Oceaneer's Lab/The worst 25 mins of my Life

[chrisn]

I had tears just listening to how frightened you were. I am one of those phycho overprotective moms. My kids are DD-16 (she has her own car and drives ) and DS-7. I lost DD at MGM in the line for Fantasmic when she had just barely turned 13. For 20 minutes my heart pounded. It felt heavy. I was hyperventilating. I couldn't breathe. I was visibly shaken and freaking out and while the CM's were already puting the word out on the CB's a nice couple came and asked for the description of my daughter and helped me look for her. When we found her, she was sobbing and I was sobbing. Believe me I know how some people are really effected by missing children. I've completely freaked recently after losing DS in my own home recently. By the time I found him (sleeping non-visibly under the covers of my bed), I could hardly take any air in my lungs. The next day not quite recovered, we lost him again on the huge dirt mound behind my house. I had phone in hand ready to dial 911 whild DH walked the neighborhood and DD drove up and down the streets sobbing over her missing brother. It's quite pathetic but I just can't help it. I think they would have had to give me a tranquilizer had I lost him on the ship the way you did Kayla. Glad everything worked out and you are right. They are our most perfect and precious treasures!

 

[jdm]

I read thru this thread waiting for a sane response and have yet to see it, so here goes...

Quite simply - sign out priviledges mean just that, that your child can sign themselves out. Say what you want about contingencies ("page me first"), if you check the sign out priviledge box (or however it's done) then you absolutely need to a) be comfortable with your child being alone on the ship and b) have a communication plan worked out with the child.

I have a DD9 and DS11 and will be cruising with them in March along with DW. They will have sign out priviledges and will be given a clear set of rules to follow (e.g., stop first at the cabin to leave a note where they're going, remain on best behavior, etc.) with noncompliance resulting in having to spend the rest of the cruise with us or in the cabin. They're both decent, friendly, responsible kids who have the sense to seek out a person in authority if they're lost or otherwise frightened or in trouble. This is a Disney cruise ship not New York City we're talking about. They need to start learning how to handle themselves independently and this (a controlled, well-monitored environment) is an excellent place to do so.

If you don't feel that your child can handle themselves on the ship alone, or that you don't feel comfortable with the setup, then don't give them sign-out priviledges.
__________________
John H.



Well, that's a man for ya.....

Jenn

 

[HappyLawyer]

yeah i agree i hope he reads my post

 

[DVCajun]

I read thru this thread waiting for a sane response and have yet to see it,...

Wow, John, how does it feel to be the most intelligent and objective person on the DIS? Although you might take lessons in reading comprehension-- but hey, none of us are perfect, eh?

I know I'm a weak minded female, but I also don't consider a vessel in the middle of the ocean inhabited by thousands of strangers a "controlled environment."

 

[Donald's#1Fan]

I think the poster(s) who is trying to say don't blame Disney bec. the parent gave sign out priv. is missing the BIG picture, even the OP stated that the sign out priv. were not the issue. The issue is, and this is a father speaking here, that Disney did not follow their own rules for properly signing in the child and they are the ones totally responsible for the anguish caused. Furthermore, what if after having failed to check in at the club and having failed to get the CM to check her in at the theater the child did leave to go back to her room and on the way something seriously bad did happen to the child. If everything was working as it should, the parent would have been notified that the child checked out on her own, and been looking for the child to arrive and w/in 5 mins of the child not showing up, they could initiate a plan, as it was if the child chose to leave the theater, no-one would ever know where to begin to look or what time she was where. That is all hypothetical, but it's a strange world we live in and in this case the blame is totally on Disney's fault for not doing due diligance to sign her in in the first place. Having children that same age and having been on cruises in the past and going in the future, I will definitely be more careful in making sure that my children are signed in properly. I'm glad that mother showed so much restraint, I'm positive I would have not!

 

[jhorstma]

yeah i agree i hope he reads my post

I've read all of the posts and replies.

Here's the thing - in each of the situations listed above the kids acted just fine while the parents totally overreacted. Each child was faced with a situation where either they couldn't find their parents or the kids club was in transition. They waited patiently (even if the CMs dropped the ball), attempted to sign in properly and/or find their parents, and then rejoined the group. The parents on the other hand completely melted down - as I tell my kids, if you melt down you can't think clearly.

