New credit card guarantees. Restaurant list, policy & common questions in 1st post

[NLD]

Mom2rtk,

I do hear what you're saying about wanting to know for specific occasions.

Back in 2009 for my dd's first (only, so far) trip, I did the "synchronize the clock, wake up early" routine to get CRT for my daughter. They had just launched the online reservation system at that point, if I'm remembering correctly, and I had it cued up to the right page and everything...

Even so, all the CRT breakfasts were GONE. Couldn't get one. This was for a mid-September trip (low low crowds) during a free dining period.

Fortunately we did get a lunch.

What's interesting though is that now it doesn't seem to be that way. I just checked, and there are STILL CRT breakfasts (and lunches and dinners) available during our upcoming January trip (also low crowd period, also free dining). Back then a CC guarantee was required for CRT, too.

BUT... there is one big difference between now and then: Princesses appear at dinner now, too.

I am really not sure the supply-demand ratio is so off now that it's necessary to have a 180-day window, at least not during low crowd periods.

Maybe a 180-day window for a few select restaurants?

 

[Colleen27]

Some NYC restaurants in the Theater district only accept reservations 30 days in advance. By then customers already have their theater tickets.

JMO but there is something wrong with a system that results in potential guests booking ADRs months before a possible trip when guests booking a package with Disney a few weeks later find no availability.

I don't blame you, I blame the system. I think 180 day ADRS, if offered at all, should be limited to guests with a Disney resort reservation. Limit the number of ADRs they can make and cancel all their ADRs if they cancel their resort.

That's where I'm at as well. It is absolutely ridiculous that if you wanted to book a Disney trip with free dining at the absolute busiest time of year there was plenty of room availability right up through the last booking date for the offer, at about 45 days out, but if you want to use that dining plan you'd better be happy with the least popular park restaurants or hauling over to distant places like Turf Club or Shutters because all the desirable dining is long since booked solid. (I know, because it crossed our mind to push our trip up to Dec but there's no way we could plan a DxDDP trip on this "short" notice - there just aren't enough ADRs open).

Disney keeps building resort after resort after resort without adding to dining capacity - the 8 resorts opened this century combined to add only 4 restaurants to the Disney dining lineup, and the expansion in the MK area (BLT, VWL & the coming villas at GF) and Epcot area (BCV and BWV) didn't add ANY new restaurants despite adding thousands of rooms in the areas most convenient for resort dining. And that chronic shortage of dining capacity coupled with the 180 day window has led to a situation where you have to book dining months before you book the trip or be shut out not only of the very popular meals but even of less popular but conveniently located options as well. But rather than add capacity to better match demand and/or alter the 180 window to reduce "on spec" bookings, Disney is choosing to stay their present course while shifting all of the blame and risk for the system's shortcomings to guests.

 

[mom2rtk]

Mom2rtk,

I do hear what you're saying about wanting to know for specific occasions.

Back in 2009 for my dd's first (only, so far) trip, I did the "synchronize the clock, wake up early" routine to get CRT for my daughter. They had just launched the online reservation system at that point, if I'm remembering correctly, and I had it cued up to the right page and everything...

Even so, all the CRT breakfasts were GONE. Couldn't get one. This was for a mid-September trip (low low crowds) during a free dining period.

Fortunately we did get a lunch.

What's interesting though is that now it doesn't seem to be that way. I just checked, and there are STILL CRT breakfasts (and lunches and dinners) available during our upcoming January trip (also low crowd period, also free dining). Back then a CC guarantee was required for CRT, too.

BUT... there is one big difference between now and then: Princesses appear at dinner now, too.

I am really not sure the supply-demand ratio is so off now that it's necessary to have a 180-day window, at least not during low crowd periods.

Maybe a 180-day window for a few select restaurants?

I'd be good with that. Or maybe even giving resort guests a code to let them book 2 or 3 ADR's for their entire trip between 90 and 180 days.

That's where I'm at as well. It is absolutely ridiculous that if you wanted to book a Disney trip with free dining at the absolute busiest time of year there was plenty of room availability right up through the last booking date for the offer, at about 45 days out, but if you want to use that dining plan you'd better be happy with the least popular park restaurants or hauling over to distant places like Turf Club or Shutters because all the desirable dining is long since booked solid. (I know, because it crossed our mind to push our trip up to Dec but there's no way we could plan a DxDDP trip on this "short" notice - there just aren't enough ADRs open).

