Nasty School Letter

[Colleen27]

I must respectfully disagree. There are many children who come to Kindergarten without those skills, not having been exposed to them at home. There are also many more skills taught in Kindergarten than colors letters and numbers. In VA the "Standards of Learning" for Kindergarten include learning about science, historical figures, social studies, etc. My girls had spelling tests and had reading booklets. It is a lot more involved than what you describe.

Oh, I understand that not all kids come in knowing those things, but I suspect that the demographics of us obsessive Disney nuts don't include many at risk kids - at the very least, the children of most DISers are the product of literate parents who have the means to vacation, which rules out the most disadvantaged students that many schools have to deal with. But having seen what goes on in a public school K with my son, and having studied the state standards for what is taught in K in preparation for homeschooling my daughter, I don't think it is so academically intensive that one missed week will make any meaningful difference to a typical, well-prepared middle class child.

 

[KKB]

Hi,

We leave Tuesday for OKW

Anyway, I had to send a letter to the teachers letting them know the kids would be missing 7 1/2 days of school and I received a nasty-gram from the Principal for my 1st grader letting me know it's illegal to keep the kids out of school that long.

I guess in exchange for them overlooking it I am supposed to have them keep journals and such (which they do anyway).

The police have informed us (I am a teacher) that there is nothing they can do when the district calls them about children who have over "X" number of absences!
UNBELIEVABLE! You give the school a head's up...ask for work...give your children experiences in life, yet YOU could be fined, etc. BUT lax parents keep their kids home anytime it suits them, and there is NOTHING WE CAN DO??!!
OK, this along w/ No Child Left Behind law...and we wonder why we can't keep good teachers in the system??!!! (yes, this is an insane law...do you realize that by 2014, ALL students are required to get 100% on their state tests??!! Yep, even if their parents don't make sure they are at school, well fed, rested, safe, or do their homework. This includes children who just arrived here from other countries, children with IQs FAR below average, and other disablilities. SORRY..can ya tell we just had ANOTHER meeting to tell us the obvious impossibilities of this law??!! (PS I have VERY high expectations for all my students...but I realize not everyone performs at the same level due to many factors..)
SORRY SO OT....I'll get off my soapbox!
PS early out day today!

 

[IlovemythreeC's]

Oh, I understand that not all kids come in knowing those things, but I suspect that the demographics of us obsessive Disney nuts don't include many at risk kids - at the very least, the children of most DISers are the product of literate parents who have the means to vacation, which rules out the most disadvantaged students that many schools have to deal with. But having seen what goes on in a public school K with my son, and having studied the state standards for what is taught in K in preparation for homeschooling my daughter, I don't think it is so academically intensive that one missed week will make any meaningful difference to a typical, well-prepared middle class child.

~Very well said

 

[heatherg]

Former high school teacher, now SAHM of 3. DH has been wanting to take kids to Disney during the "off season" for years now. My only reply has been that if it was going to happen, it had to happen before ds (the oldest) went to middle school . . . as the work is more difficult to make up with the more demanding schedule. We're pulling the kids out of school for 7 days this May . . . he'll return for his last 4 days of elementary school. May's not truly "off season", but more off season than June . . . and we had more than just financial reasons for choising to take this trip so close to the end of the school year without waiting until it was over.

We actually notified the principal and the teachers during the planning of the trip as I was trying to make sure he didn't miss any of the special things that happen at our school in the spring. So we planned after all the state tests (last one is this Thursday), which made things easier. Our principal said he thought the trip sounded great, but did need to let us know that the make-up test for the math state test is to be held while we're gone, and if DS were to fail it, he'd end up in summer school. We thought Disney was worth that! Seriously, math's the kid's strong suit, so as long as he didn't wake up sick that day, we felt pretty confident that wouldn't be an issue. I think our attendance policy is that the student has to be in school 90% of the school year. DS missed 1 day this year, DD hasn't missed any, and the other DD is homeschooled . . . so this has been a "no brainer" as far as causing attendance issues.

Our kids have no clue they're going . . . . so all the teachers/staff are giggling over knowing this secret. And trying to figure out a way to sneak in our luggage and go with us.

For us, I think it really helped that our kids had been out so few days and that I notified the school so far in advance and was trying to obviously work on when it would impact everyone the least for us to be gone.

