Online Reservations?

[mitcam]

Do you see anywhere in the future DVCers booking reservations online. I know we can email requests! (This is not online) I find it frustrating if its a Saturday and I finally decide on a plan I have to wait until Monday to call and see if it is available. I'll be honest we have never not gotten what we wanted but it would be so nice to eliminate a middle man for inquiries!

I am sure I am not the first who would like this option. Does DVC have suggestion box?

Thanks & Happy New Year
Carolyn

 

[DebbieB]

DVC is well aware that the members want online reservations, we have been requesting it for years. They have taken the first step toward it by assigning members individual id's and passwords. It's a complicated system due to members have multiple contracts & use years, it's not the same as someone booking a WDW room online.

 

[timC]

When they rolled out the new site design last May, there was some messaging in their announce that suggested on-line ordering would be introduced in the future. Recall them setting expectations that the effort was over a year away... My expection is this fall.

 

[CarolMN]

When they rolled out the new site design last May, there was some messaging in their announce that suggested on-line ordering would be introduced in the future. Recall them setting expectations that the effort was over a year away... My expection is this fall.

Based on what Jim Lewis said at the BWV annual meeting (December, 2004), your expectation is not realistic. IIRC, he said we may be able to do "inventory inquiries" by the end of 2005, but that actually making online reservations would take longer. The system is very complicated - many members have multiple contracts & use years and there are many different "point categories" (banked, current, borrowed, holding, reservation, etc.). Also have to consider home resort, non-home resort, transferred (with perhaps different home resort and use year than the contract they were transferred to). Not saying it won't eventually happen, just that it will take $$ and time.

Personally, I am more interested in DVC ensuring that any reservation website is robust enough to stand the "crush" of users that will want to make reservations for popular times when the reservation window first opens. Many a commercial site has crashed over an unexpected load!

FWIW, I don't find the current phone system all that awful.

Best wishes -

 

[timC]

Based on what Jim Lewis said at the BWV annual meeting (December, 2004), your expectation is not realistic. IIRC, he said we may be able to do "inventory inquiries" by the end of 2005, but that actually making online reservations would take longer. The system is very complicated - many members have multiple contracts & use years and there are many different "point categories" (banked, current, borrowed, holding, reservation, etc.). Also have to consider home resort, non-home resort, transferred (with perhaps different home resort and use year than the contract they were transferred to). Not saying it won't eventually happen, just that it will take $$ and time. -

Not surprised. I manage e-commerce development projects for a living. It's not unusual for these complex IT solutions to take years to build. These delays are typically due budget constraints, issues with their back-end system, or they're being slowed down by some other larger corporate infrastructure project. A on-line reservation system would be complex, but not insurmountable. Certainly inquiries could have been deployed by now, or perhaps an account activity report.

 

[tjkraz]

FWIW, I don't find the current phone system all that awful.

I don't either, but it would be nice to be able to do something on-line.

I hope you're right about the inquiries--it would certainly be nice to be able to check such things in advance of calling MS in the morning.

When I first read the comments that came out of the annual meetings, I was left with the impression that the inquiries would be limited to our own contract status--points available / banked / borrowed, etc. But then I didn't read all that closely.

The possibility that we could actually confirm whether a room is available or not, even if the booking still requires a call, is very nice to know, indeed!

 

[CarolMN]

...(snip).....I hope you're right about the inquiries--it would certainly be nice to be able to check such things in advance of calling MS in the morning.

When I first read the comments that came out of the annual meetings, I was left with the impression that the inquiries would be limited to our own contract status--points available / banked / borrowed, etc. But then I didn't read all that closely. ......

LOL! Your recollection could very well be better than mine! Mine could certainly be wishful thinking! I am quite certain, though, that Mr. Lewis said the actual making of reservations on line was going to take longer than by the end of 2005.


Best wishes -

 

[FLYNZ4]

Based on what Jim Lewis said at the BWV annual meeting (December, 2004), your expectation is not realistic. IIRC, he said we may be able to do "inventory inquiries" by the end of 2005, but that actually making online reservations would take longer. The system is very complicated - many members have multiple contracts & use years and there are many different "point categories" (banked, current, borrowed, holding, reservation, etc.). Also have to consider home resort, non-home resort, transferred (with perhaps different home resort and use year than the contract they were transferred to). Not saying it won't eventually happen, just that it will take $$ and time.