If you can't handle being apart from your child then don't give them sign out priviledges. If you have an issue with a CM then sure, lodge a complaint with DCL (but slap them around? sob and cry and scream? that's how immature children act).

 

[DancingBear]

Assuming the OP's daughter's description of what happened is accurate, the CM in the theater clearly screwed up badly. That being said, Jhorstma is not the one who tried to turn the thread into a discussion about proper age for signing out priviliges---several of the responses which were supportive of the OP did so.

I certainly feel for the terrible anxiety experienced by the OP. But, as Jhorstma points out, there was nothing wrong with the child's behavior, and nothing, I would say, for example, which supports the idea of not letting a 13yo out of your sight on the cruise.

 

[crisi]

I have a very independant kid. I've lost him twice, once at a museum when he went to story hour without telling me (at four) and once at a playground where he decided to take a walk in the woods (at two). This is made possible by my very demanding daughter, who wants all attention focused on her - and that happens often enough for him to slip off. It is really scary to lose a kid - years off my life- twice!

I now understand why they don't want people checking in their kids during "transition time." Sounds like a zoo. They certainly made an error or two - and I'm not excusing that. But that - unfortunately - will happen. The CMs are only human and they make mistakes. I wonder if there was a "headcount" error - your daughter came without managing to check in - another kid left without bothering to check out.

 

[RobinMarie]

It sounds like a tricky situation here. This was her first time going to the club? It sounds like she was very responsible. I don't know if I would feel comfortable having her go to another site to check in (other than the club). Did the children's navigator state where the children would be at the time she wanted to check in?

This seals the deal for me, going to and from the club on their own is probably very doable but diverting to a different place/different check in system independently allows for too many variables to enter the picture. I will check my child in AND out. The fear factor isn't worth it to me on my vacation. I hope other parents considering check in/out themselves consider this very real possibility they will be sent to a different place, hence increasing the chances of error.

I can't imagine the fear during this missing phase. I have felt brief moments of this fear when my child went under clothing racks in stores and around corners.

I'm very glad it turned out well.

 

[bratray]

i'm so happy that things turned out well for you and your daughter- i could only imagine how terrifying the whole situation must have been

i know every parent has their own rules but i personally feel 8, 9 & even 10 is too young to have the responsibility of checking in and out of the clubs on their own

 

[missyoh8]

We have given both of our older children the ability to sign themselves out....I feel like this is a great lesson in telling your kids the "what if" procedure if they are lost. Sorry guys but my kids have all been told to go to a MOM if they find themselves not knowing what to do! MOM= woman with children..........especailly not hard to come by on a Disney Cruise!

This poor girl did not know that she was lost so that blows that theory! When they said she was not with the group, I would like to think one of the adults in the group would check the place where the 8-9's were located at the moment. Of course I would have been as panic stricken as the poster was (I held back tears even reading of the ordeal lol). We also try to keep our kids on walkie talkie at all times, they just clip it on and off they go.

This is a great posting to let everyone know.........talk to your kids before this happens to you! Although I am not sure this could have been prevented.

MIssyoh8

 

[KathyTX]

On my DCL cruises, we've had a Navigator for the kids' clubs that outlines exactly where on the ship DS's age group will be at all times (at dinner, in the Club, in the Lab, at the movie...), and the rules have been that check in *does not* happen during transition times. This is a good reminder of how chaotic those transition times can be, and the reason that they do not check in then.

Were they sticking to the schedule listed in the Navigator on this cruise?

Yes, it does sound like the CM in the kids' club gave some bad information. But everything turned out fine. And checking in during a transition time seems to be the biggest cause of the trouble...

Glad everything turned out fine.

 

[3redheads]

I've read all of the posts and replies.

Here's the thing - in each of the situations listed above the kids acted just fine while the parents totally overreacted. Each child was faced with a situation where either they couldn't find their parents or the kids club was in transition. They waited patiently (even if the CMs dropped the ball), attempted to sign in properly and/or find their parents, and then rejoined the group. The parents on the other hand completely melted down - as I tell my kids, if you melt down you can't think clearly.

If you can't handle being apart from your child then don't give them sign out priviledges. If you have an issue with a CM then sure, lodge a complaint with DCL (but slap them around? sob and cry and scream? that's how immature children act).

