New Parking Structure/Pedestrian Bridge Question

[ClaraOswald]

Sorry, your "depression" is misguided...everyone is in a tizzy that they will HAVE to walk through the new Eastern Gateway transportation center to enter the park. Where is everyone getting this from???? Just based on speculation?

In fact, the management of HOJO has said just the OPPOSITE that in their discussions with Disney they were assured there would still be a Harbor Blvd crossing and was confirmed in the OC register Q&A piece.

I am all for brainstorming how things will get implemented, but sheesh, settle down people!

People are talking about WHERE the supposed crosswalk on Harbor will be. If the one in the 'middle' is eliminated...it really does add a lot of walking for people in the hotels in that area. When the main reason people choose those hotels is because of the short walking distance...it makes sense to be annoyed with a lot of extra walking (either to a new/different crosswalk farther away or whatever.)

If people want to be depressed or upset...let them. It shouldn't effect your day.

 

[ParkHopper1]

If people want to be depressed or upset...let them. It shouldn't effect your day.

Does not at all effect my day at all if folks want to get worked up...depressed, annoyed...overjoyed...whatever they want to feel over speculation and unconfirmed information.

I am however for making sure that what folks are reading here is distinguished between confirmed facts vs speculation so this board maintains its credibility for the casual reader unlike some of the "other" Disneyland boards.

That lack of distinction is evident based on many posts in this thread.

 

[az4boys]

Does not at all effect my day at all if folks want to get worked up...depressed, annoyed...overjoyed...whatever they want to feel over speculation and unconfirmed information.

I am however for making sure that what folks are reading here is distinguished between confirmed facts vs speculation so this board maintains its credibility for the casual reader unlike some of the "other" Disneyland boards.

That lack of distinction is evident based on many posts in this thread.

Well it seems that you replied to my earlier post without actually reading it beyond the word depressing. I think what I said was very factual. Barring some complete overhaul of the plan, the transportation hub will be behind the harbor motels and there is a good chance (not certain) that the crosswalk at Ihop will be eliminated. Both will increase walking distance for many of us. For our family it will have a big impact on where we choose to stay and our strategy for the day.

 

[Darkbeer1]

az4boys, I think I need to apologize for my history, I have covered Disneyland and many other Theme Parks and related items for two decades, and for many different websites, plus have had information used in Newspapers, including Associated Press, books and magazines (and a true reporter getting paid for my work with Press Credentials), plus work behind the scenes for TV programs shown on things like the Travel Channel. It is a long history, and does cover stories that include advance information and rumors, and can get changed after publication. Some folks have had have issues with it, but overall, the info I have stated has been proven correct, with a few things that needed a correction, but then again, that is why newspapers have their "correction" column on a regular basis. So it seems a couple of folks have an issue with me in general.

As a current resident of Anaheim and regular park visitor, this story drew my attention, especially since I have been dealing with city government for multiple reasons not related to Theme Parks lately, and why I posted the info I did.

I have tried to make it clear what is true fact, what is partially agreed to, and has actually has gotten the green light. And since these are "Discussion Boards", that is what we are doing, discussing the news.

My advice, ignore them, and keep posting your opinions and thoughts, that is why the DIS boards are here.

Have a great day!

 

[Nonsuch]

Just quoting the beginning and ending of your post:

I truly understand, and some places will be "winners" and some losers, but the same thing happened when Disneyland was converted from a one park location to a Resort location...

...Only time will tell, but yes, as of today, I would say those Motels, Hotels, Restaurants and Shops on the East Side of Harbor between Manchester and Disney Way will be mainly losers in the overall plan.

Many of those businesses on the East Side of Harbor already existed prior to building DCA and the current transportation hub. They were certainly "winners" back in 2001, but likely "losers" in 2018.

It's easy to forget how pedestrian unfriendly Harbor Blvd was prior to 2001. There were no traffic lights or crosswalks on Harbor between 5 and Disney Way, and no sidewalk on the West side either.

The 4-star Anaheim Plaza replacement and Gardenwalk will both benefit from the Eastern Gateway, since a pedestrian entrance will be directly across Disney Way.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Heck, nonsuch, look at the reaction Walt Disney had when he got frustrated in not being able to control the area that he bought in 1953/1954. There are many sources that talk about the issue.

Starting with having to allow a friend, Jack Wrather build the Disneyland Hotel and give him the rights to the name.

His solution, when they had enough money to build a second location, to buy as much land around the two original parks in Florida as possible so his company could control as much as possible.

So I am looking forward to the upgrades in the parks, and well, with the good, comes the bad.

 

[Indiana Scott]

We don't go to WDW because we don't want to do all the walking. If they do away with the crossing in the middle of Harbor we will likely start skipping even more of our once, annual trips.

 

[Darkbeer1]

We don't go to WDW because we don't want to do all the walking. If they do away with the crossing in the middle of Harbor we will likely start skipping even more of our once, annual trips.