Personally, I am more interested in DVC ensuring that any reservation website is robust enough to stand the "crush" of users that will want to make reservations for popular times when the reservation window first opens. Many a commercial site has crashed over an unexpected load!

FWIW, I don't find the current phone system all that awful.

Best wishes -

Carol,

My experience is very different than you suggest. As you know, I belong to another condo association (WM) that has 2X - 3X the members that DVC has (over 200,000 owners)... and owns nearly 60 different resort complexes... (vs 7 at DVC). WM is also a point based system, with a different set of reservations rules... but no less complex. For example... WM has restrictions on length of reservations by season, number of weekend-only reservations, as well as different banking and borrowing policies. All in all, I would say the booking complexities are similar to DVC... but the scope of properties is much larger.

Also... there are still a few things that WM owners need to do manually... such as transfering points from one member to another... but that is a minor problem compared to the basic issues of being able to see a real time status of 100% of the inventory... and being able to book it with a mouse click. The complexities you described... are exactly what computers are good at... usually much better than people.

Finally, we are spending a fortune by living with an antiquated manual system. By keeping ourselves in the dark ages of computing... it has to be raising our MFs. I think it is about time that DVC moves boldly into the 1990's.

/Jim

 

[mitcam]

As always great response from knowledgable DVCer's. What would be nice is to know what types of delays DVC is experiencing (i.e., budget, complexity etc...) you would think they would "throw us a bone" sometime in 2005 just to let us know they are working on it and it is not "on the discussion table"

For the record. I am not dissatisfied by the current system I just know it can be better!

Thanks for listening and responding. I hope the conversation continues to provide me with more great insight!

 

[tjkraz]

As always great response from knowledgable DVCer's. What would be nice is to know what types of delays DVC is experiencing (i.e., budget, complexity etc...) you would think they would "throw us a bone" sometime in 2005 just to let us know they are working on it and it is not "on the discussion table"

Regarding delays, I honestly don't think they were making any efforts to facilitate on-line functionality until after Jim Lewis took over in late-03. So the main reason for any delay through that point was apathy.

They certainly are working on it now--but I can appreciate their reluctance to release too many details too early. In the software / web development biz, overcommitting yourself often leads to disappointment.

If they stay on course implement SOME additional functionality before the end of this year, my guess is we won't hear anything else until October or November at the earliest. The next time it is addressed from a long-term standpoint will probably be the next set of Annual Meetings in November / December '05.

 

[FLYNZ4]

For the record. I am not dissatisfied by the current system I just know it can be better!

By nature... I am not the type of person who sees anything and is satisfied. I always want to see things be done better.

One of the reasons that I really like Disney is because I think they do an icredible job overall... better than just about any company that I have ever seen... and I find it refreshing to go to WDW and immerse myself into that level of quality.

When it comes to the DVC reservation system... it is not even close to being up to Disney standards... and even worse... it is about the worse that I have ever seen in the industry. My experience is that the individuals who answer the phone have all been very nice... and equivalent to what I would expect from Disney. However, the overall system in which they exist is "Worst in Class". It is hard for me to even imagine the series of events that would lead to such mediocre service in Disney.

/Jim

 

[Laurabearz]

The system is very complicated - many members have multiple contracts & use years and there are many different "point categories" (banked, current, borrowed, holding, reservation, etc.). Also have to consider home resort, non-home resort, transferred (with perhaps different home resort and use year than the contract they were transferred to). Not saying it won't eventually happen, just that it will take $$ and time. -

It is complicated... I have 6 contracts, 3 home resorts, and 2 UY's. I beleive I could fuigure out the system, with DISers help... lol , but I think there are a lot of folks who would bank when they ment to borrow..... and a lot of mistakes will be made....

As much as I would like Online reservations I fear them. I do hope for online account status though.... that would be very helpful.

