News Round Up 2017

[TheMaxRebo]

Lord of the rings is in a bind of sorts. People thought Rowling was bad, the Tolkien estate is 10 times worse. They are very very protective of that brand.

It also strikes me as a brand that would be hard to please everyone with - as the hard core fans are really core and then you have the masses that have probably seen some of the movies but not really into it

I guess I am not picturing how a land with a ride or two would fit into a theme park - seems like something you would have to go big on and rely on the very specific target audience to come big

 

[jknezek]

It also strikes me as a brand that would be hard to please everyone with - as the hard core fans are really core and then you have the masses that have probably seen some of the movies but not really into it

I guess I am not picturing how a land with a ride or two would fit into a theme park - seems like something you would have to go big on and rely on the very specific target audience to come big

Absolutely. You'd have to go immersive land like Pandora and SW and HP. And again, I think people underestimate how many people are really into this stuff. Go to a big city Comic-con one day and just watch the teaming crowds and money being spent. It's astonishing.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Absolutely. You'd have to go immersive land like Pandora and SW and HP. And again, I think people underestimate how many people are really into this stuff. Go to a big city Comic-con one day and just watch the teaming crowds and money being spent. It's astonishing.

I guess my thinking is - would something the size of Pandora be enough? Almost seems like you would need an entire park so you had one area for the Hobbit lands and one for the Elves forests, etc. .... would the big time fans be happy with just one area represented? And I know Comic-cons are huge and stuff but you are asking that group to support a theme park 365 days a year - and something they have to travel to not something that comes to a city close to them.

 

[joelkfla]

Its really hot down here now. Without AC we would use other transportation except early and late.

Just another option/choice-nothing difficult for me here.

However we usually visit throughout the winter so it would be great then regardless.

Traveling from DHS to one of the Gondola Resorts (hey! I just coined a term! ) you'll have your choice: wait in the hot sun 20 minutes for a bus, or ride in the shade in a slightly warmish gondola. (DHS does have shelters, but they cover only a small part of the queues.)

 

[jknezek]

I guess my thinking is - would something the size of Pandora be enough? Almost seems like you would need an entire park so you had one area for the Hobbit lands and one for the Elves forests, etc. .... would the big time fans be happy with just one area represented? And I know Comic-cons are huge and stuff but you are asking that group to support a theme park 365 days a year - and something they have to travel to not something that comes to a city close to them.

See this is where I think it gets muddled, because you aren't really asking them to do this. The theme parks are always going to be supported by the multitudes that go to them regardless of whether SW or Avatar or HP or any other IP is represented. The way to boost your attendance is to get the people who may NOT be going to your park to come and check out the cool new thing, or the people to stay a day longer, or to buy a park hopper instead of a regular ticket. This is what HP did for Universal. Universal's park isn't supported by HP fans. It's boosted by the influx of HP fans. There is the normal flow, plus a percent more. Then building the two lands a part and connecting them with their version of a hopper? Brilliant.

This is what you are asking SW fans to do. Will there be a huge crush? Sure, but over the long term, the 50 year+ lifespan of the land being built, what you are really asking is for SW fans to make an extra visit every year or 3, stay an extra day and so on. They don't have to support it 365 days a year. The regular crowds do that. They just need to plus the crowds to make it worthwhile. Now the SW hotel? That is a different animal. There I agree with you. But if you are talking a 100 room boutique, you aren't asking that many people either. Can it be sustained for 10 or 20+ years? That will be the question.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I'm still amazed Universal didn't pick up Lord of the Rings. I guess with Harry Potter another castles and magic and dragon story might be redundant, but that story has been popular for over 70 years and is absolutely timeless because of the setting. Disney's idea for HP was sad. We, as customers, are so much better off for Universal doing it right and kicking Disney's butt on the concept.

Me too...you never know.

