my first grader's pants were pulled down today--Update page 6

[N&B'smom]

This happened many a time growing up, it was just something that kids did. Someone pantsed someone else at or end of year softball party a month ago. When I was in school it was mostly a boy thing. It would get a scolding and nothing more.

There is a difference between inappropriateness and kids being kids. I'd chalk this up with making kids wear helmets every time they ride their bike, being over protective.

Just my opinion.

Seriously, you think someone causing a child to be partially naked in front of a room full of their peers is 'kids being kids'??? This wasn't some idiotic group of boys in the high school locker room that pulled someone's shorts down exposing their boxers. This was a situation where a little girl was exposed in front of a lot of kids. Personally, I think this trouble maker needs to be punished BIG TIME for that. I would follow through until something was done.

Regarding bike helmets, you think that's over protective? It's the law where we live.

 

[BuffettFan]

So now being pantsed is sexual harassment

This happened many a time growing up, it was just something that kids did. Someone pantsed someone else at or end of year softball party a month ago. When I was in school it was mostly a boy thing. It would get a scolding and nothing more.

I have to say I kinda agree....

I do have kids. Mine are teens now, but over the years Ive seen plenty of kids "pantsed"...both when I was younger, and at sporting events etc. with my own kids. Yes, the perpetrators were rightfully scolded, but I think sexual harassment would be a real stretch !!

I would chalk it up to kids being kids.

Im not saying the OP did the wrong thing, I would def. call the school and make them aware of what happened.... But I wouldn't expect a suspension, or anything along the lines of punishment for sexual harassment.

 

[java]

So sorry to hear this. And not only do you need to put it in writing as an incident report, but I would make sure that the teacher was aware of it. I would be livid. I would call the girls mother too. And let her know what took place.

In our school a more involved incident occurred several years ago. And the boy doing the pulling ended up suspended for a week. (he actually convinced someone else to pull down their own pants) By the way that first grader is now a 7th grader and he's still getting in trouble(he brought Porn into school last year)

 

[FireDancer]

How many kids do you have? I'm betting you don't have any.

Nope, no kids. I was however a kid and I was pantsed on multiple occasions. Somehow I managed to grow to be a productive member of society despite the horrible abuse I sufferd.

As far as helmets go, I was also a kid and not one single solitary person I grew up with wore one. Not one. Yet somehow we all manged to grow to be adults. The human species didn't cease to exists in the late 80's because we didn't wear helmets. Our family did weekly outings to the local parks and road the trails helmet-less. My parents and brothers included, yet we are all still breathing. I cycle often and of course when I'm on the roads doing 30 or 40 miles an hour on the road bike training I wear one. I don't if I am on my slower bikes and not on main roads.

That was just the example I used to go along with the whole over reaction by adults in society. I'm not that old, I didn't grow up in the 50's but we were allowed to be kids. We were allowed to do childish pranks, like pantsing someone, without it turning into parent conference time. We were allowed out after dark and on our own, provided it wasn't a school night. When we played sports there were winners and losers, only the winners got the trophy. We weren't cottled and taught that everyone is a winner. No, there are also losers. That is how life is. The guy (or lady) that hits their goals at work are not treated the same, normally, as the other guy that never meets quotas. There are winners and losers in the real world.

It is just a general trend I see with not allowing kids to actually go out and discover the world and themselves on their own. Being embarrassed from time to time is good, it teaches you humility. It is part of like like being hurt, being disappointed, being let down. Learning to deal with those things are just as important as learning to deal with happiness, joy, and accomplishment. It is merely my opinion, it is neither right nor wrong, as opinions go.

 

[N&B'smom]

I have to say I kinda agree....

I do have kids. Mine are teens now, but over the years Ive seen plenty of kids "pantsed"...both when I was younger, and at sporting events etc. with my own kids. Yes, the perpetrators were rightfully scolded, but I think sexual harassment would be a real stretch !!

I would chalk it up to kids being kids.

What is your definition of 'pantsed'? Pants pulled down to expose underwear (boxers) or the person having their pants pulled down including their underwear exposing themselves?

 

[okeydokey]

I would schedule a sit down with the teacher, principal and guidance counselor. Discuss in concrete terms what will happen now (who will inform the girl's parents, and what the consequences will be) as well what steps to take in the future to prevent this from happening again. Put a plan in writing.

