New security measure: Do not disturb signs being Removed!

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

I really don't see how much they are going to be able to see at the front desk anyway. If I was doing human trafficking I'd leave them in the car, do my checkin and then head up. I'm not sure how a front desk visit would really help that much.

I also have no problems with HK coming by. I normally want them to come by every day and clean my room so come on by.

So this whole thread is about people coming into to your room ... You say you don't object to this so you're not particularly impacted as they have basically said either housekeeping check or security check. So really you're not trying to minimize contact with WDW CM/security. Which if you allow housekeeping is zero issue for you. We love housekeeping so we only call when they don't come....

If when we check in at the front desk they see a child that matches the age identifier we've provided on our booking for the past 10 years I'm thinking that they may have more confidence that he's our actual child... add to the fact they have photopass/memory maker photos which show him should allow WDW to know that we have our actual child with us.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

I think both posters (you and the other poster) have points though.

However, front desk is only required of the main person who is on the reservation. Now that may lead to suspicious behavior coming out but it would probably have a low percentage of actually catching something in all honesty.

Totally don't disagree with this at all but....

When we check in at the front desk they have always seen our entire party because we are international guests.... why they decided not to do that for domestic guests if this was the major issue it seems to be is anyone's guess (as a cynic I'd say cost and to avoid interacting with actual guests... rather than guest convenience.) --- so there should be some way for them to designate that. Also they SHOULD see that we check in with a child that matches what they expect from MDE and our past visits (he's aged from 8 months to 12 years during our visits ---- that have also been recorded in their systems --- so if they see us check in with a 12 year old who the front desk speaks with the CM should alleviate some concerns... it should not represent the same risk as someone who has never visited before --- AGAIN they have the data so USE IT.) If everything seems OK and we don't refuse housekeeping it should be fairly run of the mill. If we sleep in one morning it should not trigger an alarm that requires security coming by..... if we do that multiple mornings then fine. It is about reasonableness... They have this info from our yearly visits so .... THEY SHOULD HAVE THE INFO AND MAKE THEIR DECISIONS BASED ON THAT!

 

[Krandor]

So this whole thread is about people coming into to your room ... You say you don't object to this so you're not particularly impacted as they have basically said either housekeeping check or security check. So really you're not trying to minimize contact with WDW CM/security. Which if you allow housekeeping is zero issue for you. We love housekeeping so we only call when they don't come....

If when we check in at the front desk they see a child that matches the age identifier we've provided on our booking for the past 10 years I'm thinking that they may have more confidence that he's our actual child... add to the fact they have photopass/memory maker photos which show him should allow WDW to know that we have our actual child with us.

A year ago when I did dopey a friend of mine and her child came with me mainly because since I was already paying for a hotel room made for a less expensive way for them to be able to come and enjoy disney. Should I be questioned at the front desk about that since that child would be in none of my records for any previous visit?

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Totally don't disagree with this at all but....

When we check in at the front desk they have always seen our entire party because we are international guests.... why they decided not to do that for domestic guests if this was the major issue it seems to be is anyone's guess (as a cynic I'd say cost and to avoid interacting with actual guests... rather than guest convenience.) --- so there should be some way for them to designate that. Also they SHOULD see that we check in with a child that matches what they expect from MDE and our past visits (he's aged from 8 months to 12 years during our visits ---- that have also been recorded in their systems --- so if they see us check in with a 12 year old who the front desk speaks with the CM should alleviate some concerns... it should not represent the same risk as someone who has never visited before --- AGAIN they have the data so USE IT.) If everything seems OK and we don't refuse housekeeping it should be fairly run of the mill. If we sleep in one morning it should not trigger an alarm that requires security coming by..... if we do that multiple mornings then fine. It is about reasonableness... They have this info from our yearly visits so .... THEY SHOULD HAVE THE INFO AND MAKE THEIR DECISIONS BASED ON THAT!