Yes, this has been a big difference ever since WDW opened, Florida was designed to be isolated, and even the transportation between the Disney owned Hotels and the parks can be a big pain.

On the other hand, here in Anaheim, we have a lot of benefits, like the walk between the two parks, instead of needing transportation, easier access to non-Disney owned hotels, plus other tourist attractions, shopping, restaurants, etc.

Will the changes make a minor change, yes, but as I mentioned earlier, how much walking do you do now within the parks? What we are talking about is about an extra half mile or so round trip to the Motels on the east side of Harbor, depending on the specific location. Still a LOT better than WDW both in walking distance and waiting time for transportation, at least in my opinion.

 

[STLstone]

Ok, if you look at the map Disney submitted on page one (Green Colored area), plus the City of Anaheim Planning Commission website (DEV2016-00014), what is going in front of the Planning commission is the EAST Side of Harbor project, and the boundary ends at the end of the ramp on the east side of Harbor. It does not cover the actual bridge or any work being done on the West Side, the map Disney submitted clearly states that the West side of Harbor section of the drawing is not "Not a part of the CUP and Final Plan - Included for Reference Only". (CUP - Conditional Use Permit). So all Disney is doing currently is to get approval for Phase 1 of the project, which is the East Side area, as that has to be done and available for use before most of the West Side of the project is completed.

So the bridge isn't even on the plate yet, and how it would effect the Monorail.

This is a very important point. This CUP submittal does not include any of the work at the street level on Harbor - which means whatever is to happen there is not "official." I believe that Ho Jo's is accurately reporting what they were told by Disney, but those plans haven't actually been submitted and may be subject to change. So we're all left to argue about our best guess based on partial info.

But I disagree that "the bridge" is not included in this submission. It appears to be enclosed in the dashed red line that encompasses the rest of the work being done under this CUP.

 

[Darkbeer1]

The map shown at the Anaheim Planning Commission site shows the project ends on the East Side, and does not include the bridge or west side. (Number 4 of the August 9th filing date)

http://gis.anaheim.net/developmentactivity/

Though I did get a good laugh reading the bottom of the map, and stating "City of Anaheim, County of Los Angeles.. " And yes, when the city of Anaheim was formed, it was part of Los Angeles County decades ago.

 

[STLstone]

The map shown at the Anaheim Planning Commission site shows the project ends on the East Side, and does not include the bridge or west side. (Number 4 of the August 9th filing date)

http://gis.anaheim.net/developmentactivity/

Though I did get a good laugh reading the bottom of the map, and stating "City of Anaheim, County of Los Angeles.. " And yes, when the city of Anaheim was formed, it was part of Los Angeles County decades ago.

That is interesting. That map also shows the U.S.C.I.S included, but it's left out of the other map. Admittedly, I don't know where the map I posted came from. I just reposted it from the beginning of the thread.

 

[Darkbeer1]

That is interesting. That map also shows the U.S.C.I.S included, but it's left out of the other map. Admittedly, I don't know where the map I posted came from. I just reposted it from the beginning of the thread.

I am pretty sure that came from Disney as part of a select press release to only a few members of the media, which also included the concept art used by the OC Register and LA Times, in regards to the filing of the proposal with the city to meet the deadline for a September hearing. Since Disney knew the cat was going to be let out of the bag, they were trying to make sure it had the best "spin" possible for them.

Editing to add, the OC Register took the first map, and redid it for publication, which is slightly different than the one shown on page one of this thread. Here is that revised version.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/disney-725346-parking-disneyland.html?graphics

 

[Kindermouse]

but as I mentioned earlier, how much walking do you do now within the parks? What we are talking about is about an extra half mile or so round trip to the Motels on the east side of Harbor, depending on the specific location.

Maybe I'm weird (I've been accused of being worse) but I have very different feelings and I go through a very different experience between the walking I do inside the park and each step I have to endure past the current security check point. The walking in the parks is tiresome but the walk down harbor after all that in park walking it agonizing. The walk down harbor makes me a grumpy sourpus who doesnt want to come back to disney anymore. Its a rough walk that comes after I already used up all the walking I felt I had in me for the day. I have walked in the parks until my feet literally bled but not one of the steps that led to that was as difficult and the handful I had to do to leave the parks.

So to me that extra half a mile of walking is like comparing applesauce and apple bottom jeans. they might sound alike but to me it is no comparison. I am assuming that those who are upset about this feel similarly. Just an extra half a mile you say. What I'm hearing is "its just an extra half a mile of walking...over a bed of nails.

Harbor walking and main street walking are 2 very different kinds of walking.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Also, if you go back in History to the original expansion plans from the 1990's, where Disney did agree to pay for the road improvements, but the actual work on West Street (aka Disneyland Drive) and Magic Way including the realignment of the road, the DTD bridge, and even the flyover over Ball Road were all done by city (and its contractors) for legal reasons. (Public roadways).

And the Mickey and Friends Parking structure was built and owned by the city, and leased back to Disney in a deal that allows the city to recover costs from getting a portion of the parking fees to make sure the deal was break-even.