 

[N&B'smom]

Nope, no kids.

Enough said.

OP - I'd do what okeydokey suggested.

 

[FireDancer]

Enough said.

That is irrelevant. Seeing as I was a child I know what it was like. I wouldn't change anything, including the embarrassing things that happened, they all shape you into what you become. Someone I manged to grow to be a functional, tax paying, college educated, employed member of society.

What is your definition of 'pantsed'? Pants pulled down to expose underwear (boxers) or the person having their pants pulled down including their underwear exposing themselves?

Either way. The former was probably the intention, the later the result. Just kids being kids. If anyone of any age complained to me about being pantsed I'd say suck it up, it isn't going to kill you.

 

[Jen414]

I just had to butt in here. I have 20 kids in my class and if I turn around to tell one not to run(or pinch, yell, hit, burp obnoxiously), it is very easy to miss something like this. Children like this one will watch and wait for adults to be dealing with something else and then they will strike.

OP here--I totally agree. I teach also and I have lunch duty 3 days a week with ONE other adult. There are 180 kids. It's VERY easy to miss something. This incident happened when they were lining up to go to recess. She said one teacher was in the front of the line and one teacher was in the back of the line--they were somewhere in the middle. There are probably around 150 kids. I don't blame the teachers at all. And for everyone that is going to say there needs to be more supervision, where would that come from???? That would cost more money, and in tough economic times, most buildings are at the minimum level (or less) staff they can have to function. There are no extra people around to pick up another duty--at least there's not in my school and I teach in a pretty wealthy community.

The OP's daughter should have let someone know. I understand she was probably embarrassed, but it is a big deal. That was definitely sexual harrassment and at my school, the child that did it would be suspended for 1-3 days(depending on her record). In addition, I can't believe that other kids did not see it. We need to make sure all kids know that it is their responsibility to let an adult know when something like this happens, EVEN WHEN THEY ARE NOT THE VICTIM. I have always told my son that if there is a problem where someone is being hurt physically or emotionally, he needs to let an adult know. That is part of being a good citizen.

OP, I would really have a heart to heart with your DD. Find out why she didn't tell(was she scared, embarrassed or what) Make sure she knows that anyone who touches or exposes your(or others') private parts, or exposes theirs to you(or others) needs to be reported. Hopefully, this will get easier as she gets older.

I would not call the parent. The principal will contact her, and HOPEFULLY the child will be suspended. You may want to ask your DD who else saw this happen, and report that info to the principal. That way he can talk to the witnesses.

I'm sorry this happened to your DD. I'm glad she seems to have gotten past it though.

Marsha

She said she didn't tell because she didn't want to get out of line. She just moved away from J*** and went to a different part of the line (still with her own class). I don't consider this sexual harassment nor does my husband. It's just more annoying behavior from this annoying little girl. From her description, the whole thing took only seconds. I'll have to ask her and her sister if anyone else noticed. Actually, I'm not sure her sister even noticed or she just told her about it.

I think Torinsmom has a good, balanced approach to the situation. I'm so very sorry that your daugher is going through this. We had a bully situation in 2nd grade (and a bit in third) and it is no fun. It's even harder when they don't want to tell an adult at school about it. I wish I could give you some good advice or words of wisdom about dealing with that girl but I think you're doing right by talking to your daughter and limiting any contact. But I would expect that the school counselor is working with that girl on an individual basis.

Thanks for your support. I don't think this girl is targeting my daughter--she's definitely an equal opportunity bully as many kids in her class had problems with her last year. Luckily, I know how schools work and I requested that my daughters not be placed with her. Other parents I'm friendly didn't know you could do that and/or figured with 7 sections, their child wouldn't be with J*** again. I did talk about telling an adult or telling her twin and they both could tell an adult. Hopefully, nothing will happen again, but if it does, they'll tell.

The counselor definitely works with this child. My own children have told me many times Mrs. So and So had to come get J*** today because she wasn't doing what the teacher asked or she had to go to the principal and her own mother has told me that she sees the counselor on a regular basis. I could tell within 2 minutes last year on the first day that this child was on an IEP for behavior. She's on for academics as well--again, mom told me, but her behavior is just totally inappropriate all the time.

