Not to reopen that can of worms but...

[mom2rtk]

I don't think it's fair that my internal body clock has trouble staying up late for fireworks. I'm writing Disney to see if they'll reschedule them for 7PM from here forward.

 

[wisblue]

I agree! So many factors that make the numbers do so many interesting things. Also plenty of opportunities to highlight any numbers you choose to "prove" any point you wish to make...

Will be really interesting to look at numbers over the next 10-15 years as the Orlando tourism landscape continues to evolve...

I think it will also be interesting to see over the next 5-10-15 years if Disney chose to implement MM+ INSTEAD of making significant expansions to the parks or in PREPARATION for expansion.

 

[itchin2go]

Not everyone lives in the Eastern time zone. So no it really isn't fair to expect them to get up super early for the chance to ride a ride.

Fair depends on how you look at things. There is no way for Disney to set up FP and have it be fair to everyone. You just have to make the best of whatever system they have.

Fair to me is everyone has the same rules. Not that it matters, really.

Look at this way. It's not "unfair" to me that we never see the fireworks because my husband doesn't want to stay out that late. I could say - hey, it's unfair that the fireworks are SO late because we go to bed early. But I don't. It's not advantageous to me. It's not ideal for me. But the terms .... the rules are fair. Anyone with a ticket can see the fireworks. We choose not to because we like to get to bed early.

 

[WillAustin]

I think it will also be interesting to see over the next 5-10-15 years if Disney chose to implement MM+ INSTEAD of making significant expansions to the parks or in PREPARATION for expansion.

As I like to say, they move at a glacial pace. A Star Wars land should have been halfway built already. Avatarland should have been done by now. Frozen should have planned for more than a ride. Adding capacity to Toy Story and Soarin' should have been a 6-9 month project 2-3 years ago. Slow. Slow. Slow. If you have to wait 10 years, it's too slow.

 

[mom2rtk]

Fair to me is everyone has the same rules. Not that it matters, really.

Look at this way. It's not "unfair" to me that we never see the fireworks because my husband doesn't want to stay out that late. I could say - hey, it's unfair that the fireworks are SO late because we go to bed early. But I don't. It's not advantageous to me. It's not ideal for me. But the terms .... the rules are fair. Anyone with a ticket can see the fireworks. We choose not to because we like to get to bed early.

I'll let you know if I hear back on my request for earlier fireworks in the parks.

 

[itchin2go]

I don't think it's fair that my internal body clock has trouble staying up late for fireworks. I'm writing Disney to see if they'll reschedule them for 7PM from here forward.

I wish they would! (See my previous post!)

Last trip, I booked the dessert party so I could see Wishes JUST ONCE. My husband was NOT happy, but went along with it, reluctantly (bless him!). It rained about 100% of the day and night that day. We had just gotten dried off from daytime touring (such as it was - sitting under Astro Orbiter in Tomorrowland watching the weather radar on my phone). We put on our newly dried clothes and SHOES, only to slosh back over to the MK in the pouring rain. No problem. We're going to be under the terrace! We're going to see Wishes! We got THE BEST TABLE. That's what happens when you call at the earliest possible moment (patting myself on the back like you wouldn't believe). A bunch of crappy desserts, and an hour later .... Wishes is delayed due to weather. And again, and again. Fast Forward to quarter past eleven - still nearly monsoon conditions, and most importantly - lightning like crazy. We decided to pack it in.

No Wishes for me. I'm not even trying for it next trip. There are worse things than never seeing Wishes!

For those who are curious: We ate at California Grill the next night, and asked our waitress if they ever shot off the fireworks last night. Yep, sometime after midnight. It wasn't unfair, though. Just unfortunate.

 

[Luckybee]

Not everyone lives in the Eastern time zone. So no it really isn't fair to expect them to get up super early for the chance to ride a ride.

Fair depends on how you look at things. There is no way for Disney to set up FP and have it be fair to everyone. You just have to make the best of whatever system they have.

Sorry but I don't agree. Of course its fair because it is a personal choice. When we go to Hawaii, or Australia (or anywhere else where there is a significant time chg) we have to adjust to the time zone because if we don't we'd miss a whole lot of the beach time we have available. What isn't fair is to expect the world to adjust to my time zone requirements. As I said we don't do rope drop, we aren't early entry people but imho I would be awfully entitled complaining it isn't fair for anything if I CHOOSE not to take advantage of something available.

 

[wisblue]

I'm not going to get into the discussion about "fairness" and more even distribution of FPs again.

But, it shouldn't be hard to see why Disney might not want to continue a system that essentially requires someone to be in a park within the first hour or two to have any chance to get a FP for the newest and most popular attractions. If you think rope drop at MK is bad now, just imagine what it would be like if you didn't have thousands of guests who don't need to join in that rush because they already have FPs for 7DMT and/or A&E.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I don't think it's fair that my internal body clock has trouble staying up late for fireworks. I'm writing Disney to see if they'll reschedule them for 7PM from here forward.

DLR's got you covered during the holidays...apparently during the week we'll be there, last year's hours for those dates were 10am-8pm, fireworks at 7:45pm (every night b/c it was holiday season). Talk about perfect timing w/a toddler in tow!

 

[mom2rtk]

I wish they would! (See my previous post!)

