More Dining Info from AllEars

[50 years Too!]

I hope the deluxe plan is available to DVC members.
We are taking my two young adult kids and my daughter's boyfriend Christmas '08.
I can see us all eating at sig restaurants, the young people having their snack credits and lunch TS to go off on their own.
Leaving cash for a tip is okay with me. I think, in the long run, with older kids who like fine dining and an entire family who hates CS, this will be a good thing.
If my kids were little, probably not.

 

[Colleen27]

Add me to the list of people who think that the new Deluxe plan is disgusting. If you've ever done the DDP (especially for a lengthy trip), you know it is a LOT of food. We had VERY LITTLE additional out-of-pocket food expenses with the previous DDP.

Now with the Deluxe plan, basically DOUBLE the amount of food. Of course, you don't have to eat it all (what a great lesson to teach kids: Throw away 60% of your food!), and then increase the price from $38.99 for those 10 and over to $69.99. Do the math for a 7+ day trip: No way is that affordable!

Affordable and too much food are entirely a matter of perspective.

The DDP, for us, was not enough TS food and far too much CS food. It was such a great deal that we still use it for the meals we want, and use the CS credits for fruit trays to snack on at night or let them go unused entirely. We eat 2 meals per day most days, and the deluxe plan would let us make every meal an enjoyable meal - character breakfast or light lunch, signature dinner. The DDP provides enough food for those 2 meals per day, but one of them has to be a CS meal that we don't find as enjoyable.

As far as affordability, the deluxe plan is roughly equal to the cost of the DDP plus the meals we know we'll be paying for OOP. That's pretty affordable for our situation and vacation style - for the same money, we'll get an additional snack per day and the refillable mugs that we buy anyway.

And IMO, food not ordered isn't wasted. We don't go out of our way to max out the plan. If we don't use some of our CS credits, so what? If we don't feel like dessert, we don't order it. I agree that it would be wasteful to order every last thing you could get and not eat it, but there is no food wasted by not ordering 3 courses at every meal.

 

[rkwells]

Maybe all these rumors are just a big conspiracy!....When Disney decides in August to just up the price significantly and leave everything else as is most of us will wipe our foreheads an sigh after dodging the deluxe DDP bullet!

 

[LGH1946]

Can someone tell me the details of the new Dining Plan and when does it start?

 

[pilferk]

Can someone tell me the details of the new Dining Plan and when does it start?

NOTHING is official yet. But there are some strong rumors and information from reputable sources out there.

http://www.allears.net/blogs/debwills/

The rumored timeframe for the rumored changes to go into rumored effect is for all trips in January of '08.

I think the rumors are going to turn out to be pretty accurate, but there are those (not so far posting in this thread, I don't think) who take offense at all this stuff not being labeled RUMOR. So I make sure that I do.

 

[Colleen27]

Wait....you forgot to figure in that you have to pay RACK RATE for your room as well....no discounted room codes allowed. I think that is a big hidden cost that people aren't calculating! From what I'm reading the codes often give you a 20 - 25% discount....

Rack rate isn't a given, though, to use the dining plan. You have to pay rack rate to get *free* dining, but there are codes throughout the year that combine with the dining plan. The late summer code that just expired, for example, got us $75 per night off our Beach Club room and allowed us to add the dining plan. Not all codes will "stack" with the dining plan - AP rates don't, because the dining plan is only available with a package - but other codes do.

If you look at Mousesavers' chart of past discounts, there have been quite a few package discounts offered in the slow seasons.

 

[NMW]

I hope the deluxe plan is available to DVC members.
We are taking my two young adult kids and my daughter's boyfriend Christmas '08.
I can see us all eating at sig restaurants, the young people having their snack credits and lunch TS to go off on their own.
Leaving cash for a tip is okay with me. I think, in the long run, with older kids who like fine dining and an entire family who hates CS, this will be a good thing.
If my kids were little, probably not.

Well, my kids aren't all that old, but they love dining in restaurants. They all have their favorites they want to do again and again. They have their favorite entrees-my middle son loves the NY strip at Flying Fish and the potato leek soup at Rose and Crown. My oldest son loves the shrimp and scallops at Kona and the cheddar cheese soup at Le Celliar. All my kids love character breakfasts. It's a big part of trip to Disney, as is the resort we stay in, not needing a car, etc.

 

[Colleen27]

Well, my kids aren't all that old, but they love dining in restaurants. They all have their favorites they want to do again and again. They have their favorite entrees-my middle son loves the NY strip at Flying Fish and the potato leek soup at Rose and Crown. My oldest son loves the shrimp and scallops at Kona and the cheddar cheese soup at Le Celliar. All my kids love character breakfasts. It's a big part of trip to Disney, as is the resort we stay in, not needing a car, etc.

