Please help us decide if DVC is right for us

[Deb & Bill]

...Another thing to think of if you decide to go with the cheaper resort like SSR is the exportation date . OKW will expire sooner then SSR . Cause all dvc resorts are 50 year contract from there opening date . This is the reason I bought SSR over others , cheap pp and less dues then others , that were avalable .

You can find an OKW contract that expires in 2057 if you look. DVC offered OKW owners the opportunity to extend to 2057 for $15 a point a few years back. We didn't take that offere because I won't see those years.

 

[Missyrose]

I dont plan on using my membership exclusivly to stay at disney . In my later years(50's) I am sure I wont want to do to disney I wil take advantage of rci .

I just want to make sure you and other people reading along know that being able to trade out through RCI is a perk that Disney can take away at any time. When deciding whether DVC is right for you, you really need to figure out if you'll use you points at DVC resorts because that is where the real value is.



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[BestDadEver]

You can find an OKW contract that expires in 2057 if you look. DVC offered OKW owners the opportunity to extend to 2057 for $15 a point a few years back. We didn't take that offere because I won't see those years.

Forgot they extended just trying to make the point ,that the experation is something you should consider when buying .

I just want to make sure you and other people reading along know that being able to trade out through RCI is a perk that Disney can take away at any time. When deciding whether DVC is right for you, you really need to figure out if you'll use you points at DVC resorts because that is where the real value is.

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Are you sure about that , cause I specifically asked about that when I was signing the closing documents . When I read that there is a contract with RCI that is ending shortly I asked . And they told me that they have to have something doesn't nessasarily need to be with RCI but comparable .

I am sure that they could do it if they wanted to but wouldn't make sence since its a selling point , so most likely wont happen . Maybe the guy doing my closing had the wrong info IDK .

Anyway after about 5 years I figure I hit my brake even point , and if they do away with RCI I would be disappointed , but not be extreamly upset if I had to only use DVC resorts , especialy since they seem to adding more adult destinations like hawai and HH .

 

[ELMC]

Anyway after about 5 years I figure I hit my brake even point , and if they do away with RCI I would be disappointed , but not be extreamly upset if I had to only use DVC resorts , especialy since they seem to adding more adult destinations like hawai and HH .

Please take another look at your numbers. I can almost guarantee you that if you are buying direct, there is no chance you are breaking even in 5 years unless you are comparing what you were going to spend on your original vacation with what you will spend on shorter vacations using DVC and trying to offset the purchase price that way.

Regardless, this is not a true comparison and it does not give you an accurate break even point. It would be the equivalent of saying that you were going to book 2 weeks at a BLT Grand Villa this summer but instead you decided to buy 150 points BLT direct. It's the same amount of money ($25,560ish) so therefore you broke even in year one. You've spent the same amount of money, but you have not received the same value in each case and it is not a true break even point.

 

[BestDadEver]

Please take another look at your numbers. I can almost guarantee you that if you are buying direct, there is no chance you are breaking even in 5 years unless you are comparing what you were going to spend on your original vacation with what you will spend on shorter vacations using DVC and trying to offset the purchase price that way.

Regardless, this is not a true comparison and it does not give you an accurate break even point. It would be the equivalent of saying that you were going to book 2 weeks at a BLT Grand Villa this summer but instead you decided to buy 150 points BLT direct. It's the same amount of money ($25,560ish) so therefore you broke even in year one. You've spent the same amount of money, but you have not received the same value in each case and it is not a true break even point.

I didnt buy blt , so the cost is less . How much is a week at a dvc resort cost cash ? I figure $2000 . Regardless when I brake even maybe 8 years , my son is only 2 so figure we have atleast 18 years before we are realy looking at rci . I hope I brake even by then.

 

[Dean]

Are you sure about that , cause I specifically asked about that when I was signing the closing documents . When I read that there is a contract with RCI that is ending shortly I asked . And they told me that they have to have something doesn't nessasarily need to be with RCI but comparable .