If when we check in at the front desk they see a child that matches the age identifier we've provided on our booking for the past 10 years I'm thinking that they may have more confidence that he's our actual child... add to the fact they have photopass/memory maker photos which show him should allow WDW to know that we have our actual child with us.

Respectfully and just speaking about the front desk-In all honestly I think you are taking too much stock in what they would be doing at the front desk.

I don't think that the majority of people lug everyone out of the vehicle if they drove or lug everyone including their luggage up with them into the check in line. I sure as heck know the All-Stars doesn't have the room for that at all and enough people would be grateful not to have very energetic children or ones having meltdowns out of the line. I'm not entirely confident that a front desk employee is looking up and down inspecting the child (if you have them up there with you), guessing their exact age, trying to figure out if he's your exact child or not (what about adoptions that occur too), looking at past bookings etc. It's common enough to invite friends and family members and they may be new to the reservation and they may not be on the next reservation too. That in itself shouldn't be cause for alarm.

Disney isn't basing your comings and goings off of previous years. Goodness that to be honest makes little sense. What my husband and I do in our 20s is likely different come the time when we bring our children (that we hope to have) and would have been different for sure had my in-laws (who are in their 60s) came with us this past September. In a nutshell what we do one trip may be completely different from another trip. Plus you have people like me that don't go often enough and heck this past September was my first time on site. I surely hope that if I stay on site next time I go (which will likely be 50th anniversary or a few years after that) Disney isn't sitting there questioning why I'm not out in the parks for 12-14 hours but instead in the parks for less time or that I'm leaving later than I did last time or that I'm coming back earlier than I did last time and then creating an alarm based on that. And hopefully Disney isn't questioning why the next time we go if we stay on site why all of a sudden we reflect young children and possibly another adult (who would be my mom) And hopefully if years down the road Disney isn't questioning if we go and stay on site and bring a friend of our child(ren) why all of a sudden we have another child on the reservation. And hopefully Disney isn't questioning if we go and stay on site even more years later and that child the we brought with us that was our child(ren)'s friend didn't come.

Essentially the data you speak of really isn't feasible nor usable for Disney for the exact purpose you're wanting it to be. There are way too many variables here that should not be cause for an alarm.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

A year ago when I did dopey a friend of mine and her child came with me mainly because since I was already paying for a hotel room made for a less expensive way for them to be able to come and enjoy disney. Should I be questioned at the front desk about that since that child would be in none of my records for any previous visit?

Since I have no idea about what doing a "dopey" is I have no idea what you're talking about but I assume WDW does... so if this was outside of the pattern of your normal booking this would had made you more likely to be looked at in any other circumstance...... just based on your normal pattern with WDW. You do know that this is how it works in many other different situations in the real world where peoples patterns change be it international travel or shopping or internet site visits or really much of what happens in modern life. So yes there's really no more or less reason for checking you at check-in versus someone who has come for years that chooses to stay in their room because of a migraine.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

Disney isn't basing your comings and goings off of previous years. Goodness that to be honest makes little sense. What my husband and I do in our 20s is likely different come the time when we bring our children (that we hope to have) and would have been different for sure had my in-laws (who are in their 60s) came with us this past September. In a nutshell what we do one trip may be completely different from another trip. Plus you have people like me that don't go often enough and heck this past September was my first time on site. I surely hope that if I stay on site next time I go (which will likely be 50th anniversary or a few years after that) Disney isn't sitting there questioning why I'm not out in the parks for 12-14 hours but instead in the parks for less time or that I'm leaving later than I did last time or that I'm coming back earlier than I did last time and then creating an alarm based on that. And hopefully Disney isn't questioning why the next time we go if we stay on site why all of a sudden we reflect young children and possibly another adult (who would be my mom) And hopefully if years down the road Disney isn't questioning if we go and stay on site and bring a friend of our child(ren) why all of a sudden we have another child on the reservation. And hopefully Disney isn't questioning if we go and stay on site even more years later and that child the we brought with us that was our child(ren)'s friend didn't come.