I have to say I kinda agree....

I do have kids. Mine are teens now, but over the years Ive seen plenty of kids "pantsed"...both when I was younger, and at sporting events etc. with my own kids. Yes, the perpetrators were rightfully scolded, but I think sexual harassment would be a real stretch !!

I would chalk it up to kids being kids.

Im not saying the OP did the wrong thing, I would def. call the school and make them aware of what happened.... But I wouldn't expect a suspension, or anything along the lines of punishment for sexual harassment.

I don't expect suspension at all. I'm not sure what I want--I guess I want her spoken to, I want her mother called, and I don't want my 2 anywhere near her at all during the day.

So sorry to hear this. And not only do you need to put it in writing as an incident report, but I would make sure that the teacher was aware of it. I would be livid. I would call the girls mother too. And let her know what took place.

In our school a more involved incident occurred several years ago. And the boy doing the pulling ended up suspended for a week. (he actually convinced someone else to pull down their own pants) By the way that first grader is now a 7th grader and he's still getting in trouble(he brought Porn into school last year)

I did leave a voice mail for my daughter's teacher. Still not sure if I'm going to call mom--definitely not tonight. I might take my cue from the school. If they call her, I won't need to, but if they don't, I will. This is a mom who's in way over her head in life, so I'm not sure what she'd even do.

 

[manning]

I would not call the mother. You are too close to it and it could turn into an emotional verbal slug-fest.

Strongly impress on the school to step in and have a serious talk with the girl's parents maybe in the presence of the girl to discuss why this should not happen and what the penalty is if it does happen again.

 

[Mrs.Toad]

Nope, no kids. I was however a kid and I was pantsed on multiple occasions. Somehow I managed to grow to be a productive member of society despite the horrible abuse I sufferd.

As far as helmets go, I was also a kid and not one single solitary person I grew up with wore one. Not one. Yet somehow we all manged to grow to be adults. The human species didn't cease to exists in the late 80's because we didn't wear helmets. Our family did weekly outings to the local parks and road the trails helmet-less. My parents and brothers included, yet we are all still breathing. I cycle often and of course when I'm on the roads doing 30 or 40 miles an hour on the road bike training I wear one. I don't if I am on my slower bikes and not on main roads.
That was just the example I used to go along with the whole over reaction by adults in society. I'm not that old, I didn't grow up in the 50's but we were allowed to be kids. We were allowed to do childish pranks, like pantsing someone, without it turning into parent conference time. We were allowed out after dark and on our own, provided it wasn't a school night. When we played sports there were winners and losers, only the winners got the trophy. We weren't cottled and taught that everyone is a winner. No, there are also losers. That is how life is. The guy (or lady) that hits their goals at work are not treated the same, normally, as the other guy that never meets quotas. There are winners and losers in the real world.

It is just a general trend I see with not allowing kids to actually go out and discover the world and themselves on their own. Being embarrassed from time to time is good, it teaches you humility. It is part of like like being hurt, being disappointed, being let down. Learning to deal with those things are just as important as learning to deal with happiness, joy, and accomplishment. It is merely my opinion, it is neither right nor wrong, as opinions go.

While I do agree with some of your points about kids being coddled today, with regard to the bolded part, I have to say, how nice for you. You were lucky. Tell that to my high school friend, the straight A student and nearly ready to turn pro surfer, who went flying head over handlebars off his bike (at a slow speed on a side street) right into a fire hydrant. No helmet. He lived, but he had brain damage, had to relearn how to walk and never did regain his full mental capacity.

Then there was another friend, wearing his helmet, who was also riding in a quiet neighborhood, not very fast, when a child darted out in front of him from behind a car, he slammed on his brakes, also went over the handlebars, landed on his head, cracked his helmet in half and ended up with only a bruise on his head. The doctors said the helmet saved his life.

There are many, many stories like these out there. We used to ride in the backs of pickup trucks when I was a kid, too. The car I spent most of my childhood riding in didn't even have seatbelts. It's not coddling when society learns over time how to be safer.

 

[FireDancer]

While I do agree with some of your points about kids being coddled today, with regard to the bolded part, I have to say, how nice for you. You were lucky. Tell that to my high school friend, the straight A student and nearly ready to turn pro surfer, who went flying head over handlebars off his bike (at a slow speed on a side street) right into a fire hydrant. No helmet. He lived, but he had brain damage, had to relearn how to walk and never did regain his full mental capacity.

