Number of People Walking

Discussion in 'DVC-Mousecellaneous' started by DougEMG, Oct 30, 2018.

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  1. ParkHoppers

    ParkHoppers DIS Veteran

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    Look I am not in here to start trouble. But I think it is fair for those opposed to walking to say so and why they feel that way. Like I said many times people can do what they want. People saying I am shaming people just don’t want to hear what I have to say. Another forum tactic. Just take my individual points and dispute them. Simple. Right? I am getting anything but that and it speaks volumes. Just because someone does get in trouble for doing something wrong doesn’t mean they didn’t do anything wrong. I,ll make this simple for the walkers. Just answer one simple question instead of deflecting.
    “ Is the reason for your walking to circumvent the 11 month rule?”
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
  2. twinklebug

    twinklebug too far away from home.

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    There is no dishonesty going on in regards to any member using acquired skill to gain a room. The only "cheater" out there is possibly Disney itself in regards to those rooms that were pre-blocked out before any member could reach them. As for the rest of us, we are all playing the same game with the same rules.

    No member is running a scam or has any back door access to the system, nor are they running any special software that will grab a room before anyone else. It is all timing. All they have is perseverance and skill. Skill anyone can acquire? Meh, probably not any more than just anyone can pick up a football and run a touchdown. It's an ability to see patterns and work with them. Does that make them a cheater? No.
     
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  4. ParkHoppers

    ParkHoppers DIS Veteran

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    Like I asked above is the reason for walking to circumvent the 11 month home resort booking rule? Cause if that is the reason I,m not sure how that wouldn’t be considered a type of cheating. If you are getting a head start on the 11 month window you are breaking that rule. Just because Disney doesn’t stop you doesn’t make it OK. Other members are negatively affected. No?
    Look I get no one wants to make waves in here so they stay out of certain conversations but sometimes the truth must be told. Even if it gets uncomfortable. That is the nature of truth.
     
  5. Liv&Leah

    Liv&Leah Earning My Ears

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    I think it's beating a dead horse. People will walk reservations and people will complain. If you don't like how the system operates, that's your perogative. Until it becomes an official rule, there is nothing morally wrong with walking a reservation. That's my opinion and I don't expect everyone to agree with it.
     
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  6. twinklebug

    twinklebug too far away from home.

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    Disney's design of DVC created the supply and demand problem. I'm sure they saw it coming and just didn't care. When there are enough rooms for every member to have one, but a disproportionate number all want the same weeks (holidays, celebrations, opening of new lands) then the kids are all going to line up early. Think of it like the folk who line up outside ticketing booths waiting for a concert to go on sale. Are they cheating?

    Now, Disney clearly sees the issue - look at the Midnight magic events. They purposely do not tell us when they are until the 11 month window has passed. Either that or they really have no plan. (I wouldn't put that past them either, LOL)
     
  7. ParkHoppers

    ParkHoppers DIS Veteran

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    There is no rule that people can’t line up early for concert tickets. Therefore everyone is on a equal playing field. There is however a DVC rule against booking your home resort before 11 months. Those walking are circumventing that rule hence breaking that rule. No? This is not my opinion. This is fact. Walking is having a negative effect on other members. Fact.
    Question is will anyone answer my question about the intent of walking. Why are people doing it? What is their intent? The fact no one wants to answer is speaking volumes.
     
  8. twinklebug

    twinklebug too far away from home.

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    Your answer is right there. Supply and demand, that's the reason. People are just getting in line early to be first in line. They are in the way to the same extent that those who are looking to get to the ticket window to buy their tickets would be stumbling over the kids camping out. I'm not promoting it, just saying Disney created the problem with the initial design and now we need to learn to live with it as it is never going away, at least not in any way that I can see.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
  9. ParkHoppers

    ParkHoppers DIS Veteran

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    Supply and demand has never been a reason to circumvent a rule that is in place. Let’s say there are no walkers and there are 5 CL studios on Dec 1st in the system. Supply and demand states that there will be more people that want said rooms than rooms in that category. Always has been that way with supply and demand. The people first in line on Dec 1st all have a CHANCE at getting those 5 studios. Some will and some will not. That’s a fair system. Now take how it is now with walkers circumventing the rule by a loophole that allows them to start early taking those rooms before dec 1st hence cheating those members playing by the rules out of even having a CHANCE at getting those rooms. That is unless they want to cheat also. Which should not be expected of them.You don’t see a problem with that. I,ll ask again. What is the intent of walking? Why do people walk? Supply and demand is their excuse why they circumvent the 11 month rule but that doesn’t take away from their intent to break the 11 month rule. You know what I,m saying you just don’t want to admit it. That’s fine. I,m used to that around here.
     
  10. ParkHoppers

    ParkHoppers DIS Veteran

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    Actually there is an official rule. It’s called you can book your home resort at 11 months. Not a day before. Walking is a way to break this rule. Just because Disney hasn’t done anything about it doesn’t mean walkers aren’t doing anything wrong. It’s a fact walkers are hurting those members who play by the rules. Like I said people can do what ever they want. It’s just hard to listen to them pretend they aren’t doing wrong by other members. They are.
     
  11. ericar

    ericar Mouseketeer

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    There are more Walkers here than an episode of The Walking Dead :)
     
  12. twinklebug

    twinklebug too far away from home.

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    Don't drive angry. Okay, no really...