Essentially the data you speak of really isn't feasible nor usable for Disney for the exact purpose you're wanting it to be. There are way too many variables here that should not be cause for an alarm.

Absolutely they should use Big Data and if you don't think they do for a zillion reasons... marketing, security, etc... then you are in total denial. Every corporation you deal with does this.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Absolutely they should use Big Data and if you don't think they do for a zillion reasons... marketing, security, etc... then you are in total denial. Every corporation you deal with does this.

Marketing sure. As soon as I signed up for an MDE account I got mailings. As soon as my husband watched a quick video for SWA RR pts Disney sent him and still does from time to time about DCL. I'm not ignorant about marketing at all.

But marketing is completely absolutely different than checking for human trafficking. What parameters you set up is something I highly doubt front desk employees are actually doing. Especially given that you mentioned earlier "Your 5 minutes.." at the front desk.

You're missing a lot of the details honestly that change from trip to trip and details that cannot be acertained if not all members of the reservation are even at the front desk to even use all this data you speak of.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Since I have no idea about what doing a "dopey" is I have no idea what you're talking about but I assume WDW does

I'm assuming for dopey they are meaning the Run Disney Marathon that has the Dopey Challenge.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

Essentially the data you speak of really isn't feasible nor usable for Disney for the exact purpose you're wanting it to be.

I'm not really sure if this is that you don't think really happens or you if just have faith that isn't .... but it is actually used everywhere, everyday, in many ways most people don't expect. It is totally feasible to use and totally done everyday single day through every EULA you ever agreed to and in many ways that most people don't think about -- including by corporations such as Disney. Interesting but troubling that people don't assume that this data is used by these corporations.

Disney sees that the child you bring over the years has moved through WDW child tickets to adult tickets. Is it the same group every year etc... what do you do... well they child went to kids club in XX year then this year you booked a room where he was this age and bought a ticket for this age group. Not rocket science and WDW has the data and can and will use it --- whether you see it or not.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

I'm assuming for dopey they are meaning the Run Disney Marathon that has the Dopey Challenge.

Not a marathoner so no idea.... but I'm guessing WDW knows... and they will use it to sell you shoes, rooms, admission, etc... all part of big data.

If there's something to know about you from the WDW various sites (store, resort, tv, video, etc...)... assume they all know... and they'll all use it for marketing or for whatever purpose the EULA you agreed to allows. Assuming anything less is not probably very wise.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I'm not really sure if this is that you don't think really happens or you if just have faith that isn't .... but it is actually used everywhere, everyday, in many ways most people don't expect. It is totally feasible to use and totally done everyday single day through every EULA you ever agreed to and in many ways that most people don't thing about -- including by corporations such as Disney. Interesting but troubling that people don't assume that this data is used by these corporations.

Disney sees that the child you bring over the years has moved through WDW child tickets to adult tickets. Is it the same group every year etc... what do you do... well they child went to kids club in XX year then this year you booked a room where he was this age and bought a ticket for this age group. Not rocket science and WDW has the data and can and will use it --- whether you see it or not.

Yeah I don't think we're going to see eye to eye on this. I don't know if you're actually considering anyone aside from your family that may stay the same characteristics year after year but millions of other visitors to Disney do not stay the same year after year. I do not think that the front desk employee is actually doing as indepth information as you think they are or should be.

And I have no idea what you mean by "Interesting but troubling that people don't assume that this data is used by these corporations." I already said I wasn't ignorant to marketing. Please don't insult me by assuming I don't have knowledge of what information is being collected.

But I do not think that Disney is using your child's age and attempting at the front desk to figure out if the kid (if the kid is even standing there at the front desk because the entire traveling party is not required to be at the front desk) is your exact kid. They are not detectives there at the front desk. And they sure as heck had absolutely no time whatsoever to deal with that the Friday before Irma hit. None of those employees had any time to do anything other than be on the phone extending people's stays or getting them a room to hole up in during Irma. I do not think Disney is looking at the fact that you left early in the morning in 2017 but in 2018 you're leaving later.

