Muhammad [pbuh], the Master of Prophets

[CRB#33]

This is a little off topic, but a friend of mine is working within a muslim community and he was told that one muslim can NEVER go against another muslim, regardless of whether there is agreement or not.

To put this into an example, no muslim can testify against a muslim terrorist without going against his religion and without having a death threat put against him.

I must say that I don't know if this is true. It would be intersting dialogue if you would care to clarify this. Having discussions about your religion would go a long way to make your point, and look like something other than "trollism."

Also, since we are talking religion, my favorite is about God's Son:

In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning.

Through Him all things were made, without Him nothing was made that has been made. In Him was life, and that life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it. John 1:1-5 NIV

I would be more than happy to discuss this

 

[CathyCanada]

Well said, Hound!!

No more hijacking now, you know what the punishment for that is!!
(wait...I don't know what the punishment is... ) but it isn't nice.
CC

 

[lilboo]

Originally posted by WebmasterCathyCanada

(wait...I don't know what the punishment is... ) but it isn't nice.
CC

Better not let JasonLyons hear this!!

sorry, sorry no more hijacking...back to the regularly scheduled thread, whatever that is...

 

[CRB#33]

Okay

Please feel free to address my question on a new thread if you desire.

 

[jfulcer]

Originally posted by RoutemanDan
Hey Mitch,where's that dead horse?!

Hey RMD, the dead horse is prolly here .

 

[SPAGo 98]

what's a pbuh? is that some brand of peanut butter?

 

[Mermaid02]

I'm glad you asked that question Hes..... I feel like he's spitting at me!

 

[figmentvi]

Just an FYI.....no controversial statement here....

"pbuh" is an anacronym for "Peace Be Unto Him". A statement that is uttered by some Muslims after saying the name "Muhammad".

Happy Holidays and Peace to all Humans.

 

[SPAGo 98]

thanks figment! that makes sense.

but for some reason there's this little guy dancing around in my head saying "puh buh" over and over again...

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Originally posted by SPAGo 98
what's a pbuh? is that some brand of peanut butter?

I look at that word and envision Fred Flinstone...you know the grand pubah, his lodge and for some reason I see their hats. Yes I know that is wierd but if you can think peanut butter I can think what I want, LOL!!!

BTW...Figmentvi thanks for clearing that up, maybe now I can get the Flinstones out of my head.

 

[yasooa]

Dear....CRB#33

The first verse of the so-called Gospel of John, which says
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God"
certainly reeks of Greek thought. Scholars have proven that statements almost exactly like this were made by Philo of Alexandria, who was a Jewish philosopher. Certainly Jesus, and all prophets, were above the philosophical rubbish of John 1:1. In short, if you look at (St.) Paul's writings, as well as the "Gospel of John", Jesus is portrayed as a angelic-being that bridges the gap between God and man. There are texts that clearly portray Jesus as a distinct entity apart from God (John 1:18). Likewise, I John 4:12 is fairly explicit that "No one has seen God at any time". Additionally, some texts of the Bible portray Jesus as a creature " . . . the first born of all creation" (Colossians 1:15-17) and " . . . the beginning of the creation of God" (Revelation 3:14). Seemingly, in (St.) Paul's view, Jesus rules the universe, but God gave him that position (Philippians 2:9). Need I mention the verses that say Jesus sits "at the right hand of God"?

 

[vickyBaby]

Originally posted by yasooa
The first verse of the so-called Gospel of John,

Can I refer to you as a "so-called" Muslim? Or the "so-called" Kuran?

 

[mhopset]

I'm with RMD!!!!!!!!

CathyCanada I am surprised you haven't moved this thread yet. It is what you are good at!

 

[yasooa]

5= To His Compassionate Grandfather


Abdul-Muttalib brought the boy to Makkah. He had warm passions towards the boy, his orphan grandson, whose recent disaster (his mother’s death) added more to the pains of the past. ‘Abdul-Muttalib was more passionate with his grandson than with his own children. He never left the boy a prey to loneliness, but always preferred him to his own kids. Ibn Hisham reported: A mattress was put in the shade of Al-Ka‘bah for ‘Abdul-Muttalib. His children used to sit around that mattress in honour to their father, but Muhammad [pbuh] used to sit on it. His uncles would take him back, but if ‘Abdul-Muttalib was present, he would say: "Leave my grandson. I swear by Allâh that this boy will hold a significant position." He used to seat the boy on his mattress, pat his back and was always pleased with what the boy did.

