Petite Woman Bumped from SWA for a hefty passenger.

[FireDancer]

Also if this child was on another flight prior and this was connecting flight...apparently that portion of the flight did NOT make her have two seats???

You only have to purchase two seats on full planes. If you purchase two seats and the flight is not full the second seat is refunded even though you technically need it.

 

[FireDancer]

I can't even discuss this anymore.

The major point seems to be that a petite passenger was inconvenienced for the sake of a hefty 14 year old. I guess compassion doesn't come into play if the 14 year old is "hefty". What if the 14 year old had been average sized and needed two seats because she had a broken leg? Would it be such an issue?

No, the issues is that a person who bought the one seat they required was bumped for the person who didn't buy the two they did required. Had the hefty passenger bought the two seats they should have or fit in the one seat they did buy it would be a moot point because everyone would have done what they should ahead of time.

 

[Tammi67]

You only have to purchase two seats on full planes. If you purchase two seats and the flight is not full the second seat is refunded even though you technically need it.

Wow. And I get charged an extra $50 if my bag weighs 51 pounds.

 

[FergieTCat]

No, the issues is that a person who bought the one seat they required was bumped for the person who didn't buy the two they did required. Had the hefty passenger bought the two seats they should have or fit in the one seat they did buy it would be a moot point because everyone would have done what they should ahead of time.

By the mere fact that the passengers sizes were (and are continuing to be) stressed, I beg to differ.

 

[NotUrsula]

Ding ding ding.

The minor was insufficiently ticketed. She needed two seats but had one so she only paid for 50% of her needed seats. The standby passenger, on the other hand, paid for 100% of her seat.

It isn't an issue of giving her seat to the standby lady because, not having bought the second seat, it wasn't hers to begin with. If you need two seats buy them (or buy your child them) and if you don't too bad so sad.

Everyone is making it sound like SWA gave the 14yo's seat to the standby passenger which is simply not the case. They gave the extra second seat that no one including the 14yo bought to the standby passenger and then took it away and gave it to the teen that should have bought it in the first place.

Well, not everyone.

I really do not think that you can separate what happened from the age of the "customer of size". Had she been an adult the situation would have been handled differently, the SWA spokesman that USAToday quoted said so.

IMO it really doesn't matter whether or not she "should" have been ticketed for two seats -- the fact is that she wasn't, and the unsold seat had been given away too soon. SWA chose NOT to assume the potential liability of stranding a minor when they had it within their power to get her on the aircraft that she was ticketed on.

I'm betting that from here on out, SWA will instruct gate agents to wait until they can actually see the last connecting passenger before giving a standby a lone unsold seat, especially if that connecting passenger is a minor. (They would have that information now because of the new requirement to submit a DOB regardless of fare class purchased.)

 

[freckles and boo]

I just read that the "petite" passenger was refunded her money and placed on a flight that got her to her destination two hours before schedule. I don't know if that was two hours before her original flight or two hours before the stand-by flight, but either way running to the media about this under the circumstances is ridiculous. It was an unusual situation that required a judgment call. One was made. Her boo-boo was properly kissed. Story over.

 

[amberg@eastlink.ca]

not sure if this was brought up, im tired and this is a long thread! lol but when i read the orginal post, twice, no three times cus im tired....i didn't see that it said the child was even unaccompanied. are we presuming or was there more to the story on tv?

im sorry if this points been adressed.

 

[amberg@eastlink.ca]

never mind, re reading again, a late coming passenger answers it...man i am tired! lol

but as others have said isnt ua kids seated first, up here an an unaccompanied minor we were always seated first.

 

[robinb]

I just read that the "petite" passenger was refunded her money and placed on a flight that got her to her destination two hours before schedule. I don't know if that was two hours before her original flight or two hours before the stand-by flight, but either way running to the media about this under the circumstances is ridiculous. It was an unusual situation that required a judgment call. One was made. Her boo-boo was properly kissed. Story over.

Over on Flyer Talk Brian Lusk (Manager of Communication, Southwest Airlines) said that the bumped passenger was put on the very next flight out and refunded her fare for the inconvenience of being bumped. Now I think she's an even BIGGER cry-baby.