But if you are confident in your take on the front desk situation in having every person go to the front desk and every person required to be at the front desk who is in the traveling party in order for the front desk employee to do their detective work I would honestly highly suggest you write in to Disney regarding your possible solution.

 

[Krandor]

Since I have no idea about what doing a "dopey" is I have no idea what you're talking about but I assume WDW does... so if this was outside of the pattern of your normal booking this would had made you more likely to be looked at in any other circumstance...... just based on your normal pattern with WDW. You do know that this is how it works in many other different situations in the real world where peoples patterns change be it international travel or shopping or internet site visits or really much of what happens in modern life. So yes there's really no more or less reason for checking you at check-in versus someone who has come for years that chooses to stay in their room because of a migraine.

Dopey is a rundisney race.

So what should I have to do at check-in to prove that everything is legit in this situation where I show up with a friend and her child who haven't been to WDW with me in the past?

 

[Krandor]

I'm assuming for dopey they are meaning the Run Disney Marathon that has the Dopey Challenge.

Correct. I mostly do trips for rundisney races so often think of my trips in terms of the which race weekend it is.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

And I have no idea what you mean by "Interesting but troubling that people don't assume that this data is used by these corporations." I already said I wasn't ignorant to marketing. Please don't insult me by assuming I don't have knowledge of what information is being collected.

But I do not think that Disney is using your child's age and attempting at the front desk to figure out if the kid (if the kid is even standing there at the front desk because the entire traveling party is not required to be at the front desk) is your exact kid. They are not detectives there at the front desk. And they sure as heck had absolutely no time whatsoever to deal with that the Friday before Irma hit. None of those employees had any time to do anything other than be on the phone extending people's stays or getting them a room to hole up in during Irma. I do not think Disney is looking at the fact that you left early in the morning in 2017 but in 2018 you're leaving later.

But if you are confident in your take on the front desk situation in having every person go to the front desk and every person required to be at the front desk who is in the traveling party in order for the front desk employee to do their detective work I would honestly highly suggest you write in to Disney regarding your possible solution.

I think maybe the only thing we'll agree on is that we don't agree...

There are many departments in a corporation other than "marketing" which seems to be your focus. I work in IT Security and they can see lots, lots, and lots of data (photos, data, facebook, credit cards, etc....). Where a company can see my Memory Maker photos (which WDW can should they choose to) you would see it's an evolving version of the same person if they are really checking for human trafficking. If you don't think they'll do this then again --- that's awesome.

I think you're simplifying my statement about the front desk for your purposes but that's fine --- it's convenient and if you think that eyes on guests aren't what WDW is looking for then --- again awesome. There was certainly a time where Hotel/Motels wanted to see everyone checking into a room at the time of check in -- because it meant they had some notion of if the people registered in the room matched those checking in. The convenience of online check-in aside doesn't offset the value of a check in person seeing the actual people. Again we'll agree to disagree and I won't waste my time or yours on trying to get you to see the value of eyeballing at checkin but WDW lost something when they agreed to let people go to their rooms without any notion of who/how many they were. They now see some value when they want housekeeping/security to check people/rooms out.

 

[Krandor]

I think maybe the only thing we'll agree on is that we don't agree...

There are many departments in a corporation other than "marketing" which seems to be your focus. I work in IT Security and they can see lots, lots, and lots of data (photos, data, facebook, credit cards, etc....). Where a company can see my Memory Maker photos (which WDW can should they choose to) you would see it's an evolving version of the same person if they are really checking for human trafficking. If you don't think they'll do this then again --- that's awesome.