 

[WDWHound]

Originally posted by yasooa
The first verse of the so-called Gospel of John, which says
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God"
certainly reeks of Greek thought. Scholars have proven that statements almost exactly like this were made by Philo of Alexandria, who was a Jewish philosopher. Certainly Jesus, and all prophets, were above the philosophical rubbish of John 1:1. In short, if you look at (St.) Paul's writings, as well as the "Gospel of John", Jesus is portrayed as a angelic-being that bridges the gap between God and man.

Actually, Yasooa, Philo believed Jesus to be a separate intermediary as well. The Gospel of John was a departure from Philo's philosophy, not an extension of it. Philo stated his theory on this is quite clearly: "The Father who engendered all has given to the Logos the signal privilege of being an intermediary between the creature and the creator . . . it is neither without beginning as is God, nor begotten as you are [mankind], but intermediate between these two extremes ". In fact, Paul was most likely referencing Philo, not John, in the passage you sited. John saw Jesus as God, Philo saw him as an intermediary between creature and creator. Its ironic that Philo actually backs your argument in this case, yet you refute him.

I had hoped that it would be possible to have a meaningful conversation with you, however the first key to meaningful dialog is to at least try to be respectful. By referring to the gospel of John as "rubbish" and "the so called Gospel of John" you have shown that you are unwilling to do so. You have yet to join in any other threads. You never asked questions about other viewpoints, but instead only make statements about your own. I must conclude that you are not here to talk, you are here to preach. I see the CB as a place for conversation and dialog, not a pulpit.

Again, if you ever feel like actually joining this community in respectful dialog rather than just preaching to it, I would be interested in talking to you. Until then, I wish you all the best.

 

[glo]

Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but there is no need to prove that one religion is any better than another, or to critisize eachothers beliefs.

It would also be nice if we ALL practised some tolerance during this holiday season.

If it continues this thread will be closed.

 

[CRB#33]

Yes, the fact that muslims see the trinity as seperate entities it what allows you to disbelieve that Christ is the son of God. However, most Christians to not believe that the trinity is three seperate entities, but three in one.

C.S. Lewis said it best..."You know that in space you can move in three ways--to the left or right, backwards or forwards, up or down. Every direction is either one of these three or a compromise between them. They are called the three Dimensions. Now notice this. If you are using only one dimension, you could draw only a straight line. If you are using two, you could draw a figure: say, a square. And a square is made up of four straight lines. Now a step further. If you have three dimensions, you can then build what we call a solid body: say a cube--a thing like a dice or a lump of sugar. And a cube is made up six squares.
"Do you see the point? A world of one dimension would be a straight line. In a two-dimensional world, you still get straight lines, but many lines make one figure. In a three-dimensional world, you still get figures but many figures make one solid body. In other words, as you advance to more real and more complicated levels, you do not leave behind you the things you found on the simpler levels: you still have them, but combined in new ways--in ways you could not imagine if you knew only the simpler levels.
"Now the Christian account of God involves just the same principle. The human level is a simple and rather empty level. On the human level one person is one being, and any two persons are two separate beings--just as, in the two dimensions (say on a flat sheet of paper) one square is one figure, and any two squares are two separate figures. On the Divine level you still find personalities, but up there you find them combined in new ways which we, who do not live on that level, cannot imagine. In God's dimension, so to speak, you find a being who is three Persons while remaining one Being. Just as a cube is six squares while remaining one cube."


Now I understand that this is really beyone human comprehension. You take it on faith, just as you, as a muslim, take on faith that your prophet ascended to heaven and was instructed on prayer by God.

As far as the "so called Gospel of John", Greeks used this term (word) not only of the spoken word, but also of the unspoken word, the word still in the mind--the reason. When they applied it to the universe, they meant the rational principle that governs all things. Jews, on the other hand, used it as a way of referring to God. Thus John used a term that was meaningful to both Jews and Gentiles. As far as I know John was not a greek
, but he sure knew how to speak to them.

I think you might get further with your ideas if you weren't so insulting. I didn't insult you or your beliefs. Peace be to you through Jesus Christ, who is Fully God.IMO

 

[mhopset]

Go for it Glo, I want it closed, I for one am sick of hearing Yasooa's crap!

 

[CRB#33]

mhopset, While I understand and empathize with your anger, there just may be some very inciting things going on in this thread. Think about it. Do you think he is doing more harm or more good for his beliefs? What's the best thing we could be learning here?

Christ taught us to reach out to our enemies in love and peace, not in hate. Whether or not we believe in Him, it's still a wonderful idea and could be a great way to go.

 

[minnie56]

Count me in as being happy to see the end of this thread!

I question any faith that requires such a 'hard sell'!