 

[Stacy9402]

I was Responding to a poster whose 16yo dd had to deplane for a 2 hour layover. That was separate from the OP. IME, there is ALWAYS a risk that Plans can be disrupted on a connection due to mechanical trouble, weather delays or a horiffic circumstance such as 9/11. While a minor cannot check into a hotel, as a parent allowing your child to travel alone, you are accepting a risk. Thankfully, the only time I got stranded--I was 18. Unfortunately, by the time we were able to deplane...all the hotels were booked as the airport shut down due to ice. We were all out of luck and slept in the airport.

So whether a minor can check into a hotel is moot when you knowingly place them on a flight with a connection with no backup plan.

But what would have happened to my daughter if she was not able to get on another flight. SW only had 2 flights later to her destination. She is a minor and therefore cannot check in to a hotel and can easily be taken advantage of. I was comfortably putting her on a flight that was a direct flight with no plane change (what SW calls it) becasue she would not have to be in a strange place by herslf. But I am not comfortable with them having her to get off a plane because their connection time was off when I paid for a flight that had no plane change. Lesson learnt.

Oh and by the way in my state you have to be 16 years and 3 months before you can get your licenses and she is not got hers yet because I do not feel comfortable having her on the road by herself...

I was just saying that they should treat all minors over the age of 12 the same...

 

[mom3sonstt]

Oh - another thought. If the overweight passenger had been an adult I seem to remember a quote from the airline that said something along the lines of "they would have been required to purchase a second seat". Ok fine - but would the standby lady have still been bumped to allow that person to purchase the 2nd seat. Obviously the overweight person can't take one seat on two different planes - and they had confirmed at least one of the seats. Wouldn't them getting the 2nd seat that the airline says they need be a priority (as an already confirmed passenger) to someone who was just hoping to get on the plane? Again going back to my previous question of does the flight crew have the discretion of determining who "requires" 2 seats as opposed to who is going to have a tight fit?

 

[Tammi67]

I'm not saying I would have done what she did or even that I agree with it, but she had every right to go to the media with this. How many times do we hear "whatever happened to free speech?" It isn't just for minorities or the ADA. It's about time an average person spoke up regarding their "wrong". Why is it when it is a skinny female has a problem because of an overweight person is it a bad thing?

 

[freckles and boo]

I'm not saying I would have done what she did or even that I agree with it, but she had every right to go to the media with this. How many times do we hear "whatever happened to free speech?" It isn't just for minorities or the ADA. It's about time an average person spoke up regarding their "wrong". Why is it when it is a skinny female has a problem because of an overweight person is it a bad thing?

Do you really see this as a civil rights issue?

 

[FireDancer]

By the mere fact that the passengers sizes were (and are continuing to be) stressed, I beg to differ.

In this case the size of the passengers is the most important detail. If the 14yo either:

1. fit in the one seat they bought
or
2. bought the two seats needed

it would have been a moot point and nothing would have happened. In the first scenario the standby passenger would have stayed on the plane and flown to their destination. In the second scenario the seat given to her wouldn't have been in inventory because it was pre-purchased. You don't purchase the second seat at the gate after the fact, you buy it at the time of booking which takes that seat out of inventory. To leave out the detail would completely change the circumstances of what happened.

 

[FergieTCat]

In this case the size of the passengers is the most important detail. If the 14yo either:

1. fit in the one seat they bought
or
2. bought the two seats needed

it would have been a moot point and nothing would have happened. In the first scenario the standby passenger would have stayed on the plane and flown to their destination. In the second scenario the seat given to her wouldn't have been in inventory because it was pre-purchased. To leave out the detail would completely change the circumstances of what happened.

If the 14 year old needed two seats for any other reason and only bought one, this wouldn't be a story and it wouldn't be in the media. Especially since the other passenger was compensated BEFORE she went to the press.

 

[robinb]

I'm not saying I would have done what she did or even that I agree with it, but she had every right to go to the media with this. How many times do we hear "whatever happened to free speech?" It isn't just for minorities or the ADA. It's about time an average person spoke up regarding their "wrong". Why is it when it is a skinny female has a problem because of an overweight person is it a bad thing?