    I do software analysis/coding/design for a living. I've been studying the system for what feels like forever now. I don't think there is a way to stop walking. If there was I'd be all over Disney to implement it. The problem is rooted in the base concept of DVC itself. We don't have fixed dates and so people will cross over each other all the time. Add to that the need to be slightly flexible with dates changing and the fact that some folk own thousands of points while others may only own a handful. It is messy by design.

    I hear you, understand you, but you seem to be looking to blame one group of people for the issue Disney themselves created. This is another reason why I think Disney may be planning to let DVC be and start up a new Timeshare system. They've learned from (some of) their mistakes.
     
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  13. ParkHoppers

    ParkHoppers DIS Veteran

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    Just for the record I am not mad at all. The all caps were to point out that the almost lottery system that existed for people who played by the rules is gone. Only a few would get their room by chance but it was fair to everyone. Walkers have taken that away from those members. I,m not sure how you can dispute that. That’s a problem and the walkers would be to blame and not because I want to blame anyone. Who is too blame is who is to blame. Has nothing to do with me. Not to mention how people have to piece meal things together now. Why shouldn’t people speak up about these things. To not upset the herd. That’s not honest discussion. Since there is now a noticeable negative effect from walking on other members it’s hard to hear people talk about it like they aren’t doing anything wrong or hurting anyone. I think they are. For some it is a game or competition. There needs to be a counter balance to this and maybe it’s someone like me. I don’t book standard studios so I only speak up because I think I should not just for my personal gain. And finally this is not about morality. It is about what I see as other members playing by the TRUE rules being affected in a negative way. Let’s be clear about that. No more deflection please
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  14. DougEMG

    DougEMG DIS Veteran DVC Gold

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    There was a simple solution to the Dec walking problem that DVC could have implemented but didn't.

    They could have increased the point charts for that time of year to more accurately reflect the demand. The whole point of the point chart is to level demand out by charging more points for high demand times and less for low demand times. Somehow they figured out how to do that with ticket pricing, but choose not to do it with the point chart.

    Like really, in what universe should AKV value rooms have their point cost lowered?
     
  15. nasmith

    nasmith DIS Veteran

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    DVC DID limit his ability to walk - he was once planning on walking a reservation for three months and got blocked by DVC pulling availability out of the week he was walking thru (which I still don't understand how or why they do)(different debate).....

    That same thing could also happen to any owner, no matter how many points they have, and mess up their walk......So the prevailing thought that you can have two nights booked and walk indefinitely is now wrong - DVC has ( and therefore apparently can) pull out inventory before it becomes available to DVC owners thereby messing up your walk ------ from what I've read on this thread, it's happened at least 2 times in the past a couple months.....
     
  16. Marionnette

    Marionnette Children see magic because they look for it

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    DVC also prevented owners who had a legitimate desire to book those specific dates from being able to do so, which I feel is pretty shady. I would rather have a minute chance of booking my desired villa than a zero chance.

    I've been trying to cobble together a reservation in a Std. View studio at BWV during early December. Every morning, there is at least one studio available at 7:59 AM on the 11-month day. That gives me a shot at it. If DVC were to remove those studios from inventory like they did with AKV CL and Value Views, then I have no chance at all.
     
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  17. ziravan

    ziravan Welcome Home

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    DVC is still blocking owners of AKV from booking values for the month of DEC.

    As of today, you can book through Dec 16. The last day that was open outside the 11 month window was the 3rd and it had days outside the 11 month window avail in front of it (those rooms aren’t being walked).

    Every morning at midnight Eastern, the calendar in the booking engine rolls to the next day. Every morning at 8am, booking becomes available. So. There’s an 8 hour window at 11 months plus 7 nights where the room should show avail no matter what. Room pops on calendar at midnight but can’t be booked, even by walkers, until 8am.

    Those rooms in value have been showing up empty for two weeks now.

    There is no value inventory avail past Dec 3rd.
     
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  18. ziravan

    ziravan Welcome Home

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    The value dates missing has nothing to do with walking. Even if DVC wanted to penalize walking, you don’t do that by penalizing everybody. And the days ARE popping up empty.

    And DVC knows these are normally very popular weeks and with Star Wars opening was going to be even more popular. The idea that they’d take every single value room out of service for maintenance for the two busiest weeks probably ever in its history is silly.

    Makes you wonder how much other inventory is missing in categories that don’t show up so readily...

    I mean, I don’t want to be a conspiracy theorist, but how else should we interpret it??
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  19. Madame

    Madame DIS Veteran

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    It’s sad that members get angry
    Agreed, but Disney prefers members squabbling with each other as it remains above the fray...
     
  20. twinklebug

    twinklebug too far away from home.

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    It could be coding errors, although I really don't buy that.

    Hiding behind the problems as bugs is just an excuse. I treat my DVC membership with care just as I would a bank account. I expect Disney to treat it the same. That means not only are my points, contract and dues info are correct at all times, but that their software is properly functioning and when a bug is reported it is taken seriously and looked into immediately.
     
  21. ziravan

    ziravan Welcome Home

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    I don’t think they prefer us squabbling.

    I think that solution, seriously increasing December point costs, wound prompt a blowback they don’t want.

    The current member unrest over the lockoff chart change, and yet another attempt to topple resales are business decisions. I might think that they’re poor business decisions but that’s what they are.

    Managing some customer unrest to pursue the business model is business 101.

    If they seriously tweaked Dec in favor of say Summer, the unrest would be exponentially higher than what it is now and with no profit model to show for it. They didn’t reallocate Fall Frenzy because there’s no economic reason to bring that firestorm on themselves.
     

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