Disney keeps building resort after resort after resort without adding to dining capacity - the 8 resorts opened this century combined to add only 4 restaurants to the Disney dining lineup, and the expansion in the MK area (BLT, VWL & the coming villas at GF) and Epcot area (BCV and BWV) didn't add ANY new restaurants despite adding thousands of rooms in the areas most convenient for resort dining. And that chronic shortage of dining capacity coupled with the 180 day window has led to a situation where you have to book dining months before you book the trip or be shut out not only of the very popular meals but even of less popular but conveniently located options as well. But rather than add capacity to better match demand and/or alter the 180 window to reduce "on spec" bookings, Disney is choosing to stay their present course while shifting all of the blame and risk for the system's shortcomings to guests.

I agree that this was short-sighted. They are adding the "Be our Guest" restaurante in the expansion, but right now it's only slated to be TS for one meal a day. I'm guessing that alone will put it in VERY high demand.

So why do you suppose they have opted not to add more TS locations with all the added rooms? Either they like running at 100% capacity or they're just poor planners. Or perhaps they intend to pull back on free dining as their "go to" method of filling all those rooms........ Maybe they assume 1) the economy is going to rebound any day now or 2) the expansion will bring the guests in without the FD promo.

 

[Marshay]

Another thought on the "poor excuse", I dont want the "poor excuses" dining next to me...I dont want the overtired, overstimulate, missed nap kids sitting next to me. I dont want the kids or the dad who is annoyed that they had to come to an ADR soaking wet. Or the cranky grandpa who thinks WDW is a waste of money and they made him come out in the cold when his arthritis is acting up. If those guests would be happier back at their resort, eating there, or doing quick CS then I would like them there so my TS can be pleasant. And if you impose this fee, you will have more people like this dining around you, we already do! but if that family is at risk of losing $50+ they are more likely to try and keep it when they shouldnt

I agree but only time will tell how this all plays out. Maybe folks have a lot of extra money floating around and will just pay and not do their ADR.

You do bring up another great point though. Let's say I'm at Narcoosee and I'm sitting next to Mr. Crankypants and his wife and on the other side is Mrs. Disney Downer's sick, crying family.

I can tell you that we won't be ordering our normal apps, wine, entree and dessert. I'll cut my own meal short just to get away.

So in this scenerio, it's affecting the guests who may just order a drink and leave, but it's also affecting guests who don't want to put up with the sick/overtired/wet/"fill in the blank" guests and finish early, too.

That's a lot of missed opportunities for $$$ ...

 

[Colleen27]

And for those of you wanting a shorter window to book, I completely understand, but it was HORRIBLE trying to book with a shorter window with busy lines and frozen computer screens. Having it at 180 days spreads it out to make it manageable.

But Disney's inadequate web system is just another example of cost-minimization trumping guest experience. It isn't impossible to put together a functional web site, even with the demand that Disney's experiences at peak times. Check out Ticketmaster on a major on-sale date and you'll see how well it can work. But Disney chooses to stick with their hit-or-miss (both in terms of reliability and accuracy of content) web site rather than spending the money to create and maintain a more seamless internet booking experience.

 

[Lewisc]

Disney reduced the demand for CRT by raising the price and increased the inventory by adding the Princess to dinner and by adding another venue (EPCOT).

I think a firm reservation with penalties are needed at restaurants that are selling a specific table (can't overbook/) like HDD and the Lua. CRT appears to be a "dress up meal" for kids. Accommodating walk ups wouldn't be the same.

Disney is adding resorts. Giving free dining instead of room discounts. Promoting dining to other guests. Pushing upgrade from the QS plan to DDP to guests at value resorts. Maybe Disney needs to increase capacity. Might a character meal make sense at the value resorts? You don't need to hire a 5* chef for a character meal. You don't even have to offer meals 7 days a week. Maybe you could use existing space. The kind of construction needed for that kind of restaurant isn't that expensive.

Weren't the BWV built at the same time BWI and the restaurants on the Boardwalk? Disney actually reduced the number of restaurants at BC, wasn't Ariel's originally open to the public.

Mom2rtk,

I do hear what you're saying about wanting to know for specific occasions.

Back in 2009 for my dd's first (only, so far) trip, I did the "synchronize the clock, wake up early" routine to get CRT for my daughter. They had just launched the online reservation system at that point, if I'm remembering correctly, and I had it cued up to the right page and everything...

Even so, all the CRT breakfasts were GONE. Couldn't get one. This was for a mid-September trip (low low crowds) during a free dining period.

Fortunately we did get a lunch.

What's interesting though is that now it doesn't seem to be that way. I just checked, and there are STILL CRT breakfasts (and lunches and dinners) available during our upcoming January trip (also low crowd period, also free dining). Back then a CC guarantee was required for CRT, too.