Then there was another friend, wearing his helmet, who was also riding in a quiet neighborhood, not very fast, when a child darted out in front of him from behind a car, he slammed on his brakes, also went over the handlebars, landed on his head, cracked his helmet in half and ended up with only a bruise on his head. The doctors said the helmet saved his life.

There are many, many stories like these out there. We used to ride in the backs of pickup trucks when I was a kid, too. The car I spent most of my childhood riding in didn't even have seatbelts. It's not coddling when society learns over time how to be safer.

You have a valid point. I'm sure there are people out there that are saved by many safety measures, helmets included. I guess I just see it as part of a larger trend in the micromanagement of children to the point where often times they can't be children. We used to play cowboys and indians without having to worry about the political correctness of a kids game.

Perhaps the helmet was a bad example, I still wouldn't require one for my children, but I would respect your decision to have your kids wear them. I am 100% for the liberty to decide what is best for you. My brother doesn't require my nephew to wear a helmet and only one of my friends with kids require theirs to wear one. I've had this same conversation about the over protective nature of society to children with both my mom and grandma and they are of the same opinion. Both of them have managed to raise all of their children to adulthood, scars and all .

 

[luvmy3]

OP, I'm very sorry your dd is having to deal with that kind of stuff . I would request a meeting with the principal. Hopefully they will take it serious enough to meet with the parents of the other girl and discipline her accordingly.

 

[MouseketeerOvaHere]

You have a valid point. I'm sure there are people out there that are saved by many safety measures, helmets included. I guess I just see it as part of a larger trend in the micromanagement of children to the point where often times they can't be children. We used to play cowboys and indians without having to worry about the political correctness of a kids game.

Perhaps the helmet was a bad example, I still wouldn't require one for my children, but I would respect your decision to have your kids wear them. My brother doesn't require my nephew to wear a helmet and only one of my friends with kids require theirs to wear one. I've had this same conversation about the over protective nature of society to children with both my mom and grandma and they are of the same opinion. Both of them have managed to raise all of their children to adulthood, scars and all .

I have to say, I agree with everything you've posted. Society nowadays put children in a bubble when it comes to growing up. Yes, the world is not as safe as it was 20+ years ago, but children need to be allowed to be children. We climbed trees and broke arms, ate things off the floor and lived to tell about it, fought the kid on the bus and then played with them the next day, and I even crashed a bike with no brakes, getting 12 stitches in my chin. You guessed it, no helmet either. My point is accidents can happen anywhere, whether safety precautions are taken or not. I've seen a person wearing a helmet while riding a bike, get hit by a truck. Of course the helmet didn't do much when his neck was broken on impact. As far as the child depantsing OP's daughter, yes, something needs to be said to the child and the mother about the girls behavior. Perhaps, a meeting between the parents, children and school officials, however filing sexual harassment on a 6 yr old is absurd unless some sort of molestation occurred. I'm sure that other girl just meant to pull her pants down and the underwear just happen to come with. Upsetting, I'm sure but daughter's OP is over it so it's not like she's grieving over this. She did the right thing telling her mother and now her mother needs to arrange a meeting through the school to inform the other child's mother. Perhaps, she is unaware of her child's behavior.

 

[FSUDisneyGirl]

I would definitely request that disciplinary action be taken, severe enough that the girl thinks twice before doing it again. Your daughter deserves an apology, and the teacher should be sure to move the other girl away from your daughter in the classroom/lunch room/ line where they may be temporarily unsupervised.

Kids make bad choices sometimes...that does not make them bad people. Unfortunately, some kids do not learn how to interact with others at home in a good way, and this translates into problems at school. I'm not sure that telling your daughters that they are not allowed to talk to/ play with the girl is the way to go...she may be reacting to them ignoring/ not playing with her by trying to get their attention in a negative way. This is not an excuse, but maybe you can tell your girls that they may not play with her if she says/ does mean things to them or other students.

 

[FireDancer]

Yes, the world is not as safe as it was 20+ years ago, but children need to be allowed to be children.