I think you're simplifying my statement about the front desk for your purposes but that's fine --- it's convenient and if you think that eyes on guests aren't what WDW is looking for then --- again awesome. There was certainly a time where Hotel/Motels wanted to see everyone checking into a room at the time of check in -- because it meant they had some notion of if the people registered in the room matched those checking in. The convenience of online check-in aside doesn't offset the value of a check in person seeing the actual people. Again we'll agree to disagree and I won't waste my time or yours on trying to get you to see the value of eyeballing at checkin but WDW lost something when they agreed to let people go to their rooms without any notion of who/how many they were. They now see some value when they want housekeeping/security to check people/rooms out.

Two things.

1) Check in doesn't require (or shouldn't) everybody to be there. They only see the primary person on the account. Requiring the whole party to be present at a front desk check-in would be unreasonable especially if people are arriving at different times.
2) Eyes on guests is not what WDW is looking for - If I check in online, run my race, then go to the parks the rest of the day (my normal routine) unless they come by in the small window when I'm changing between race and park they will never see me... and that would fit perfectly with the new policy.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I think maybe the only thing we'll agree on is that we don't agree...

There are many departments in a corporation other than "marketing" which seems to be your focus. I work in IT Security and they can see lots, lots, and lots of data (photos, data, facebook, credit cards, etc....). Where a company can see my Memory Maker photos (which WDW can should they choose to) you would see it's an evolving version of the same person if they are really checking for human trafficking. If you don't think they'll do this then again --- that's awesome.

I think you're simplifying my statement about the front desk for your purposes but that's fine --- it's convenient and if you think that eyes on guests aren't what WDW is looking for then --- again awesome. There was certainly a time where Hotel/Motels wanted to see everyone checking into a room at the time of check in -- because it meant they had some notion of if the people registered in the room matched those checking in. The convenience of online check-in aside doesn't offset the value of a check in person seeing the actual people. Again we'll agree to disagree and I won't waste my time or yours on trying to get you to see the value of eyeballing at checkin but WDW lost something when they agreed to let people go to their rooms without any notion of who/how many they were. They now see some value when they want housekeeping/security to check people/rooms out.

You're back to insulting my knowledge but ok. Yeah we'll leave it as agree to disagree and move on.

 

[HopperFan]

The thing that I found interesting about this... if it is human trafficking that is the reason for this is --- why allow so many options to opt out of contact with CMs.... You don't have to go to the desk at check in anymore, you can opt to skip housekeeping at Values/some mods, etc.... both of which they should stop before they institute random checks of every guest. The front desk and housekeeping could easily be the first eyes on a problem.

We use the same MDE account for every trip so they know, our contact/address/credit card info, who we travel with, where we stay, we add our flight info, they can see our ADR numbers, our extra event bookings, where we stay and who is in our party, where we eat, which parks we go to , which rides we like, what events we're willing to part with additional dollars for, what we buy, our mousekeeping history, etc.... Big data is important... if WDW were using it right this would not be an issue.... If they're not using this data in making their decisions it's not excusable... someone/or many people should be fired.

These checks should be defined by the data WDW already has about previous guests (and yes this may mean new guests get more checks --- but really it's like any business relationship --- disney knows regular, return guests more than new guests...) Also when you think of it they can see more of you than you even think ---- facebook, twitter, internet postings, blogs, etc....

Each time we've been there recently the front desk person has engaged my son in conversation at check in (since we're international guests we have to pick up our magic bands at the desk) --- so maybe everyone should have this initial interaction -- if this is really a concern versus a lawsuit checklist..

I have well over 135 stays at Disney, they absolutely know way too much about me. Before online I would book via phone and they will say "oh is x, x and x coming back with you" ........ NONE of that would tie into this situation, if that is what it is, because these folks will leave as little data evidence as they can.

There is an assumption that these "guests" are listing their real name, and repeating it with each visit. They are not. With multiple IDs, credit/debit cards, it is very easy to register and pay for a room under multiple names. Our IT age has made it very easy to be someone else, real or not.