BUT... there is one big difference between now and then: Princesses appear at dinner now, too.

I am really not sure the supply-demand ratio is so off now that it's necessary to have a 180-day window, at least not during low crowd periods.

Maybe a 180-day window for a few select restaurants?

 

[racefanof88]

I can only speak for myself, but if I had a "slight cold" & just felt a little run down I'd most likely still be up doing stuff. Do people stay in their rooms on a Disney vacation because they have a slight cold? Even during the days when we toured the parks during the day I'd mostly likely hang at the pool to relax if I felt run down.

Even at home, a "slight cold" doesn't stop me. I may go to bed earlier or try to rest a bit more, but life goes on.

That is my point. Most people won't stay in their room with a cold; minor illness for most, BUT not for all. Like I posted, what would be a cold for someone with a normal immune system, can be a serious illness for a baby or say, someone who just completed chemo. RSV can be a deadly illness for a baby, and bacterial pneumonia can also be deadly for the immune suppressed.

Our immune system isn't as effective when we are tired, so the baby or the immune suppressed are at an even more compromised position. So, while they, or I, may have stayed in our room for the evening because we are tired or have a minor illness, now we won't because it will cost us.

I agree with those who have posted about charging no shows, but if I cancel 30 minutes before my ADR then those "walk ups" can still get my table. I think Disney has found another way to get more money out of people's pockets. They get the $10 per person, AND the walk up business.

 

[CandleontheWater]

Serious question.......for some reason I thought I had heard somewhere that each Disney restaurant/lounge is individually responsible for their own profits/losses, etc. Almost like an independently owned organization.

BTW - sounds like your family had a great time!

We did have a great time!

And I learned an important lesson- no breakfasts the day after we all arrive!

 

[tarheelmjfan]

I'd have to go back in the thread to find my exact wording, I don't believe I actually stated that I skipped one just because I wasn't hungry. I believe it was a "what if" scenario using a "not so good" excuse that wouldn't likely be waived. The whole point of it was to present a likely lowest point that I would find acceptable to cancel shortly ahead of time.

In fact, the meal I missed this year was due to a minor illness. Nothing major, I had the sniffles and overslept on my nap and woke up an hour after ADR time (ADR was for 5:30, I woke up at 6:30). It was the end of the trip, and my normal 2:30-3ish to 3:30-4ish nap went over. Until the time I woke up, I had every intention of going, and was even really looking forward to it (it was tied as my #1 meal from last trip). I had been feeling cruddy all week with a minor cold, though I did go to my ADRs that I had planned. Most of them I even got sat in a reasonable amount of time too! Just, this one evening, things didn't work out. I didn't mention this before, as it's not about that. Even under the changes I suggested, I would have been charged the $10 fee and I would have been OK with Disney with that (I probably would have been more annoyed at myself though )

An alarm clock is your friend.

You're words were actually, "So, now, If I find out I have no appetite shortly before my ADR (which happens), I have to either order and pay for food that will go in the trash (thus taking up server, host(ess), chef time and materials), or pay $10 pp? Since I didn't realize that I wouldn't be hungry enough for a meal until just a few hours before it (if that, but I'd be happy if the timeframe were just a couple hours), and this certainly wouldn't qualify for "Extreme Circumstances", there's no way I could get out of paying this."

Do you really think you should be able to get out of an ADR last minute, because you've decided to eat more than you can hold? What about the person that wanted the ADR you no longer want, but couldn't get in? Their vacation has been negatively affected, so you could book more meals than you could actually eat. How can people not see why stuff like this is a problem?

PS: I'm not focusing on your specifically. This excuse is certainly as good as some of the others we've seen on this thread.

Now, I don't have an issue with those who think they must make their own family make every ADR they sign up for every time without even considering canceling them after the window closes. That's there business, not mine. I have an issue with Disney penalizing the wrong people in a lackluster effort to curtail behavior which they can better control with other methods. Of course, those other methods aren't a nearly guaranteed source of income, so it's no wonder why Disney went this way.

I don't just think my family has to show up for every ADR I make. I think I have to show up for everything I book in life & obligate myself to. To me, the right people to punish are those who will book things, then not feel completely obligated to follow through, regardless of how many commitments they've signed up for.

The more recent information from the CMs (and since much of them are spouting identical information, it's hard to claim the typical CM making stuff up like) screams that it's all about additional revenue. Either by charging the $10pp fee, or by forcing said families to the table, even though it may not be in anyone's best interest to have them there. Disney has now made the decision that their bottom line is more important than their guests' well being and than guest satisfaction. That is not a precedent that I like seeing.