First, do you have children? Apparently there are those that think your opinion only matters if you do. I'm just kidding of course.

I have had this discussion with people also and we aren't all that sure that the world really is less safe. I think a lot of the things we hear about happened 20+ years ago, it was just not as easy to find out because the world was smaller and news traveled slower. For example, I don't think that more kids are molested or abused today than 20 years ago. We just know much more about what happens than we did 20 years ago. Yes, the Internet is new, but the Internet is merely a medium. The same people that troll chat rooms for children used to troll shopping malls or playgrounds. There are real dangers in the world for children, and children should be taught to be prepared and to be able to recognize them. I am in the technology field and a very common area of discussion is the difference between the real threats to children online and the ones that non tech savvy parents think the threat is, but that is a whole new threat.

I am not delusional enough to think there aren't dangers, but there is a difference between a child molester and another kid that pantses you in the hall way. There is a difference between the kid that hugs another kid in kindergarten and the adult that hugs a child in an inappropriate way. There is a difference in the positive attention of a mentor and the exploitation of trust by someone in power. If the child is prepared to critically think for themselves even a first grader can distinguish the difference.

 

[ColoradoMom!!]

My two cents is that you just need to make sure the "paper trail" on this girl includes this incident. A year or two or three from now, if things get worse, and the school is trying to take action, all those "little things" that no one officially recorded will be sorely missed.

 

[locolala]

I think that the girl who did this to your child needs to face some consequences for sure. Also, maybe they should have a counselor talk to her to find out if there's something going on at home. It's possible that she's dealing with abuse at home. In a good percentage of bullying cases, the bully is actually mistreated at home or sees it happen. I don't think it's normal for this to happen, I never saw a kid pantsed at school.. never. If a kid over a certain age did it, it could very easily be seen as sexual harassment, not to mention completely classless and trashy.

 

[MouseketeerOvaHere]

First, do you have children? Apparently there are those that think your opinion only matters if you do. I'm just kidding of course.

Well, apparently my opinion is invalid as well. Do siblings/cousins count? That should count for at least a fraction of an opinion.

I have had this discussion with people also and we aren't all that sure that the world really is less safe. I think a lot of the things we hear about happened 20+ years ago, it was just not as easy to find out because the world was smaller and news traveled slower. For example, I don't think that more kids are molested or abused today than 20 years ago. We just know much more about what happens than we did 20 years ago. Yes, the Internet is new, but the Internet is merely a medium. The same people that troll chat rooms for children used to troll shopping malls or playgrounds. There are real dangers in the world for children, and children should be taught to be prepared and to be able to recognize them. I am in the technology field and a very common area of discussion is the difference between the real threats to children online and the ones that non tech savvy parents think the threat is, but that is a whole new threat.

I agree, technology has made the population more aware of the dangers of the world. However, the world has grown by 3 billion people in approx. 30 yrs. so the risks of these encounters has grown as well. The abundance of people allows for more crimes to occur, more accidents to occur, more diagnosis of autism to occur, ect. There were many killers back in the mid 1900's just as there are killers today, but I agree the easy access of the media has made it far more easily to obtain the information. I actually just read an article about the number one threat to children right now, and it is internet predators. Why go through the trouble of strolling playgrounds and parks when perpetrators can access the children easily online.

 

[Tink888]

to you & your daughter OP. What a horrible thing to have happened. I can't think of anything more humiliating to a child. Thank goodness your daughter has been able to take it all in stride. And kudos to you for being able to remain calm and level-headed in such an infuriating situation.

If it were me, I wouldn't contact the parent directly. Let the school handle it. Since the girl is in another class, I would take it straight to the principal. In our district, something like this would result in a suspension for the girl.

Unfortunately, there always seems to be that one kid in every grade like this, and thanks to inclusion laws, they've got as much right to an education as everyone else and the rest of us are left to deal with it.

Just let your daughter know that any type of bullying is unacceptable and it is ALWAYS okay and NECESSARY to tell an adult about it. Having sent two boys through elementary school, I'm at the point where I also tell them it's okay to defend themselves (which is another debate and thread altogether) but honestly, as a parent you just get so fed up with this kind of crap you know?

Hang in there and hopefully your daughter won't have to deal with this girl anymore and the girl will continue to get the help she needs to overcome her issues.