I am sure that they could do it if they wanted to but wouldn't make sence since its a selling point , so most likely wont happen . Maybe the guy doing my closing had the wrong info IDK .

Anyway after about 5 years I figure I hit my brake even point , and if they do away with RCI I would be disappointed , but not be extreamly upset if I had to only use DVC resorts , especialy since they seem to adding more adult destinations like hawai and HH .

This is specifically covered in the POS and yes, it can be changed or removed. Even then DVC is a poor vehicle for RCI or II exchanging.

 

[ELMC]

I didnt buy blt , so the cost is less . How much is a week at a dvc resort cost cash ? I figure $2000 . Regardless when I brake even maybe 8 years , my son is only 2 so figure we have atleast 18 years before we are realy looking at rci . I hope I brake even by then.

My example using BLT was just that, an example. I don't know the details of your purchase or situation. But, the logic still applies. My point is that I think it would be a good idea for you to learn more about your DVC purchase so that you are not hoping for a break even point, but you actually can predict when it will happen.

 

[BestDadEver]

My example using BLT was just that, an example. I don't know the details of your purchase or situation. But, the logic still applies. My point is that I think it would be a good idea for you to learn more about your DVC purchase so that you are not hoping for a break even point, but you actually can predict when it will happen.

I know when my brake even point is . Its the diffrence in room rates that has us thinking diffrent times for brake even , its 5 maybe 6 vactions and I brake even . I say its $2000 for a week . The reason I ask is cause if you say its $1500 for a week then it would be more time .

 

[BestDadEver]

Regardless, this is not a true comparison and it does not give you an accurate break even point. It would be the equivalent of saying that you were going to book 2 weeks at a BLT Grand Villa this summer but instead you decided to buy 150 points BLT direct. It's the same amount of money ($25,560ish) so therefore you broke even in year one. You've spent the same amount of money, but you have not received the same value in each case and it is not a true break even point.

I am not trying to be an *** . But I am not comparing it that way . This is the way I look at it .

Example SV Studio AKL is $485 per night jambo house , 104 points gets me 6 nights thats $2901 plus 12%of $348 = $3249 if I stayed there for 4 6 day trips I am at brake even in less then 4 years .

There can be variations of how you look at it. But the only way I look at it is my out of pocket expence is nothing but my dues for the rooms after the 4th stay .

 

[ELMC]

I am not trying to be an *** . But I am not comparing it that way . This is the way I look at it .

Example SV Studio AKL is $485 per night jambo house , 104 points gets me 6 nights thats $2901 plus 12%of $348 = $3249 if I stayed there for 4 6 day trips I am at brake even in less then 4 years .

There can be variations of how you look at it. But the only way I look at it is my out of pocket expence is nothing but my dues for the rooms after the 4th stay .

Thank you for sharing your thinking. I'm not trying to badger you, so I hope it doesn't seem that way. I agree that we are definitely looking at it differently. I'd be happy to share my numbers with you as well, but if you want me to let it go I will. Just let me know.

Out of curiosity, did you purchase at AKV and get the 20 "free" point promotion?

 

[BestDadEver]

Thank you for sharing your thinking. I'm not trying to badger you, so I hope it doesn't seem that way. I agree that we are definitely looking at it differently. I'd be happy to share my numbers with you as well, but if you want me to let it go I will. Just let me know.

Out of curiosity, did you purchase at AKV and get the 20 "free" point promotion?

I dont think you badgering me hope your not getting a bad vibe form me cause its just an opinion . I would like to see the numbers .

I didn't do AKV , cause even though I could have gotten the 20 extra points . SSR was the same price if I bought the 120 and ultiamtly ended up with only 100 points for even less . The main reason I went with SSR is cause the dues were cheaper by a bit and I was looking long term .

Although I did start to think maybe my points would last longer if I could snag one of those value rooms at AKV . It may have been worth the extra dues . Only time will tell .

 

[Dean]

I am not trying to be an *** . But I am not comparing it that way . This is the way I look at it .