No one is saying that she doesn't have the right to go to the media and declare herself to be an anonymous self absorbed cry baby who puts her wants ahead of the needs of a teenager .

 

[FireDancer]

If the 14 year old needed two seats for any other reason and only bought one, this wouldn't be a story and it wouldn't be in the media. Especially since the other passenger was compensated BEFORE she went to the press.

That is impossible to know.

 

[FergieTCat]

I'm not saying I would have done what she did or even that I agree with it, but she had every right to go to the media with this. How many times do we hear "whatever happened to free speech?" It isn't just for minorities or the ADA. It's about time an average person spoke up regarding their "wrong". Why is it when it is a skinny female has a problem because of an overweight person is it a bad thing?

As previously posted ... over on Flyer Talk Brian Lusk (Manager of Communication, Southwest Airlines) said that the bumped passenger was put on the very next flight out and refunded her fare for the inconvenience of being bumped.

Why was it then necessarily for her to then go to the media to whine? And neglect to mention that she was adequately compensated?

 

[FergieTCat]

That is impossible to know.

Whatever.

 

[sbell111]

People keep saying that SW had a right to bump the passenger due to an oversell situation. I, however, don't see it as an oversell.

The stand-by passenger got the last seat on the plane, however the 14 year old still had a seat - there were still enough seats for everyone on the plane to get a seat. The problem is that the 14 year old needed two seats. From the sound of it, she did not book herself two seats (or her parents/guardians did not do so). If she had booked two seats, the standby passenger would not have been given a seat on the plane. It seems that the 14 year old (her parents) not only didn't purchase the required two seats but showed up at the very last minute (after standby passengers had been loaded). ...

It's best to not get caught up on the number of seats on an airplane since, as I previously explained, flights are frequently restricted to a lesser number of passengers than there are seats. This was just one more example of how that can happen.

Oh for crying out loud. For the umpteenth time, everyone realizes that the girl had a confirmed seat. The standby passenger DID NOT, I repeat, DID NOT, take the girl's CONFIRMED seat. The standby passenger took a DIFFERENT, YET UNPURCHASED, seat. The girl needed an ADDITIONAL seat, on top of the already purchased seat, which by this time, WAS PURCHASED by the standby passenger. Sheesh.

This is not believed to be correct. Southwest apparently required the standby passenger to upgrade her ticket to full fare (per their rules), but they would not have confirmed a standby passenger on that flight. Therefore, the standby passenger never 'purchased a seat' on the plane. She paid to upgrade her discounted ticket to full-fare as a condition of being allowed to standby for the flight. She was issued a boarding pass and seated when it appeared that the other passenger would misconnect. When the passenger did not misconnect, and it was clear that two seats would be needed, the standby passenger was removed. I suspect that the teen wasn't charged for the additional seat due to expediency.

ok, but sheesh...stand-by is still stand-by.

ding ding ding. People keep ignoring this fact.

Not after you're allowed to PURCHASE a ticket. Now you are a passenger who has paid for your seat, just like everyone else on the plane.

If she had purchased a ticket on teat flight, she wouldn't have been standing by for it. Therefore, no ticket was purchased.

Also if this child was on another flight prior and this was connecting flight...apparently that portion of the flight did NOT make her have two seats???

Purchasing an additional seat is only required if the flight is full. Even then, an agent may or may not push the issue.

No, the issues is that a person who bought the one seat they required was bumped for the person who didn't buy the two they did required. Had the hefty passenger bought the two seats they should have or fit in the one seat they did buy it would be a moot point because everyone would have done what they should ahead of time.

1) The person bumped did not purchase a ticket on that flight. She was standby.
2) Whether the teen bought two seats is a revenue issue between her and the airline and is not related to whether a standby passenger should be bumped.

Oh - another thought. If the overweight passenger had been an adult I seem to remember a quote from the airline that said something along the lines of "they would have been required to purchase a second seat". Ok fine - but would the standby lady have still been bumped to allow that person to purchase the 2nd seat.

Regardless of whether the overweight person purchased two seats, the standby person would still be bumped.

There is no difference between this issue and if the aircraft had a seat that was broken and they didn't realize it until boarding. The last standby passenger would be bumped and the confirmed passenger would be given her seat.