 

[beth_cam]

Maybe I missed it but I wonder about the outcome for the person who started this thread a year and a half ago.

do you realize that by 2014, ALL students are required to get 100% on their state tests??!! Yep, even if their parents don't make sure they are at school, well fed, rested, safe, or do their homework. This includes children who just arrived here from other countries, children with IQs FAR below average, and other disablilities.

But aren't the state tests minimal standards for being passed to the next grade? Passing the test with 100% would then be akin to getting a D. The state standards testing dont touch extra abilities right just bare minimal needs to build on in the next year. I would think most of the kids should be well ahead of the standards while some could barely meet it and the slower ones, yes even the ones who's parents didnt care, would need to be held back to try to learn it again. Maybe the holding back wold be a wake up call for some of the parents. Although even with having said that, I think 100% is asking a bit much. I consistantly scored in the top 95% for everything in stardized testing, often testing 3-5 years above my grade level (thank goodness they weren't testing my amount of type-o's lol) yet it wasn't often I would achieve 100% on any test.

My dd came home the other day and was upset because they are working so hard on their DIBBLES. It measuring reading fluency supposedly telling if they can read well. The only thing it really does is see how fast they can read. I am a very very slow oral reader. Again this is a point that while I could have scored way above grade level in many areas, I might have suffered. I was a very very good reader but somehow reading allowed has always been difficult for me. They aren't tested on comprehension, just on how many words they read in 1 minute. When we moved here this was brand new to us 3 months into 2n'd grade. The very first dibbles assesment they gave her she surprisingly read 92 words. The goal at that time was 60 something. The end of the year goal is 90. She is now reading about 120 (almost done with 2nd grade). Yet day in and day out she is having to work on dibbles, because very few kids in the class can consistantly read 90 words. She said they have to keep this up until 17 kids can get to 90. Now while I dont necessarily think it's fair for her, what about the other 5 kids in the class...We just say oh well when we get to the magic 17? We dont care if they can get there. Do we then pass them on since it isn't fair and some are too slow? If not passing this test means they can't read well enough to pass 2nd grade then they shouldn't pass 2nd grade. Reading is way too important to just move them on because we shouldn't expect everyone to do it. I think the goal should be for everyone to be able to meet the standards. And we should be trying for that. We shouldn't just write off the other students.

Yet, I'm not a teacher and for good reason. I'd be fired in a heartbeat for telling them what they can do with their standards and their rules. I think this dibbles thing is the stupidest assesment I've ever heard of. And the school is going on about it all the time.

 

[kaysmommie]

Part of it is money and part of it is the "No child left behind" stuff. From my understanding, that put more pressure and more constraints on the schools if kids are missing days.

My DD attends a school with the No child left behind policy too. I'm started to think it is more harm then good. People bringing very sick kids to school because of attendance policies. Also many kids that had head lice in school. It is just disgusting. Also I think they put way too much emphasis on test scores (my DD is a good test taker BTW) and put pressure on the kids. Luckily our principal is a nice lady who really cares about the kids and does have their best interest at heart mostly. They did not give me any grief when I said DD would miss 5 days of school for vacation but they insisted she do all her work . That is all she can miss for the whole year too. She has missed 6 days unexcused but I have not had any problems. I would not tolerate a school giving me grief for a few missed days. That is just ridiculous. I think school is important but there is nothing wrong with a weeks vacation with the family if your kids are doing well.

 

[kaysmommie]

I think teachers and principals have it hard in this day and age because of the constraints the state put on them. It is totally ridiculous that so much depends on these stupid state tests. I got the letter and had to go to the school board last year after my daughter missed so many days of school. Basically what I told the board was that my child is a straight A student, in the GATE program, and I wouldn't be taking her out of school if I didn't think she could handle it. I also told them that since this No Child Left Behind came to be, my very smart and gifted child has her services cut so that they could focus on the kids that aren't doing well and whose parent's really don't give a crap about it. I also told them at least when my kid is absent, at least I know she is and where she is, she is with her family. They didn't refer me to juvenile court, which I am sure has better things to do than deal with me and my kid who has no issues. What a waste of money.

And I wouldn't pay them for my kid being absent either...that is what my taxes pay for and they should be getting it no matter what.

Well said I agree 100 %.