 

[Caskbill]

I still have my notes from the OKW annual meeting. The target for the 1st level is December 2005, and it will be for members to log on and check their account. This includes all financial information, all current reservations (already made via MS), all contract's point status. They were specific in that they will <u>not</u> have anyway for a member to check villa availability or to make any reservations, bank/borrow points etc. In other words it will be totally passive to begin with: I.E., you can look at your records. It is not active in that you would be able to actually do anything like bank points, make reservations, etc.

At a couple of the member mixers I had the opportunity to talk with a couple of the CM's who work on the current database system. It is extremely complex. I don't remember some of the details they said, but things that may seem simple to us such as just checking if a member is trying to make an 8-month lead time reservation at a non-home resort is fairly complex when designing an on-line member's reservation system.

My $.02: There may be about 80,000 members now, but how many would actually make reservations on-line? While members of the DIS are fairly computer savy, I don't believe it's the same for the general public. If only 10% of members would totally use an on-line system, that becomes an awful lot of programming and resources expended for the benefit of 8,000 people. From a cost stand point, how much does it cost to develop an on-line system versus the cost of someone in MS to make reservations for those 8,000 people.

For those who didn't know, today there are typically more than 100 CM's at a time manning the phone lines when you call.

 

[DrTomorrow]

Gotta love DISsers - if I wait long enough, someone else posts just what I was thinking.

Laurabearz summed up my complexity concerns; with all those options, that's going to be one heck of a User Interface. Even CaskBill's Planner - which I love - has a lot of radio buttons and other options. I'm not as experienced as FLYNZ4, but I've done my share of developing, implementing, training and supporting database apps for internal use (CLEC), and I've seen bright people make stupid mistakes. It's entirely plausible - to me, at least - that the increased number of serious mistakes that need CM intervention might undo a lot of the anticipated savings. Plus, a lot of these mistakes might not be discovered until someone shows up at BCV to check in to a 2BR and they realize that their reservation is really for a Studio - at VB! Or, more realistically, when they find out that they forgot to use banked points, which they've since lost.

Caskbill brings up an more meaningful issue though: what does the average DVC owner - the customer - really want? Would I like to be out at the pool here in Arizona with my laptop (or hand-held), checking my points and making a resservation on-line? Heck yeah! But I'm well aware that I'm hardly the typical DVC owner. And Disney has to be thinking about which allocation of resources will meet the needs of the greater number of customers. Even I - techie geek that I am - would rather see finite resources spent on making sure that every MS CM is aware of all facets of DVC reservation processes, and can handle even the most complex situations, before I want a penny spent on on-line reservations. During my last stay at SSR, I had to make 3 phone calls before I got the "official word" that they could print out my boarding pass at the SSR front desk. Yes, I know - it's Disney, that shouldn't happen. But until the CMs are trained and aware of what DVC currently offers, let's not be searching for other windmills to tilt at.

Since DVC did indeed send out userID's and PINs to all owners, they certainly know how many actually activated them, and therefore have a pretty good idea how many people woud benefit from on-line reservations. Sure, if they implemented it, the number of users would grow over time, but I can understand why it isn't a high priority right now.

IMHO - YMMV

 

[Tagrel]

After spending years writing database applications for all kinds of industries, I just do NOT understand why DVC is so slow to modernize. It can really ONLY be apathy and budget constraints.

Computers handle complex situations like DVC accounts very well (when designed and written well) and DVC OBVIOUSLY already has all the logic necessary to run the DVC system. It sounds more like their internal IT team is just not staffed to take on the challenge of bringing that system to the web. Its been my experience that this typically happens when the existing team has very little knowledge of web based interfaces and are understandably afraid of creating one. So, both some expert assistance and new, web savvy IT team members would be needed.

I don't really buy into the 'everyone will screw it up' excuse. Millions of people make online reservations everyday. At hotels, airline tickets, rental cars and cruises. People purchase billions of dollars worth of online merchandise every year. I think most anyone that uses any internet based system (for other transactions as mentioned above) are pretty capable of booking the correct hotel and room type. Every credit card I own is fully accessible online, as are my bank accounts and retirement funds. I've yet to transfer away all my money, and really haven't heard any horror stories about those who have... Unless a system is designed incredibly badly, there are typically all kinds of safeguards and warnings before you do something that is irreversable. Will people make mistakes? Sure. But there will also be the vast majority that cruise on through without a single problem (as with most online systems).