Too bad the showrunners at game of thrones are degenerate perverts...that could be a good medieval type concept too under different circumstances

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Traveling from DHS to one of the Gondola Resorts (hey! I just coined a term! ) you'll have your choice: wait in the hot sun 20 minutes for a bus, or ride in the shade in a slightly warmish gondola. (DHS does have shelters, but they cover only a small part of the queues.)

I assume you have been to florida...

What do you see constructed enclosed that does not have air conditioning? Just curious...panhandle/Alabama kinda guy?

 

[TheMaxRebo]

See this is where I think it gets muddled, because you aren't really asking them to do this. The theme parks are always going to be supported by the multitudes that go to them regardless of whether SW or Avatar or HP or any other IP is represented. The way to boost your attendance is to get the people who may NOT be going to your park to come and check out the cool new thing, or the people to stay a day longer, or to buy a park hopper instead of a regular ticket. This is what HP did for Universal. Universal's park isn't supported by HP fans. It's boosted by the influx of HP fans. There is the normal flow, plus a percent more. Then building the two lands a part and connecting them with their version of a hopper? Brilliant.

This is what you are asking SW fans to do. Will there be a huge crush? Sure, but over the long term, the 50 year+ lifespan of the land being built, what you are really asking is for SW fans to make an extra visit every year or 3, stay an extra day and so on. They don't have to support it 365 days a year. The regular crowds do that. They just need to plus the crowds to make it worthwhile. Now the SW hotel? That is a different animal. There I agree with you. But if you are talking a 100 room boutique, you aren't asking that many people either. Can it be sustained for 10 or 20+ years? That will be the question.

I agree with all of this - my point was, is a land in a larger park enough for the rapid Lord of the Rings fans or would they *need* a full park, and is there enough interest to support a full park?

I think if they could add just a land it could be pretty cool - not sure what park it would fit (I guess DHS as they seem to be going with the "immersion" theme there)

 

[STLstone]

Interesting read...

http://www.vulture.com/2017/07/disney-world-pandora-avatar-theme-park.html

When it comes to Star Wars land, it might not really affect Disney's numbers in the end, but I think it's a mistake to not make it out of something directly from the movies.

Wizarding World is like walking into the movie. I don't even like anything about the Harry Potter movies, but Daigon Alley is amazing.

 

[adam.adbe]

Its really hot down here now. Without AC we would use other transportation except early and late.

Just another option/choice-nothing difficult for me here.

However we usually visit throughout the winter so it would be great then regardless.

Except it's unlikely that Disney will leave empty capacity in place. This works out in one of two ways:

#1: The gondolas reduce capacity on buses, so Disney reduce buses.

#2: The gondolas are sitting empty, so Disney reduce buses to move guests to the gondolas.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

When it comes to Star Wars land, it might not really affect Disney's numbers in the end, but I think it's a mistake to not make it out of something directly from the movies.

Wizarding World is like walking into the movie. I don't even like anything about the Harry Potter movies, but Daigon Alley is amazing.

I agree and haven't ranted about this but it's being ignored.

You have 3 eras to use...one is outright rejected...one is planetwide adored...

And the other is what Disney wants...and it's gonna fall somewhere in between as far as longterm appeal.

...and thats why they punted on this...in many ways.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Except it's unlikely that Disney will leave empty capacity in place. This works out in one of two ways:

#1: The gondolas reduce capacity on buses, so Disney reduce buses.

#2: The gondolas are sitting empty, so Disney reduce buses to move guests to the gondolas.

Exaclty...disney USED to eat overhead costs inefficiently to maintain their image. That is OVAH...they will not suffer wasted employees or electricity any longer and really haven't for years.

 

[jknezek]

I agree with all of this - my point was, is a land in a larger park enough for the rapid Lord of the Rings fans or would they *need* a full park, and is there enough interest to support a full park?