Last trip, I booked the dessert party so I could see Wishes JUST ONCE. My husband was NOT happy, but went along with it, reluctantly (bless him!). It rained about 100% of the day and night that day. We had just gotten dried off from daytime touring (such as it was - sitting under Astro Orbiter in Tomorrowland watching the weather radar on my phone). We put on our newly dried clothes and SHOES, only to slosh back over to the MK in the pouring rain. No problem. We're going to be under the terrace! We're going to see Wishes! We got THE BEST TABLE. That's what happens when you call at the earliest possible moment (patting myself on the back like you wouldn't believe). A bunch of crappy desserts, and an hour later .... Wishes is delayed due to weather. And again, and again. Fast Forward to quarter past eleven - still nearly monsoon conditions, and most importantly - lightning like crazy. We decided to pack it in.

No Wishes for me. I'm not even trying for it next trip. There are worse things than never seeing Wishes!

For those who are curious: We ate at California Grill the next night, and asked our waitress if they ever shot off the fireworks last night. Yep, sometime after midnight. It wasn't unfair, though. Just unfortunate.

Oh man, that stinks!

If you ever get another chance, and want a fairly low stress viewing of Wishes, I would recommend watching from the TTC. We weren't in the park that day but parked at the TTC that night and had an easy non-crowded exit right after they were over. We were in bed asleep around half an hour later.

Wishes by mom2rtk, on Flickr

 

[mom2rtk]

DLR's got you covered during the holidays...apparently during the week we'll be there, last year's hours for those dates were 10am-8pm, fireworks at 7:45pm (every night b/c it was holiday season). Talk about perfect timing w/a toddler in tow!

I appreciated those hours, believe me. With the time change heading west, it has always been really hard to make it through that late. It's one of the primary reasons we stay onsite. I know my body clock and do what I have to in order to take full advantage of the early hours of the day.

 

[itchin2go]

I'm not going to get into the discussion about "fairness" and more even distribution of FPs again.

But, it shouldn't be hard to see why Disney might not want to continue a system that essentially requires someone to be in a park within the first hour or two to have any chance to get a FP for the newest and most popular attractions. If you think rope drop at MK is bad now, just imagine what it would be like if you didn't have thousands of guests who don't need to join in that rush because they already have FPs for 7DMT and/or A&E.

If they wanted to combat that, couldn't they just have released some FPs later in the day? Like release 1/10th at rope drop, 1/10th an hour later, etc.?

It just wasn't "sexy" to suggest revamping the system they had. Rolling out a whole new pricey system with tech innovations and snazzy jewelry was "sexier".

 

[Mickey&Mouse]

Oh man, that stinks!

If you ever get another chance, and want a fairly low stress viewing of Wishes, I would recommend watching from the TTC. We weren't in the park that day but parked at the TTC that night and had an easy non-crowded exit right after they were over. We were in bed asleep around half an hour later.

Wishes by mom2rtk, on Flickr

What a beautiful photo!

 

[mom2rtk]

What a beautiful photo!

Thanks! It was an all around great experience.

 

[itchin2go]

That chart also appeared in an item in which the author declared that the Disney brand is "alive and well". So, it is kind of amusing to see some trying to use it to suggest that attendance at Disney isn't really growing at an acceptable rate.

I wouldn't say it's not growing at an acceptable rate (and I'm not sure that's what PP was saying). I would say that it's not growing SO fast that it's impossible to keep up with demand. It appears to me that it's creeping up at a good pace, but it's not like WHAM, overnight the numbers doubled, and heck, how could we have seen that coming and built more rides?

(I mean this in a 100% debate-y, conversational way and with no agenda or malice, but I'm on cold medicine ... FWIW.)

 

[wisblue]

If they wanted to combat that, couldn't they just have released some FPs later in the day? Like release 1/10th at rope drop, 1/10th an hour later, etc.?

It just wasn't "sexy" to suggest revamping the system they had. Rolling out a whole new pricey system with tech innovations and snazzy jewelry was "sexier".

I don't see how that would be workable. All you'd be doing with that is creating lines at the FP machines waiting for the next wave to be released.

 

[itchin2go]

I don't see how that would be workable. All you'd be doing with that is creating lines at the FP machines waiting for the next wave to be released.

Well, sure ... any change would have consequences. But my point is - if the concern were - gosh, people have to get up so early to get FPs and it's just not fair to the people who like to sleep in (which, I don't believe for a minute was even on their radars), there were probably some simpler ways to combat that.

It's academic anyway - just something fun to speculate about.

 

[WillAustin]

Well, sure ... any change would have consequences. But my point is - if the concern were - gosh, people have to get up so early to get FPs and it's just not fair to the people who like to sleep in (which, I don't believe for a minute was even on their radars), there were probably some simpler ways to combat that.

You're right. FP+ wasn't about being fair, even a little bit, it was about locking guests in to stay in the Disney parks in advance.

 

[Barnabe]

No problem bringing it up again. But, rather than rehashing why your presentation and interpretation of those numbers is, in my opinion, very misleading, I'll just provide a link to the thread.

http://www.disboards.com/threads/is-attendance-really-growing.3417528/#post-53809379

I didn't interpret the numbers. I think you are mistaken. All I did was provide a link to Hydroguy's article and ask if attendance had improved. Sorry it upset you that I responded to someone else introducing this information into the thread. That was not my intention.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

As I like to say, they move at a glacial pace. A Star Wars land should have been halfway built already. Avatarland should have been done by now. Frozen should have planned for more than a ride. Adding capacity to Toy Story and Soarin' should have been a 6-9 month project 2-3 years ago. Slow. Slow. Slow. If you have to wait 10 years, it's too slow.

I would like to be a fly on the wall in a boardroom to know exactly why this is.