Peoplemover Collision Feb. 28th, 2020

[midnight star]

The smoke was from the belt escalator, certainly no reason not to ride it. I remember riding it a while back and the escalator was broken, had to walk up.

We knew that, but we just weren’t sure if the ride itself would also have problems.

 

[seashoreCM]

The same mechanism used for propulsion, electromagnets in the track, slow down the cars of the Peoplemover cars as well as speed them up.. Need to make sure that real brakes (with friction pads, disks, drums, etc.) are in proper operating condition also, which includes stopping the car without using electricity..

 

[LSUmiss]

Think you can chalk all this up to budget & staffing cuts.

 

[rteetz]

Think you can chalk all this up to budget & staffing cuts.

I’m going to disagree on at least some of the incidents recently.

 

[LSUmiss]

I’m going to disagree on at least some of the incidents recently.

I’ll say jungle cruise, ppl mover & haunted mansion .

 

[rteetz]

I’ll say jungle cruise, ppl mover & haunted mansion .

I would disagree with two of those three. Haunted Mansion is certainly something that probably is maintenance related.

Jungle cruise is more of a freak accident. To my knowledge that’s never happened in WDW or DL. Could it have been prevented? Maybe, we don’t know all the factors of that one.

Peoplemover is a non-issue in my eyes. There was no damage and no reported injury. The cars do happens to hit each other but that was in design based on the system being used. It’s not that they are supposed to hit each other constantly or anything but because the ride operates on magnets and if there is a stoppage/slowdown that can cause this to happen.

 

[hertamaniac]

I would disagree with two of those three. Haunted Mansion is certainly something that probably is maintenance related.

Jungle cruise is more of a freak accident. To my knowledge that’s never happened in WDW or DL. Could it have been prevented? Maybe, we don’t know all the factors of that one.

Peoplemover is a non-issue in my eyes. There was no damage and no reported injury. The cars do happens to hit each other but that was in design based on the system being used. It’s not that they are supposed to hit each other constantly or anything but because the ride operates on magnets and if there is a stoppage/slowdown that can cause this to happen.

Based on what I heard happened at the Haunted Mansion, I have painted a possible scenario.

The track at Haunted Mansion is many years old (I am not in-tune with the exact date of last upgrade/replacement). If that track or mechanism that had a failure at the speculated point, then I am not sure they could have adequately anticipated this event to happen. It's not like CM's are armed with FLIR thermal cameras that have the capability to look for hairline fatigue or cracks in the steel (yes, I very well know about Rockwell Hardness and Young's Modulus numbers).

So, if a failure that I think may have happened, again by the reports, it's not like this is a spare part or consumable sitting in a warehouse on WDW property. In that scenario, it is likely to have a drawing (hand drafted from the early 70's?) that would need to be rapidly created CAD ready for a machine shop to make to that standard.

I am all about project managers using a risk plan and identifying consumables in operation, but the Haunted Mansion shutdown, in my mind, is not able to be predicted with any real accuracy.

 

[LSUmiss]

I would disagree with two of those three. Haunted Mansion is certainly something that probably is maintenance related.

Jungle cruise is more of a freak accident. To my knowledge that’s never happened in WDW or DL. Could it have been prevented? Maybe, we don’t know all the factors of that one.

Peoplemover is a non-issue in my eyes. There was no damage and no reported injury. The cars do happens to hit each other but that was in design based on the system being used. It’s not that they are supposed to hit each other constantly or anything but because the ride operates on magnets and if there is a stoppage/slowdown that can cause this to happen.

My opinion is that boats are not inspected or maintained as often as they should be & ppl mover is CM error which could likely be related to understaffing and/or overworked CMs. Imo, it all gives a sense of sloppiness that used to not exist in Disney.

 

[rteetz]

My opinion is that boats are not inspected or maintained as often as they should be & ppl mover is CM error which could likely be related to understaffing and/or overworked CMs. Imo, it all gives a sense of sloppiness that used to not exist in Disney.

I don't disagree but I don't fully agree with you either. Overall I think this last week or so has just been an overall coincidental bad week for Disney. Even with more staff rides are still going to have periods of downtime or issue.

 

[hertamaniac]

My opinion is that boats are not inspected or maintained as often as they should be & ppl mover is CM error which could likely be related to understaffing and/or overworked CMs. Imo, it all gives a sense of sloppiness that used to not exist in Disney.