Same here. DD5 pretty much goes with the flow of whatever we choose and her favorites are based more on characters than cuisine, but DS9 is right there with me reading menus and deciding where we want to make ADRs for. He's a little foodie. For our upcoming trip, he wants to try California Grill (for the sushi), Teppan Edo (sushi and he loves teppan-style restaurants), and "some place with good steak". Of course, being 9, he also wants to go back to Sci-fi ("the coolest restaurant ever" in his words) and try Planet Hollywood.

 

[ntsammy5]

Whether you like DDP or not, whether you like the changes or not ---- there is a HUGE amount of interest in this program as evidenced by the number of posts. All-in-all a very successful program, I think

 

[deltachi8]

The Disney Dining Plan has been underpriced since it was introduced. As much as people hate the idea, when something is underpriced, that's a problem for a business. Their job is to price things correctly, not underprice things. The removal of the gratuity and appetizer brings the plan back into the realm of appropriate pricing, and the dollar off per day keeps it still a decent deal for many guests.

Absoluetly. Much depends on where you eat and what you order, but I did some math, taking a 5 day stay and picked 5 Tables Service and 5 Counter Service places I would eat at and "ordered" off the menus from Allears.

For simplicity, as I do not have a snack menu and that is rumored to have changes to it for 2008, I utilized one snack per day valued at $3.

I utilized a 6% tax rate and 18% rate for tips.

The total for 5 days of the DDP would be: $217.23 ($37.99 per day + 18% tips at TS)
Same meals OOP cost would be: $262.30.

SO, it is a savings and that does not include the "value" one may put on having everything (save tips) prepaid and such.

Again, these figures are based on my choices of eateries and menu items, everyone will come up with a different figure base don where thy like to eat and what they like to eat.

(TS I used were: Boma, Kona, 50's Primte Time, LeCelier and Marrekesh)
(CS I used were: Flame Tree, Pecos Bills, Flatbread Grill, Cantina San Angel, Everything POP).

 

[pilferk]

Absoluetly. Much depends on where you eat and what you order, but I did some math, taking a 5 day stay and picked 5 Tables Service and 5 Counter Service places I would eat at and "ordered" off the menus from Allears.

I utilized a 6% tax rate and 18% rate for tips.

The total for 5 days of the DDP would be: $217.23 ($37.99 per day + 18% tips at TS)
Same meals OOP cost would be: $247.30.

SO, it is a savings and that does not include the "value" one may put on having everything (save tips) prepaid and such.

Again, these figures are based on my choices of eateries and menu items, everyone will come up with a different figure base don where thy like to eat and what they like to eat.

(TS I used were: Boma, Kona, 50's Primte Time, LeCelier and Marrekesh)
(CS I used were: Flame Tree, Pecos Bills, Flatbread Grill, Cantina San Angel, Everything POP).

Did you add in the snacks, too?

 

[deltachi8]

Did you add in the snacks, too?

My gosh, I completely forgot about snacks. That iwll change the numbers a bit...I will open up the ol' spreadsheet again.

SEE EDITED POST ABOVE, included an estimte for snacks.

 

[disneyfan2kids]

Hear me out...

If you were a business owner and you sold a VERY popular product (which I think we can all agree DDP was popular for the most part). Now, if you had a fantastically popular product but were losing money then wouldn't logic tell you to KEEP the popular product and simply raise the price to increase profitability?

Why in the world would you mess with the product, by eliminating some of the reasons it's popular and then just deduct $1 from the price.

For example, you sell Choc. Chip cookies that are clearing the shelves, but you're losing money. Why not just raise the price? WHY ON EARTH would you think it's smarter to remove the chips from the cookies and cut the price by a nickel???

I know... apples and oranges. But I'm just wondering how many man hours it took for some WDW "creative team" to fiddle with removing various parts of the DDP and removing the $1 to decide "THIS WILL WORK!!!". In reality, you know there was the lone worker watching all the "managers" scrambling to rearrange the DDP, and here is this worker thinking "why not just charge more?"

This seems like such a poor decision on Disney's part. I wonder how much man hours, analysis, and salary went into this decision....duh!

 

[pilferk]

Hear me out...

If you were a business owner and you sold a VERY popular product (which I think we can all agree DDP was popular for the most part). Now, if you had a fantastically popular product but were losing money then wouldn't logic tell you to KEEP the popular product and simply raise the price to increase profitability?

Why in the world would you mess with the product, by eliminating some of the reasons it's popular and then just deduct $1 from the price.

