do not know how else you can understand "no future plans". And this brings me to my original question, if she reached her tipping point with Disney and said "no future plans", why to plan another trip right away to the place that makes you so unhappy, which is clear from constant complains.

 

[Violet Parr]

This isn't really about whether other people will still come or not, it is about how it will affect the thousands of people who rely or count on evening EMH.

I'm not sure how any traveler can RELY on what amounts to one hour (maybe 2) on an entire trip. Most trips are 4-5 days. (Our family usually goes 10-13 days, but I know that most trips are about half that.) So if the average trip is 5 days, then just how many of your waking vacation hours are spent at a 3rd hour of evening EMH? One? Two?

So I guess I'm having a hard time understanding how this is such a big loss. It's a change, yes. But it is a truly relatively minor change. If only 25% of Disney onsite resort guests actually use EMH, and those guests go to 2 evening EMH during the course of one trip every 3 years (I'm thinking that the majority of Disney travelers do it just once or twice. DISers are not the norm) then what are we talking about here? A very small fraction of people attending evening EMH, and on top of that, most of THOSE people leave by the 3rd hour.

I just don't see how anyone can RELY on that 3rd hour. Not trying to be snarky. I just really don't see how it can be so vital. In 4 trips, I've never done EMH once, and I don't think I lost anything. The perks to staying onsite were still well worth the costs for our family.


VP

 

[MissMouseInTheHouse2]

I sincerely hope that it only lasts for the "low season". The really late PM EMH were one of my favorite parts of WDW. But i guess that 1 hour shorter isn't so bad...

 

[Colleen27]

I just read a quote on Touringplans that suggested that 75% of all onsite guests DON'T EVEN USE EMH.

So that said, are they really cutting away at something? If so few people use it?

That's interesting, since their best/worst days rely on (among other things) the premise that EMH days are more crowded because on-site guests who aren't familiar with WDW take them as recommendations on which parks to go to on each day. That's why ALL the big planning sites recommend avoiding EMH days in most cases... not because they're poorly attended but because the larger-than-average share of onsite guests make the EMH park busier than on days with shorter hours.

 

[Violet Parr]

That's interesting, since their best/worst days rely on (among other things) the premise that EMH days are more crowded because on-site guests who aren't familiar with WDW take them as recommendations on which parks to go to on each day. That's why ALL the big planning sites recommend avoiding EMH days in most cases... not because they're poorly attended but because the larger-than-average share of onsite guests make the EMH park busier than on days with shorter hours.

Right, I thought it was interesting for that reason as well. But I think their premise isn't that EMH are crowded, it's that parks without them are LESS crowded. It doesn't necessarily stand to reason that there are a ton of people at the EMH parks. It's just that there are fewer people at the non-EMH parks.

Anyway, just reporting what I read.

VP

 

[Colleen27]

Most trips are 4-5 days. (Our family usually goes 10-13 days, but I know that most trips are about half that.) So if the average trip is 5 days, then just how many of your waking vacation hours are spent at a 3rd hour of evening EMH? One? Two?

So I guess I'm having a hard time understanding how this is such a big loss.

Quality, not quantity. Looking back at my Mar '11 TR, in the last hour (1 to 2am) on our MK day we rode Space, the Tea Cups, Dumbo twice, Peter Pan, Small World, and Snow White. 8 rides in an hour. There is no other time of day, not even at rope drop, that you can do that. Probably 90% of the time we spend in Fantasyland is during that last hour of EMH because it is the only time that the slow-loading kiddie rides don't have long waits, even in the off-season.

At the other parks they could do away with EMH altogether and it wouldn't effect us at all. Epcot EMH was so disappointing on our last trip (all the good drink stops closed, 40-50min waits at both headliners) that we'd never do it again anyway, and Studios EMH seldom goes late enough into the night to offer any real thinning of the crowds, and when AK had evening EMH we weren't especially impressed because so much of the park still closed early because of the animals. But that one ultra-late night at the Magic Kingdom on each trip has been the setting for many of our very best Disney memories.