What a harsh response to someone who thought something had happened to their child. It's a horrible feeling to not know if something bad has happened to your child. Yes, you should remain calm, but realistically, you're going to have a moment (or longer) of panic. Should Disney be informed of this mishap? Yes. I don't think anyone is slapping the CM around...

I don't think any of these parents overreacted. It only takes a moment for something bad to happen to a child. They can be pulled into someone's stateroom, they can be molested etc... To tell them they overreacted is pure arrogance. Bad things happen.

That being said, my daughter will be 12 in April and will <b><i>not have</b></i> check out privileges. I think we need to put ourselves in this parent's shoes and realize this is scary. Whatever happened to empathy?

 

[cwf1028]

I thought the same as Kathy, I know in the younger groups it is stated that there is no checking in or out during transitions or during movies I believe. If that is the same for the 8-9 than maybe that is why proper protocol by the CMs was not followed, maybe there really isn't a protocol. Seems like the CM at the club could have advised Kayla of that and redirected her back to her cabin to check in later or have her mother paged to let her know that check in cannot be done while the kids are in the theater. Seems the lesson here is that even if not stated by Disney, the best thing to do is to go ahead and take your child to the club at this age and let them check out if desired. This way at least the child would be checked in properly and it would be known that she did make it there. I'm really glad that everything worked out OK!

 

[flexsmom]

I'm with CFW1028. While I sympathize and understand the fear factor of not knowing where your child is, I'm not sure I understand why if the OP wanted to be paged before her child signed herself out, she would allow her DD to go check herself in, especially without checking the Navigator to see that they would be at the movies? From the original post, it's clear that the OP didn't check the Navigator on a regular basis to see what the schedule was from the very first time of attempting to check in while the kids were at dinner. If she had escorted her to check in, she would have taken DD to the theater and would have ensured she got check in there, too - I don't understand the comment that the OP thinks the club counselor should have escorted DD there. The Navigator is clear not to check in during transition, or to go to wherever the kids are to check in after transition. If you show up at the wrong place, it's not their responsibility to take the kids there themselves. (Yes, he could have told her to go back to her stateroom instead of to the theater, but he probably figured if mom let her come to club by herself, she could handle finding the theater.) If the OP had shown up at the theater with DD, I don't think the CM would have "pushed" the adult back and/or not noticed an adult - and none of this would have happened. If the OP wouldn't let DD check out without a page, I assume it's so she would know where DD was going to hook up with her. There's really no mechanism for you to have known she had gotten to the club without a similar page notification, and as others have pointed out, "check out" privileges aren't the same as "check in". I'm not trying to be judgmental here, just to point out some other sides of this. I agree that the CM at the theater lost the bubble on making sure she was checked in at the theater, I think all of the parties involved contributed to the situation.....just as I have contributed to my own similar situation losing a child at a clothes store because I get preoccupied with what I'm looking at, so please don't think I'm casting stones without casting them at myself, too. I just think a lot of people here are piling on the CMs without honestly acknowledging any responsibility on the part of the parent.

 

[dbond]

I too read the post and understand and sympathize with a Mom in this situation, however, I think that maybe too much blame is being thrown at the CM's involved. The CM's were trying to help her get to where she wanted to go, even though check ins and outs are not supposed to be allowed during transition times. They gave her the info she needed, she could have turned around and gone back to her room, but she chose to go to the movie.

It sounds like Kayla did exactly what she should have done, she went to the club, they gave her directions to the movie, she went to the movie, the CM was busy doing his job of trying to organize the kids on his list and didn't realize what Kayla was trying to tell him (remember, kids are not supposed to check in outside of the club), Kayla then sat down and proceeded to enjoy the movie. No panic on her part.

The whole panic could have been avoided if Kayla had been accompanied by a parent on her first actual drop off to the club and then all of the adult's involved would have been comfortable with where she was and who was in charge of her.

Even though we give our DS (10) check/in-check/out privileges, we usually escort him to the club the first few times to make sure he is comfortable with the coming and the going. Every time we part, we communicate to him that if he decides to leave or things aren't going like he thought they were that he is to come find us at XXX or he is to go to the room. We also have the Navigator with us so we know where he should be so we can find him if we need him. We don't rely on a CM to tell us where our child is, there are too many kids for them to know which one is which and where they are at all times. In our experience, the procedures at the Disney clubs work as well or better than any other cruise ship, but unless you put these kids under lock & key, it is not foolproof. They give the kids this age a certain amount of respect by allowing them to make some of their own decisions. I think the system works very well and this was an isolated incident in which all of the adults involved participated equally in the miscommunication.

