Opinions on resale purchase: How much do you weigh contract exipiration?

[rowrbazzle]

Do you know if they only allow you to charge using the Disney card? Or can you charge using any card? If the latter I'd probably use one of my other cards as I'm guessing buying something with "Disney" in the name would trigger my travel category. Would be awesome if this is actually a good option because I'm pretty sure I can't use a card on a resale (maybe the deposit).

But i like what you're thinking if this is an option. It does drive the per point cost down if you use a card and count the cash back (or equiv) reward as a rebate vs. the original purchase price.

Yeah, you can use any card direct (I've heard the same thing about resale - deposit only at some places).

We almost pulled the trigger on a direct contract recently. We were told we could "stretch" the cost over three months (without any interest or loan or anything like that) if we wanted. This was without a Disney Visa card. Be sure to ask about that if you decide to buy direct with a different card.

 

[crisi]

I think it depends on a lot of things. For us, we are of the age where it doesn't weigh much, and bought when they were all the same.

I do have a feeling that I'd rather spend 30 years at a resort I want to be at than 40 at one I don't. So if my choices were BWV and SSR, even if I were younger, I wouldn't pick SSR. But we have the disposable cash to make that choice. I might pick BLT over BWV. (It might be hard, my husband adores the walk into Epcot thing).

 

[Ben E N]

Frankly speaking I don't think the extra 15-20 minutes of travel time is worth the price premium on the front end for a shorter contract (for us). I'm having a lot of trouble rationalizing that.

Anyway, I'm also having trouble rationalizing something else. BLT looks great other than the fact that for whatever reason the majority of the point distribution is in Feb UY. I think finding the contract we would want is going to be akin to finding a real world unicorn (low point, Oct UY). We're definitely going to need to continue with the balancing act of getting exactly what we want at a premium (direct) vs. getting something close to what we want at a discount (resale).

I would take going direct at BLT as a last resort, and that is coming from someone who bought 25 points direct there. I think the $185/point price is unjustifiable compared to other resorts, and is only set so high in order to make the prices for Poly and CCV seem reasonable in comparison.
If I were you, I would look for small BLT contracts with different use year and a reasonable price first. Considering you have no other points there, you would not be able to combine contracts for home booking advantage anyway.
Second option would be to look for more AKV resale points at s good price. You could always use them to get a Lakeview room at BLT, which would be cheaper per night via resale than standard view would be through buying direct.
Only if neither of those other two options goes though would I consider buying more than 25 points at BLT.

 

[Steph01002]

We wanted BCV or Boardwalk and they have the same expiration date, so the length of contract was not a factor. We chose the home resort where we would be most happy staying. That being said, we plan on buying a small direct contract and we did think about length of contract plus place we would like to stay for a shorter amount of time on a stay.

 

[glamdring269]

Second option would be to look for more AKV resale points at s good price. You could always use them to get a Lakeview room at BLT, which would be cheaper per night via resale than standard view would be through buying direct.

We're more than likely going to wait until after our Christmas visit to make a decision on anything. But just for reference, are lake view rooms typically the most readily available? Lakeview studio is what we would be interested in so would be nice if that's the case. AKL is similar really as we like the Savanna view which is usually easiest to get. Of course if both are normally avail at 7 months then we start talking about should we just be looking at SSR?

Anyway, I get what you're saying. There are actually 2x 110 point AKL contracts out there right now with my UY that I'll bet I could get at a price near what 50 at BLT direct would cost. I also understand where you're coming from on UY. We would typically vacation in Oct, Dec, then early Jun (in that order) so even a June UY would be ok for us relative to our current Oct UY.

 

[Ben E N]

We're more than likely going to wait until after our Christmas visit to make a decision on anything. But just for reference, are lake view rooms typically the most readily available? Lakeview studio is what we would be interested in so would be nice if that's the case. AKL is similar really as we like the Savanna view which is usually easiest to get. Of course if both are normally avail at 7 months then we start talking about should we just be looking at SSR?

Anyway, I get what you're saying. There are actually 2x 110 point AKL contracts out there right now with my UY that I'll bet I could get at a price near what 50 at BLT direct would cost. I also understand where you're coming from on UY. We would typically vacation in Oct, Dec, then early Jun (in that order) so even a June UY would be ok for us relative to our current Oct UY.