Wait...so you think a CM should be able to reverse engineer an EM propulsion system from decades ago? If so, why aren't they sitting behind desks and, armed with an engineering background, be in a general engineering systems support division? A CM is NOT armed with the system/operational background or knowledge of a legacy system.

The boats inspection is a genuine issue and should be (or have been) as part of a PM (preventative maintenance) issue. I don't see it as under-staffing, but an operational and unforeseen issue.

 

[LSUmiss]

Wait...so you think a CM should be able to reverse engineer an EM propulsion system from decades ago? If so, why aren't they sitting behind desks and, armed with an engineering background, be in a general engineering systems support division? A CM is NOT armed with the system/operational background or knowledge of a legacy system.

The boats inspection is a genuine issue and should be (or have been) as part of a PM (preventative maintenance) issue. I don't see it as under-staffing, but an operational and unforeseen issue.

I’m saying a CM operating the ride may not have been paying attention.

 

[hertamaniac]

I’m saying a CM operating the ride may not have been paying attention.

So an engineer that designed that system wouldn't have implemented a fail safe mechanism for that condition? Respectfully, I would not have hired or maintained that engineer on my team.

It's one thing to have a show light not working, but a guest loaded braking/propulsion system without a fail safe is certainly not a standard that Disney would let slip by.

I am the first to chastise an obvious oversight, but Imagineers are not Madame Leona and clairvoyant.

 

[LSUmiss]

So an engineer that designed that system wouldn't have implemented a fail safe mechanism for that condition? Respectfully, I would not have hired or maintained that engineer on my team.

It's one thing to have a show light not working, but a guest loaded braking/propulsion system without a fail safe is certainly not a standard that Disney would let slip by.

I am the first to chastise an obvious oversight, but Imagineers are not Madame Leona and clairvoyant.

Ok fine. If it’s not CM-related, then it falls back into poorly maintained by Disney. Either way related to cut backs imo.

 

[hertamaniac]

Ok fine. If it’s not CM-related, then it falls back into poorly maintained by Disney. Either way related to cut backs imo.

What I will say is that it might have been lacking in DAILY systematic testing, but is very unlikely when it comes to guest safety. In this day of litigation, I have to believe Disney has incredibly self-guarded themselves.

I am not privy to the operational schedules and protocols. But, I do know I would have a punch list for each attraction that satisfies a standard operational protocol before committing to a green light day. I would demand an audit trail that traces back to engineers/Imagineers before a systems release to the general public.

 

[MalloryDis]

Wow, makes you worry for sure...

 

[Polydweller]

Ok fine. If it’s not CM-related, then it falls back into poorly maintained by Disney. Either way related to cut backs imo.

Nope, your argument doesn’t follow. As the IT Head at a major hospital I worked closely with the maintenance dept. You can have perfectly maintained equipment, regularly inspected and repaired according to manufacturer specifications, and things still break down. It’s the real world and things happen with mechanical/technological devices. Without a lot more info to back it up the opinion of cutbacks causing the problem is a leap way too far.

 

[LSUmiss]

Nope, your argument doesn’t follow. As the IT Head at a major hospital I worked closely with the maintenance dept. You can have perfectly maintained equipment, regularly inspected and repaired according to manufacturer specifications, and things still break down. It’s the real world and things happen with mechanical/technological devices. Without a lot more info to back it up the opinion of cutbacks causing the problem is a leap way too far.

But I bet if things aren’t maintained well, etc, they are more likely to break down. And when you have multiple things breaking down a day seems more like a pattern than an isolated incident.

 

[ellbellthomps]

This is definitely just coincidence. This isn't the first time that PPM has crashed. There's not enough time in between now and the cuts for it to be due to that.

 

[Alynw]

Disney's Stock price is losing some serious value (along with the rest of the market)

Disney down to $105 today but this has nothing to do with any of the recent incidents at Disney, price changes or CEO change, the market is seeing a sell off and is dropping steadily from the coronavirus scare, the entire market is down and some of which hasn't dropped like this in over 10 years.

 

[ellbellthomps]

Disney down to $105 today but this has nothing to do with any of the recent incidents at Disney, price changes or CEO change, the market is seeing a sell off and is dropping steadily from the coronavirus scare, the entire market is down and some of which hasn't dropped like this in over 10 years.

It's definitely Corona, and the Jungle Cruise incident didn't help.