I think if they could add just a land it could be pretty cool - not sure what park it would fit (I guess DHS as they seem to be going with the "immersion" theme there)

I don't think Disney will ever make a gate based on one IP. It just isn't good business sense for a variety of reasons. They might have been smart to make a gate based on science fiction and fantasy and rolled Avatar, SW, some sword and magic property like LotR, and Superheroes into it. Each one of those properties with 1 teen+ plus ride, two family rides, and one kiddie ride, a show type attraction, a meet and greet, a qs or fs, and shopping would have been one heck of a park. But it isn't going to happen now. I just don't see a 5th gate happening while it is pretty apparent that three of the four WDW parks have pretty large numbers of people calling them half day parks. Disney really needs to fix that first. That means fixing Dinoland and adding at least 4 more family rides to AK, finishing the current construction and probably one more expansion at DHS, and getting everything in EPCOT up and running again. Once that is done, if the crowds are still coming and start growing again, then you start to think about a fifth gate. But it won't be based on one property. Too much money in one basket.

 

[adam.adbe]

Lord of the rings is in a bind of sorts. People thought Rowling was bad, the Tolkien estate is 10 times worse. They are very very protective of that brand.

It's not the brand. JRR hated Disney, and had no time for theme parks or the like. Christopher has always been clear that in his mind, he's just following his father's wishes for the property. It's a bit muddy because the Zaentz company has quite extensive rights to The Hobbit and LOTR, but AFAIK theme park would would need to be approved by the Tolkien estate.

 

[joelkfla]

I assume you have been to florida...

What do you see constructed enclosed that does not have air conditioning? Just curious...panhandle/Alabama kinda guy?

I live in Orlando. But I don't go outside during July & August.

But, seriously -- I support the a/c option. Just sayin' hopping into a shaded and moving gondola might look pretty attractive after standing in the sun for 10 minutes.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Disney doesn't Need Any whole parks...but they could use a large kick butt ip section (bigger than avatar or star war) to really lock in the demographic that has strayed to the competition in the past and could be poised to move to whatever universal does next.

 

[jknezek]

When it comes to Star Wars land, it might not really affect Disney's numbers in the end, but I think it's a mistake to not make it out of something directly from the movies.

Wizarding World is like walking into the movie. I don't even like anything about the Harry Potter movies, but Daigon Alley is amazing.

And as I keep saying, you are going to walk right into piloting the Millenium Falcon. How is that not something directly from the movies? Piloting that ship, which appears in 4 of the movies so far, is a dream of most everyone who has ever even liked Star Wars.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I live in Orlando. But I don't go outside during July & August.

But, seriously -- I support the a/c option. Just sayin' hopping into a shaded and moving gondola might look pretty attractive after standing in the sun for 10 minutes.

I think you've proved my point...I still have a hard time believing this is gonna be a string of Dutch ovens for half the year. Really a hard stance to defend.

 

[jknezek]

It's not the brand. JRR hated Disney, and had no time for theme parks or the like. Christopher has always been clear that in his mind, he's just following his father's wishes for the property. It's a bit muddy because the Zaentz company has quite extensive rights to The Hobbit and LOTR, but AFAIK theme park would would need to be approved by the Tolkien estate.

Well this is certainly true. JRR thought Disney was a crass peasant making entertainment for the underclass, something not worthy of the praise Disney received.

 

[Redcon1]

I disagree here. If you're staying at All-Stars and decide you want to drive to MK but come park in the BLT/Contemporary lot without going into that resort for food/shopping, I think you should have to pay at that location.

I wonder how many people staying on-site with vehicles would do that. By the time you park at the Contemporary and walk over to the MK, plus walking back to your car at park closing and possibly getting stuck in heavy traffic, to me, it wouldn't be worth the hassle for the bit of time you might save in the morning. I, myself, would prefer to use Disney transportation even if I had a car.

Someone suggested charging a $30 fee for parking at the hotels which would be more than MK parking. There could be a limit on the time spent, say at the Contemporary, of three hours or less, then the guest could receive a partial or full refund if they depart the hotel within those three hours. Someone else mentioned about Downtown Disney in Anaheim doing this within a two-hour window. I don't see why this couldn't work at the hotels as well in WDW.