 

[Violet Parr]

Quality, not quantity. Looking back at my Mar '11 TR, in the last hour (1 to 2am) on our MK day we rode Space, the Tea Cups, Dumbo twice, Peter Pan, Small World, and Snow White. 8 rides in an hour. There is no other time of day, not even at rope drop, that you can do that. Probably 90% of the time we spend in Fantasyland is during that last hour of EMH because it is the only time that the slow-loading kiddie rides don't have long waits, even in the off-season.

At the other parks they could do away with EMH altogether and it wouldn't effect us at all. Epcot EMH was so disappointing on our last trip (all the good drink stops closed, 40-50min waits at both headliners) that we'd never do it again anyway, and Studios EMH seldom goes late enough into the night to offer any real thinning of the crowds, and when AK had evening EMH we weren't especially impressed because so much of the park still closed early because of the animals. But that one ultra-late night at the Magic Kingdom on each trip has been the setting for many of our very best Disney memories.

I completely disagree with the above statement in bold. We've done that much (except Dumbo twice...only do it once) and it was not between 1 and 2 am. We use touringplans, the crowd calendar, etc, and we've done that much on quite a few occasions. I'm not trying to sound competitive here, but doing rope drop and hitting the parks on the quietest weeks of the year, and that's been totally possible for us. Granted, we arrive at rope drop and do Dumbo first and fast and are usually on the first group on that ride (thankfully, that's no longer necessary!) and we get in Peter Pan twice, Small World, Winnie the Pooh, Snow White, tea cups, Cindy's carousel, and then we hit the opening of Toontown and ride Barnstormer (or do Space Mountain or HM.) That's about the same amount of stuff.

I'm sure there are others who can attest to having done that much during the day. It's not as easy as it was in 2005 or 2007, admittedly, but it is do-able with the right touring plan combo, rope drop, and FP use.

VP

 

[Rip]

Check the bolded part, I do not know how else you can understand "no future plans". And this brings me to my original question, if she reached her tipping point with Disney and said "no future plans", why to plan another trip right away to the place that makes you so unhappy, which is clear from constant complains.

I did, and I take that as "I haven't made any future plans". That in no way means "I'll never go back", especially in the context of the rest of her statements. It means "I made specific plans (with my grandkids) for this trip, but I'm not making anything else definite at the moment."

I myself have "no future plans". I will go back again, but I have no specific plans as to when or why.

 

[Rip]

I'm not sure how any traveler can RELY on what amounts to one hour (maybe 2) on an entire trip. Most trips are 4-5 days. (Our family usually goes 10-13 days, but I know that most trips are about half that.) So if the average trip is 5 days, then just how many of your waking vacation hours are spent at a 3rd hour of evening EMH? One? Two?

So I guess I'm having a hard time understanding how this is such a big loss. It's a change, yes. But it is a truly relatively minor change. If only 25% of Disney onsite resort guests actually use EMH, and those guests go to 2 evening EMH during the course of one trip every 3 years (I'm thinking that the majority of Disney travelers do it just once or twice. DISers are not the norm) then what are we talking about here? A very small fraction of people attending evening EMH, and on top of that, most of THOSE people leave by the 3rd hour.

I just don't see how anyone can RELY on that 3rd hour. Not trying to be snarky. I just really don't see how it can be so vital. In 4 trips, I've never done EMH once, and I don't think I lost anything. The perks to staying onsite were still well worth the costs for our family.


VP

It's a 33.33333333 (etc) % cut for those that do use it. I don't do the dining plan, and I wish they'd eliminate it and actually start serving a variety of good food. Imagine the howling you'd hear if they did.

 

[Violet Parr]

It's a 33.33333333 (etc) % cut for those that do use it. I don't do the dining plan, and I wish they'd eliminate it and actually start serving a variety of good food. Imagine the howling you'd hear if they did.

No, it's not a 33.3333333% cut into your entire vacation time. Unless you have a 3 hour vacation.

Not sure I understand the dining plan analogy. But to be fair, it is late, and I am not sure I understand why I'm still awake.

