Membership Magic Beyond

[DVCsloth]

“Not charged yet” and “cannot be charged.” Or maybe I should say they can’t be charged separately. During the few years that Disney charged for resort parking, they couldn’t charge DVC members to park at DVC resorts when staying on points, because we’re already paying.

Disney didn't charge me for parking when I stayed on a cash reservation at OKW.

 

[CarolynFH]

Disney didn't charge me for parking when I stayed on a cash reservation at OKW.

Yes, I think we were exempt when staying at a DVC resort on cash too. All I can remember right now is that it was confusing! And as soon as they lifted the parking charges, I wiped the rules from my memory!

 

[emchen]

Okay, the cost of the new Sorercer Pass is $1063.94, so I did a little rounding when I went to $1k....but your right, it will save me $964.65, which I think you get the point.

This is the way to look at it IMO. Those who recognize sunk cost and can avoid the "sunk cost fallacy* will be the ones benefitting most from the new MMB.

To recognize that the cost of our contracts is unrecoverable (unless we sell), is key. To recognize that the cost of MMB is unrecoverable is key to understanding that DVC values those 24 OTUP at $10 pp and not $14.13 pp. and the Sorcerer's Pass to be a $950 (95 points x $10 pp) value.

Finally, DVC valuing our points at $10 pp seems reasonable considering the annual dues (AD) for most of the DVC properties are 10-20% below $10 pp. It just occured to me based on this reasoning: once the average AD becomes > $10 pp, the cost of OTUP will likely go up.

*SCF = staying with DVC even when unhappy with it, "because I paid $30K for it!".

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

While reading through this thread, I had an epiphany— I would absolutely pay $100/yr to have access to the lounges and I would much rather see Disney monetize access for moderate to heavy lounge users (like me) than shut them down. I’d also pay $100/yr to be able to keep just Starview Station (but ideally all 3) open after dark, say until 8pm…

Anyway, I’m not currently planning to opt-in, haven’t ever needed priority at DLR, I might opt in when new MK lounge opens and I have a trip planned there…but I’d rather pay a bit more and get more perks I specifically like than have Disney cut them back to pad the bottom line. If I could pay an extra $500 a year to get a guaranteed MM, I would be all over it.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

This is the way to look at it IMO. Those who recognize sunk cost and can avoid the "sunk cost fallacy* will be the ones benefitting most from the new MMB.

To recognize that the cost of our contracts is unrecoverable (unless we sell), is key. To recognize that the cost of MMB is unrecoverable is key to understanding that DVC values those 24 OTUP at $10 pp and not $14.13 pp. and the Sorcerer's Pass to be a $950 (95 points x $10 pp) value.

Finally, DVC valuing our points at $10 pp seems reasonable considering the annual dues (AD) for most of the DVC properties are 10-20% below $10 pp. It just occured to me based on this reasoning: once the average AD becomes > $10 pp, the cost of OTUP will likely go up.

*SCF = staying with DVC even when unhappy with it, "because I paid $30K for it!".

Those points are not a sunk cost. They are rentable for almost double the amount of getting the AP.

 

[tx911]

I just paid $120 for a plastic C3PO head.

How could I not be in on this?

 

[New Mouse]

Keep in mind that who you are and when/how you bought plays a HUGE part in perceived value.

If you're original DVC, that trade in for an AP looks pretty good (if renting weren't an option).

If you bought CFW the day this program came out, the trade in value of your points is abysmal, but the OTUP looks decent in comparison to what you just bought.

It's odd but not surprising that Disney doesn't even attempt to recognize that with the program.

 

[Bibbidi_Boo]

They do. I'm all for those with 1000 points being offered better free benefits and those with 50 getting the least. Now it's saying buy 50 points, spend $99 you can jump someone who bought 1000 points.

DVC sells the perks when lurchasing dvc. . DVC guides sell the perks. Paperwork or not, they openly advertise them without full disclosure in order to make a sale.

I'd also argue which I'd these perks actually has a tangible cost to DVC to justify the $99 price?

But some people could argue that they don't own 1000 points because they have no need to because they only stay in studios on weekdays during the low season...while that family of 6 that needs weekends and 2 bedrooms......in the end they are staying the same amount of days per year.....

So why would that studio stayer ever buy more points that they don't or use?

 

[Sandisw]

Those points are not a sunk cost. They are rentable for almost double the amount of getting the AP.

I have always considered buy in a sunk cost. For me, if I have to do something to recoup it then that changes the nature of that term IMO

But rental value of points only applies if someone wants to be involved in the rental process. Not everyone does.

Personally, I value the ease of turning my points into something I would be buying anyways.

So, assuming the reports that a new AP will be 95 point, I am not spending under $1k for something I want.

That is why this program, which is simply a new product DVD is offering to sell owners who also are eligible for membership extras won’t make sense for everyone.

Some buy the DDP and some do not because of how they view its value.

In the end, this is something that offers owners the ability to purchase things at a reduced rate.

It won’t be of value to all, but my guess is there will be many members who find it worth the buy in price.

 

[Judique]

But some people could argue that they don't own 1000 points because they have no need to because they only stay in studios on weekdays during the low season...while that family of 6 that needs weekends and 2 bedrooms......in the end they are staying the same amount of days per year.....

So why would that studio stayer ever buy more points that they don't or use?

Because that studio stayer, me for the most part on my solo trips, has run into the situation where they have need for occasional larger rooms for 5 to 6 people at a time and does not want to be crammed into a small space.

I booked a 2 bedroom for 5 of us, and then feel it doesn't give me the privacy I need for 2 couples and a single. Then a 6th person has appeared. The 2 bedroom is too small!

