Membership benefits and extras acknowledgement document for new direct purchases

[Sandisw]

I believe this is incorrect as there has to be an incentive beyond just because to offer those products. It is all internal accounting as its money going from one budget to another but it does exist.

I have talked to several different people about this and am confident that DVD does not pay the difference to ticketing between a general public priced AP and the DVC priced passes.

They offer FL residents discounted passes. Who would be compensating ticketing for those? This isn’t really any different.

Regardless, it is not DVC that has any input in these benefits, They manage the components. . This benefit is between DVD and Ticketing so DVD management is who people should reach out to for answers.

 

[New Mouse]

I have talked to several different people about this and am confident that DVD does not pay the difference to ticketing between a general public priced AP and the DVC priced passes.

They offer FL residents discounted passes. Who would be compensating ticketing for those? This isn’t really any different.

Regardless, it is not DVC that has any input in these benefits, They manage our things. It is between DVD and Ticketing so that is really who people there people should reach out to for answers.

Correct, I am not saying they pay the difference, just that there is a financial agreement between the departments to offer the benefit. If that wasnt the case, why wouldnt they have always offered it and continue to do so into the future as long as some benefit exists to them? Its not much different than DVD renting out the park for the member events, utilizing atlantic dance hall, the expo area in epcot, the member lounge etc. Dvd "pays" Disney for these opportunities.

On a similar level, Disney also pays itself for the right to show the movies at the resorts each night.

 

[Sandisw]

Correct, I am not saying they pay the difference, just that there is a financial agreement between the departments to offer the benefit. If that wasnt the case, why wouldnt they have always offered it and continue to do so into the future as long as some benefit exists to them? Its not much different than DVD renting out the park for the member events, utilizing atlantic dance hall, the expo area in epcot, the member lounge etc. Dvd "pays" Disney for these opportunities.

On a similar level, Disney also pays itself for the right to show the movies at the resorts each night.

We may be saying the same thing. It’s a relationship but that ultimately ticketing decides on products it offers. Right now, they are ONLY offering them to people who were passholders in 2020 prior to June. That is what allows one to get it...other than the report here of someone getting them to sell them one.

Most of membership extras are agreements that leave decisions in the hands of others, except things like moonlight magic.

But discounts...passes, spa, dining, shopping, car rental etc. .are subject to availability.

 

[Red Dog Run]

Had an excellent phone call with a DVD representative. He thoroughly explained the difference between DVD, DVC, and WDW. DVC is unable to sway WDW policies; however, part of his job it to collect qualitative data from purchasers. This data is then sent to WDW to express member wishes and allow Disney to ponder how to make the most of the possible DVC membership dollars by affording "pixie dust" to DVC (when if and if it so choses) The more data, the better the position. WDW holds all the cards, DVC/DVD attempt to portray owner desires. That's all. DVC owes me nothing. It's in management's best interest to push for us, but not in their power to change anything. My best best is a Universal Annual pass. I'll just stay on DVC property and enjoy the resorts which is what I truly wanted (along with an annual pass...)

 

[karen4546]

We purchased in 2019. We had Platinum APs but when it came time to renew (December 2019), we renewed to Gold. 2020 brought the Pandemic and we did not get to use the renewal pass until September 2020. They activated our pass as "new" and it expires September 2021.

We could have gotten a full refund but we knew they would open back up and chose to wait it out. There were many people who got a refund and then when Disney opens back up are wanting to get their passes back. And, Disney is selling passes to those who canceled "due to the pandemic". I personally don't think this is fair to those that never had a chance to buy the passes. Like new DVC members. Why should someone who canceled their pass get precedent over someone who expects the perk of a Gold Pass which make the DVC purchase a better deal if buying direct.

IMO, if you canceled-sorry you can't renew until they start selling to the public again. AND if you are new DVC direct member, at the time you purchase you can buy the passes.