I don't see that at all. The info received states there will be an exemption for serious illness & travel delays. These are the two things beyond the guests control. If it were nothing but an additional source of revenue, they wouldn't be making exceptions. The fact is, with effort, most others things can be controlled.

Write the website to make sense. Check names and numbers on all the ADRs and be pro-active in calling people up who may be multi-booking. Automatically cancel any tied ADRs to package reservations that get canceled due to non-payment at 30 days. Force CMs to work with guests if they're canceling reservations over the phone. In other words, put the resources to stop the root of the problem instead of smashing the hammer down on those who are very unlikely to be the problem.

I agree the website needs to be much more clear on the policy requirements. Unfortunately, people have always found ways around them catching double bookings. If people really want to cheat, it's pretty much impossible to stop them from doing so.

Then again, I could go on for hours (and I've already been typing for 1...) typing out my arguments, but will just be told that "It doesn't matter what you think, Disney is all that matters" from the fan-club.

I don't know anyone who has claimed to be a founding member of the Disney fan club here. I don't agree with a lot of their changes. This policy is one I am a big fan of though. That said, I'm a realist, & in reality it doesn't matter what we thing, whether we like that fact or not.

"Blowing off" and having to cancel at the last(ish) minute are two different things. Blowing off suggests no real intent in the first place. A last minute cancellation suggests they had intent and desired to dine at that location. Of course, it doesn't hold true across the board, but I'd bet that most of those who actually blow off an ADR are not those who have something come up unexpectedly.

Obviously, we all don't have the same definition of words/terms used in this thread. That's what this entire thread has been about. To me, "blowing off" an ADR suggests they had no intent of going at that moment in time. It doesn't really matter what they thought 180 days ago or even a couple hrs. before.

As far as the statistics, they only tell half the story. That's the base problem with statistics taken out of context. We don't know why January has such a high rate. We don't know why the 10% months have such a low (relatively) rate. The questions should be, why are these months so out of proportion with the others? What are the key differences in travelers and other external factors that could account for this disparity? How can we address those issues while maintaining the same level of guest satisfaction and experience? If you just look at the numbers, you're basically saying that the people traveling in Jan/Feb (or whatever other 33% level months there are) are almost all abusing the system and deserve not to have any ADRs. The policy of just bringing the hammer down suggests that they didn't bother with this and just said "Screw them all. If they don't like it, they'll pay us anyway!"

In Jan/Feb there could be more last minute opportunities to get into another restaurant that's closer to where a guest wants to be, which results in them not showing at the restaurant they originally booked. In the busier months, they're not as much availability at other restaurants. I don't know that for sure though. It's purely speculation on my part. Basically, everything that's been posted is speculation. The only people who know the truth are WDW employees, & we see what they've chosen to do to address the problem. To say we have a better solution, when we don't even know what the true problem is, proves we don't know what we're talking about.

I think there is plenty of evidence in this thread alone that proves Disney needed to do something - all the poor excuses people have listed for blowing off ADRs, plus the statistics from Touring Plans stating that no-show rates range from 10% to 33%, depending on the month.

Before reading this thread, I didn't realize how much evidence there is. I don't see how anyone could read this thread & not come to the conclusion that there's a problem.

Agreed 100%! Like I posted before; if I have a Le Cellier ADR and it looks like we won't make it, and we are outside our cancellation window, I show up, order water then leave. I have made the ADR, but Disney has made no money.

Here is the perfect example of why this policy is not a good thing----

Two years ago we were at Disney in September on the free DDP. We woke up on the morning of our last full day to a sick child. He had a fever and just didn't feel well. Though he didn't appear to have a "major illness" we decided to check out a day early and drive home. I wanted him to see our pediatrician. Well, it turned out to be Swine flu, he and I both had it. So while some are touting how great this new policy is, they need to think about that child at the next table that even though he isn't vomiting on the table, he is shedding a virus that has the potential to kill.

Disney's position on it having to be a "major illness" is boarding on careless disregard for other guests. While I may have a slight cold and just feel a little run down, that baby at the next table could get RSV, or the lady behind me catch pneumonia because she has a compromised immune system; all because Disney said I have to have a "major illness" or pay a fine. Some have said that sick people should just stay in their room, but they won't. My son and I got Swine flu because sick people DON'T stay in their room.

That's scary. I hope you both recovered fully.

