Military Continues to Discharge Gay Linguists

[TCPluto]

Quote:
Originally Posted by TCPluto
I think the sexual orientation of everyone.....

What about hetero females? Do we merit protection as well?



Best write a letter to your Congressman and Senators. Men and women have been living in the same dormitories ever since I came in nearly 20 years ago. In fact, men and women often share the same bathroom (2 rooms to a bathroom).


OK, you've totally lost me here - why in the world would you need different job standards for homosexuals and heterosexuals. Either the service member can do the job or not. It really isn't complicated.

I guess you missed where I said EVERYONE. That does include hetero females.

Dormitories and barracks in the battlefield are very different.

Showering and nudity together with members of the opposite sex? While we know it happens, I suspect the military rightfully frowns upon it, particularly when you have one group who would likely be strictly opposed to it.

Sexual harassment exists between men and women to be sure. And between gay and straight of both sexes. Would it cause a significant distraction to interject all of this, knowingly, into the battlefield? I think so.

 

[DawnCt1]

Seems to me that there is plenty of sex happening the military with just the heterosexuals - how much worse could the homosexuals be?

You are right, there is plenty of sex happening. How much worse? Who knows? Somewhat worse at least. Certainly it has an effect on the morale of others. Sexual relationships are disruptive to the structure, regardless of the sexual orientation of those involved. It can affect the chain of command with lower ranking servicemen or women feeling that they are being treated unfairly while others are getting preferential treatment. Commanders often have to deal with upset spouses who suspect an affair and report it. Its problematic at best.

 

[Bob Slydell]

Seems to me that there is plenty of sex happening the military with just the heterosexuals - how much worse could the homosexuals be?

Actually, it sounds like it would be an improvement -- no need to return to port for pregnant women if they're all lesbians.

 

[DawnCt1]

That has nothing to do with homosexuals, but sicne you brought it up, are you in favor of not having women serve in the military?

Not at all. Most women, like most men obey the rules, accept the discipline and the uniform. I am pointing out however when another group is introduced in which sexual tension results, it becomes increasingly problematic. It is problematic now as a result of the behavior of a few. The blame isn't assigned to one gender or another but when men and women are together and away from home, it happens more than it should.

 

[BuckNaked]

Sexual relationships are disruptive to the structure, regardless of the sexual orientation of those involved. It can affect the chain of command with lower ranking servicemen or women feeling that they are being treated unfairly while others are getting preferential treatment. Commanders often have to deal with upset spouses who suspect an affair and report it. Its problematic at best.

Dawn, I would greatly appreciate it if you didn't talk down to me like I'm an idiot dependent wife of an E-1. Unlike you, I speak not from the experience of being married to a military member, but from actually being a military member myself.

 

[RickinNYC]

Actually, it sounds like it would be an improvement -- no need to return to port for pregnant women if they're all lesbians.

This is what I'm sayin'!

 

[TCPluto]

Besides, the case mentioned in the OP involved a man who said that he was "outed" by anonymous e-mails and did not tell his superiors about his sexual orientation.

I guess it caused enough of a distraction that his discharge was warranted.

Also, I think your other link talks about linguists in training being discharged, not linguists. There is a difference.

 

[LukenDC]

This fear of showering around homosexuals or sleeping in close proximity to them suggests that homosexuals are sexual predators who cannot control themselves. While some people, gay and straight, are predatory, the vast majority are not. It is really a bogus argument.

I think that the real reason people are so adamant against gays in the military is that male homosexual Marines, sailors, airmen, and soldiers do not adhere to the neat stereotypical expectations of society. Gay men are supposed to be lisping sissies. They are fine as long as they are hairdressers and interior designers. But when they are butch killing machines, sacrificing themselves for our freedoms, it shatters the stereotypes. And it makes it harder for Pat Robertson and Dr. Dobson to demonize homosexuals for money.

 

[eclectics]

You are right, there is plenty of sex happening. How much worse? Who knows? Somewhat worse at least. Certainly it has an effect on the morale of others. Sexual relationships are disruptive to the structure, regardless of the sexual orientation of those involved. It can affect the chain of command with lower ranking servicemen or women feeling that they are being treated unfairly while others are getting preferential treatment. Commanders often have to deal with upset spouses who suspect an affair and report it. Its problematic at best.