Example SV Studio AKL is $485 per night jambo house , 104 points gets me 6 nights thats $2901 plus 12%of $348 = $3249 if I stayed there for 4 6 day trips I am at brake even in less then 4 years .

There can be variations of how you look at it. But the only way I look at it is my out of pocket expence is nothing but my dues for the rooms after the 4th stay .

Unless you would have stayed at AKV on cash, the rack rate of AKV is really meaningless to savings or breaks even, IMO.

 

[ELMC]

I dont think you badgering me hope your not getting a bad vibe form me cause its just an opinion . I would like to see the numbers .

I didn't do AKV , cause even though I could have gotten the 20 extra points . SSR was the same price if I bought the 120 and ultiamtly ended up with only 100 points for even less . The main reason I went with SSR is cause the dues were cheaper by a bit and I was looking long term .

Although I did start to think maybe my points would last longer if I could snag one of those value rooms at AKV . It may have been worth the extra dues . Only time will tell .

First off, I'm glad to hear that we're discussing and not arguing. It's sometimes kind of tough to tell when you're on a message board and not talking face to face.

Anyway, I agree and disagree with your analysis. I agree in that if you decide to pay full rack rate for a studio at Animal Kingdom, Jambo House, then you will break even pretty soon (it's actually year 5 once you account for interest paid and maintenance fees increasing at 2.5% annually).

But here's the problem I have with your analysis. Like Dean said above, unless you actually plan on staying at AK Jambo Studios and paying full rack rate, your comparison is not honest, it's more of a justification to purchase DVC. The numbers you quoted assumed a stay during Dream Season. Well right now there is a deal for 30% off rooms during that time. So that changes the numbers a bit.

So without pasting in a huge spreadsheet, let me sum up my analysis.

DVC Cost = cost of points, plus interest, plus maintenance fees
Outlay JH = full rack rate at Jambo that you quoted earlier
Rental JH = cost of renting points for the same stay at Jambo studio ($13pp)
Outlay SSR = cash cost of studio at SSR (your home resort) assuming 30% off
Rental SSR = cost of renting points for the same stay at SSR studio ($13pp)


Scenario #1 DVC vs. Full Rack Rate Jambo

Break even point is year 5. DVC costs $15,395. Cash costs $16,245


Scenario #2 DVC vs. renting points at Jambo

Break even point is year 17. DVC costs $22,779. Point rental costs $22,984


Scenario #3 DVC vs. 30% Discount rate at SSR

Break even point is year 11. DVC costs $18,814. Cash costs $19,519.


Scenario #4 DVC vs. renting points at SSR

Break even point is year 22. DVC costs $26,562. Cash costs $26,598.


So as you can see, there are many ways to analyze the "DVC or not DVC" decision and these are just a few of the possible outcomes. It seems that you chose the worst case scenario for booking cash and then compared it to buying DVC. If that works for you, great. I'm not trying to say that you made a bad decision or that you shouldn't have purchased DVC. But I do think that your analysis is more geared towards supporting your decision than it is taking a look at all the options to find the most cost effective one both now and in the future. In the end we are going to do what makes us happy, and I hope that your SSR purchase does just that. DVC is about more than just the numbers, and to a lot of people, that is worth any cost. Enjoy your purchase!

 

[BestDadEver]

First off, I'm glad to hear that we're discussing and not arguing. It's sometimes kind of tough to tell when you're on a message board and not talking face to face.

Anyway, I agree and disagree with your analysis. I agree in that if you decide to pay full rack rate for a studio at Animal Kingdom, Jambo House, then you will break even pretty soon (it's actually year 5 once you account for interest paid and maintenance fees increasing at 2.5% annually).

But here's the problem I have with your analysis. Like Dean said above, unless you actually plan on staying at AK Jambo Studios and paying full rack rate, your comparison is not honest, it's more of a justification to purchase DVC. The numbers you quoted assumed a stay during Dream Season. Well right now there is a deal for 30% off rooms during that time. So that changes the numbers a bit.