Like I said before, as a Mom, I do understand the feelings of helplessness. But, if you're that fearful about being apart from your child, maybe you should be more cautious about letting her go off on her own. Just my .02.

 

[S. C.]

i'm so happy that things turned out well for you and your daughter- i could only imagine how terrifying the whole situation must have been

We let GS check in & out at age 11 (almost 12). Rules was he was not to leave alone only with friends, He was to only be in the public areas, He was NOT to go back to our stateroom or be by any stateroom by himself, (there are 2000 strangers on these cruises and staterooms is bedrooms). We had walkie talkies so if there was any question as to where he was or if he wanted to let us know that he & his friends were going to the movies etc where the walkie talkie had to be off he could let us know. He knew if he broke any rule that signing out privleges would be takin away.
We trust our GS It's all the strangers we don't trust, while most people would never hurt a child you never know where the one that will hurt a child is at.

I would of also panicked, I don't think it shows immaturity. I think we panic because we know what a cruel world we live in there is a lot of sicko people out there that would hurt a child for there own pleasure.

 

[jhorstma]

What a harsh response to someone who thought something had happened to their child. It's a horrible feeling to not know if something bad has happened to your child. Yes, you should remain calm, but realistically, you're going to have a moment (or longer) of panic. Should Disney be informed of this mishap? Yes. I don't think anyone is slapping the CM around...

I don't think any of these parents overreacted. It only takes a moment for something bad to happen to a child. They can be pulled into someone's stateroom, they can be molested etc... To tell them they overreacted is pure arrogance. Bad things happen.

That being said, my daughter will be 12 in April and will <b><i>not have</b></i> check out privileges. I think we need to put ourselves in this parent's shoes and realize this is scary. Whatever happened to empathy?

I'm sorry if my post came across as being overly harsh - I was responding to HappyLawyer:

HappyLawyer
Mouse'n Down The House

see i would have forgotten that i am a profession, taken off the ship and sent to jail because i would have slapped the hell out of all of them, that is the one thing you do not screw around with, with everything going on in the world today, i am mad just typing this post-lol
i am glad you found each other did they do anything for you

That to me is a harsh post, and an overreaction.

As a parent I too have experienced a couple brief yet scary moments where I couldn't locate my kids. Terrible thoughts run thru your mind. Likewise having to take a bleeding or asthmatic/croupy (sp?) child to the emergency room is a horrible experience. Emergency situations lead to panic, yet it is precisely those situations where you have to remain calm. As parents the task is doubly difficult - not only do we need to remain calm but we need to instill calm in the face of adversity into our children.

The CMs in these situations clearly dropped the ball. After locating the child I can understand strongly complaining to DCL supervisors (I wouldn't even bother with the CMs at fault) with the intent that a) the CMs at fault receive remedial training, b) I receive proper, sincere, and believable assurances that my child's Club/Lab experience will be safe and enjoyable, and c) I'm compensated for whatever activity got ruined due to their incompetence.

Again though I find it very reassuring that the children in each case came through beautifully - their responses and actions demonstrate that they've been very well educated and know what to do when faced with uncertainty.

 

[Mickeyhugger]

I just want to say that I think the comments 'well, that's just a man for ya,' sums it all up about the kind of people who make such comments. (No, I'm a MOM myself.)

I think it's the ultimate 'victim' (or arrogance?) mentality just because the opinion is from a man. I shudder to think what would happen on these boards if a man made a comment 'well, that's a woman for ya.'

 

[3redheads]

John,

I missed that comment and apologize. I thought you were responding to the original post.

I think this was a scary moment for the parent and I'm sure it will not happen again. I'm such a paranoid parent and have been accused of hurting my child by being overprotective (told so right here on this board) so I feel for anyone who has dealt with any emergency with a child.

Bottom line, I can certainly learn from this experience and hope others can also. Not being familiar with the whole process, this has been eye-opening.

Glad all turned out well and I look forward to granting my daughter (and son) that freedom some day, but not any time soon.