VP

 

[Cyrano]

Folks this is a gentle reminder to keep this discussion on topic in relation to EMH.
Dining references have no place on TPAS

 

[Rip]

No, it's not a 33.3333333% cut into your entire vacation time. Unless you have a 3 hour vacation.

Not sure I understand the dining plan analogy. But to be fair, it is late, and I am not sure I understand why I'm still awake.

VP

I never said it was a 33.3% cut into my entire vacation time.

 

[KellyNY]

I did, and I take that as "I haven't made any future plans". That in no way means "I'll never go back", especially in the context of the rest of her statements. It means "I made specific plans (with my grandkids) for this trip, but I'm not making anything else definite at the moment."

I myself have "no future plans". I will go back again, but I have no specific plans as to when or why.

That is not how it was said, when other people were asking why to even go if having such issues with Disney, the answer was she would even cancel this trip since she reached her tipping point, if not for deposit and kids, and since it was said many times in response to different people on different threads it speaks for itself. And since words and actions do not match it is difficult to take such comments anything but spreading negativity, which we do not need on Disney board where people come looking for help with their plans and to share their love for Disney. Discussing particular problems and situations helps, stating that everything is bad, calling CEO names, yet keep going, does not help anyone. I am not saying it is just her but it became a theme on board and it is very sad.

As for actual topic of this thread, obviously some people are upset but since it is only 1 or 2 hours out of entire trip, I do not see it as a such a big issue. And while everyone is free to do whatever works for them, moving offsite and loosing remaining lets say 10 hours of EMH whe it is so important for person, does not really make sense to me.

 

[Violet Parr]

I never said it was a 33.3% cut into my entire vacation time.

No, but you said that in response to my post wondering why it was such a loss when it represents such a small fraction of one's ENTIRE vacation time.

I just think the outcry of "they're cutting perks left and right" is a little extreme here when such a small, small fraction of guests use it (by the users own admission) and when it isn't a full elimination of EMH. It's a great perk for those who use it ,I'm sure, but

well, I just don't see how it's that big of a deal. MHO.

VP

 

[Robo]

Nothing is ever a big deal if that loss is something you don't use.

Those who don't like Fantasmic! saw no loss in DHS cutting performances to 2-3 per week last year.

 

[mom2rtk]

Nothing is ever a big deal if that loss is something you don't use.

Those who don't like Fantasmic! saw no loss in DHS cutting performances to 2-3 per week last year.

Great point! That's exactly how I felt about it. In fact I loved that cutback because it made it easier to identify lower crowd days.

 

[Violet Parr]

Nothing is ever a big deal if that loss is something you don't use.

Those who don't like Fantasmic! saw no loss in DHS cutting performances to 2-3 per week last year.

I've never seen Fantasmic, but I tnink that is somewhat more legitimate complaint. Again, if a trip is only 5 days, it could be very hard to get to see Fantasmic at all if it is only a few days a week.

But you know, even if they cut Fantasmic completely, I just don't think I could get too upset, even if I LOVED it, because things change, ya know? Sometimes it's a bummer when things we like are gone, but sometimes it's the only way to make way for newer, better things.

 

[stitchrulz]

Folks this is a gentle reminder to keep this discussion on topic in relation to EMH.
Dining references have no place on TPAS

I think the poster was just trying to make the point that in reference to the EMH's, many posters repeatedly use the reasoning that I don't use them, anyway, and therefore it's perfectly all right by them if they go away. They continue to state that it's no big deal and seem to insist that those who do view this as a concern are somehow completely wrong. This comes across as pretty rude to those who DO think it's important as their feelings and concerns continue to be diminshed and disrespected. That's the frustration. This issue is very subjective, after all. So yes, some don't care, some care very much, and both views are o.k.

The reference to the dining plan, I believe, was simply to put the shoe on the other foot to perhaps get them to think how they would feel if something they did care about (since they don't care about the EMH)were eliminated. I don't think the intention was to discuss the dining plan per se or to take the thread off-topic.