 

[lunabkat]

I think teachers and principals have it hard in this day and age because of the constraints the state put on them. It is totally ridiculous that so much depends on these stupid state tests. I got the letter and had to go to the school board last year after my daughter missed so many days of school. Basically what I told the board was that my child is a straight A student, in the GATE program, and I wouldn't be taking her out of school if I didn't think she could handle it. I also told them that since this No Child Left Behind came to be, my very smart and gifted child has her services cut so that they could focus on the kids that aren't doing well and whose parent's really don't give a crap about it. I also told them at least when my kid is absent, at least I know she is and where she is, she is with her family. They didn't refer me to juvenile court, which I am sure has better things to do than deal with me and my kid who has no issues. What a waste of money.

And I wouldn't pay them for my kid being absent either...that is what my taxes pay for and they should be getting it no matter what.

Not to make in "issue" out of your frustration, by my daughter is one of the children who doesnt do well in school because of a central auditory processing disorder (which makes sounds buzz rather than be clearly heard) and not only do I give a crap but MY work is what has made her become a grade level student, not the school which keeps blowing smoke and mirrors so that it took my until 2nd grade to get her IEP, even tho I made them test her BEFORE Kindergarten, and they, of course, saw no problem because "technically" CAPD can't be "properly tested" for iin a child until they are age 7. I also know where my daughter "is" when she is not attending school, with me. I also don't think that the joy of a Disney vacation need to be based upon whether or not a child has a problem at school, every child should be able to go at least once and, personally, I don't think its any of the &#^$% schools business if I want to take my child out of school for a vacation. She is MY child and I will decide what I think is best for her, school is a part of life, not the whole of it.

 

[kaysmommie]

I am a teacher in the public school system. I am absolutely appalled by the negativity toward teachers and principals. We are just cogs....we are not making these rules or passing these laws.

The stringent rules regarding attendance are largely an issue of the federal mandates for schools across the country to meet the ever increasing and ultimately unattainable benchmarks of NCLB. Yes, individual school districts can and will define the attendance issues as they see fit, and they do so in the best interest of the school system. The financial survival of schools is directly linked to the state tests that each and every child is eventually going to experience. Missed days of instruction have the potential to negatively impact a child's performance on their state test. Yes, I know, in the grand scheme of things one missed week should not make that kind of impact...but the schools cannot rely on parents or students to fill in the gaps they missed. The schools, teachers, administrators and eventually the state will get slapped for poor performances and school personel (read that teachers and principals) are at risk of losing their jobs if test scores are not good enough. The bottom line is that they are not trying to deny you and your family a vacation, they are trying to do what they can to protect the school. Yes, that is unfortunate but you can directly place blame on the federal government who has put palpable fear into the public schools systems.

Please don't bash the teachers and principals who are constantly trying to jump through governmental hoops likes dogs at a dog show all the while being booed by the public.

Kat

I agree with you because I see how crazy the school is over these damb Tcaps this week. I wish the goverment would butt out of the schools. The problem is the parents that don't care about thier childs education and the rest of us have to suffer because their children are doing so poorly in school when they show up. Some of the parents are just not doing their part in helping their child to learn. I do feel for the teachers and the principals having so much pressure on them. Still as long as DD is getting good grades she might miss a few days for vacation. I do let the school know way ahead of time though. Sorry, I think I'm done now .

 

[finnster77]

Dear sweet teachers of course your work is valued and appreciated but what I seriously question is anyone's attempt to make parenting decisions for my child including whether or not I take her out of school or not. It is simply not a decision that they should be permitted to make. I am her parent and I make the rules.

Lizzy, I promise I'm not singling you out; there have been similar posts. But...........don't you see that these regulations are made for the PROTECTION of ALL children. You're a good parent....that's great. But you must follow the same laws that unfortunately had to be made because of deadbeat parents who don't do their jobs. Parents need to understand that making decisons for their children is a revokable privilige. The options that we have include electing different officials to make these laws, sending our kids to a private school (who will likely have STRICTER policies), or homeschooling.