There is the assumption these "children/teens/adults" are on the reservation with them, so eyes on them would be a sign. WHY would they create an association online or in person? There would be no extras listed on the reservation, they would not be coming to front desk with them to check in. The extras don't need MagicBands or anything else from Disney.

There would be nothing electronically or visually to signal someone else is going to that room. Disney allows anyone to come through the gate to "eat" at the resort so the extra guests could be brought later after check in is complete. The only thing that will help at this point is eyes in the rooms, and catching guests off guard.

MANY guests do not put their tickets on MDE [shocking how many don't do FP+], don't buy tickets as all as they are there for work or other activity, don't make ADR .......... so a guest not having any of these things may be strange to most, certainly not unheard of or instant guilt.

Disney has enough IT problems, they aren't on FB, twitter etc stalking guests ..... if it is an issue that is being watched, it's the law enforcement handling that stuff.

The problem is the direct to room has been going on for years and to pull back wouldn't make change anything. Opting out of housekeeping is a straight up staffing nightmare for Disney. They have upped their signing bonus from $500 to $1250 - clearly they are not only short but losing them. So they are in a hard spot.

Honestly Disney needs to think about going tech in a way they don't now ......... LOTS of cameras. If they had cameras on each hall, and only one person watching screens at each resort (replacing the room inspectors) they would then actually see the rooms with guests going in and out too often, that look like they don't belong - and then it would be on video.

This is a sophisticated industry which is why law enforcement is having such a hard time getting it under control or even scratch the surface. Aside from the great customer base coming in to Disney, the sheer size of the Disney hotels makes it much easier for them.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I have well over 135 stays at Disney, they absolutely know way too much about me. Before online I would book via phone and they will say "oh is x, x and x coming back with you" ........ NONE of that would tie into this situation, if that is what it is, because these folks will leave as little data evidence as they can.

There is an assumption that these "guests" are listing their real name, and repeating it with each visit. They are not. With multiple IDs, credit/debit cards, it is very easy to register and pay for a room under multiple names. Our IT age has made it very easy to be someone else, real or not.

There is the assumption these "children/teens/adults" are on the reservation with them, so eyes on them would be a sign. WHY would they create an association online or in person? There would be no extras listed on the reservation, they would not be coming to front desk with them to check in. The extras don't need MagicBands or anything else from Disney.

There would be nothing electronically or visually to signal someone else is going to that room. Disney allows anyone to come through the gate to "eat" at the resort so the extra guests could be brought later after check in is complete. The only thing that will help at this point is eyes in the rooms, and catching guests off guard.

MANY guests do not put their tickets on MDE [shocking how many don't do FP+], don't buy tickets as all as they are there for work or other activity, don't make ADR .......... so a guest not having any of these things may be strange to most, certainly not unheard of or instant guilt.

Disney has enough IT problems, they aren't on FB, twitter etc stalking guests ..... if it is an issue that is being watched, it's the law enforcement handling that stuff.

The problem is the direct to room has been going on for years and to pull back wouldn't make change anything. Opting out of housekeeping is a straight up staffing nightmare for Disney. They have upped their signing bonus from $500 to $1250 - clearly they are not only short but losing them. So they are in a hard spot.

Honestly Disney needs to think about going tech in a way they don't now ......... LOTS of cameras. If they had cameras on each hall, and only one person watching screens at each resort (replacing the room inspectors) they would then actually see the rooms with guests going in and out too often, that look like they don't belong - and then it would be on video.

This is a sophisticated industry which is why law enforcement is having such a hard time getting it under control or even scratch the surface. Aside from the great customer base coming in to Disney, the sheer size of the Disney hotels makes it much easier for them.

You just reminded me how often the advice to create a 'phantom' person on your MDE account for the purposes of ticket assignments and/or FP assignments is given here on the DIS.

 

[rteetz]

While I appreciate the ongoing discussion it’s seems to have gone on a tangent a bit. If you want to further this discussion I suggest joining the existing thread on the resorts board.