Looks like there are between 295 and 428 total rooms at BLT, depending on how they are used. 69% of them are Lake View. Standard view go quickly, but lake view seem to mostly be available if you book right at 7 months. I forget the name of the 7 month booking thread, but it gives a pretty good breakdown of what to expect. However, it is not a guarantee, so unless you are comfortable staying at SSR from time to time, I would be careful about buying there.
From my limited personal experience, the lakeview rooms at BLT are pretty awesome. Others have complained about the size of the studios there, but my family loved theirs, and the walk to both the Magic Kingdom and the Contemporary monorail stop were both very easy.

 

[glamdring269]

Yeah, I hear you on SSR. Can't believe we would ever really consider that one.

I think at this point I'm just going to keep an eye out primarily for Oct contracts (as that is our VWL UY) but I think a June would work for us as well, maybe even September. If the perfect contract pops up with any of those UY we may have to pounce and then figure out how to deal with the multiple UY conundrum if it goes down that way.

 

[ziravan]

Buy where you want to stay.

I don't see expiration date as more than a minor consideration, at best.

For example in my case, I'm 49 and I own at BCV (2042) and Poly (2066). Yes, Poly is 24 more years.

But. I'll be 73 when BCV expires and 97 when Poly expires.

Right, now, and hopefully for many years to come, I'm in my prime.

1. I'm relatively healthy.
2. I'm more financially secure than at any time in my life.
3. I'm at an age when I can still slog through parks with a minimum of side effects.
4. I'm still raising young kids (DD9 and DGS4) and they love Disney.
5. Star Wars opens in 2 years and BCV will be a gondola ride away.

If I could only choose one of those options (BCV or Poly) would I trade my time now where I want to stay for time 24 yrs from now when:

1. I might be on a fixed income
2. I'll probably no longer be a park commando by then.
3. I might not even be a Disney fan by then.

Etc etc.

(DW says she'd keep BCV in a heartbeat if she had to choose. I agree. How much is staying where I want to stay worth to me now vs still being a member in my 90's? As I said, what happens in 2043 will take care of itself and is - and should - only be a minor consideration in my current luxury purchases.)

Timeshares are a luxury. Trading out where you want to stay for where you might be in a quarter century seems not very cost effective for a luxury purchase.

Plus. If you're like many of us, you'll probably add on. When I did, it was at Poly. IF I find that I still want to go to Disney into my 80's, I can stay at Poly.

In the meantime, I can stay at BCV for years to come.

The later date resorts aren't going anywhere, and DVC is always adding more with expiration dates further into the future. If you buy a 2042 resort and still want to be a DVC member after 2042, that option will be available to you without sacrificing where you want to stay today.

 

[Bing Showei]

It's worth repeating what Bill stated earlier on in the thread.

IMO most owners will burn out after 10 to 15 years if that. Families change, jobs change...

Judging from resale rates, the likelihood of benefitting from the 40-plus-years savings rates are probably low for the majority of people buying. Is it important to consider for resale? Maybe. But here, again, the oft repeated "Buy where you want to stay" is probably the most sound advice, as that will more likely affect what you get out of your contract.

When we were weighing our purchase decision for DVC, I started calculating the value of DVC, we had pages of spreadsheets with lost opportunity costs calculations, comparisons to discounted rack rates, the true value of dollar against inflation, closing costs, multi-small contract vs single larger contracts, cost per point over life of contract, etc.

Looking at the numbers my wife asked, "how old will we be by the end of this?" And with one quick additional column next to the "cumulative savings vs. 30% discounted rack rate" that showed our age throughout the contract, we both just started laughing.

We ended up putting in a couple of offers on VGF because that's where we would be happiest staying. Irrespective of the cost/point/year/contract life.

 

[glamdring269]

You guys keep posting too much vacation logic and aren't doing me any good in talking myself out of buying a BCV or BWV contract. I'm trying to make this as much of a value proposition as possible but of course the more it gets discussed the more you realize the most logical choice may be to do exactly what people propose all the time: "Buy where you want to stay". Disney could be gone in 20 years. We could be gone in 10. We could be unable to fully enjoy a WDW vacation by 2045 so who cares if our contract goes to 2100. Etc. Etc.

What do I know for sure? We enjoy food & wine festival. We enjoy walking around Epcot world showcase even when visiting during other times of year. We were ok doing the same while staying at AKV but frankly speaking I'd be lying if I said I preferred taking the bus to Epcot over just walking there.

Thanks for continuing to further complicate the issue.

 

[CaliAdventurer]

You guys keep posting too much vacation logic and aren't doing me any good in talking myself out of buying a BCV or BWV contract. I'm trying to make this as much of a value proposition as possible but of course the more it gets discussed the more you realize the most logical choice may be to do exactly what people propose all the time: "Buy where you want to stay". Disney could be gone in 20 years. We could be gone in 10. We could be unable to fully enjoy a WDW vacation by 2045 so who cares if our contract goes to 2100. Etc. Etc.