 

[Nancyg56]

Lizzy, I promise I'm not singling you out; there have been similar posts. But...........don't you see that these regulations are made for the PROTECTION of ALL children. You're a good parent....that's great. But you must follow the same laws that unfortunately had to be made because of deadbeat parents who don't do their jobs. Parents need to understand that making decisons for their children is a revokable privilige. The options that we have include electing different officials to make these laws, sending our kids to a private school (who will likely have STRICTER policies), or homeschooling.

I was on a long winded rant about something that had irritated me about the regulations and my son told me the same thing. He had just graduated and his observations included a birds eye view of his fellow students and their circumstances. It was an eye opener because while I could understand what applied to my family and their needs, or lack thereof, I was not able to see some of the other children and the tools their parents gave to them.


It is very sad that we need to have this discussion but for every one of our kids who have parents who ensure that education is taken seriously there are others who need to be forced to send their kids to school.

 

[hsmamato2]

don't you see that these regulations are made for the PROTECTION of ALL children. You're a good parent....that's great. But you must follow the same laws that unfortunately had to be made because of deadbeat parents who don't do their jobs. Parents need to understand that making decisons for their children is a revokable privilige.

I don't agree- I'm sorry,but I respectfully disagree... I think some people are actually benefitting from so many regulations,testing,and scores, but I don't think it's anyones children. I don't think it's even the teachers who benefit....I've known many great ones who are simply trying to stay afloat amid the regulations...
Revokable privilege? Very scary indeed. Yes, in extreme cases,where parents go against nature and society itself to cross the line of abuse,but in cases where prents still feel they have a right to decide if their kid takes the day off to visit Aunt Millie,or go on vacation,or just have a stress free day (B/c we all know, scoring a 90 on your daily "dibbles" test in 2nd grade is a sure way to know how your life will turn out... )
This is sad and scary that a parent would agree to such terms. Parents, these are still our children! Utilizing the school system to help us educate our children does not mean we hand over our parental duties and rights-
In our state, the law specifically says we are responsible for educating our own children. That makes all decisions and responisibilty mine,no matter which educational course we choose- We are still the parents,and we are families first,and 'part of the system' after that.
there are probably ways to help those kids who aren't being helped at home,or by all the NCLB regulations...but I don't think truancy police is the way....

 

[DizneeMommy]

Just a quick correction for some folks on the board here--the national standards do not say that every child must make 100% on the "test" by 2014 at all. Instead, every child is expected to be on grade level by 2014 and be able to PASS the "test" for their grade level by 2014.

(Another aside, it's not the DIBBLES tests, it's DIBELS. These tests (there are various ones for different grades and ability levels) actually cover a wide range of reading skills, including oral reading fluency, phonics and phonemic awareness skills.)

 

[beth_cam]

well however you spell it, my daugther is tested daily almost on how many words she can read in a minute...by the way I asked her about it and she read 143. She doesnt read that fast for me. If she gets anywhere near that, she doesnt have a clue what she is reading it's all just a bunch of words...so her memory is good enough that she can speed read. But can she sound out words she doesn't know? nope, atleast not well. Her counts drop down to closer to 90 if I give her something brand new that has a few words she might have to think about. There was also a congratulations sent home that they now have 7 students who have met the end of year goal. That's only 1/3 of the class. I'm still glad they are going to have to try harder to get everyone at the goal. I really wish though that there was a way to do that without holding back those that are already there.

 

[write2caro]

Wow that is just ridiculous.. I guess I am lucky because in Canada I have never heard of such things!!

I grew up in Canada and must say that all of this really surprises me. It was never an issue for us in school when we were kids. When I had a particularly stressful time, my mom would declare a "Carolyn Day", and I got to stay home and do some fun stuff just with her. I was often out for things like bronchitis - my mom would get my work from school and that was that. If I was over my alloted days out of school, would my mom have gotten in trouble for the "Carolyn Days"? If the answer is yes, that seems just crazy to me. I always did well in school - no problems.

It's amazing what I've learned on DIS! I won't open up another thread's can of worms, but this is the second thing about US schools I recently learned that have me concerned about my kids' educations here. I've heard a lot about the extreme problems with the US school system, but these other things are new to me. Surprising.

 

[wdwdasiy]

Just a quick correction for some folks on the board here--the national standards do not say that every child must make 100% on the "test" by 2014 at all. Instead, every child is expected to be on grade level by 2014 and be able to PASS the "test" for their grade level by 2014.