So without pasting in a huge spreadsheet, let me sum up my analysis.

DVC Cost = cost of points, plus interest, plus maintenance fees
Outlay JH = full rack rate at Jambo that you quoted earlier
Rental JH = cost of renting points for the same stay at Jambo studio ($13pp)
Outlay SSR = cash cost of studio at SSR (your home resort) assuming 30% off
Rental SSR = cost of renting points for the same stay at SSR studio ($13pp)


Scenario #1 DVC vs. Full Rack Rate Jambo

Break even point is year 5. DVC costs $15,395. Cash costs $16,245


Scenario #2 DVC vs. renting points at Jambo

Break even point is year 17. DVC costs $22,779. Point rental costs $22,984


Scenario #3 DVC vs. 30% Discount rate at SSR

Break even point is year 11. DVC costs $18,814. Cash costs $19,519.


Scenario #4 DVC vs. renting points at SSR

Break even point is year 22. DVC costs $26,562. Cash costs $26,598.


So as you can see, there are many ways to analyze the "DVC or not DVC" decision and these are just a few of the possible outcomes. It seems that you chose the worst case scenario for booking cash and then compared it to buying DVC. If that works for you, great. I'm not trying to say that you made a bad decision or that you shouldn't have purchased DVC. But I do think that your analysis is more geared towards supporting your decision than it is taking a look at all the options to find the most cost effective one both now and in the future. In the end we are going to do what makes us happy, and I hope that your SSR purchase does just that. DVC is about more than just the numbers, and to a lot of people, that is worth any cost. Enjoy your purchase!

As I understand you looking at it those ways . To me I wouldn't rent points from others, maybe once before I bought in . But to me I would find that a hassle banking on strangers to make my reservations . There is no way I would do it for 11 years .

The 33% off would be good but what is the chance that I get a reduction multiple years .

So really the only constant is the cash price to me . It's really not a justificaton . Cause my reality is , if I wasn't dvc I would probably not visit as much as I plan now . But I can pretty much assure you my vacations would be priced around the $5k mark where ever I go . If I could eliminate half the cost joining dvc that works for me .even if it takes 5-8 years .

 

[Dean]

As I understand you looking at it those ways . To me I wouldn't rent points from others, maybe once before I bought in . But to me I would find that a hassle banking on strangers to make my reservations . There is no way I would do it for 11 years .

The 33% off would be good but what is the chance that I get a reduction multiple years .

So really the only constant is the cash price to me . It's really not a justificaton . Cause my reality is , if I wasn't dvc I would probably not visit as much as I plan now . But I can pretty much assure you my vacations would be priced around the $5k mark where ever I go . If I could eliminate half the cost joining dvc that works for me .even if it takes 5-8 years .

when people use reasonable assumption for current comparison's, it's generally 8-12 years or more to "break even" but that assumes you'd go routinely and are staying in similar accommodations. For many, even those who think it's a great deal, they will NEVER break even. For example, anyone who buys with the intent of doing much trading will likely never break even, even many who only use DVC and go the same number of trips and days will not every break even if a 1 BR or 3 BR is their comparison. They may or may not get additional value, it depends on circumstances plus a portion of the "value" is subjective and personal. Ultimately most people never break even simply because of the psychology of the timeshare. You go more, stay in better places than you would otherwise and you spend the extra money anyway.

 

[BestDadEver]

when people use reasonable assumption for current comparison's, it's generally 8-12 years or more to "break even" but that assumes you'd go routinely and are staying in similar accommodations. For many, even those who think it's a great deal, they will NEVER break even. For example, anyone who buys with the intent of doing much trading will likely never break even, even many who only use DVC and go the same number of trips and days will not every break even if a 1 BR or 3 BR is their comparison. They may or may not get additional value, it depends on circumstances plus a portion of the "value" is subjective and personal. Ultimately most people never break even simply because of the psychology of the timeshare. You go more, stay in better places than you would otherwise and you spend the extra money anyway.