Another piece of related history is the Park Vue Inn and how it reacted to a proposal for a new public transit system that wanted the land (First Monorail/Peoplemover that changed to rail, and now looks like just a rapid bus system). The Park Vue spent money on improvements and submitted plans for a big project before a deadline that would make it much more expensive to buy using eminent domain, and no longer considered by the city to purchase.

http://voiceofoc.org/2014/02/anaheim-hotelier-dont-take-my-family-legacy-for-street

It is a very complex situation that while started a few years ago, has only really just started.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Maybe I'm weird (I've been accused of being worse) but I have very different feelings and I go through a very different experience between the walking I do inside the park and each step I have to endure past the current security check point.....

Remember that the proposed changes have Disney controlling the new walkway from Disney Way and Harbor, the new sidewalk behind the Motels, and the bridge. So I presume Disney will theme the entire area like the rest of the resort. So the only "generic" portion will be the walk south on Harbor to Disney Way.

Yes, it is frustrating and disappointing for those who normally stay in the East Side of Harbor near the middle of Manchester and Disney Way. But which is better?, the new Star Wars and Marvel Lands, or dealing with a bit longer walk? That is a personal decision....

 

[smartlabelprint]

Well it seems that you replied to my earlier post without actually reading it beyond the word depressing. I think what I said was very factual. Barring some complete overhaul of the plan, the transportation hub will be behind the harbor motels and there is a good chance (not certain) that the crosswalk at Ihop will be eliminated. Both will increase walking distance for many of us. For our family it will have a big impact on where we choose to stay and our strategy for the day.

Maybe the bridge will be built in such a way that it can be entered via stairs at harbor near I hop. All speculation after all.

 

[Darkbeer1]

One more related thought, and this related to those who like camping and RV options, two major ones were removed to improve the resort.

A Major Campsite with RV parking was removed to build the Mickey and Friends parking structure. And recently the RV park at the corner of Harbor and Ball was bought by Disney to allow more Cast Member parking.

I am pretty sure those folks were disappointed in the changes in needing to find options farther away, or a different type of stay, such as a Motel/Hotel.

As with life, things will change, and everybody gets a day older every day.

Enjoy it while you can!

Editing to add I just thought of one more group of visitors that got recently disappointed, those who don't like staying at Hotel/Motel including Extended Stay options.

Folks who like to rent a Condo for a few days on Walnut behind the Mickey and Friends parking structure and any other "residential" housing, as the city of Anaheim just outlawed the practice of Short Term Rentals.

 

[az4boys]

Maybe the bridge will be built in such a way that it can be entered via stairs at harbor near I hop. All speculation after all.

I'm actually hoping for a skyway ride to lift us up and over.

 

[Indiana Scott]

Maybe I'm weird (I've been accused of being worse) but I have very different feelings and I go through a very different experience between the walking I do inside the park and each step I have to endure past the current security check point. The walking in the parks is tiresome but the walk down harbor after all that in park walking it agonizing. The walk down harbor makes me a grumpy sourpus who doesnt want to come back to disney anymore. Its a rough walk that comes after I already used up all the walking I felt I had in me for the day. I have walked in the parks until my feet literally bled but not one of the steps that led to that was as difficult and the handful I had to do to leave the parks.

So to me that extra half a mile of walking is like comparing applesauce and apple bottom jeans. they might sound alike but to me it is no comparison. I am assuming that those who are upset about this feel similarly. Just an extra half a mile you say. What I'm hearing is "its just an extra half a mile of walking...over a bed of nails.

Harbor walking and main street walking are 2 very different kinds of walking.

Very well put.
Just because I walk for miles at DLR doesn't mean I want to walk that far back to my room and to automatically assume otherwise is foolhearted.
I've had it by the time I leave the park and that short walk to my hotel across the street is the reason I stay there and a great deal of what makes a DLR trip so enjoyable for us. If they ruin that portion of my experience I will travel to DL less in the future.
There are just too many other wonderful places competing for rmy vacation bussiness.

 

[Alinasan]

Speculation or not, I find this thread fascinating and informative all the same.

I am eyeing a trip at the end of this year, so I hope that none of this construction will drastically alter my plans to stay at a place on Harbor, whatever may wind up happening down the road.

Another piece of related history is the Park Vue Inn and how it reacted to a proposal for a new public transit system that wanted the land (First Monorail/Peoplemover that changed to rail, and now looks like just a rapid bus system). The Park Vue spent money on improvements and submitted plans for a big project before a deadline that would make it much more expensive to buy using eminent domain, and no longer considered by the city to purchase.

I was reading reviews on the Camelot Inn on Trip advisor, and noticed that the manager responded to some recent reviews with a comment about "exciting news" that hinted at room renovations next year. When I read what DarkBeer is saying about the Park Vue in that bit I quoted, that made me wonder if there will be a trend of those properties on Harbor renovating themselves in a more elaborate way than they might have previously planned, as a response to this whole parking project.