Good luck and I really hope they bring the Gold pass perk and MORE to DVC "extras". (Cheez it and animal crackers @ DVC lounge in EPCOT lol)

 

[eandt]

Had an excellent phone call with a DVD representative. He thoroughly explained the difference between DVD, DVC, and WDW. DVC is unable to sway WDW policies; however, part of his job it to collect qualitative data from purchasers. This data is then sent to WDW to express member wishes and allow Disney to ponder how to make the most of the possible DVC membership dollars by affording "pixie dust" to DVC (when if and if it so choses) The more data, the better the position. WDW holds all the cards, DVC/DVD attempt to portray owner desires. That's all. DVC owes me nothing. It's in management's best interest to push for us, but not in their power to change anything. My best best is a Universal Annual pass. I'll just stay on DVC property and enjoy the resorts which is what I truly wanted (along with an annual pass...)

lol I have been asking my guide for some of that "pixie dust" for a couple months ..... hasn't happened. I know Disney doesn't really care about someone that might buy minimum points but the suspensiion or elimination of benefits (AP in particular) is literally what is keeping us from making a direct purchase. My guide has said in all of his years of selling 1000's of DVC contracts he never had one person buy in FOR THE PERKS ..... that may be true but I know of at least one that will not buy direct or most likely at all because of the LACK OF PERKS. Frankly I call BS on his comment.

 

[TinkB278]

lol I have been asking my guide for some of that "pixie dust" for a couple months ..... hasn't happened. I know Disney doesn't really care about someone that might buy minimum points but the suspensiion or elimination of benefits (AP in particular) is literally what is keeping us from making a direct purchase. My guide has said in all of his years of selling 1000's of DVC contracts he never had one person buy in FOR THE PERKS ..... that may be true but I know of at least one that will not buy direct or most likely at all because of the LACK OF PERKS. Frankly I call BS on his comment.

I bought direct for the perks lol. Specifically the AP

 

[Leight19]

lol I have been asking my guide for some of that "pixie dust" for a couple months ..... hasn't happened. I know Disney doesn't really care about someone that might buy minimum points but the suspensiion or elimination of benefits (AP in particular) is literally what is keeping us from making a direct purchase. My guide has said in all of his years of selling 1000's of DVC contracts he never had one person buy in FOR THE PERKS ..... that may be true but I know of at least one that will not buy direct or most likely at all because of the LACK OF PERKS. Frankly I call BS on his comment.

That is odd statement to make as this board alone has tons of people who weighed direct vs resale and chose direct at higher cost for perks. I’d also add if no one ever bought for perks why would DVC offer perks? They clearly weighed costs of perks in past and decided cost was offset by additional people buying.

 

[Sandisw]

That is odd statement to make as this board alone has tons of people who weighed direct vs resale and chose direct at higher cost for perks. I’d also add if no one ever bought for perks why would DVC offer perks? They clearly weighed costs of perks in past and decided cost was offset by additional people buying.

They way I interpret the statement is that people don’t buy DVC simply as a way to get perks. They buy it for stays and go direct because it comes with perks.

Semantics really but silly statement to make the way it did.

 

[New Mouse]

They way I interpret the statement is that people don’t buy DVC simply as a way to get perks. They buy it for stays and go direct because it comes with perks.

Semantics really but silly statement to make the way it did.

Considering the ability to use your points at every resort is a perk that seems to be tied to direct ownership, Id say many buy direct for the perks.

 

[eandt]

They way I interpret the statement is that people don’t buy DVC simply as a way to get perks. They buy it for stays and go direct because it comes with perks.

Semantics really but silly statement to make the way it did.

Yeah I knew from reading here that what he was saying was BS. I think perhaps its frustrastion over us not being able to commit and wasting his time idk.

 

[ScubaCat]

I bought direct for the perks lol. Specifically the AP

I'd be upset, too. It'll come back, though, and you'll be glad you have your blue card ready when it does!

 

[Red Dog Run]

Yeah I knew from reading here that what he was saying was BS. I think perhaps its frustrastion over us not being able to commit and wasting his time idk.

I bought 1 direct for the ability to stay at Riveria using OKW points and 3 resales. The Riveria restrictions threw me out of wanting to own there.

 

[ScubaCat]

I bought 1 direct for the ability to stay at Riveria using OKW points and 3 resales. The Riveria restrictions threw me out of wanting to own there.

I hope that one direct contract has a good number of points, because those Riviera point charts are frightening!

 

[Grumpy Mouse]

I just wanted to post a follow up here concerning my discussions with DVC management regarding the purchase of new annual passes.

After being essentially ignored for weeks, I felt I had no choice but to file a formal complaint with the Florida Attorney General's office. The Florida AG responded to me quickly and asked Disney to respond directly to my concerns - which they also proceeded to ignore for weeks. I then had to file a second complaint (which the Florida AG also responded quickly too) - and then I received a reply from Disney today.