I dont understand that point of you going more , and spend more as a negative .Isn't that the reason you join is do you can go on more vacations . Out eliminate some of the expense .

The guide that was on my cruise, made mention that the reason they do dvc is to get you to come back to disney year after year to spend money . It waen't a secret and obvious even if they didnt mention it .

To be honest if I didnt look at it the way I do . I wouldn't have bought in .

 

[Dean]

I dont understand that point of you going more , and spend more as a negative .Isn't that the reason you join is do you can go on more vacations . Out eliminate some of the expense .

The guide that was on my cruise, made mention that the reason they do dvc is to get you to come back to disney year after year to spend money . It waen't a secret and obvious even if they didnt mention it .

To be honest if I didnt look at it the way I do . I wouldn't have bought in .

As long as you understand that's what's happening and are OK with it, that's fine. However, it has nothing to do with break even other than that you may not get the "savings" you expected.

I can see you have swallowed the hook, drank the kool-aid and donned the rose colored glasses. But then what do I know, I've only owned timeshare for 18 years including over 50 weeks, bought and sold and never lost money. I've gone to HI (several times), Cabo, Cancun, Puerto Vallarta and Aruba (twice) for a total per diem cost around $150 per day for 2-4 people for 1-2 weeks trips including air and indirect timeshare expenses, not to mention many US trips using timeshares. I've done trips with 7-9 two BR units for a week for less than most would spend in a hotel for a week in the same places including at Disney. And I leave for HI in a few weeks with Ocean Front 1 & 2 BR units.

 

[DougEMG]

As long as you understand that's what's happening and are OK with it, that's fine. However, it has nothing to do with break even other than that you may not get the "savings" you expected.

I can see you have swallowed the hook, drank the kool-aid and donned the rose colored glasses. But then what do I know, I've only owned timeshare for 18 years including over 50 weeks, bought and sold and never lost money. I've gone to HI (several times), Cabo, Cancun, Puerto Vallarta and Aruba (twice) for a total per diem cost around $150 per day for 2-4 people for 1-2 weeks trips including air and indirect timeshare expenses, not to mention many US trips using timeshares. I've done trips with 7-9 two BR units for a week for less than most would spend in a hotel for a week in the same places including at Disney. And I leave for HI in a few weeks with Ocean Front 1 & 2 BR units.

No wonder you know so much about timeshares

 

[BestDadEver]

As long as you understand that's what's happening and are OK with it, that's fine. However, it has nothing to do with break even other than that you may not get the "savings" you expected.

I can see you have swallowed the hook, drank the kool-aid and donned the rose colored glasses. But then what do I know, I've only owned timeshare for 18 years including over 50 weeks, bought and sold and never lost money. I've gone to HI (several times), Cabo, Cancun, Puerto Vallarta and Aruba (twice) for a total per diem cost around $150 per day for 2-4 people for 1-2 weeks trips including air and indirect timeshare expenses, not to mention many US trips using timeshares. I've done trips with 7-9 two BR units for a week for less than most would spend in a hotel for a week in the same places including at Disney. And I leave for HI in a few weeks with Ocean Front 1 & 2 BR units.

Thats great . Do you own DVC ? That would shock me if you say yes .

 

[Dean]

Thats great . Do you own DVC ? That would shock me if you say yes .

I do, DVC was my first purchase and is still my first love though I've downsized significantly from 10 years ago. However, even though we usually have several stays a year in DVC resorts, we haven't used our points ourselves routinely in several years. DVC is still a great option for many people used appropriately but there are so many options out there for one willing to invest a little time and effort. There are a number of members of this board who own other timeshares and many, like me, owned DVC first and later branched out. I'm not aware of any of them that aren't happy they did branch out. There are a few that owned other timeshares before DVC that haven't been happy with their other options but in general they bought retail and didn't put the effort into learning and using the other options to their fullest from what I can see.