For passive transactions such as current reservations, point balances, etc. I can't see much reason for the system to take so long other than problems within the Disney IT system. Sharing database resources with outside groups is ALWAYS a big deal, and someone is dragging their feet fighting the change. The code to do these types of lookups is NOT rocketscience, so the obstacles is almost certainly a connectivity issue between their web system and the backend databases... And in this day and age where companies are linking up databases all over the place, I again see someone dragging their feet against the change...

Just another .02 cents!

 

[kweaver]

One more thought to follow up Dr T and Tagrel's posts...surely a much bigger percentage of the population than 10% makes online hotel reservations now. I realize that DVC is a bit more complicated...but other timeshare companies offer online reservations with few problems.

We all know there are a (hopefully) small number of DVC members who are unaware of (or chose not to worry about) banking rules, borrowing rules, transferring rules, etc. and mismanage their accounts ot the point where they lose some. There have also been a number of CMs (at the call center and at the hotels) who have wreaked havoc with a member's account . We've read the stories right here! It's going to happen now and then whether DVC has a manual system or an online system.

I believe the majority of people who will use an online system will do just fine.

 

[timC]

For those who didn't know, today there are typically more than 100 CM's at a time manning the phone lines when you call.

Interesting info. Thanks.

IT investments generally are prioritized by return-on-investment. The projects that will return the most revenue or cost savings will usually get IT funding first. The DVC on-line transactions may not yet offer Disney the saving that would warrant a big IT spend. So with a smaller budget, they're chipping away at this thing a piece at a time. Been there, done that.

Regarding complexity, online user interfaces can be simplified for the casual user, having all the complexity buried in the underlying business logic. Break the functions in several transactions. Have a friendly step by step design. Focus on the most common, straighforward transactions first. Lots of things can be done on the front end to make it easy for the user.

 

[DrTomorrow]

[...] I don't really buy into the 'everyone will screw it up' excuse. Millions of people make online reservations everyday. At hotels, airline tickets, rental cars and cruises. People purchase billions of dollars worth of online merchandise every year. I think most anyone that uses any internet based system (for other transactions as mentioned above) are pretty capable of booking the correct hotel and room type. Every credit card I own is fully accessible online, as are my bank accounts and retirement funds. I've yet to transfer away all my money, and really haven't heard any horror stories about those who have... Unless a system is designed incredibly badly, there are typically all kinds of safeguards and warnings before you do something that is irreversable. Will people make mistakes? Sure. But there will also be the vast majority that cruise on through without a single problem (as with most online systems). [...]

I do so hope and wish you are correct - I'm really am an optimist, and a strong believer in on-line business activity. I'm just well aware of the common assumption that most technical people make that the rest of the world is as comfortable and competent using on-line systems as techies are; I know folks with broadband access who refuse to use credit cards for online purchases - identify theft, don't ya know. And I think that a typical online purchase - even a hotel reservation - doesn't have the possible levels of complexity that a DVC reservation would. Usually it's "I want this item (maybe you have to specify dates and/or destinations) here's how I'll pay for it... Accept" and you're done. At DVC, there's "I'd like to book dates X-Z at Resort S from Contract 1, then 3 contiguous days from Contract 2, then link in a cash reservation on Saturday"; and let's not get started on banked or transferred points.

But hey, as in many other DVC discussions, we're not going to resolve it in this forum. I agree that Disney has the resources, technical know-how and experience to implement such a system. They fact that they haven't yet means they've made a deliberate decision not to; maybe they know more than we do about their customers and business needs.

IMHO - YMMV

 

[jennz]

We just bought into DVC and I asked our person that last week - she said it's at least a year out, but they're planning on it. FWIW. I would love to have it, I much prefer doing things online and have been dying just to get into the DVC members website - we don't have our pin # yet - but the "general" userid and password they have in the book don't work (of course there's a possiblity I read into what was supposed to be an example & it's not intended for that oh well! ). So....all good things come to those who wait??

BTW, off topic but I asked her about the Contemporary and she said she can't comment on those things but they had added DVC units at places where there was a high demand before - so again - for what it's worth! She also said the bus drivers can tell you a lot more about what's going on. I thought that was amusing. They must be sort of like the mail room guys.