I'm not going to get into the details but there was much pointing to the fine print of the contract regarding termination of benefits - yet still many unanswered questions since the benefit is technically not terminated, nor any "reasonably similar" benefit offered (2 free days after you buy at least 4 is NOT reasonably similar). I have sent a follow up response.

I did want to, however, post one sentence from the letter I received. Make of it what you will; parse the words as you will:

"At this time, however, Disney Parks, Experiences and Products, Inc. has made the decision to discontinue selling new annual passes."

In the paragraph following this declaration, there was discussion of considering "member events, discounts, and experiences" that may be offered at a later time. No discussion or mention whatsoever of the resumption of annual passes or the corresponding DVC discount.

And note the letter I received was not from some MS agent; it was from someone high-up in the food chain.

I am finding Disney's lack of communication on the subject of WDW annual passes deafening - or maybe telling. I want to believe they'll be returning soon - but statements like the above (with a tone of finality) and Disney's utter silence on the subject - a different outcome is beginning to emerge as a real possibility.

Maybe they feel that slowly phasing out the existing AP program will be an effective way to "thin the daily herd" - and drive a better experience for the more infrequent visitor. Maybe they feel that if you have an overwhelming desire to go more - you'll pay more - period. They're certainly not seeing any evidence to the contrary - not in DVC sales, nor in demand to go to the parks. Basic economics: high demand, low supply = higher prices.

Then again maybe Chapek is not even paying attention to DPEP; DMED is his happy place now - it certainly has made his stock options happy.

I'll post any follow up response I receive. This is about as far as I take it; pursuing true legal remedy is likely not worth it.

 

[Leight19]

I just wanted to post a follow up here concerning my discussions with DVC management regarding the purchase of new annual passes.

After being essentially ignored for weeks, I felt I had no choice but to file a formal complaint with the Florida Attorney General's office. The Florida AG responded to me quickly and asked Disney to respond directly to my concerns - which they also proceeded to ignore for weeks. I then had to file a second complaint (which the Florida AG also responded quickly too) - and then I received a reply from Disney today.

I'm not going to get into the details but there was much pointing to the fine print of the contract regarding termination of benefits - yet still many unanswered questions since the benefit is technically not terminated, nor any "reasonably similar" benefit offered (2 free days after you buy at least 4 is NOT reasonably similar). I have sent a follow up response.

I did want to, however, post one sentence from the letter I received. Make of it what you will; parse the words as you will:

"At this time, however, Disney Parks, Experiences and Products, Inc. has made the decision to discontinue selling new annual passes."

In the paragraph following this declaration, there was discussion of considering "member events, discounts, and experiences" that may be offered at a later time. No discussion or mention whatsoever of the resumption of annual passes or the corresponding DVC discount.

And note the letter I received was not from some MS agent; it was from someone high-up in the food chain.

I am finding Disney's lack of communication on the subject of WDW annual passes deafening - or maybe telling. I want to believe they'll be returning soon - but statements like the above (with a tone of finality) and Disney's utter silence on the subject - a different outcome is beginning to emerge as a real possibility.

Maybe they feel that slowly phasing out the existing AP program will be an effective way to "thin the daily herd" - and drive a better experience for the more infrequent visitor. Maybe they feel that if you have an overwhelming desire to go more - you'll pay more - period. They're certainly not seeing any evidence to the contrary - not in DVC sales, nor in demand to go to the parks. Basic economics: high demand, low supply = higher prices.

Then again maybe Chapek is not even paying attention to DPEP; DMED is his happy place now - it certainly has made his stock options happy.

I'll post any follow up response I receive. This is about as far as I take it; pursuing true legal remedy is likely not worth it.

Thank you for the update. Just as a quick refresher I believe you previously mentioned your main point of contention was they have the perk listed and they can suspend it but there is no language that allows them to selectively sell ap to certain members but not all blue card members (sorta all or nothing)? It seems dvc response looks to leverage language the perk can be stopped and they are indicating the perk is no longer active due to ap sales being suspended (despite them actively selling and applying discounts to some members who previously had ap). Is that an accurate summary?

My main reason to ask is I know some had mentioned buying dvc since ap suspended and the language in membership documents still indicates the ap discount. I think it would be interesting to bring up to agency dvc is still marketing the perk despite them admitting it’s not active for over a year now. However, I could not recall if you were in this situation and aware of this additional counter point to dvc response.

 

[4luv2cdisney]

I just wanted to post a follow up here concerning my discussions with DVC management regarding the purchase of new annual passes.