I'm pretty sure all of us would prefer sick people not dine next to us, but they do all the time. I just don't think assessing a fee will make a difference. If my kid was that sick, I wouldn't care about the fee. No, I don't throw money away (many people would say I'm thrifty, if they were trying to be nice about it ). If I wasn't willing to pay the fee, & made us go anyway, I probably would have done that before this policy was implemented too. Some people won't put themselves & others in harms way to save money or prove a point, some people just don't care. You cut your trip short a day to take your child to the doctor. I'm willing to bet you're one parent who would pay the $10 fee, even if you didn't like it, rather than make him go to a restaurant sick. Unfortunately, there's many parents who aren't like that.

This is your opinion, in my opinion MOST people have had valid excuses. But no one seems to be in favor of completely blowing off ADRs, quite the contrary, most people that dont like this policy are saying charge the true no shows, give a more reasonable window, and work better to fill those seats with walkups or getting the word out that a time slot is available.

This would be great, if it helped all guests. Unfortunately, it doesn't. It doesn't address early morning, same day ADRs at all. I realize this has been said before, but some of us think a shorter window won't address all issues. It will only really help those who want to cancel last minute.

There isn't a single piece of evidence in this thread which proves such a thing. Disney doesn't release such statistics. They don't release them to internet sites such as DIS or Touring Plans. The only thing we know for sure is Disney has found a new revenue stream.

I haven't seen any evidence that proves anything, except the fact that some people saw ADRs as a convenience not a true commitment. Some people have said just that. I haven't seen anything else proven. I've seen a lot of speculation. No one knows what the true issue is. To say what the issue isn't is as incorrect as to say what it is.

Cruise ships have a process in place for dealing with outbreaks of norovirus. They include replacing guest service at buffets with staff service. Does anyone think Disney is staffed to have CMs serve us at the buffet line?

I'm sure they could bring in the staff, if they felt the situation warranted. They're not stuck out at sea. Their employees live in the area. Cruise ships have to prepare for all situations. Their employees can't be called in at the last minute.

edited to add--What about people who book ADRs at 180 days before they book their flights and hotel. How an they possibly be making a "commitment" to that meal when they don't even know if they'll be taking the trip. I'll say if there is a problem it starts with the 180 day policy. I don't care if those people eventually cancel their ADR. It affects the way "normal" guests have to plan their vacation. Face it normal guests make dining reservations after they have firm plans.

I agree the 180 day window is ridiculous. I tried to fight that, when it switched from 90 days years ago. You see where that got me. You win some, you lose some...

 

[Lewisc]

I agree the website needs to be much more clear on the policy requirements. Unfortunately, people have always found ways around them catching double bookings. If people really want to cheat, it's pretty much impossible to stop them from doing so.

Before reading this thread, I didn't realize how much evidence there is. I don't see how anyone could read this thread & not come to the conclusion that there's a problem.

Only open up early ADRS to guests with a resort reservation. Tie the ADR to the room reservation number. Probably the best, and maybe easiest, way to stop overbooking. Let other guests book 30 days out.

There isn't shred of evidence in this thread as to a problem. Disney doesn't release statistics. We have no idea what the no-show rate is. We have no idea if walk ups can (or are) being used.

The only thing we know is Disney has found a new source of revenue. A year or two ago the bean counters came up with peak pricing. Now it's cancellation fees.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

I can only speak for myself, but if I had a "slight cold" & just felt a little run down I'd most likely still be up doing stuff. Do people stay in their rooms on a Disney vacation because they have a slight cold? Even during the days when we toured the parks during the day I'd mostly likely hang at the pool to relax if I felt run down.

Even at home, a "slight cold" doesn't stop me. I may go to bed earlier or try to rest a bit more, but life goes on.

I think you're the same as most. People are not going to stay in their room & skip the parks, because they have a cold. However, they may decide they don't want to keep their ADR. Maybe, WDW has decided that doesn't work for them. It certainly doesn't increase the chances of guests getting sick.

Another thought on the "poor excuse", I dont want the "poor excuses" dining next to me...I dont want the overtired, overstimulate, missed nap kids sitting next to me. I dont want the kids or the dad who is annoyed that they had to come to an ADR soaking wet. Or the cranky grandpa who thinks WDW is a waste of money and they made him come out in the cold when his arthritis is acting up. If those guests would be happier back at their resort, eating there, or doing quick CS then I would like them there so my TS can be pleasant. And if you impose this fee, you will have more people like this dining around you, we already do! but if that family is at risk of losing $50+ they are more likely to try and keep it when they shouldnt

We deal with things like this at WDW restaurants all the time, even signatures. There's been no fee to cancel or not show up in the past. Why did they come then? To me, this is an argument that will never hold water. The sick, grumpy, tired, overstimulated, etc. have always eaten at WDW restaurants. Will a few more make that much of a difference? I think not. I'm with you. Even though, I'm "thrifty, there's been times I'd like to offer a family $10/person to leave. The threat of being charged a fee wasn't the reason they were there though. They were there, because they weren't concerned with other guests experiences. Those who go now, will go for the same reason.