I 'almost' bought a resale a few months back and then decided to just pay cash for an extra room. I'm not the 'small and young close family that doesn't mind sharing intimate spaces' anymore. My guests are mostly family and I'm in the situation where I have been accommodated by them on multiple occasions and also in for the most part nicer places than DVC that are not theme park oriented.

Decided not to buy but to supplement with OTU points and cash to see how it goes. My solo trips are 3 to 4 a year with at least one with extra people. One year may have no extras, next year could have a grand villa full. A couple of dozen OTU points cuts my cash outlay nicely at $10 a point.

Most of my reticence about buying more has to do with not wanting to accumulate 'too much timeshare'.

 

[Sandisw]

Because that studio stayer, me for the most part on my solo trips, has run into the situation where they have need for occasional larger rooms for 5 to 6 people at a time and does not want to be crammed into a small space.

I booked a 2 bedroom for 5 of us, and then feel it doesn't give me the privacy I need for 2 couples and a single. Then a 6th person has appeared. The 2 bedroom is too small!

I 'almost' bought a resale a few months back and then decided to just pay cash for an extra room. I'm not the 'small and young close family that doesn't mind sharing intimate spaces' anymore. My guests are mostly family and I'm in the situation where I have been accommodated by them on multiple occasions and also in for the most part nicer places than DVC that are not theme park oriented.

Decided not to buy but to supplement with OTU points and cash to see how it goes. My solo trips are 3 to 4 a year with at least one with extra people. One year may have no extras, next year could have a grand villa full. A couple of dozen OTU points cuts my cash outlay nicely at $10 a point.

Most of my reticence about buying more has to do with not wanting to accumulate 'too much timeshare'.

I took that post to mean that having benefits for “free” based on owning more points leaves out the owner who does not need more points.

This program doesn’t do that..it makes all owners who are eligible for membership extras eligible to purchase this vs a program that only allows those who bought more to have access

You, as someone who doesn’t need more points on a regular basis and may not own 900 like me, the same ability to purchase and access the value.

Instead of just rewarding those who spent more to buy points, they are offering a discount program to all.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

I have always considered buy in a sunk cost. For me, if I have to do something to recoup it then that changes the nature of that term IMO

But rental value of points only applies if someone wants to be involved in the rental process. Not everyone does.

Personally, I value the ease of turning my points into something I would be buying anyways.

So, assuming the reports that a new AP will be 95 point, I am not spending under $1k for something I want.

That is why this program, which is simply a new product DVD is offering to sell owners who also are eligible for membership extras won’t make sense for everyone.

Some buy the DDP and some do not because of how they view its value.

In the end, this is something that offers owners the ability to purchase things at a reduced rate.

It won’t be of value to all, but my guess is there will be many members who find it worth the buy in price.

I do understand your thought process, but by definition they are not a sunk cost.
That said, I do not blame you for putting a value on not having to go through the rental process. That certainly does add value imo.

 

[Brittleebee]

What’s the prediction on when we will hear about point amounts needed for the annual pass and prices on the 5 day weekday tickets?

 

[Sandisw]

What’s the prediction on when we will hear about point amounts needed for the annual pass and prices on the 5 day weekday tickets?

I think we will find out next month before the sale date because that will make a difference to owners when deciding to purchase.

 

[dvc lover 1970]

Disney didn't charge me for parking when I stayed on a cash reservation at OKW.

Disney no longer charges for parking for guests staying at WDW resort. I think that was short lived. Besides - they probably just built it into the cost of the room

 

[New Mouse]

They are pushing added waterpark access a lot now. Maybe numbers are drastically down between blizzard being closed more often and the added free waterpark on checkin day.

That's also a move go try and block people from heading to epic universe with it being 5 days plus 1.

Smart marketing would make that an irresistible discount to the point that guests say with that discount we will wait until next trip for epic universe.

 

[DVCsloth]

Disney no longer charges for parking for guests staying at WDW resort. I think that was short lived. Besides - they probably just built it into the cost of the room

Yes, I had forgotten that they changed it a few years ago.

 

[Genie+]

But some people could argue that they don't own 1000 points because they have no need to because they only stay in studios on weekdays during the low season...while that family of 6 that needs weekends and 2 bedrooms......in the end they are staying the same amount of days per year.....

So why would that studio stayer ever buy more points that they don't or use?

Yes. I think this has less to do with overall spending than per capita spending (There’s already the first barrier of spending $25k+ on direct).

A nominal fee based loyalty program attracts and rewards the highly engaged customers.

Blue card perks reward the loyalty of buying direct. That already gives Moonlight Magic, APs, discounts, lounges, etc.

Beyond has an entry fee that is negated to those already engaged in certain patterns of spending. It’s a targeted approach. Helps improve the satisfaction of members who are actively spending in many areas.

 

[emchen]

Those points are not a sunk cost. They are rentable for almost double the amount of getting the AP.

I was referring to the money we paid for our contracts, not the points, as "sunk cost". The points themselves are not a cost. Annual dues are the recurring costs and that is why I wrote that ADs is how DVC values our points. You see that reflected in their point pricing conversion with Disney Cruises, among other uses of points.

I get what you are saying though. Most sunk costs cannot be "rented out". A movie ticket, an obvious sunk cost, cannot be recouped just because we don't like the movie. Technically though, DVD stipulates in our contracts that we're not supposed to use our points to rent them out for commercial purposes.

 

[Tatebeck]

For hybrid members and the season passes, would we be able to use our resale points for them as long as the member qualifies for direct benefits? I couldn't find it anywhere in the details.

For cruises, etc they let you book using resale if your points were bought before restrictions were announced right? So they were grandfathered.

Would it be something similar here? If you have resale points from before they started Membership Magic Beyond, then maybe we will be able to use them for the pass swap but not anyone who bought after?