What do I know for sure? We enjoy food & wine festival. We enjoy walking around Epcot world showcase even when visiting during other times of year. We were ok doing the same while staying at AKV but frankly speaking I'd be lying if I said I preferred taking the bus to Epcot over just walking there.

Thanks for continuing to further complicate the issue.

I was also torn about expiration and BCV etc. Being in my 30s, I could not justify the shorter span for BCV. Part of the appeal to me is providing something my grandkids can enjoy even if I'm not. We have no intention of ever selling so those calculations didn't factor for us. Of course, we wanted a good value because things can always change.

We ended up going with VGF because it's ultimately our very favorite, where I think we'd want to be most when the kids have flown, restaurants, golf, and because we could probably find a trade for another resort in 11 mo window easily. If you look at trade threads, it's not easy for folks with SSR points to trade for hot times at hot properties. I still watch BCV prices soaring and wonder but when news hit that the back gate to Epcot will become filled with gondola riders from many other rooms, I feel better about the decision as that quiet, leisurely stroll will not be the same in coming years. We've also gotten BCV for spring break the last two years and though it's not f & w, it is flower and garden which is becoming a f & w lite so that may end up becoming a hot time in future and could be hard to get so that's a reason to go BCV perhaps. If I had it to do again, I'd prob have bought split the points and bought at both.

I liken WDW to Vegas. If you stay at the mandalay vs caesars vs the Wynn, you will have a completely different vacation. The restaurants you'll eat at, the shows you'll see etc. We almost always stay at the Wynn because it's our favorite and has the best dining and rooms but when we have older kids mixed in we stay at mandalay for the pools and what not . VGF is our wynn and BCV is our mandalay. BCV is super convenient to Epcot, boardwalk, has the pool, etc but It's not convenient to everything else.

 

[Dean]

You guys keep posting too much vacation logic and aren't doing me any good in talking myself out of buying a BCV or BWV contract. I'm trying to make this as much of a value proposition as possible but of course the more it gets discussed the more you realize the most logical choice may be to do exactly what people propose all the time: "Buy where you want to stay". Disney could be gone in 20 years. We could be gone in 10. We could be unable to fully enjoy a WDW vacation by 2045 so who cares if our contract goes to 2100. Etc. Etc.

What do I know for sure? We enjoy food & wine festival. We enjoy walking around Epcot world showcase even when visiting during other times of year. We were ok doing the same while staying at AKV but frankly speaking I'd be lying if I said I preferred taking the bus to Epcot over just walking there.

Thanks for continuing to further complicate the issue.

Knowledge and experience will help you make a good decision, emotions a bad one.

 

[Ben E N]

Just to throw a weird analogy into this discussion. I see this problem like I see pancake syrup. I can buy the huge bottle of corn syrup based stuff, and it will last me for years on end. Instead, for more money, I buy the small bottle of real maple syrup. It will only last me a month or so because I enjoy it so much.
It is a much worse "value" to buy the real stuff, as I am spending more for less product, but it is what makes me happy.
If you want to enjoy any particular resort, feel happy knowing that you are spending your money to stay there. Like syrup, DVC ownership is something that is done for pleasure, not to make the most out of your money.

 

[bwvBound]

Just to throw a weird analogy into this discussion. I see this problem like I see pancake syrup. I can buy the huge bottle of corn syrup based stuff, and it will last me for years on end. Instead, for more money, I buy the small bottle of real maple syrup. It will only last me a month or so because I enjoy it so much.
It is a much worse "value" to buy the real stuff, as I am spending more for less product, but it is what makes me happy.
If you want to enjoy any particular resort, feel happy knowing that you are spending your money to stay there. Like syrup, DVC ownership is something that is done for pleasure, not to make the most out of your money.

In your storyline, my SSR would be the huge bottle of corn syrup stuff. However, zoom out.

To me owning "DVC" is access to the entire DVC network. My SSR is just one tool in my timeshare toolkit. What you view as "corn syrup" becomes my week in Aulani, my week at BWV, my 4n at Copper Creek Cabins, my DCL cruise, my stay at the Grand Californian, etc. If I want to stay within the DVC Collection, it is easier, more efficient and more certain to own DVC points than to try doing the same using my non-DVC timeshare.