It was me who used the hungover excuse.

Now before you get your pitchforks handy- lets discuss the situation.

From what I have been reading, there are two types of people gun-ho on this issue- those that believe that skipping ADRs means lost revenue for Disney (bad) and those that believe that it is immoral to take a reservation when someone else might want it (bad).

OK, so lets discuss my specific hungover situation. My family travels together- all eight of us. The fist night of our vacation we were so happy to all be back together we staked out a location in the bellvue lounge and hung out there catching up and reconnecting for the rest of the night, until they kicked us out of the bar. We were good customers, so I think they even let us stay longer than usual. That evening we rang up a $700 bar tab (my dad still talks about having to pay for it ).

The next morning some members of our party were not feeling up to the 9 am breakfast. When I realized there was no rousing them, I called Disney dining and canceled the reservation.

OK, so here is the breakdown- Disney could have gotten $281.12 for our breakfast- instead they got $700 (plus tip). That is a net gain for Disney of at least 418.88. I think any bean counter would be happy with that kind of math. Disney won in that situation.

OK, I also canceled the reservation around 7:30am, so some pitiable first timer staying at the contemporary who knew nothing about ADRs, was now able to walk up to the podium, and enjoy breakfast with Mickey- that is a win for the little guy!

So if Disney wins financially, and the little guy wins as well, and my family had a wonderful evening, where are the losers, why is this such a terrible scenario?

I don't happen to own any pitchforks, & I'm been none to overindulge myself. I am one who sees this from an availability standpoint. If WDW makes money, so be it. I'm not sure you're canceling at 7:30 am really helped anyone though. We don't know that for sure. Then again, we obviously don't know a lot about what goes on in their restaurants.

I can see Disney keeping the fee sinc the restaurant will already win by being fully booked with all tables full of paying diners (with walk-ups and last minute ADR's). Right?

As I said above, we don't know for sure that's the case. Enough said, I'm getting tired of arguing the same points. You all are wearing me down.

That is my point. Most people won't stay in their room with a cold; minor illness for most, BUT not for all. Like I posted, what would be a cold for someone with a normal immune system, can be a serious illness for a baby or say, someone who just completed chemo. RSV can be a deadly illness for a baby, and bacterial pneumonia can also be deadly for the immune suppressed.

This has always been the case. The new policy won't change much of anything.

We did have a great time!

And I learned an important lesson- no breakfasts the day after we all arrive!

I'm really glad you had a great time. We have a big family getaway coming up next weekend, & I can't wait.

I really think you're discovered the solution. People will now give more thought to their ADRs. It's obvious missing out on that ADR didn't do anything to diminish your trip. Being able to play it by ear & enjoy family can be much more fun than a character breakfast.

 

[Lewisc]

http://www.disboards.com/showpost.php?p=43095340&postcount=1


Restaurants are telling guests no room for walk ups. At the same time the ADR system is letting guests make a same day ADR for that exact restaurant. A poster used the mobile website.

I don't know about others in this thread but I don't think I'd expect to find availability at a restaurant after the restaurant told me nothing for the rest of the day.

Easier to blame the customer then come up with solutions.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

Only open up early ADRS to guests with a resort reservation. Tie the ADR to the room reservation number. Probably the best, and maybe easiest, way to stop overbooking. Let other guests book 30 days out.

There isn't shred of evidence in this thread as to a problem. Disney doesn't release statistics. We have no idea what the no-show rate is. We have no idea if walk ups can (or are) being used.

The only thing we know is Disney has found a new source of revenue. A year or two ago the bean counters came up with peak pricing. Now it's cancellation fees.

I agree the peak pricing was nothing but a money grab. Honestly, I don't care if the new policy is all about making them money. It will eventually help most guests get desired ADRs. People will stop playing the system &/or booking up so many ADRs, if they have to pay enough fees. Unlike you, I do see proof that there is a problem. I've read the DIS long enough to see the ADR lists for those who booked multiple ADRs per meal, an ADR every meal for their entire trip, etc. & read enough trip reports to see people change their minds at the last minute & blow off a much sought after ADR. This board is proof of abuse.