"Who knows?" Exactly right. Nobody, because no one has experienced what would happen yet. Let's face it, the only reason most who are opposed to this is because they are morally opposed to homosexuality, plain and simple. All the other reasons are pure conjecture and assumption. Name me one army in the world that has fallen apart because it openly allows gays to serve...... I can't think of one either.

 

[salmoneous]

Well put and I agree. I think that any situation which creates sexual tension, whether heterosexual or homosexual is detrimental to the structure and discipline of the military.

So, what you are saying Dawn, is that you think woman should be kicked out of the miliary. Is that what you want? Or do you just want to kick *gay* people out of the miliary that create sexual tension, but allow *straight* people to stay?

Psss - come on Dawn, you can admit it, you like the Don't Ask, Don't Tell policy because it came from Clinton

 

[BuckNaked]

This fear of showering around homosexuals or sleeping in close proximity to them suggests that homosexuals are sexual predators who cannot control themselves. While some people, gay and straight, are predatory, the vast majority are not. It is really a bogus argument.

I think the root of the problem is that many men in the military are afraid that they'll have to deal with the same kind of harassment that they've been inflicting on female military members for decades.

 

[TCPluto]

Oh give me a freakin' break.

This certainly appears, by language and smilie, that you were actually talking down here.

Maybe you can keep it above board also.

 

[DawnCt1]

Dawn, I would greatly appreciate it if you didn't talk down to me like I'm an idiot dependent wife of an E-1. Unlike you, I speak not from the experience of being married to a military member, but from actually being a military member myself.

I responded to your point by adding my opinion and perspective of the situation. I am certainly aware of your military affiliation and I am certain that you are aware as much as anyone of the issues that occur on a regular basis. Since you aren't the only one that reads this reply, it clearly makes sense for me to explain my opinion. Sounds like you are being a tad overly sensitive Brenda. I wasn't talking down to you.

 

[salmoneous]

This fear of showering around homosexuals or sleeping in close proximity to them suggests that homosexuals are sexual predators who cannot control themselves.

Or is the fear that too many straight soldiers will be lured over to the "other team" if surrounded by young, available sweaty soldiers?

 

[BuckNaked]

This certainly appears, by language and smilie, that you were actually talking down here.

Actually, it's sarcasm, which is different than condescension.

Maybe you can keep it above board also.

My bad, I missed the memo where you made a moderator - congrats!

 

[LukenDC]

Well, judging by the lawsuits and scandal at the Air Force Academy, it appears that evangelical Christians are harming the morale of military personnel and causing a distraction with their bullying and proselytizing. They have made their non-Christian and less theologically conservative peers uncomfortable. Should we discharge them as well?

 

[TCPluto]

This fear of showering around homosexuals or sleeping in close proximity to them suggests that homosexuals are sexual predators who cannot control themselves. While some people, gay and straight, are predatory, the vast majority are not. It is really a bogus argument.

By your logic, we should just have the men and woman shower and bunk toghther side by side, because very few are the predators you speak of, right?

 

[DawnCt1]

So, what you are saying Dawn, is that you think woman should be kicked out of the miliary. Is that what you want? Or do you just want to kick *gay* people out of the miliary that create sexual tension, but allow *straight* people to stay?

Psss - come on Dawn, you can admit it, you like the Don't Ask, Don't Tell policy because it came from Clinton

Yup, that's just what I said. Don't Ask, Don't Tell works for a great number of servicemen and women. If it works and allows them to serve, its a workable compromise. I don't think you can anticipate however, gay men or women serving openly in the United States Armed Forces. I could be wrong but I would bet the rent on it.

 

[JennyMominRI]

By your logic, we should just have the men and woman shower and bunk toghther side by side, because very few are the predators you speak of, right?

They already bunk together in many cases

 

[BuckNaked]

By your logic, we should just have the men and woman shower and bunk toghther side by side, because very few are the predators you speak of, right?

There is not reason whatsoever why men and women should not be able to shower in the same room (curtains??) and bunk down next to each other.

Am I the only straight person on this thread that doesn't feel the need to hop into the sack with every male that has the misfortune of strolling by me? Do people really hold military members in such low esteem that they believe they can fight and win any war but can't keep their pants on?

How insulting.