(Another aside, it's not the DIBBLES tests, it's DIBELS. These tests (there are various ones for different grades and ability levels) actually cover a wide range of reading skills, including oral reading fluency, phonics and phonemic awareness skills.)

Most state test also do measure if a child is above grade level. Also, students who are severly mentally disabled are expected to be on grade level or the school system must prove to the state why they cannot meet the standards. Schools have to teach the child who is mentally 18 months but in the 4th grade the 4th grade standards.
Our system is one of the best in our state....that is why we live here. We also have a great rep for serving special needs children and many parents move here because of that. BUT the state in all it's wisdom says that our number of children getting special ed services is too high so we must be doing something wrong! You tell a parent that that the services their child needs are being cut for him/her because the state thinks our systems numbers are too high and their child is the least needy. It happens even when the schools fight for the child.

School systems are bound by laws that were made by men/women who know nothing about education. It sounds good to get on tv and say every child in America will be on grade level by 2014 but that is not realistic for every child. Parents and teachers of these wonderful children know this. To bad the government does not.

 

[DizneeMommy]

Well put, wdwdaisy!

 

[leighe]

School systems are bound by laws that were made by men/women who know nothing about education. It sounds good to get on tv and say every child in America will be on grade level by 2014 but that is not realistic for every child. Parents and teachers of these wonderful children know this. To bad the government does not.

Exactly! And this is one of the reasons it gets so frustrating to hear teachers/school systems bashed and second-guessed at every turn - especially sometimes here on the Dis. There are so many things that go on in the education systems that teachers/administrators have very little control over.

 

[Starr W.]

Just a quick correction for some folks on the board here--the national standards do not say that every child must make 100% on the "test" by 2014 at all. Instead, every child is expected to be on grade level by 2014 and be able to PASS the "test" for their grade level by 2014.

(Another aside, it's not the DIBBLES tests, it's DIBELS. These tests (there are various ones for different grades and ability levels) actually cover a wide range of reading skills, including oral reading fluency, phonics and phonemic awareness skills.)

My youngest is starting Kindergarten in the fall and I found out they start doing the DIBELS testing in K now(didn't 5 yrs ago with my eldest).

Write2Caro, I don't think your "Carolyn days" would get you into trouble in our district. My eldest son had a classmate last year who always seemed to be sick on Mondays(helped out in computer lab on that day). Teacher knew they spent weekends at their cottage on the lake(perhaps making a lot of 3 day weekends), the family was never called out on it.

My eldest had a few pm appointments(he's a Aspie on an IEP, much excitement when he tested grade level from his teachers) and one family always has dr's appointments for 3 kids on fridays at around 1pm. Got this from being a nosy parker and reading the sign out list while waiting for DS.

DS's teacher started giving the spelling test on Thursday, since it's right after lunch & recess (1:30) and too many kids were leaving school early.

If it was a big problem it would be in the weekly newsletter, though DS's teachers have had a problem with kids not turning in homework, have had multiple notes on this during the year.

 

[labst60]

Lizzy, I promise I'm not singling you out; there have been similar posts. But...........don't you see that these regulations are made for the PROTECTION of ALL children. You're a good parent....that's great. But you must follow the same laws that unfortunately had to be made because of deadbeat parents who don't do their jobs. Parents need to understand that making decisons for their children is a revokable privilige. The options that we have include electing different officials to make these laws, sending our kids to a private school (who will likely have STRICTER policies), or homeschooling.

In no way, shape, or form do I see making decisions for my children as a revokable privilige. I feel it is my RIGHT and my RESPONSIBILITY as their parent to make the best decisions for them and our family.

My DH works a LOT and there are only a few small windows each year that he can take vacation without it negatively impacting his performance at work. Actually, when I worked, our available times conflicted which was part of the reason that I ultimately quit - planning vacations would have been a nightmare- it is important to us tobe able to spend quality family time together - away from the hussle & bustle of home life. Right now, our oldest will be starting preschool next year - so this hasn't been an issue for us yet - but actually, I don't anticipate it ever being an "issue". We will vacation when my DH's schedule allows it - his salary pays the bills. I'm sure that if the children need to miss school, they'll adjust. I am quite certain it will not have any substantial impact on their ultimate academic/career/life success. And I'm also quite certain that they will have many happy memories to cherish.