As far as the onsite only ADRs, you all can knock yourself out arguing that one. It will affect many more people than the ability to cancel last minute will though. This will punish people who always keep their ADRs, but if WDW thinks this is a fix, I'm sure they'll try it. You can bet the outcry would be much worse than they're seeing over this plan. They'd be dealing with the local news media on that one. For me, I'll work in the system in place, whatever that is. Constantly fighting every policy change is counterproductive. They will only listen, if it's a rare occurrence. So far, I've never seen them make a change that some didn't claim outrage over.

 

[Mkrop]

Could you please verify the timeframe for cancellations on the new Dining Reservations of certain restaruants, particularly the character meals? I know you have to now leave a credit card and will be charged afee of $10 per person if you cancel. What is the timeframe that you cancancel without a fee? I have read anything from 24 hours before to a full day before. I think this is limiting flexibilty in vacationing, making it extremely hard to dine with kids and older people who could have things pop up that would cause them to cancel prior to the day before. I would like WDW know my complete displeasure with this new policy. I think it is acceptable to charge for no shows, but you need to give a more family friendly window for cancelling.


Above my email to WDW.

Their response:

When booking a reservation at the following restaurants, you will be required to provide a credit card to hold the reservation and will be charged $10 per person if you need to cancel and do not cancel at least one day in advance.

Subject to change without notice.



Still no clarification to me on the timeframe...I sent another email asking the definition of one day in advance.

 

[mcd2745]

edited to add--What about people who book ADRs at 180 days before they book their flights and hotel. How an they possibly be making a "commitment" to that meal when they don't even know if they'll be taking the trip. I'll say if there is a problem it starts with the 180 day policy. I don't care if those people eventually cancel their ADR. It affects the way "normal" guests have to plan their vacation. Face it normal guests make dining reservations after they have firm plans.

There's something we agree on 110%.

There is no good reason for Disney or their guests to be making ADRs that far in advance. I also say 45 days for on-site guests, and you must link the ADRs to your resort reservation. So no CC would be needed - if you don't show, it gets charged to your resort account and if you cancel the resort reservation, the ADRs automatically get cancelled. Then, 30 days for off-site guests, but those will require a CC hold for ALL reservations. I think then you'd have a much higher percentage of ADRs that are made with the full intention of showing up at those meals to begin with.

 

[twinklebug]

Subject to change without notice.

Thank you for asking & posting your response. This line above is key to me... It means they may change up the rules. If they can reduce the time frame to 3-6 hours I'm fine with giving them my CC to hold our reservations.

For us, if one of us is ill we typically know by the night before in the case of breakfast/lunch the next day and certainly know shortly after noon the following day if we'll make dinner.

There will still be a few folks this won't work for: particularly those with young children and whom are unaccustomed to touring the parks (push the kids too hard too long forgetting they need down time - you see it all the time, hate to admit I was one of them back when I was a young parent) For them I feel bad since they're also one of the demographics that needs that money the most & is just trying to have a bit of fun with their children with the short vacation time given to young workers.

 

[MELSMICE]

That is my point. Most people won't stay in their room with a cold; minor illness for most, BUT not for all. Like I posted, what would be a cold for someone with a normal immune system, can be a serious illness for a baby or say, someone who just completed chemo. RSV can be a deadly illness for a baby, and bacterial pneumonia can also be deadly for the immune suppressed.

How would someone with a slight cold know (or even imagine for that matter) that they would be sitting next to someone with a suppressed immune system?

In reference to the peak pricing.........I look at it as a function of supply & demand. Airlines raise their fares during peak times also. Most hotels raise their prices during their peak seasons. Many restaurants will raise their prices on a night like New Year's Eve.

 

[mcd2745]

As far as the onsite only ADRs, you all can knock yourself out arguing that one. It will affect many more people than the ability to cancel last minute will though. This will punish people who always keep their ADRs, but if WDW thinks this is a fix, I'm sure they'll try it. You can bet the outcry would be much worse than they're seeing over this plan. They'd be dealing with the local news media on that one. For me, I'll work in the system in place, whatever that is. Constantly fighting every policy change is counterproductive. They will only listen, if it's a rare occurrence. So far, I've never seen them make a change that some didn't claim outrage over.

You're not kidding. I've seen people here on the DIS that i think would give up their first-born before they willingly give up the ability to make ADRs 180 days out. I don't understand it. But there is a segment of WDW regulars who are very passionate about that.

 

[Lewisc]

At one time the average Disney guest went on 1 or 2 trips. Posters on DIS are not typical Disney guests.