After being essentially ignored for weeks, I felt I had no choice but to file a formal complaint with the Florida Attorney General's office. The Florida AG responded to me quickly and asked Disney to respond directly to my concerns - which they also proceeded to ignore for weeks. I then had to file a second complaint (which the Florida AG also responded quickly too) - and then I received a reply from Disney today.

I'm not going to get into the details but there was much pointing to the fine print of the contract regarding termination of benefits - yet still many unanswered questions since the benefit is technically not terminated, nor any "reasonably similar" benefit offered (2 free days after you buy at least 4 is NOT reasonably similar). I have sent a follow up response.

I did want to, however, post one sentence from the letter I received. Make of it what you will; parse the words as you will:

"At this time, however, Disney Parks, Experiences and Products, Inc. has made the decision to discontinue selling new annual passes."

In the paragraph following this declaration, there was discussion of considering "member events, discounts, and experiences" that may be offered at a later time. No discussion or mention whatsoever of the resumption of annual passes or the corresponding DVC discount.

And note the letter I received was not from some MS agent; it was from someone high-up in the food chain.

I am finding Disney's lack of communication on the subject of WDW annual passes deafening - or maybe telling. I want to believe they'll be returning soon - but statements like the above (with a tone of finality) and Disney's utter silence on the subject - a different outcome is beginning to emerge as a real possibility.

Maybe they feel that slowly phasing out the existing AP program will be an effective way to "thin the daily herd" - and drive a better experience for the more infrequent visitor. Maybe they feel that if you have an overwhelming desire to go more - you'll pay more - period. They're certainly not seeing any evidence to the contrary - not in DVC sales, nor in demand to go to the parks. Basic economics: high demand, low supply = higher prices.

Then again maybe Chapek is not even paying attention to DPEP; DMED is his happy place now - it certainly has made his stock options happy.

I'll post any follow up response I receive. This is about as far as I take it; pursuing true legal remedy is likely not worth it.

I just take that sentence as passing the blame. DVC is saying they didn't make the decision and they can't control it.

I get it. But they definitely shouldn't be advertising it as a benefit.

Many people are desperate for a vacation and will spend freely as soon as they begin to travel, but that will die down. Disney Parks wants to take advantage of all the "free-spenders" while they can to make some money back. Then they will reinstate APs.

But maybe it's just wishful thinking. We have already had the discussion as a family. With no APs, WDW becomes an every 3 year trip. No more annual visits. Makes me sad, but well over $2K per trip for tix is a deal breaker for us. Holding off on an add-on to see how it all shakes out.

 

[Matty B13]

Maybe they feel that slowly phasing out the existing AP program will be an effective way to "thin the daily herd" - and drive a better experience for the more infrequent visitor. Maybe they feel that if you have an overwhelming desire to go more - you'll pay more - period. They're certainly not seeing any evidence to the contrary - not in DVC sales, nor in demand to go to the

Talk about a policy that will kill Direct Purchases, the only real benefit of buying direct right now is the access to the Gold AP, the other benefits are nothing compared to the savings compared to buying resale. Can't believe the DVC Division is happy about this hold on AP sales right now. Unless they come out with a lot more DVC specific events soon, there is no reason to buy Direct except at RIV.

 

[TinkB278]

Talk about a policy that will kill Direct Purchases, the only real benefit of buying direct right now is the access to the Gold AP, the other benefits are nothing compared to the savings compared to buying resale. Can't believe the DVC Division is happy about this hold on AP sales right now. Unless they come out with a lot more DVC specific events soon, there is no reason to buy Direct except at RIV.

I was just laying in bed thinking about this very point last night. I don’t think I would’ve bought direct if I would’ve known that in March 2021 the AP would still not be available. Does anyone have any idea or data on whether the unavailability of the AP is hurting direct sales right now? There literally are no direct perks other than not having your point usage restricted.

 

[Sandisw]

I was just laying in bed thinking about this very point last night. I don’t think I would’ve bought direct if I would’ve known that in March 2021 the AP would still not be available. Does anyone have any idea or data on whether the unavailability of the AP is hurting direct sales right now? There literally are no direct perks other than not having your point usage restricted.

Not sure we can figure that out since sales are lower due to less people traveling. From all I have read and heard, DVD isnt happy but in the end, the AP program is bigger than DVC.

I think that is why we may have seen the ticket deal. Not the same, but something for them to offer. The good news, IMO, is things are getting better, occupancy limits at the parks should be increasing and more things will start to come back...including this.