The rest of my timeshare toolkit? These are awesome non-Disney products. One used to give me BWV every year through II/RCI ... but more recently gives me Reno, Pagosa Springs, Yellowstone, Solvang, Seattle, Anaheim, etc. Another timeshare gave me horses, hot springs, history and lasting IRL friendships. Another was a thrifty and powerful trading tool via RCI. Great stuff ... none are "corn syrup." Really.

 

[4luv2cdisney]

I didn't even think of the direct add on option. A 50 point add on would probably be sufficient for us and should actually give us the option to choose whatever we want with the UY we want with less hassle. At least in theory. I do think buying BWV direct would be way too expensive but might be worthwhile for something like PVB.

In the meantime, I think we may hold off unless some amazing contract pops between now and our December trip. Then we'll have a chance to consider PVB while doing our Christmas resort tour night.

If you really want an Epcot area resort and a later end date, maybe Riviera direct will be a good option for you. 2019 isn't too far away!

 

[Bing Showei]

If you really want an Epcot area resort and a later end date, maybe Riviera direct will be a good option for you. 2019 isn't too far away!

4luv. Seriously. You're saying this to the same group of people (me included) who decry the humanity of having to wait 3 weeks for estoppel?

4luv: Maybe Riviera direct will be a good option for you... in 2019.
me: Wait...2019... that's... ... ...

Yeah. The idea of waiting killed the emojicon me. And I went to heaven... in case you didn't get that.

 

[Matty B13]

Also, Riviera might be going for $185 a point!

 

[4luv2cdisney]

4luv. Seriously. You're saying this to the same group of people (me included) who decry the humanity of having to wait 3 weeks for estoppel?

4luv: Maybe Riviera direct will be a good option for you... in 2019.
me: Wait...2019... that's... ... ...

Yeah. The idea of waiting killed the emojicon me. And I went to heaven... in case you didn't get that.

LOL!

Well, OP already has a membership and an upcoming trip... Maybe they only want to vacation every other year! Anything is possible!

 

[Dean]

Just to throw a weird analogy into this discussion. I see this problem like I see pancake syrup. I can buy the huge bottle of corn syrup based stuff, and it will last me for years on end. Instead, for more money, I buy the small bottle of real maple syrup. It will only last me a month or so because I enjoy it so much.
It is a much worse "value" to buy the real stuff, as I am spending more for less product, but it is what makes me happy.
If you want to enjoy any particular resort, feel happy knowing that you are spending your money to stay there. Like syrup, DVC ownership is something that is done for pleasure, not to make the most out of your money.

Not really, a better analogy is buying at the organic store and paying more for a brand that might or might not be better compared to getting the best stuff at Publix or similar. The question is, are you or are you not getting more value if you spend more and is any added value worth it to the buyer. The reality is that no one new to DVC truly knows what will give them added value for the money. Other than those with a ton of experience from renting or vicariously from family trips, no new buyer is going to be able to know that paying more is worth it to them. Unfortunately many of them will think they know and buy into the hype thus paying more for something that doesn't add value to them. Like so many things in personal finance and purchasing, the reality is not really about the math but the end behavior. Think of it like buying a car where far too many people overpay and the emotions/hype takes over and supersedes the decision making. 100% of those who lease fall into this category and most who buy new do as well.

 

[Ben E N]

Not really, a better analogy is buying at the organic store and paying more for a brand that might or might not be better compared to getting the best stuff at Publix or similar. The question is, are you or are you not getting more value if you spend more and is any added value worth it to the buyer. The reality is that no one new to DVC truly knows what will give them added value for the money. Other than those with a ton of experience from renting or vicariously from family trips, no new buyer is going to be able to know that paying more is worth it to them. Unfortunately many of them will think they know and buy into the hype thus paying more for something that doesn't add value to them. Like so many things in personal finance and purchasing, the reality is not really about the math but the end behavior. Think of it like buying a car where far too many people overpay and the emotions/hype takes over and supersedes the decision making. 100% of those who lease fall into this category and most who buy new do as well.

Yeah I thought of that comparison, or name brand vs. Generic bread or something, as well. In all honesty I was eating pancakes when I came up with the syrup one.
The basic message I was trying to convey is that it is all good. If you are happy paying more or getting less years on a contract to stay at BCV for food and wine, that's great and I am glad you are happy. If you also feel that a longer contract would benefit you more (that applies to me, someone in my 30's with two young kids), that's also great. There really is no 'right' value for everyone to agree on because we all have different wants with these resorts and contracts. It is unique to everyone's resort desires, timelines, and budgets.