The fact that some posters claim to make tons of ADRs doesn't tell us if the number of guests engaging in that kind of (rude) behavior is significant. You think you see proof but anecdotal evidence on an internet board isn't proof of anything.

The new system seems is going be be releasing ADRs a day or two in advance. I doubt it will help me. I might have been interested in trying for a walk up. Participate in a "wait list" with a message if a desired ADR became available. I have no interest in spending my park time on a web enabled phone constantly checking for availability.

I don't see this a system of "excuses" and needing to punish people. Disney is encouraging people to make a lot of ADRs before they even have firm plans.

Assume a 1% no show rate. I think we'd agree no problem. Now assume a very high (50%) no show rate. I'd say the problem is with Disney. Encouraging, allowing, guests to make ADRs they're not sure they'll be keeping. Not specifically asking guests to cancel ADRs they won't be keeping. Not making it easy to cancel. One poster was on hold something like 20 minutes.

I'd cut back the 180 days to 45-60 for on site guests and 30 days for offsite.

Disney would never do this but why not just cancel all a guests remaining ADRs if they're a no show or cancel very late. We're sorry reserved restaurant seating doesn't work for your family.

Allocate some tables for walk ups.

Disney has the right to charge what the market will bear (peak pricing). Given that policy I have no reason to think $$$ isn't the main issue.

I agree the peak pricing was nothing but a money grab. Honestly, I don't care if the new policy is all about making them money. It will eventually help most guests get desired ADRs. People will stop playing the system &/or booking up so many ADRs, if they have to pay enough fees. Unlike you, I do see proof that there is a problem. I've read the DIS long enough to see the ADR lists for those who booked multiple ADRs per meal, an ADR every meal for their entire trip, etc. & read enough trip reports to see people change their minds at the last minute & blow off a much sought after ADR. This board is proof of abuse.

As far as the onsite only ADRs, you all can knock yourself out arguing that one. It will affect many more people than the ability to cancel last minute will though. This will punish people who always keep their ADRs, but if WDW thinks this is a fix, I'm sure they'll try it. You can bet the outcry would be much worse than they're seeing over this plan. They'd be dealing with the local news media on that one. For me, I'll work in the system in place, whatever that is. Constantly fighting every policy change is counterproductive. They will only listen, if it's a rare occurrence. So far, I've never seen them make a change that some didn't claim outrage over.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

At one time the average Disney guest went on 1 or 2 trips. Posters on DIS are not typical Disney guests.

The fact that some posters claim to make tons of ADRs doesn't tell us if the number of guests engaging in that kind of (rude) behavior is significant. You think you see proof but anecdotal evidence on an internet board isn't proof of anything.

The new system seems is going be be releasing ADRs a day or two in advance. I doubt it will help me. I might have been interested in trying for a walk up. Participate in a "wait list" with a message if a desired ADR became available. I have no interest in spending my park time on a web enabled phone constantly checking for availability.

I don't see this a system of "excuses" and needing to punish people. Disney is encouraging people to make a lot of ADRs before they even have firm plans.

Assume a 1% no show rate. I think we'd agree no problem. Now assume a very high (50%) no show rate. I'd say the problem is with Disney. Encouraging, allowing, guests to make ADRs they're not sure they'll be keeping. Not specifically asking guests to cancel ADRs they won't be keeping. Not making it easy to cancel. One poster was on hold something like 20 minutes.

I'd cut back the 180 days to 45-60 for on site guests and 30 days for offsite.

Disney would never do this but why not just cancel all a guests remaining ADRs if they're a no show or cancel very late. We're sorry reserved restaurant seating doesn't work for your family.

Allocate some tables for walk ups.

Disney has the right to charge what the market will bear (peak pricing). Given that policy I have no reason to think $$$ isn't the main issue.

It seems to me the new policy is their way of addressing the problems. They're now saying people should give the ADRs they're considering some serious thought, before booking them. The message to cancel is now very clear. There's a new number devoted to cancellations to make canceling easier. They've addressed your concerns. You should be happy.

As I've said before, I think the biggest benefit to the change in policy is people will eventually stop booking up all the most desired times & locations early in the ADR window. If that doesn't happen, I still haven't lost anything with the change. The ability to make early, same day ADRs is the secondary reason I like the change. For me, it has nothing to do with walk-ups. I don't want to spend my time going restaurant to restaurant hoping for a chance to be seated. If I get a tweet or see on a board that a restaurant is seating walk-ups, by the time I get there, they may have filled their quota. Those who like to take their chances walking up may benefit from the change too. Who knows? They certainly won't lose anything.