For example, you sell Choc. Chip cookies that are clearing the shelves, but you're losing money. Why not just raise the price? WHY ON EARTH would you think it's smarter to remove the chips from the cookies and cut the price by a nickel???

I know... apples and oranges. But I'm just wondering how many man hours it took for some WDW "creative team" to fiddle with removing various parts of the DDP and removing the $1 to decide "THIS WILL WORK!!!". In reality, you know there was the lone worker watching all the "managers" scrambling to rearrange the DDP, and here is this worker thinking "why not just charge more?"

This seems like such a poor decision on Disney's part. I wonder how much man hours, analysis, and salary went into this decision....duh!

The problem is, we don't have nearly the volumes of info Disney does.

I'm certainly not saying they're always right. No such thing. But we don't know what the impetus is.

One scenario is that market research told them that the price point couldn't move without losing too many participants. That reducing the benefits (like the app and tip), along with that thin dollar reduction, would result in FEWER losses in volume than raising the price by, say, 20% (about $45 per night, for adults) to be more profitable than the old plan.

Now, does that mean that projection is right? I have no earthly idea. But we all have to keep something else in mind: The Disboards does not make up "the masses". We're a small, and IMHO more "educated" (on Disney), more passionate, and more fickle group than the "average" disney customer. I'm not sure these changes will be much of a blip on their average customers radar. Maybe so...maybe not. We'll have to wait and see.

And if people vote with their wallets, likely Disney will listen...maybe not the way we'd like, but they'll listen.

 

[salmoneous]

Why in the world would you mess with the product, by eliminating some of the reasons it's popular and then just deduct $1 from the price.

One thing you have to figure in is free dining. This allows Disney to continue to offer free dining at a lower cost.

 

[Cinderumbrella]

One thing you have to figure in is free dining. This allows Disney to continue to offer free dining at a lower cost.

With all these versions of the plan, I think Free Dining is a thing of the past. If I were a betting gal ( ) I'd say they will come up with a new promotion for the slower time of year/hurricane season....

 

[Colleen27]

Hear me out...

If you were a business owner and you sold a VERY popular product (which I think we can all agree DDP was popular for the most part). Now, if you had a fantastically popular product but were losing money then wouldn't logic tell you to KEEP the popular product and simply raise the price to increase profitability?

Why in the world would you mess with the product, by eliminating some of the reasons it's popular and then just deduct $1 from the price.

For example, you sell Choc. Chip cookies that are clearing the shelves, but you're losing money. Why not just raise the price? WHY ON EARTH would you think it's smarter to remove the chips from the cookies and cut the price by a nickel???

I know... apples and oranges. But I'm just wondering how many man hours it took for some WDW "creative team" to fiddle with removing various parts of the DDP and removing the $1 to decide "THIS WILL WORK!!!". In reality, you know there was the lone worker watching all the "managers" scrambling to rearrange the DDP, and here is this worker thinking "why not just charge more?"

This seems like such a poor decision on Disney's part. I wonder how much man hours, analysis, and salary went into this decision....duh!

I suspect that Disney *wants* the plan to be less popular. The ADR system and the impossibility of walk-ins has gotten way out of hand, many dining venues appear to be perpetually overextended, and Disney is losing customers because of that. Not DIS'ers, who know to plan every bite they want to eat in advance, but the casual Disney guest who is going for the first time or the first time in many years and figures they'll just wing it when it comes to meals. Those people are stuck with CS or going offsite now, and I suspect that they're part of the motivation for these changes. DIS'ers and other super-planners make up a smaller share of Disney visitors than the more casual guests, and Disney has to do something to get the dining dollars of the less obsessed visitors. It doesn't make sense to keep packing the restaurants with low profit DDP guests while turning away higher profit OOP guests. I think that this is a move towards restoring balance as well as increasing profit.

 

[Wish_I_Was_At_WDW]

With all these versions of the plan, I think Free Dining is a thing of the past. If I were a betting gal ( ) I'd say they will come up with a new promotion for the slower time of year/hurricane season....

I agree.

 

[n2mm]

With all these versions of the plan, I think Free Dining is a thing of the past. If I were a betting gal ( ) I'd say they will come up with a new promotion for the slower time of year/hurricane season....

I too agree. I think the end is near!

 

[NMW]

I'm starting to agree with the posters who think that Disney wants some people to drop the DDP. Probably the people who tried to get every last cent out of the plan by sharing meals, paying for kids meals to save credits, etc. The people who never did any of those things will probably still buy the plan or even get the deluxe one. So even if Disney loses the people that split every meal to "save credits", it's still going to get the people who just used the plan without cost-cutting ideas and free up restaurant space in the process.